A tragedy on Site

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Nov 05, 2019, 11:38

The problem is that Mozart and AO - frequently supported by Pakie - over the past few years wrote so much BS on site in their attacks on some Springbok players and the coach that they now find themselves  in trouble for spouting all the BS they wrote,   Instead of apologizing and accept that Erasmus and the whole team deserve winning the RC and WC - as well as gaining performance awards - they continue with their totally disgraced attacks.

I know it is hard for them to accept that they were wrong - why do they not just say sorry we were wrong and move on from there?   Instead they start afresh spouting BS on site and do not really accept the fact that the Springboks won the WC - congratulate the team on that and that be the end of the story,   Instead of that AO started a story again stating that the losing WC squad in 2015 was better than the WC winners in 2019.   They are now even more spiteful than they used to be. 

I know that type of thing is silly and foolhardy - but will they never stop making utter fools of themselves on site and start on a fresh basis of logical debate?   At least Pakie realized the way the situation is at present and was very good in saying he was wrong in what he wrote in the past - the other two did nothing of the kind.      I think all the members would welcome that and we can all make a fresh start looking at the future, which seems very bright from a rugby perspective at present. 

Nov 05, 2019, 11:56

Maybe we should offer some kind of amnesty to all the egg-faced Pieter-Steph bashers.

Let's give them 24 hours to admit that they were wrong about the 2019 World Rugby Player of the Year. 

Those who take back all their childish and hopelessly biased slagging and slander of this fine rugby player on this thread over the next 24 hours qualify for amnesty and will not be reminded going forward of what ignorant and prejudiced fools they have been . . . those that don't will keep getting egg all over their stupid faces forever.

Sound fair? 

Pieter-Steph du Toit . . . 2019 World Rugby Player of the Year and Springbok legend!

Nov 05, 2019, 11:57

Nov 05, 2019, 12:05

An apology? 

Image result for smiley laugh gif

Nov 05, 2019, 12:59

Well, here is the reality of a forum like this:

1. To the best of my knowledge, nothing we say here has any effect on team selections or player performance.

2. This is a discussion forum. The more contrary views there are, the more discussion, especially if we have well motivated views. If we all just back slapped and thumbs-upped one another all the time, there won't be much discussion and this place will die a slow death.

Example: Steph winning player of the year. I don't begrudge him the award for a second, but why can't we talk about the underlying merits or meaning of the award, put different views on the table, etc?

Variety is the spice of (forum) life, lads. Why this push for conformity?

Nov 05, 2019, 13:09

"The more contrary views there are, the more discussion, especially if we have well motivated views."

Hmmm . . . well motivated views you say? Like . . . ummmm . . . Pieter-Steph must be crap because he has a long neck . . . PSdT is a "process" tackler . . . PSdT should have saved a try when he wasn't the 1st, 2nd or even 3rd tackler . . . PSdT shouldn't play rugby because he has thin wrists . . . PSdT was "gassed" by [insert name here] . . . PSdT didn't win a turnover when he was on the opposite side of the ruck . . . PSdT is slow/fat/clumsy/lazy/stupid/the antichrist? 

Those kind of "well motivated views"?


So no takers of the Ruckers Forum Human Rights Amnesty offer so far?

Nov 05, 2019, 13:10

One can achieve so much less by agreeing with everyone and everything. 

Nov 05, 2019, 13:11

"One can achieve so much less by agreeing with everyone and everything. "

I disagree!

Nov 05, 2019, 13:17

The Church of Steph have repeatedly demonstrated poor analytics and herd like behaviour. When dissent is in their air, they become quite agitated. When requested to provide any kind of reference for their unfounded belief, they shield themselves with personal attacks to by time and space, distract from their lack of information. The information against this cult is vast, only increasing their agitation and hostility. It makes no difference, fall quickly or slowly, but fall you will. It is inevitable. The same faces, with the same play sheet, with the same embarrassing outcome. 

The bottom line is thus: They know he is the best player, but they don't know why. However, you better believe this unspecified reason for belief as fact, or you are stupid. If you still resist, they will scour the net looking for a well known face that agrees with them. That proves they are correct, but we must only listen to the tings these experts say that correlates with the herd's theology. 

