I think it's unanimous, Sacha is the best back in SA. Looking like he might not just be the best 10 to come out of SA, but like he would be the best 15 or 13 to if you chose to play him there.

I'd put my money on him eclipsing Dan carter, and probably anybody else on the world stage too. I don't like hype trains but can't seem to find the door to exit this one. Every bit of evidence suggests that Sacha is SA's Messi.

So, the question...

How do you build around him and who do you choose.

Looking at the score he made on the weekend, after being tackled in the air, DDP was just quick enough to keep up and receive his pass. Would DDA have been there? Of course not.

Looking at at the support line he ran for one his scores against Benneton, tells you that you'll get maximum benefit from Sacha by selecting a twelve that will take contact and then find the wonder-kid with an offload.

DDA doesn't fit the bill. He just doesn't. So who is Sacha's long term partner at 12? Is Willemse the guy? I still feel like AE is the option. I don't think he can keep up with Sacha but I do think that gain line advantage will give Sacha front ball and allow him to escalate momentum. In terms of maximising the Sacha advantage, perhaps there's an outside pick that we're all missing.

For me, it's Williams at 9. A no-brainer by all accounts. Williams is the fastest 9 in world rugby and crispy as all hell with his passing. He'll give Sacha more time than anybody else, by far, and that's exactly what I'd want.

Looking at how Sacha is 21 and beat Connacht on his own. Seeing how he takes sniffs of chances and makes something bankable from them, you simply have to build a side around him. You can't just pick your BIP players and roll on.

If you do pick players that will benefit him the most, and you get an extra 20% out of him, you simply have to go that route because an extra 20% from Sacha is worth more than an extra 200% from anybody else.

What do yas think?

Who would you put around Sacha?

Sacha

A combination of Sacha and De Allende worked out very well and was successful in 2024 - so for the time being the top 12 in the world according to rugby experts will be the best choice at 12. That is also what Sacha will prefer, An example was in the Aussie test - where Sacha made a clean break through the Aussie backline - ran for about 30 meters and passed the ball to De Allende and he in turn drew in the last defenders and passed the ball to Reinach who scored under the posts.

In the case of the 12 other than De Allende the likely inside enter will be Willemse. There are no other real 12's that is always mentioned on site - Eaterhuizen is as thick as a brick when it come to rugby and is physical - but deficient in pace. Hooker and Kriel are both not physial enough to play on test level at 12 - and will do better as 13 or on the wings and even at full back, - where they will be good back-ups,

As to scrumies I think Williams is the best option - but I will as back-ups prefer Van den Berg, Jantjies or Papier as back-ups - Reinach being too old to play at scrummie on test level in future, ,

I am not sure what will happen in the upcoming July tests, I doubt whether Sacha will even play in the tests against Georgia and IIaly and the same applies to Pollard,

,

Mike,

Here's a question you won't answer.

Who is faster, AE or DDA?

Here's the answer: AE has both more acceleration and top speed than DDA.

If you dispute this we can hold a vote on this board to prove it to you or you could simply search some videos and look for yourself.

So, is DDA slow?

Hooker not physical enough? You are joking, right?

DDA = 102Kgs and 189cm

Hooker = 98Kgs and 194cm...and still a baby. He could get to 105-108 quite easily.

I really like Hooker at 12 with sacha at 10. That is a mouthwatering prospect. Hooker has that dog in him that always wants to chase play and i think he'll work well off of Sacha. Also, one of the few 12 contenders that can keep up with Sacha in terms of pace.

A good long-term combo, based on current form anyway.

EggChasers says...

" A combination of Sacha and De Allende worked out very well and was successful in 2024"

Sacha usually bypassed The Tractor

( DDA ) by well placed kicks for our fast wings.

Or he found space on his own with good runs beating defenders, and then passing the ball to Kolbe, Arendse, Kriel and Fassi/Willie.

To my recollection there was absolutely no positive interaction between Sacha and The Dud. ( Like running of Sacha into space for example)

When John Deere gets the ball, he runs straight into contact and the ball dies with him…..as usual he is a Cul de Sac.

For now I would definitely start AE more as he is capable of creating space.

Much better at offloading the ball….Very very good at pulling in defenders and so creating more space for his Backline to run off.

We definitely need a new 12 that can embrace the teachings of Brown and improve our Backline play.

Hooker is definitely a option, but I really hope that Rickus Pretorius will come back to SA to be considered.

Is JJ injured?? My favourite to join Pretorius or Hooker would be Henco. But JJ should also be given a shot, to see how he does….

