Voting without Identification in Europe

Forum » Beenos Trumpet » Voting without Identification in Europe

Apr 05, 2021, 12:39

After repeating the propaganda of the leftists on site like the brainwashed idiot he is - I asked Sharkbok whether voters  in Europe are allowed mail-in voting without identification or voting without proof of identity and he never answered the question.  


He perfectly knows that those things are NOT allowed in any Democracy other than the USA.   Why should that be?   Because the nations know that such electioneering methods are essentially corrupt and fraudulent.   There was even a England newspaper that had an article in that stated the US election in November 2020 was corrupt and fraudulent even before the counting was finalized and that not any faith should be based on the outcome.


World leaders know that too and there dealings with the USA will always be turned into benefit for their countries and not the weak government in Washington.    That is why China and Russia already shit all over the Biden Administration.   They would compliment Biden's negotiators and took them on a ride that they would only know how to thank the other leaders for their kindness and throw the interests of the USA under the bus.  


The joke will be when Harris try to bribe Presidents of countries where the migrants came from.  The bribe would amount to $4 billion - but Biden and co is known for demanding a 15% kick-back from third world countries to which  foreign aid is provided - under Obama it was 10% - but Biden is even more corrupt than Obama was - and there are some people he will have to include on the kick-back scheme.    So they will take the on paper $4 billion and in fact really $3,1 billion and will do nothing in return - bar encouraging more migrants to leave for the USA and for certain knows that further bribes will follow.   And Biden will not be able to do anything about it,                       


             

Apr 05, 2021, 12:46

Mike superb post.

Anybody with any integrity and half a brain know the CCP Demonrats dont want any voter integrity as they a election fraud cheats on a scale never seen before. But its very clear ou Sharkstink has zero integrity and is a halfwit of note as well. You want get a straight answer from this bent loon so don't hold your breath!  s Hahahahahahahahahaha

 Ditto Redstink and the other members of the Stinker group.



Apr 05, 2021, 13:05

Beeno

Before his death the late Vlag put some clips on site by a comedian named Jimmy Something,  I cannot remember the guy's name.   He used to work for ABC - but is now away from him - an outright leftist - but interesting because he had all the dirt ion Government in the USA  to speak about,  

Cannot remember the guys name - can you think who he was?   

Apr 05, 2021, 13:05

Beeno

Before his death the late Vlag put some clips on site by a comedian named Jimmy Something,  I cannot remember the guy's name.   He used to work for ABC - but is now away from him - an outright leftist - but interesting because he had all the dirt on Government in the USA  to speak about,  

Cannot remember the guys name - can you think who he was?   

Apr 05, 2021, 14:19

People need to register to be given the right to vote, at which time they need to produce ID. (In the UK and USA). 


What they are "not" required to do is vote in person bringing their ID for each election. (except in Northern Ireland). 
 
So they can vote by mail, but only if they have previously proved their identity when they became an eligible voter. 
A ballot is sent to their address, and they can complete this by post. They have to sign this, and accept the terms that fraud is punishable by a prison sentence. 

Something like 20-40 cases of fraudulent votes get found at each election- regardless of which political party is the current regimen. While the system is not perfect, no party claims after losing an election that it was because it was a fraud. 

If the same person voted twice, this would raise an obvious red flag for investigation. 
Or if someone was dead and they voted, but the government listed them as deceased. 

The government knows a lot more information about you than you think. A bit like Big Tech in that way. Credit Ratings companies have so much information on people that they know if you make one late payment (e.g. 10 days late) on any credit agreements. The government has this, and more...
The government knows what my bank account and address are, as I pay them council tax each month. If I vote by post, they know it is me. 

Apr 05, 2021, 15:06

Jimmy Door, Mike.

Political commentary


Apr 05, 2021, 16:44

Ummm I’m English, have lived here all my life and have never once had to provide ID to register to vote. 

Apr 05, 2021, 16:49

"Ummm I’m English, have lived here all my life and have never once had to provide ID to register to vote. "


Wow...how do they verify eligibility?