Who could possibly resist such logic? :D

Nov 05, 2019, 13:19


No one ask for conformity - that will be deadly for the forum anyway.  If everyone agrees on everything it will be the death of the forum.

You have done very well and admitted that some of your views were wrong and you congratulated all involved.  So lets move on from there and heaven forbid that we agree on everything - let us move forward in diversity.

The problem is in fact that AO is running wild and so does Mozart - the team is poor - some players are substandard (the same players they disliked in the past) - and the coach is a fool without any game plan.   Fine that is their view - can they not just forget the past and look at the future,  To keep telling us how poor the present team is compared to the 2015 team is just plain idiotic.   

All that should happen to my mind  is that the two mentioned congratulate the team winning the WC and the Team of the Year Award -  Erasmus in winning the Coach of the Year award - Du Toit winning the Player of the Year award without personal attacks on the coach and  players and then proceed from there to explain  their views for the future on site.  I would miss every minute of membership if they do not continue with their different viewpoints on site.   What they do at present is plain stupid and childish.  From comments of other members it is clear that it upsets some members.


Nov 05, 2019, 13:19

See what Pieter-Steph is holding in the picture above, Omlett?

No proof required. If you think that Pieter-Steph wasn't actually named the 2019 World Rugby Player of the Year and it's all a hox then put up some links or at least something to back up your pitiful squealing.

Thanks in anticipation.

Nov 05, 2019, 13:33


Just a question.   We know that the selection was made by 8 experts that has been involved  in rugby and all played test rugby for any years.   They made the decision about Du Toit.   We do not know their reasons for their decision.  

Do you want to tell members the experts who selected Du Toit knows nothing about rugby and you do?   That is rather rich coming from you.  

Nov 05, 2019, 13:57

Rather rich coming from me? Considering the source, that's laughable. You are the one who claims that the most decorated 10 in South African history is the worst 10 of all time. You claim that the coach who presided over a span of 23 tests unbeaten by all but New Zealand, keeping us consistently second, that with a team that had lost 9 legends of Bok rugby, is the worst coach of all time. You also claim that Jake White, a man universally revered within the game by all of its greatest minds, a man World Rugby has utilised to develop the game, is also the worst coach of all time. Then there is Ludeke, the most successful South African super rugby coach in history. You claim he too is the worst coach of al time. 

Lets face it Lügnerin, you are a terrible source of insight. Possibly... the worst of all time! :D

It wouldn't be the first time that I was ahead of the curve on conventional thought. The day you shied away from that video of Steph's dozen missed tackles in Wellington (in one half) was the day you unveiled your willful ignorance. You cannot nor will you ever be able to defend your position. It has nothing to do with facts, just raw emotion. Steph was your anti-Matfield, just as Lambie was the anti-Morné, Rassie the anti-Meyer, Jones the anti-Jake, Bissie the anti-Smit, Watson the anti-Schalk, Pretorius the anti-Butch, Pienaar the anti-Du Preez. Over and over, these mythical entities raised up to fell an out of favour warrior/genius of the game. Pure emotional twaddle. We know it's twaddle, because you cannot articulate one measly reference to justify your position. I on the other hand can cite references from every game. All consistent with match footage. Until you can match that, you will continue to be pumped full of holes. 

Nov 05, 2019, 15:03

Are you nuts - seems you are a habitual liar as well?  In which test did Du Toit missed 12 tackles liar?   

Then we have the BS about being anti anybody.  I mentioned various coaches and players of the past an provided proven statements for what I wrote,  I was never a Watson supporter - in fact the exact opposite.   No The fact is the Du Toit and threat to Matfield started off you hate campaign against Du Toit,  I never caused it,   What I wrote about Matfield was that he was just harming his reputation by coming back and he was poor in the games after his return.     Morne did not need any anti - he was anti himself from 2012 onwards,   Meyer dismissed him from the Springbok team in 2012 and in 2014 twice,   I never wrote anything about Pretorius,   Jones was brought on board by White to help with backline coaching himself and everyone else - inclusive of White himself  - believed that he had deficiencies in backline coaching which he was wise enough to realize and hence his call to Jones for help.    I never wrote anything about Smith and Bismarck.