DDA

DDA by a poverbial mile, Besides from that DDA has rugby intelligence totally absent in AE. DDA is always vey close to where the action is - AE is n0ot, That is why he scored tries against the AB's or play a role in scoring such tries - with Anever present in such cases,

A vote on the board is meaningless - bbecause to man members have prejudice against De Allende because they prefer thick players like AE.

Rugby ex[perts over the last 5 ears has rated the llende as the top no 12 in thew orld and that counts wth me as well.

Manpower

I gave one example of a ty against the Aussies wer scored last year already. I also accept what Pollard said about De Allende - namely that he is the best inside center he ever oplayed with and that include De Villiers. Sorry - but you miss the main criterium present and required from a 12 - namely to be a physical player woith intelligent play also a requirement. That is why De Allende score tries and AE does not, .

The wfollowin g quote applies 100% to Estrhuizen:-

"When John Deere gets the ball, he runs straight into contact and the ball dies with him…..as usual he is a Cul de Sac."

Esterhuizen has poor ball skills and the ball dies since he does run striaght into the imaginary cu-de-sac you wrote about. He loses more balls in turnovers, If Engelbrecht is tacked with the ball is turned over he gets baclk slowly to his position - - the same does not happen to DDA.

I agree with rugby experts world-wide about DDA and that is why he got contrcts overseas and AE got found out and had to come back to SA. The Japanese clubs playing a pace-linked game would not offer AE a job as water carrier.

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Plum, both DdA and AE are on the slow side for centers... I like AE and I think he's good enough for the Bokke, but I think Damian is slightly better...and faster...but it would be interesting to see what the rest think...will probably follow the normal lines.

" AE got found out and had to come back to SA"

Do you have prove that this is why Esterhuisen came home?? I smell BS here big time.

AE was a standout player for Harlequins.

If he is so useless as you make him out to be, why did Harlequins keep him for 4 seasons??

Just remember uncle Mike, Kak praat is n siekte:)

Rassie & Brownie will need to rethink our attack game plans with our Zuluman at the helm .

I'm not convinced that either of the two(DDA and AE) have the necessary skills to play alongside Sasha. I don't know who is best to fill the position but he must have good running skills and a desire to run the ball, he must also have natural speed off the mark that way there's speed from 9 to 14.

Rassie & Brownie will need to rethink our attack game plans with our Zuluman at the helm .

Not sure if anyone can make up a plan for these guys, if they do I reckon it goes out the window as soon as the game kicks off.

Sasha will get the best out of the players around him...it will get better gradually as he plays with them...exiting times!

Scha alrezdy plaid wifo the Springboks agaainst the A;; Blacks and Wallabies with teh ecosting bacline players and the rethink is not necesary..

He as and is goin g t be the pivot and the othe players he aleady played with is thier to furthe built out the emphasis on backline attacking play here the loosies also play a major role.

Anybody but DDA.

AE gives you gain line advantage, an offload, excellent hands, beastly power and, as Mike will tell you, he's got great rugby IQ.

Hooker gives you, pace youth and since he's in Sacha's age bracket, it has long term benefits if they start playing together now.

DDA gives you "Ima run into everyone, make no ground, stand up for a while, give the defence 6 years to reset... and then go read Ruckers cos Mike and Dave are the only two fans I have left."

For the moment AE….longer term Hooker looks the business. There is absolutely no merit in having a crash baller like Dud at 12. Here’s the distinction.

Sacha passes to Dud who immediately slows down to take contact, he tractors in place refusing to go down but eventually capitulates. The ball is retained and it comes back to Sacha one meter from where he got it before facing a stacked defense

Sacha passes to Esterhozen….he hits his opponent at pace, then deflty offloads to Sacha as he wraps around Sexton style…..Sacha is now in the gap between 12 and 13 channel with some space to operate. Only good things can happen.

We'll see...

Esterhuizen is definitely not the answer considering he is already 31

Sacha is an unbelievable talent - the hype of late has been DuPont but Sacha is even better without a doubt

Who to build around him at 10?

