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Allende better than Kuridrani?

Forum » Rugby » Allende better than Kuridrani?

May 24, 2019, 17:46

Believe it or not, there were some on here who claimed Allende was a superior centre to Kuridrani. . Even when Kuridrani owned him to win a test for Oz.

Looking at today's game I was struck by the line Kuridrani ran to set up the first Brumbies try.....pure Joe Cool. Why can't our centres since JdV master the hard cut onto the ball....into the gap?

May 24, 2019, 17:50

Because Kolisi receives those passes and run those lines....deception...:D

May 24, 2019, 18:20

Kuridrani has done nothing all season. He is definitely not better than de Allende who happens to be a 12.

Unfortunately under useless Pote the Bulls play unimaginative rugby. The backs either crash it up or put in aimless kicks.

Gelant has moved from an exciting attacking threat to a player who’s first instinct is to kick it aimlessly.

May 24, 2019, 18:28

Is there a single great backline coach in the country. I can't think of any. 


May 24, 2019, 18:58

One can see De Allende improving.

Problem is that it's taken him five years to learn what he should have in one.

May 24, 2019, 19:04

Plum, in mu opinion he has gone backwards in the last 5 years...software needs to be updated pronto...couple of drivers missing. Windows 10 can be difficult at times.

May 25, 2019, 00:14

He has gone backwards over 5 years, and even then he was massively inferior to Kuridrani. Allende is more of a concept than a contributing rugby player......stick with moz.

May 25, 2019, 00:33

Beenz, who were the great backline coaches in the 80's? Carel...Danie...or maybe ...

May 25, 2019, 01:31

"Is there a single great backline coach in the country. I can't think of any."

It's hard to believe that there were decent backline coaches back in the day, how could there be if they played a 10 man game with a "gameplan" based on the boot and raw talent. A 10 man game negates a backline coach.

May 25, 2019, 01:50

Mozart

You started off with Bausteraud and the Kuridrani and then Kerevi about how they are better than anything SA can offer.    Now it is back to Kuridrani - who is not even in the Aussie starting line-up anymore. 

What the hell are you on about?   Kuridrani scored against very poor defense on the part of the Bulls and now suddenly he is world class again.    So lets get to the Bulls backline defense:-

*     Tackles made   -     36

*     Tackles missed  -    17

*     Possession handovers   -    7

*     Missed tackle ratio       -   32,9

This kind of BS is laughable and really showed another bout of rugby ignorance.    

May 25, 2019, 02:03

Mike, with all due respect it's not hard to better anything South Africa has to offer when it comes to backline play. An oldie but a goodie...."In the land of the blind the one-eyed man is King."

May 25, 2019, 02:09

Agree but assessments should be realistic - not based on amateurish fables.

May 25, 2019, 05:33

This is realistic.....Kuridrani would walk the Springbok team

May 25, 2019, 07:24

Allende has started to support slightly more, kicks bit and wraps attackers slightly better.

What made him good five years back was his step. That's gone awol now.

May 25, 2019, 07:26

In the absence of any real 12s, I still think Kwagga may as well be slotted in there for the Boks.

At least he'll run straight, make his tackles and bust a few. Oh, he offloads too.

May 25, 2019, 09:23

Mozart

Hahaha - when Mozart supports selection of any player just go for the opposite and you will be always correct.   

May 25, 2019, 10:14

Plum you and I agree with this but the trend here in SA is to take promising backs and turn them into loose forwards of which we typically have an abundance. 

Too many of the oaks here think that is real smart but of course is insane. 

With an up to scratch backline we would be unbeatable even with a bent kiwi ref officiating. 

You could put the best backline player in the world into say the Bulle backline and he would look like a duffer. 

Last decent backline we had featured Nass, Danie, Carel etc. Many years ago. They ripped the wee abs apart. 

May 25, 2019, 15:00

With Jean and Habana were as good as any two backs in the game back in 2005.

May 25, 2019, 17:12

Must always talk about the past - never the present or the future/   

May 25, 2019, 20:19

True, especially when the point I'm responding to references our rugby circa 1988.

May 26, 2019, 05:01

Mozart

The real top backline players were playing before the ban introduced in the 1980's when there was a different game played to what is became in the 1990's and subsequently.  In the 1990's  the Springboks started off  playing an extremely restricted game plan where the backline players ere selected to defend only and the kick and case game became the norm.   

This approach progressively became worse and worse = it became so bad that by 2007 White to his credit realized that there was a huge problem in the making and called in Eddie Jones as an advisor in backline play.    The backline players afterwards admitted that Jones taught them some things they were never taught by any coach.   

Even the great try scorers like Habana and De Villiers had to use individual abilities and create opportunities for themselves to score tries.   The situation got worse and worse and under Meyer became the worst ever.    The fact is the emphasis became virtually totally the kicking game and for that Morne was the epitome.   Kicking is certainly part of the game and all teams use it - but the problem is that there  was no way a usable kicking game was developed and implemented in SA = there was no difference made between good and poor kicking.   The fact is the kicking became totally predictable and of an extremely poor quality.       

The problem was not only Meyer - who even publicly said that SA players do not have the skills to play a ball-in-hand game - it went even wider and became a joke on Super Rugby level as well.    In 2013 the Cheetahs started to develop  new game approach and they did very well by reaching the play-off stage.  The other Unions started a raiding expedition against them, - but what happened then?   The coaches who chased them ended up coaching their laying skills out of them.

Despite that the Lions picked up on something and as early as 2014 became the top performing SA team in Super Rugby basically using a ball-in-hand approach to the game.   Despite the evidence of the Lions the approach of Meyer was pathetic - he flatly refused to have any Lions players in the 2015 WC.   

So lets look at what happened under Meyer as well.   He was forced to use Le Roux as from 2013 to play Le Roux at full back.    Initially he was  like a fresh new breath in backline play - but by 2015 all his enthusiasm was gone and  Meyer used Kirchner in the Japan disaster as a full back.    He was then brought back into the team for the remainder of the WC tests - but he was flat and made mistakes left right and center.   The game plan used by Meyer in 2015 did not allow for anything for use by backline players.

I have became cynical about backline coaching and the game plans of SA coaches - whether on National or Super Rugby level.   I often made the remark that players who came on board looking relatively good skills became flat and it became more and more evident that skills were coached out of players.

Le Roux went to play in England and soon became the dynamic player he used to be.   This became evident last year when he played for the Springboks.   Players like de Allende was very good in 2-14 and lost every skill he had when Meyer got hold of him.  

Thus year he started to show more of the player he used to be and yesterday he showed his real worth in the game as an example.   He ahs been good in virtually all games he played this year and nobody seems to realize that.   Maybe the games he played in Japan helped him a bit - the SA coaches did not him anywhere.

It is a fact that under a string of SA coaches since 2000 the development of backline players stopped and we ended up with a situation where there are constant bleating about poor backline players without looking at the real reason for the deficient development of backline players.   I think a person should rather look at what went wrong - why was it that backline players with rare exceptions showed no development in SA since 1992,   With rare exception all coaching of backline players went missing and that is a fact nobody wants to recognize or deal with.  

Fact is players like De Allende and Kriel showed signs of improvement this year for the first time since Meyer and Coetzee got hold of them and did their best to destroy them as players.   So the attack on the players should stop and we should rather look at the defective and even destructive role of the SA coaches insofar as backline player development is concerned,  

                            

      

 
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