Where you got from the above lot is basically BS.   As to the Meyer issue - you dreamed up he had all kind of qualities as a coach that nobody else could see.   I looked at Meyer as a nice person - with extremely little coaching ability,  You are the one that praised Meyer and then started attacking Erasmus endlessly.   It eventually gets under the skin of people when constant BS on site is preached by you  who really knows zero about rugby.    

Your interpretation of what happened in games has zero relationship with  reality and based entirely on prejudice.   Then there are BS about weak upper body BS on De Allende and total shit like that about Du Toit,  

Anyway I tried to get some logic back on site and you ended up causing more reason for you being called a total BSter with zero knowledge about the game.                           

Nov 05, 2019, 15:15

I have never had a hate campaign against any player. The hate rests with you. How about your outburst against "cuntfield" after his MOM performance in his final test? Or de Jongh, the subhuman who should have been thrown out instead of the afterbirth? Or Fat Frans, a grotesque and worthless pig? I could go on. You seem to depersonalise those who displease you. Quite a dangerous trait to be roaming freely in society. Always relativistic in your moral judgement. Tisk tisk. 

Nov 05, 2019, 15:26

So Peeper let's get this straight, you honestly believe Stephanie is the best rugby player in the world in 2019?

Nov 05, 2019, 15:34


That is not the point why I started this thread,   I just think neither you nor I know what made the experts who selected Du Toit as Player of the Year decided on him.   Once he was selected and  in fact all other Awards to the team and coach have been announced they should be congratulated for what they achieved and then move forward from there.   We had a bad patch in rugby for a decade and it is time to put that behind us and start looking at the future.       

Nov 05, 2019, 15:35

Ask him why he knows he is the best player. Those questions lead to much laughter, on my end. Watch them squirm. The wriggly wee wirms be hitting turbo reverse! a good wake with a shovel ought to relieve them of their delusions. :D

Nov 05, 2019, 15:42

Hey Piss Mint

You might want to correct your last post, where you say that those who think that this is a "hox" …..might want to post some links as proof.....

It does not bother me at all...…….but everyone and their cousin on this forum..... knows exactly how you selectively attack people who make spelling mistakes, and how you detest grammatical errors, so I am just offering you the opportunity to do the right thing here, so that you don't get caught out or called up on it..... because you have done it so many times before, yet I have not yet offered you this opportunity before......

I would hate for someone to call you a proper doos, twat.... or a hypocrite..... for doing the same thing that you blame others for doing all the time.

Always here to help


Nov 05, 2019, 15:43


Are you a better rugby expert than the experts who selected Du Toit as Player of the Year?  Apparently you are a prejudiced idiot that believes you are.   Nobody on this site selected  Du Toit is the Player of the Year - you do not know why - neither do I.   Nobody squirm about anything - but you in fact do.    LMAO

Nov 05, 2019, 15:49

"So Peeper let's get this straight, you honestly believe Stephanie is the best rugby player in the world in 2019?"

What I believe doesn't matter. What I do know for a fact is that Pieter-Steph du Toit is the current World Player of the Year . . . and he's holding the trophy that proves it.

Nov 05, 2019, 15:49

How many of them analysed even a minute of his game? This is where you all fail, you make assumptions. In 2015, when Damian singlehandedly tanked the Wallaby test, everyone knew he was the best 12 in world rugby. Inspite sparking zero attacking play, he was integral. Video assessment proved differently. Just like Lambie's botched 2014 Twickenham performance. You followed the experts, the video showed something quite different. Your very last form of defence is that the video is biased or erroneous, yet you can never prove any such thing. Splicing clips of every action in a test is ironclad. You'll find that out, yet again in the coming days! 

Nov 05, 2019, 16:26

So you don't believe he is the best player in the world.....nor do I. 

