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Why are we struggling so much

Forum » Cricket » Why are we struggling so much

Feb 22, 2019, 16:24

The answer to that question can be found by looking at the team sheet.....there always seem to be one or two new names in the batting line-up. We have experimented with so many new players and it varies by format. Amla, Faf and Quinton are the only regulars in the top 7.

And none of the youngsters look like super stars. Van Dussen who is 30 frankly looks the best of the bunch. This is what happens when you lose the team and go for flavour of the day picks.

We desperately need AB for this WC, maybe Rossouw as well.

Feb 22, 2019, 19:45


I wrote some comments om the relationship on site and that I am prepared to make peace with you as long as nasty personal insults not be made on site.   There are many things people can differ about without becoming uncivil about it.   Fact is the Ed also think from his latest thread that things are going wrong on site and that set me thinking of my personal conduct on site.

As it is there is really  no reason for personal insults when people differ from each other on things relating to rugby and cricket,   The fact is that personal insults does not shave any relation to what we really think and worry about.

Take for instance the above statement of yours and I quote:-

"The answer to that question can be found by looking at the team sheet.....there always seem to be one or two new names in the batting line-up. We have experimented with so many new players and it varies by format. Amla, Faf and Quinton are the only regulars in the top 7" 

I do not know whether the above relates to Tests, ODI's or T20I's so we may as well look at the latest team-sheet and see how far we get:-


The present situation are as follows:-

Elgar          -       53 test apperances

Markram    -       16 test apperances

Amla          -        122 test appreances

Bavuma      -       35  test appearances

Du Plessis  -       57 test appearnces

De Kock      -       37 test appreances

The team was basically the same for the past two years and the only recent change was the retirement  of AB de Villiers and bringing on board this year of Hamza - that only because Faf was banned for 1 match.


Here  again there were very few real changes  over the pasty two years - and those basically occurred only because of the retirement of AB and some  injuries.   In reality the following are constant in the top 6:-

Amla, De Kock, Du Plessis, Miller.

The absence of AB caused a serious problem and the other top 6 player was Duminy who have been out with an injury for 5 months now and the Indians dropped him from the IPL squad as well.

AB announced his retirement and whether we like it or not he is not interested in playing on international level anymore.   He did not play cricket for 6 months and then came back to play in the Mzanzi series - where he failed badly.

SAC tried to fill the gap left by AB and basically tried three players to fill the gaps left by Ab and Duminy:-

Hendricks  - to my mind not an international cricketer with a mixed bag performance record.

Klaasen     -   bad failure in all games he played in

Van der Dussen -  After being the top run scorer in the Mzanzi series - where he beats De Kock by 3 runs  - he was drafted into the team and has had an excellent performance record,


It is not worth discussing T20I's because the selection of players is a crazy mixed bag.

Batting problems

Whether we like it or not there are serious problems in both the test and ODI batsmen.   The serious batting problems in tests and ODI's  are -

*    Amla, Elgar and Bavuma - ie two of the most senior batsmen in the team and one who should never have been in the team; and'

*    Amla in that even where he makes reasonable and good runs the team still loses the matches he made runs - what is weird is that where he is out early the Proteas won the games.

AB and Rilee Rossouw

I do not believe there is anything that would onvince AB to play in ODI's again.  He will still play in the IPL -  but whether he will be successful after his Mzanzi mishaps is questionable.

Rossouw signed a Kolpak deal in January 2017 and as far as I am aware it was a two-year contract.   Recent newspaper reports indicated that he has not renewed the deal and what he is up to now is anybody's guess.   There has been no public indication that he has been approached by SA Cricket at all and that could be because of the rather nasty way he departed in 2017.

Fact is I only see at present -

*    the need  of replacing the failing Amla in the squad and looking at Van der Dussen instead - bearing in mind that Amla was poor in previous WC play-off games in 2011 and 2015;

*    to get two other potential players in the squad  and that remains a problem - nobody will get AB to agree to return to play; and

*    that SA Cricket try and convince Rossouw to return and play for the Proteas;

Markram and perhaps Hamza should be phased into the squad. 