Inside him it has to be Williams with vd Bergh the next best. I like Papier and Nohamba and did like Jayden Hendrikse but am starting to question that - hopefully it’s just a form thing

At 12 the obvious choice for me is 98kg Willemse - a combative talent with a craving to attack. Back ups at 12 are Hooker, David Kriel and Jordan Hendrikse

At 13 we have young options in Jurenzo Julius, Moodie and Henco v Wyk

On the wings, Arendse is a certainty as is Kolbe for now, but at 31 the clock is ticking. Backups are Edwil vd Merwe, Horn, Moodie and Green if Rassie is savvy enough to cap him

At fullback it has to be Fassi with Jordan Hendrikse, Willemse and Moodie as options

This combination excites me in the near future - 9 Williams 10 Sacha 11 Arendse 12 Willemse 13 JJ 14 Moodie 15 Fassi

The fact s that Dave is right - the choice at 12 if changed is Willemse. The beutuful picture of Al and Mozart is total prejudiced shit. If there is a crashballer ot is St Esterhuizeen. H is sklo nd gettinmg slower. Watch he second try scored by Ulster against the Sharks and see how Eaterhuizen;s slow jog back where a loose scum developed and there was no ball poction and the ulste playe got he ball and scored with A E at ful pace was not at te 22 yet.

In recent matches AE showed again his ball skills are deficient - and his tendency to knock balls on has been in exiostence at the time of the Under 20 WC and that is also t he reason why at 31 he has no try scored a try at center for the Sprngboks in 21 tests, The one case he had the opportunity to score a try for the Springboks in 2019 he knocked the ball passed to him - similar to the case where he did when playing for the Under 20's in teh final losing the Under 20 final for the Juniors

That is why under Erasmus he was not in the 2019 RWC squad, When given the oppostrtunity to play with Sacha he fucked up royally by getting red carded 3 minutes after the start of the match and got a 4 week ban as a result.

Rassie had it with that guy - he is eveything and worse at it than Plum, and Mozart describe in their day dreams about playing him at center, He was not in the RWC squad in 2019 for the reasons gven by me - a waste of balls when he was center - so when Kriel was injured Erasmus called up the newbie Willemse to replace Kriel. In the tess Willemse played for the Boks he scored 56 poinmts for them - in the case of Esterhuizen = even against Georgia and Tonga in the 2023 RWC his contribution was one big zero.

But then conveniently it was forgottem by the two of you De Allendde did scored a try and played a major role in the Springboks to beat France - a team I beieve is rated higher than Tonga and Romania, Mozart still believe in the if and buts - and faied to accept that the Springbks did win the RWC trophy in 2023.

The whole arguments of Plum and others are based om prejudicial BS to give it an exact descri[tion and n their world of delusion De Allende is worse at centter than AE, With Willemse returning from injuy Esterhuizen is totally out of contention for a place at 12 and I think Erasmus will not select the slow donkey AE playing at center.

Last year he was given the opportunity to play in a test to see how he adjust to the changed format of attacking play and he faled horribly - a red card within 3 minutes intothe game he got red-carded an d copped ban of 4 weeks and that is near t end of his career as a Sprinbok player,

Btw "Plum, both DdA and AE are on the slow side for centers"

I refute this claim.

DDA is slow, very slow.

AE is quicker and stronger than DDA. I would venture that AE is quick enough to play at 13. I would never dream of playing DDA there.

Watch the first break against NZ...there is a second or two where you see his pace versus the AB backs. They'd not have caught him were it not for the 15 in the way. That is not slow for an inside or outside centre.

This would have been my 12 from day one in the job.

Let’s have a bit of perspective about Sacha boys for fucks sake!

Yes, he’s very talented but he’s only had one season of test rugby. According to Plum he’s going to blitz Dan Carter’s record and we also have Suffolk saying he’s already better than Dupont!!

You’ve gone completely over the top about his prospects and I only hope he’s not reading this shit otherwise he’ll end up under unbearable pressure!

moolaa, you're right and Sacha does look like he might be injury prone . . . but you also have to understand how long it's been since we had a talent like this in the #10 jersey rather than just a mindless kicker.

Of course we're excited! We might actually use our backline in the future.

There is no way in hell Esterhuizen is faster and stronger than DA

Strength probably par and de Allende is quicker without doubt

Sasha is the most all-around flyhalf we have had in the professional era. A fly-half needs to be able to run. kick and get his backline running. Sasha has done all of this and more.

It is early days, and Sasha does look his best when he gets space. He still has to go through tight test matches with less time and space. Also, how he copes behind a losing pack where he has to play most of the game in his own half.

Far too early to compare him to Dan Carter, but a damsight better than any 2nd choice alternative in SA.

Sorry, Moola...

The hype train's choo'ing too loudly... can't hear ya.

Sacha has been phenomenal. Every time he plays he just does amazing stuff and it pays dividends.