Nov 05, 2019, 16:33

A South African player had to be given the World Player of the year, given all of the allocates that the Boks received. 

If not Steph Dutoit, then who would it be? 

Kolbe? Maybe. Faff, possibly. Marx has not been in top form. 

Nov 05, 2019, 16:40

Faf, Thor and Eben were our constants. I'd personally have given it to someone else. No South African stood-out as the best individual player in the tournament. Of the players selected, neither Steph nor Kolbe qualify, although the latter did provide moments of individual magic. 

Nov 05, 2019, 17:00

So he's a symbol.....so what's the criteria for a symbol? Blond hair....I can relate to that! My guess though is popularity. The Beast, Vermeulen, Faff, Pollard, Etzebeth, Kolbe .....all had more to do with our knockout wins.

The obvious choice was the Beast.....a long term great Springbok.....his destruction of Coles was the thing that broke England on the scoreboard and broke their confidence. And he was dominant in every game he played.

Nov 05, 2019, 17:10

Vermuelen was good all tournament, Beast was too. 

Nov 05, 2019, 17:10


Nov 05, 2019, 17:10


Nov 05, 2019, 17:10


Nov 05, 2019, 17:12

What I believe doesn't matter. What I do know for a fact is that Pieter-Steph du Toit is the current World Player of the Year . . . and he's holding the trophy that proves it."

Technically, nope. What you can say for a fact is that he has received enough votes from a very small sample of selectors to be named the Player of the Year? Whether he is indeed the best, is still up for debate. 

Nov 05, 2019, 17:13

Let's not forget Steyn...

Please, can we call him "The Two Time" from now on?

Frans "The 2 Time" Steyn!

Has a great ring to it. I'm sure we all agree.

Nov 05, 2019, 17:22

We can all have our own player of the year, but there is also an official one which is decided by the IRB commitee which includes some of the most established players to have graced the game. 

Nov 05, 2019, 17:27

Image result for beating a dead horse gif

Nov 05, 2019, 17:44

Well I think that du Toit is an excellent player.

I for one do not believe that any one player can be the best in the world and have global support to back up those claims.

We all have our "special players" and cannot/will not allow ourselves to be open and honest with respect to other players of excellence.

The fact is that he was voted in as the best rugby player of 2019 and we cannot change that.....so live with it and move on.

Well done PSDT.

Many of us rugby followers are proud of your player of the year award.


Nov 05, 2019, 17:52

This as 2019 and the dumb fool refers to 2015 in a match against Australia - where the real BS started about De Allende.  He made 15 tackles that day and missed 6 .  That is a very gigh number of tackles by a backline player anyway,   However, since then De Allende's defense became a hell of a lot better and there is no problem with his defense at present.   

What the fool claims is laughable - how does he know De Allende has a weak upper body.  De Allende in the WC in 2015 made 9 turnovers at breakdowns.  The idiot is  too stupid to realize that with a weak upper body that would be impossible,

When I mentioned the story to one of the present Springboks in December last year he was amazed by the stupidity of the statement and he played many matches with De Allende in the team.  It is that kind of BS that demeans the quality of discussions on site to a farcical level.

Nov 05, 2019, 17:58

Just a pity when presented with 2 Open field tackles on May and Watson Dud missed both. Fortunately Frans was there to save the try Watson was set to score.

Nov 05, 2019, 18:10

No Mozart 

Watson fell down after Steyn factually also missed the tackle and since Watson was not held he could have got up and scored the try was it not for Du Toit who got to him and prevented him from going further - in the process Warson knocked the ball on.   Remember always to tell the full story and then there can be no uncertainty as to what actually happened. 

Nov 05, 2019, 18:15

Nope he didn't  fall down...he was knocked down in Space by Frans  after Dud Allende couldn't even lay a glove on him. Dud Toit then dove on the player on the ground and should have been penalized.

Now tell us why Dud Allende missed May who was dead stopped in his in goal area....that was a beaut! Cost us a great try scoring chance.