Apr 05, 2021, 17:03

As I recall, there is a verification process. 

My partner was European and not a permanent resident and so never received voting docs. 

It's not a case of simply walk in and vote. This is going back some years so I could be wrong. 

If I'm not mistaken, she qualified to vote in local elections but not national. 

Apr 05, 2021, 17:04

@Becs I suspect you have forgotten that you have registered to vote. 

I registered on the voting roll ages ago.
 
The UK online vote registration process has various steps including a NI number (National ID).
Registering to vote relies on previous identification. (I got an NI number as soon as I got to the UK, where I had to visit an official government office in person)- perhaps to get JSA. (Job Seekers Allowance). 

On the 5th step, it shows an NI number is required to vote. 
So without this, you have to provide other ID. (see the page above). 

This how-to apply for an NI number. (Proof of identity and right to work in the UK are required)- along with a physical address. 

Anyone that works in the UK has an NI number. Also, anyone who does not work, but is paid state benefits would have an NI number for identification, along with bank account and physical address. 

https://www.gov.uk/apply-national-insurance-number

Apply for a National Insurance number - GOV.UK


Call the National Insurance number application line to ask for an application form. You'll need to return the application form along with your proof of identity and your right to work in the UK. You'll be told which documents you can use as proof when you get your application form.


Apr 05, 2021, 17:27

This is the same stuff as in the US. Believe me, the government know who you are.

Any career politician would know that the government can identify people in various ways, including as an employee, or an unemployed person being paid state benefits. (Address, bank account details with a working ID)


In the US, it is just nonsense by Trump that the election was a fraud. 
It has never been raised before in an election in the US as impacting the results of an election. 

Also, US working people also have to pay income tax, another way to verify someone from their bank account. People not working will have to register with social security which will involve an ID, to pay them money into their bank accounts. 

Pensions, Birth Certificates and social security are other ID's to verify people. 

All of this ID stuff is all linked together and intertwined giving the government even more ability to identify people. 
Nearly any database table of the government is going to have an ID, as a means to identify the person. (An ID can be a passport, drivers ID, work ID, etc, etc. 


Voter ID laws in the United States are laws that require a person to provide some form of official identification before they are permitted to register to vote, receive a ballot for an election, or to actually vote in elections in the United States.

  Photo ID required (Strict)
  Photo ID requested (Non-strict)
  Non-photo ID required (Strict)
  Non-photo ID requested (Non-strict)
  No ID required to vote

.


Apr 05, 2021, 19:25

My NI number arrived on my 16th birthday and I registered to vote when I was 18.

There is no question of any other ID required to actually vote, but the system is certainly an easy target for  abuse. Distance voting is a simple case of anyone being able to fill in your form for you and just turning up to vote with a piece of paper with a persons details on it is hardly foolproof. 


Apr 05, 2021, 19:47

Ooooooops

Becs, you just sank Shark's boat.

Hahaha

Apr 05, 2021, 19:52

In fairness to Shark, he is looking at the system from a different perspective to one born here. 

We just get sent our NI numbers on our 16th birthdays, no application form or recognised ID. It just arrives on your doorstep. As with voter reg, I don’t recall needing anything as proof of ID to register for that, I was simply sent a form. 

Voting is subject to abuse, anyone knows that , but it’s debatable as to how much there really is. 

Apr 05, 2021, 20:09

Becs, in addition to your birth certificate -the first ID that anyone gets,
you would have registered with a school that would have required an ID.
The NHS also keep a record to identify people, as do the police. And governmental departments all share this data. 


Being born in a country is even more secure than someone not born in a country. 
You have been identified multiple times before you are even 16. 

Children can also be identified from their mother's ID. 
Most people over 18 have a passport, at some point in their lives- if not at all times. 

A drivers license is another accepted ID, and getting other ID's is based on your first Birth Certificate ID. 



Getting your first adult passport - GOV.UK

https://www.gov.uk › ... › Passports
You can apply for a first adult passport if all of the following apply: you're a British national. you're aged 16 or over (or will be in 3 weeks) you've never had a UK passport before.