Feb 22, 2019, 23:38

Mike the implication of your first paragraph is I make nasty comments and you are the victim. It's a two way may not even be aware of how much needle there is in your posts, but there's a lot.

I have said this before, think of me as a mirror....I will reflect exactly what you give me. Disagree in a civil way and I will fully support your right to your opinion. Present it as a gotcha, and I will respond in kind.

We differ on a lot of things, players, the need for experience and tactics. So there is a lot of scope to's how that happens that will decide whether we can co-exist civilly.

I will continue to be critical of flavour of the Boks and players that in my view are hyped....because it's destructive to the enterprise. And if your facts are materially incorrect I will point that out. But I will also look for reasons to agree as well.

If that works for you I'm quite willing to give it a go.

Feb 23, 2019, 01:16

Wtf Am I going mad?

Feb 23, 2019, 01:52

'Going'.....hahaha. FFS Chipp-Ou change your avatar, I keep thinking you're HasBeen_Ou.

Feb 23, 2019, 10:52

Fine - but no comments on the issues I actually mentioned in the rest of the item.   You know my own opinion - experience without real performance is a disaster for any team.   Elgar and Amla is slipping badly not only in batting, but also in fielding.   I believe hat in the case of Amla is eye-hand disfunctioning related to advancement in age.   The other problem - especially in fielding is slow reaction times.   Whether the latter two problems can be overcome is indeed a problem.

I personally think that the main reason why AB retired was because of a string of injuries and when he returned he felt that he had the same problem as Amla is now showing in abundance.   AB always put the team above everting else and his remaining in the squad  caused him to review his situation and announce his retirement.

As to Amla I think there are serious reservations in both the media and even on site,   Even your ardent supporter Denny thinks he should be out of the squad.   I know you still favour him strongly - but their should be reasons for that and real analysis on a fair and reasonable basis should be provided in such a case.

As to De Kock - he had one dip in performance since 2013 - but that happens to all players and rushing him back into the 2015 WC squad after a three month injury absence  did not help either.   He is however, by now the only top run-scorer in the team - beating other contenders by a mile,   In both tests and ODI's his runs scored and strike rates are high    My only problem is that he tends to get out through carelessness from time to time when eh really scored runs against all formats of bowling.

probably set to take over the captaincy when Du Plessis retires after the WC.


Feb 23, 2019, 12:16

Now it brings me to the bowlers.   We thought the bowlers were good enough - but is it?  So let look at the bowling in the Pakistan and Sri Lanka series:-

Pakistan tests

The  figures for the top bowlers is as follows:-

                                       Overs    -     Runs   -    Wickets     Rpo

Steyn                                 94              350               12         3,72

Rabada                              85              318               17         3,74

Olivier                               88              353               24         4,01

Philander                          57              171                  6         3,00

In essence  the rpo is too high - and the only two bowlers who really brought their side of the bargain was Olivier and Rabada.    Steyn was reasonable - Philander poor.

Pakistan ODI's       

I did not look at the all-rounders and bit bowlers - only the regulars:-

                                         Overs    -     Runs   -    Wickets     Rpo

Steyn                                 23              120                3          5,21

Rabada                              44              215                4          4.88

Must say the bowling figures are not all that impressive.   The fact is that Steyn played in 3 ODI's  and averaging 1 wicket per ODI  is not all that impressive.   The same can be said about Rabada with no wickets imn 2 of the three ODI's he played in/

Sri Lanka  Tests

                                       Overs    -     Runs   -    Wickets     Rpo

Steyn                                 56              193                3          3,32

Rabada                              63              220                8          3,49

Olivier                               51              180                7          3,52

Philander                           18                45                3          2,50

I am not all that impressed with Steyn performances - 3 wickets from 2 tests  is not what I would call an achievement to write home about.    Philander was injured again and is a bad investment from an injury perspective.

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