Nov 05, 2019, 18:40

It was not a tackle more a bump than a tackle attempt by Steyn.  You talk about a bump - that would also have been a potential penalty as well since Steyn did not use his arms at all in the process.    The fact is the player who really saved the try was Du Toit - not Steyn or De Allende.  

He dived on the legs of the player - not a penalizable offence anyway,  

Mozart you know that De Allende was in no position to make that tackle you said he should have made. - he was not near enough to May to tackle him or even try to tackle him.   At best he was at least three to four meters away from May.   

Please keep to facts  for a change.   


Nov 06, 2019, 09:50

Seriously...what is the matter with you lot??? I can only assume you actually like each other and just love the toxic banter.

You've just won the RWC FFS!!!!!!!... the rugby championship...team of the year..player of the year and coach of the year.

Enjoy the moment...feel good?

....now you know how it feels...I've had many years of this feeling...enjoy it while it lasts.

Nov 06, 2019, 10:30


Why was Mostert dropped from the starting line-up after the AB WC game.   Let me take some time and explain the reason.

In the first instance the Erasmus master plan was tested in many games with the objective of seeing whether players are capable of participation properly  in executing the plan and when they came short they were getting the chop from the starting line-up or from the squad.  Mostert  however obviously failed in a number of matches and in the test I referred to he was also a negative.  .  

Secondly Mostert missed the tackle that ended up in a try being scored by the AB's.   It was not the first time  Mostert failed in making such tackles in the past year - so that must have been influencing the decision to drop him from the starting line-up in crucial tests.              

Nov 06, 2019, 10:32

Razor, it's the Saffa way...we love to disagree on everything...and nothing is ever good enough, we'll always find something to complain about...on the flipside, we always find something to be positive about too, even when all seems lost.

Nov 06, 2019, 10:44

The celebrations ended Saturday evening. Back to business :D

Nov 06, 2019, 10:55


Agree with you wholeheartedly and am enjoying the win.   Problem is that some members on site has been on an anti-Erasmus campaign for years now and the fact that the Springboks won after their totally negative attacks on them has more to do with personal protection against retorts by other members than what actually happened in the games. 

I am very happy about the way the AB's manhandled the Wales team and fact is the two top ranking positions clearly indicates how the two top rugby teams in the world should in fact being rated all the time.    

Nov 06, 2019, 14:13

Mozart you know that De Allende was in no position to make that tackle you said he should have made. - he was not near enough to May to tackle him or even try to tackle him.   At best he was at least three to four meters away from May.   

Please keep to facts  for a change.  

Yes, clearly three to four meters away. Let's keep to the facts, as ou Mike says :P Note the tackle opportunity was once May had moved outside the goal area, Moz.

Nov 06, 2019, 14:18

Thanks Pakie - I thought initially De Allende where further away from May/   

Nov 06, 2019, 14:21

Er, you thanked me? You're not going to tell me I doctored the pic or used deceptive angles? Jewish lady must have made you a very nice lunch today. But you're welcome Mike, it's important to get these things right when discussing the game.

Nov 06, 2019, 14:27

No comment

Nov 06, 2019, 15:17

Pakie, in some of your and some of the other posters' spats with Maaik, you guys sometimes give the impression that you are "attacking" some of the Boks. Oom Maaik is a bit overprotective about some of his "likes" and overly "aggressive" in his "dislikes":D  ...and so enthusiastic in his defense/offence, he loses a bit of perspective at times...as do we all...I was surprised too when he conceded his error after the pic....

I'm also surprised that people noticed so many errors, even after watching it again, I hardly noticed big errors and almost always felt comfortable about how the Boks were playing. I started feeling confident while observing our players during the anthem, and that confidence stayed with me right up until the end. Obviously a bit nervous because anything can happen...and does, but our cover defense was outstanding.

We won the RWC, I think we can be less critical of players till their next match at least.

Nov 06, 2019, 16:13

I don't attack. I call a spade a spade. Emotional types and I have a low level of mutual compatibility, though. It's too real for them. Hence my name. :D

Nov 06, 2019, 16:48

Draad so much of rugby is hot air......'too much gas', 'huge engine', 'crushing tackle', 'so physical' etc etc.