Apply online

Apply online · Coronavirus (COVID-19) and getting a passport ...

Apply with a paper form

a filled-in application form · 2 identical printed passport ...

What documents you need to ...


Apply for your first adult British passport - who can apply, how ...

After you apply

Apply for your first adult British passport - who can apply, how ...

Apr 05, 2021, 20:20

The problem is not  with registering to vote or even early voting  which has been  practiced for many years in all democratic countries,     The problem is turning up at polling booths or sending in votes claiming you are a certain person on the roll and then voting - ejilr he relevant person has moved or even died.

SB in his ignorance posted  an article on security as to mail  in voting with the signnatire of the voter being the identification norm.    However,  when an audit of voting  un  a county in Montana i was found that there were thousands of votes cast by mail-in 0 but thousands of no envelopes could be produced so as to ensure  that there were indeed identification of voters done,   . No envelopes - so where did the  votes come from?    Definitely not from the relevant registered voters     The auditors then went to the homes of a number of voters and asked the occupant  whether they are the registered voters there and most said  the registered voters have left the place long  ago.   Most interviewees indicated that they did not vote in the election - so who voted   and how?

The fact is people should identify themselves when registering to vote and should produce identification when they in fact vote - since identity theft is a real problem  and as proven in Montana  about 6.33% of all votes cast were in fact fraudulent,    Further audits are being done in other states and if t

 If a high percentage of fraudulent votes were cast there as well   the matter will to the Supreme Court to issue clear instructions on voting processes.                                           

Apr 05, 2021, 20:32

Shark, my parents certainly didn’t have to take ID to enrol me into School and the Police only have a record of you if you have committed crime or approached them for a specific reason ! 

I have no driving licence nor passport. All I have to identify me officially is a short form birth certificate. 

Apr 05, 2021, 20:45

Becs, and the government also have a copy of your Birth Certificate.
If you lose your Birth certificate, you have to contact the government to get a new one issued. So they hold the master record ID system of all ID's from this 

The government verification system is an example of multiple ways the government can ID you
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/introducing-govuk-verify/introducing-govuk-verify

https://www.gov.uk/order-copy-birth-death-marriage-certificate

Welcome to the General Register Office for England and Wales online ordering service.
The General Register Office holds a central copy of all birth, adoption, marriage, civil partnership and death registrations for England and Wales. This service allows you to search our historical birth and death indexes and order copies of registrations in a variety of formats including certificates and PDFs via the government's own official website.


Lost Birth Certificate

All replacement birth certificates supplied are full long formUnabridged, certified/extract copies for England and Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland and include parents names.

The replacement certificate will normally include full name of child, mother's name, father's name (when registered) DoB, where born and registration district.

Duplicate Birth Certificates are often essential to prove identity when applying for:

Passports
Bank accounts
Pensions
Social Security
Employer ID
Driving licence
Visas and Immigration
Divorce
Adoption


Apr 05, 2021, 20:54


Proof of address and date of birth documents for school ...

https://beta.lambeth.gov.uk › schools-and-education › p...
?? 10,995?? 600?? 0
These documents can be as scanned PDFs or clear photos of the required items. If you're ... You can email these to schooladmissions@lambeth.gov.uk on the ...

School admissions terms and conditions

Documents required to support a school application

Additional information may be requested if necessary including proof of a move to the applicant address if it has taken place within the last 12 months.

Admission to primary schools/infant schools

Bromley Admissions check council tax records for all applicants.

Reception intake September 2021

  • Birth certificate for the child – full version including parent/s name/s
  • A photocopy of the child benefit entitlement letter* dated after September 2019 showing the child’s name and date of birth.

Apr 05, 2021, 21:13


@CleverMike - how is the US government able to send out Covid cheque payments if they cant identify people?
They posted them to each person's address, or via a bank transfer after being ID'd. Banks also have their own security systems as you would expect .