But these labels are applied subjectively to players....there is a 'what really happened factor'. It's investigative work ....fun. Stephanie is seemingly the nicest bloke in the Boks set up, that doesn't change the objective assessment, but it certainly warps the subjective view.

Why the truth is so offensive to some posters is a mystery.....but their patently dishonest squawking just makes it more fun to show what really happened.

Nov 06, 2019, 16:51

True Auge, but your views are bias too...i'ts the human condition...you have a very systematic way of presenting your facts and you have an unique way of analyzing the game, but you can be too critical at times...You have your blind spots too...your likes and dislikes.

Rassie managed to create a team environment where the sum was more than the individual parts...you have recognized in a previous post I think. There will always be the possibility of a better player or combination, but if you have less than 2 years to prepare for a RWC, you must settle on your most-likely-best-team and the game plan to suit them best...and then you must stick to your guns and see it through. That is exactly what Rassie and his team did, and they timed it to perfection. Our team peaked in the final...warts and all, we are the rugby world champions for the next 4 years. Yes, there are room for improvement of the personnel and the game plan, but we have a great platform to build from...gradually...we have that luxury ATM and the team earned it....and it seams that some on here does not want to give them the credit they deserve for it.

Nov 06, 2019, 19:52

EGG mountains of EGG have landed. The Trio have nowhere to go. 

Nov 06, 2019, 22:41

But yet they stand fast...they have higher standards than a wee rugby world cup!

Nov 07, 2019, 01:47

Razor...it is what it is....hang around you'll get used to it or you'll get sick of it but one thing for sure, it ain't gonna change.:D

Nov 07, 2019, 07:39

But yet they stand fast...they have higher standards than a wee rugby world cup!

Draad, as Moz said, for some of us it's fun to take the game down to a play by play level. We like to dig deeper than "LEKKA BOKKE YES BOYS!". Everyone can make of it what they want, ignore it, ridicule it, disagree with it, whatever. For me digging into individual plays, following a single player around to see what they actually get involved in during the 80 minutes, that's the interesting part.

Nov 07, 2019, 08:08


If digging deeper only entail to demonize and belittle certain players or anybody else is not aimed on real and objective analysis so  it is total BS and that remains why especially Mozart and AO "digs deeper".     There is never  a positive word of any of the players subjected  to "dig deeper" - it all goes around only certain players and not everyone.   If the players they try and dig up faults - often imaginary ones - they ignore positive contribution totally.

What dig deeper means should not be what they make it out to be and you are not entirely innocent about it either.   On the whole such "digging deeper" is totally worthless and negative BS..     .  

Nov 07, 2019, 11:33

Mike...there's a song called "Tragedy"...would you like to hear it?

Nov 07, 2019, 15:07

It would be easy to lose one's breakfast reading Muck's holier than thou rants, knowing what he has said about Vermeulen, Jantjies, Pollard, Mostert and Louw among many others.

Hypocrite doesn't even begin to cover it. 

Nov 07, 2019, 15:33

Did I say anything negative about any of the players who played in Japan after the WC?    Fact is I  said near to zero because there were sound reasons why Jantjies was NOT playing in the play-off games and why Mostert and Louw was on the bench and not in the starting side in those games. 

What Beeno said elsewhere that this is all an effort to get out of the corner into which you painted yourself into - sad to say.    What I said about Vermeulen and Louw before the tests this year is mild compared the malignant attacks on players you have been starting hundreds of threads about.   So I have reason for what I wrote on site.  I caused for some levelness in dealing with issues - but you apparently are not interested on objective assessment of anything,     . 

Nov 07, 2019, 18:28

Maaik, you didn't exactly acknowledge your mistakes regarding them either.:D

Nov 07, 2019, 22:45

Here Mike....just for you...now quit droning and enjoy.

Nov 07, 2019, 23:53

Vok, but that's a tragic song ...... be shocking to listen to with a babelaas.

ouMaaik when I saw the heading, I thought, sheeit who's dead ..... the board's shutting ..... Beano's been granted moderator status.

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