Coronavirus: Trump's name to appear on US relief cheques ...

https://www.bbc.co.uk › news › world-52293910
?? 190,228,619?? 1,254?? 0
16 Apr 2020 — President Donald Trump's name will be printed on paper cheques being sent to millions of Americans struggling financially because of coronavirus. ... But for those who did not provide banking details, they will receive a cheque with "President Donald J.

Coronavirus: US pushes direct payment plan as part of $1tn ...

https://www.bbc.co.uk › news › business-51932403




?? 190,228,619?? 1,439?? 0
17 Mar 2020 — "We're looking at sending cheques to Americans immediately," says ... Coronavirus: US pushes direct payment plan as part of $1tn stimulus ... amounting to nearly a quarter of what the US federal government spent last year.

Apr 05, 2021, 21:21

In my day there were no requirements to take a birth certificate to enrol in School, simple as that. I only have a short form certificate; stating my name, sex and date/place of birth. 

I am well aware of the practice of gaining lost certificates, Shark. 

I was an historian, we know a thing or two about public records offices !! 

Apr 05, 2021, 21:28

And the Schools Admissions Code states no School is to ask for a long form birth certificate ie one containing parents names etc ! 

The information given from Lambeth / Bromley appears to be incorrect. 

Apr 05, 2021, 21:35


Becs, I see that-  the short version of a Birth Certificate appears to suffice. This would also give the school the opportunity to do their own ID process to check everything is in order.  Proof of birth date would surely be a Birth certificate or another ID original derived from this. 


4. Once parents have been offered a place for their child, you can also ask for proof of birth date, but you must not ask for a ‘long’ birth certificate or any other documents which would include information about the parents.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/389818/Free_School_Admissions_Common_Issues.pdf


------------


Birth certificates and the full birth certificate policy - GOV.UK

https://www.gov.uk › government › publications › birt...
?? 78,246,355?? 10,867?? 0
30 Oct 2019 — birth certificate is required, for passport purposes, as evidence of a person's name, date and place of birth. A full birth certificate is normally ...

Apr 06, 2021, 07:13

SB

I quote you about the issue of fraudulent  cotes and ask you how you account for the subsequent  issues:-   

"Something like 20-40 cases of fraudulent votes get found at each election- regardless of which political party is the current regimen. While the system is not perfect, no party claims after losing an election that it was because it was a fraud/

*     After the 2016 election there were 1275 cases  stemming from  fraud  in the USA.  Of  those 1 case was illegal actions by a House member  from Georgia  and the election was declared  null  and void,    The other  1274 cases were fraud committed  by Democrats.   That does not seem that  both sides committed fraud in voting - one Republican case against  1274 Democrats are really one=sided,

*      An alarming court case was  in California  where an audit revealed that there were  more than  5,5 million dead and missing people on the voters roll and of those circa 3,2 milliomn actually voted,   That means that the votes were fraudulent - especially since about 10 000 people a month is migrating from California to other states,  The Judge  could have the state  elections nullified - but  he ruled that the California Government must clean up  the voters roll - but the judgement was  by 2018 not implemented and  is unlikely to be cleaned up by now,.

*      Instead the State introduced  a system of vote harvesting where party agents  could collect votes from voters for up to 14 fays after the election.  In 2018 in three House seats in San Diego at the end of counting of all votes received up to  closing of polls - the Republican candidates had a majority of more than 250 000 votes,    After  the vote harvesting fourteen days later  the Demcorat candidates were declared the winners.    Another court case and the obvious fraud systen introduced by the state was thrown out,     Suffice it to say the Democrats lost  all three seats in the 2020 election.  

*      In 2020 there were suspected votes  problems in one  county controlled by the Democrats and the  Republican state House and Senate instructed that an audit should be done.    When checking the mail-in votes they found that  there were thousands of fraudulent  votes and that it involved  was that there  were no envelopes for 6,33%   of all votes cast - so there were no checking possible  as to the legitimacy of those votes,

*      In the State of  Arizona a similar audit has been authorized  and is underway,    Of that state is to be found to be in the same situation  as happened in Montana  other states may be forced by the Court to do similar audits.

By the way  this has nothing to do with  whether Trump lost the election  - it has everything to do with fraudulent voting  and the problem is that your Democratic heroes  have institutionalized  election fraud as part of their election strategy as is proved by thousands of cases over the last 60 years.     

The  Democrats are not interested in expanding the vote to all people  - they are interested in how to legalize fraudulent elections through their latest legislation.    .       .  

Apr 06, 2021, 13:40

@CleverWanker,

You did not answer my question about how can the US government send Covid cheques if they cant identify people? The US government writes out individual cheques and posts them. Then people cash the cheques by making a bank deposit.
Sounds a lot like the process used in mail-in ballots...

Like the other Trumpanzees, you are dishonest. If Trump is not making up the lies for you, you create your own.

The government being able to post cheques proves that they know who people are, and where they live- because they have ID's going back to Birth Certificates, then later on other ID's like driver licenses, social security benefits (non-workers) or income tax (workers), as well as bank accounts, health system registrar, credit history etc, etc etc. 

Dominion software was a favourite, but that is no longer being bandied around by the brain dead Trumpanzees. Dominion is currently taking the Trump legal team to court to sue them for billions in libel damages. Libel is being talked about as the best solution to misinformation, disinformation and outright lies to hold people to account. 

Someone has to be an eligible voter to be counted. If I went and lived in America, I could not vote- unless I was given the right to vote. I would have to first apply to be added to the voting register, providing ID at that time. Security checks are done at that time to prove eligibility. Death certificates are compared with the eligible voter list, and any people that died before the election are not counted- along with many other security checks. Some people believe that in the 21st century, mail-in votes are more secure than voting in person.  

You can continue to lie to yourself, along with the rednecks in America - but the reality is your master lost the election.

What is worse for you, is that younger generations have never been so Democratic, so every 4 years the Democrats get stronger, while Republican rednecks smaller. 

Even in the red states, the cities are now Democratic majority. It is expected that cities will continue to grow rapidly in population, while the rural redneck areas will decline. 
So the writing is on the wall for the Republicans, and the only way they can win an election is by not counting legitimate votes by Democrats by making it difficult to vote (e.g. limited places to vote, that are in conservative Trumpanzee areas. 

If someone is allowed to vote in America, their vote can be counted. People who are not allowed to vote, are not counted. It is that simple. 
It is computerised, but even manual recounts got the same results in places like Georgia. 

If millions of ballots turned up, and they were not registered voters - it would be fraud- but that never happened. 

If someone is from another country, they have to first prove their right to work and live with ID long before being able to vote in the US. (As is the case in many countries).

Apr 06, 2021, 18:01


This idiot is so brainwashed and clueless and a like the Democrats who are habitual liars wjo hate the truth he is creating lies/  Meng jou met die semels  en die varke vreet jou,          

Apr 06, 2021, 18:06

You've got a good point there Shark...I'm sure a lot of dead people are allocated relief cheques...imagine what the ANC would be able to do with such a covid relief system...luckily all the politicians and state officials are much too honest for IT to happen in America...wink, wink!...;)

Apr 06, 2021, 19:03

The ANC government probably does not have a clue who anyone is in South Africa, except for money received. They are useless, and this is far beyond their ability or inclination. 

Although even still, they would not be capable of posting cheque payments in the post as some areas probably do not have post/zip codes or any mail system. 
The ANC would love to steal most of the cheque payments, so surprised they did not consider this. 

It is simple if the government in the US knows how to send payments to people, they know who the people are and where they live.
If anyone did not receive a cheque payment -  they would contact the government to arrange to get the Covid cheque payment. (This would root out any fraud like identity theft- like voting twice). 
So if anyone did not receive payment, this would be subject to identification. And remember, the Republicans were the first to send cheques, and now the Democrats are sending cheque payments. 

A birth certificate is the master ID record for people born in a country, and there is something equivalent for people who move to another country.
All future ID's like bank accounts, paying the government income tax or getting benefits for non-working people into their bank accounts are further ID verification. 
Then drivers license, international travel, education like schools, health services doctors, dentists etc, etc.




Apr 06, 2021, 19:10

Draad he has no point whatsoever.  The  Covid 19 checques are based on the national register of  the Federal Government  and the people going to the banks will have to prove that hey are the legal recipients,   

Voters rolls are a State responsibility and rolls are not updated like  SB so eloquently  indicated,   The rolls in States run by the Democrats  like California,  Washington, Oregon, Illinois and New York are  hugely out of  date and the  Democrats  prefer it that way because they have the ability to raise he dead  on election day,   It happened in 2016  - so why did it not happen in 2020/?   

Apr 06, 2021, 19:12

Yet Biden won states that were Red like Georgia, where the Republican in charge of the election said the Democrats won, despite Trump trying to blackmail and bribe him. 


Apr 06, 2021, 19:23

So the US government knows who everyone is, but the states do not? 

Utter nonsense. 

The states are the ones that would make the government aware of births and deaths. (Birth Certificates and Death Certificates- typically data from the hospital or morgue etc.

If millions of cheques are being paid to dead people, or lost to identity fraud, or the opposite political party stealing - this would all be found out and accepted by most thinking people. It was just wild allegations, with no proof

Trump and his followers just made every accusation in the book- but judges in all states threw them out of court. (Including Many Republican Judges- and those that were appointed in the Trump era). Trump-appointed DOJ said that there was no fraud that influenced the outcome of the election, as did the person who was in charge of election security- another Trump appointee. 

Here's what the stimulus checks with Trump's name may look like -  CNNPolitics


Apr 06, 2021, 19:48

Get this into you thick skull - this is NOT about Trump - it is about voter fraud/   Mein Gott =you really are incredibly stupid.    People make sure their data is up to date insofar as the Federal Government is concerned - but not so when it cones to the voters roll.   Tens of thousands pf people leave  California, New York  and States like Washington and Oregon  monthly to get away from the atrocious conditions they fled from/.   These people will  stay on the roll for years to come,      That is why the Court ruled that the California Voters  Roll must be cleaned up/   

Apr 06, 2021, 19:56

And conservative judges that probably voted Republican - threw the voter fraud cases out of court in Republican states very quickly. 


I suppose they must be getting paid off by the Democrats in your reality- along with Trump DOJ William Barr- and all other Republicans that said the vote was not influenced by Fraud. 

Voter Fraud has never been a problem in the US or UK, at least not in modern times with computers and sophisticated voting software etc. If people vote twice, this is obvious and it will have a security check- which would happen if significant identity fraud was happening. 

Governments at the national level and local level keep a voting registrar that is updated with deaths. They actually share data as well. 

Your master lost... As one of the more "renouned" Qanon said, "it is time to move on with our lives"...

Apr 06, 2021, 20:32

"So the US government knows who everyone is, but the states do not? 

Utter nonsense. "

So no ID is needed...do the banks feel the same?

Apr 06, 2021, 22:50

When will it ever enter your dunce head that the issue of fraudulent voting is a criminal offemse following voter audits and has in the main not gone to court yet.    If huge problems come to light and there have already been some  huge problems  found  - the matter will go to court based on proven fraud and not vague statements without real proof  that served before  the courts previously.   The matters will probably cause serious disquiet  and some  elections - eg for House, Senate and other seats could be ordered by the courts to have re-electionne.   .   

If fraud was so widespread as is  already found in Montana  -  the Supreme Court will have to  decide on the punishment.

I would be very worried if I was a Democrat winner in for instance Georgia,                

Apr 07, 2021, 00:33

4 More Years!!!!

Apr 07, 2021, 01:53

8 More Years<3

Your lot lost so ffs. suck it up !!

Apr 07, 2021, 05:04

The moment idiocy is uncovered on this board SD and a few  others go dilly and come up with unrelated shit.  

 
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