The hype actually matches what we see on the field.

It's very difficult not to get excited.

If he has a full career, I can't see it not being an amazing one.

"It is early days, and Sasha does look his best when he gets space. He still has to go through tight test matches with less time and space. Also, how he copes behind a listing pack where he has to play most of the game in his own half."

Did you watch the All Blacks tests last year where Sacha was the difference at the end?

His territorial game nullified both Dmac and Baudie when it really mattered.

So there ain't much evidence, but the evidence that does exist points to him already having passed your test, VisKop.

The All Blacks are not as good as they used to be, so more needs to be proven,like how he plays in the northern hemisphere

Well we are apparently the rugby masters of the universe at the moment and the ABs ran us very close twice last year.

In one of the games they had the lead until the last 6 or so minutes and could easily have won.

So they can't be that shit.

Agree on the NH challenge though.

England and France are the best NH sides at the moment. Will be good to see how Sacha does in the against French away from home. Of course Ireland will be a challenge too...but less so.

Quickness depends in part on reaction time….Esterhozen reacts way faster than Dud Allende who suffers from brain lock.

Looking at the Esterhozen tackles in the video there is something else Dud never does ….put in a massive tackle. I can’t ever recall seeing Dud Allende crush an opponent. Cling to him …yes…annihilate him nope. Actually I can’t ever remember Dud making a low tackle in space.

I don't know how anyone can think that DDA has more pace than AE.

DDA never gets away on a break because even if he does get through he is run down almost instantly.

Not only is AE a lot quicker, they're not even in the same speed bracket. DDA has the pace of a slow flanker. Seriously Kolisi is faster.

And strength wise, AE is in Eben's strength bracket. That's how he manages to hold up three forwards on his try line.

Indeed Moz, he seems incapable of making aggressive tackles. Am, a 13, has made bigger hits than DDA has in the same time period.

The guy does absolutely zero for me. Nada.

It looked like the hooker, the flyhalf and scrumhalf.

https://www.reddit.com/r/rugbyunion/comments/1k2s8nr/andre_esterhuizen_holds_up_3_attackers_in_front/

Chat: "Between Damian de Allende and André Esterhuizen, Damian de Allende is generally considered the faster of the two.

Here's why:

1. Playing Style & Agility: De Allende, while a powerful and physical center, is known for his agility and acceleration in tight spaces. He often breaks the line with short bursts and clever angles.
2. Body Type & Speed: Esterhuizen is bulkier and more of a direct, crash-ball runner. His size (around 112–115 kg) affects his top-end speed, whereas De Allende (around 100–105 kg) is leaner and quicker over distance.
3. On-field Evidence: Watching their games for the Springboks or clubs (Munster and Harlequins, respectively), De Allende shows more frequent line breaks and cover defense involving pace, while Esterhuizen dominates more through brute force.

In short, De Allende likely has better acceleration and top-end speed, while Esterhuizen has the edge in raw power.

Thats means nothing Draad.

Chat is terrible at that sort of thing when there is very little information to go on.

Watch videos...there are plenty.

I watch plenty of matches an DdA is not half as bad as you guys make him out to be...that smashing through two Poms to feed Kolbe for his try was epic.

Who cares who’s the fastest? Fact is Esterhuisen is better at tackling, better at pulling in defenders and still manages to offload so the game will go on…

DDA causes the ball to die and forming rucks is all he does…

now and then he will get a open run in to score which necessitates zero skill from him.

AE is definitely the more intelligent player, and that is what’s needed in the midfield. Not a robot….

Bonus is his raw strength as sharks video showed holding up 3 defenders… Wow.

Plenty of acceleration...what you need from a center...take off the blinkers.

.

DDA is almost as polarising as Bozo. Not for me though. I've always maintained that DDA is not nearly as bad as his critics make him out to be and not nearly as good as his fans make him out to be. He's somewhere in between.

I don't think there's much between DDA and AE in terms of pace, defence or playing style, but if I had to choose between them, I'd pick AE right now simply because he's two years younger. He'd only be my third choice though. I still like Damian Willemse at #12 and he'd be my first choice with Ethan Hooker my second.

Buttplug just apes whatever his master says and we all know that Moffie's opinion of his pet hates like DDA and PSdT is worth nothing.

Umm Rooi...I've been slating DDA for at least the last 5 years.

In fact, I was one of the first here to notice how sub par he is.

I'd dredge up the posts if I still gave a toss about proving you wrong.

Draad, DDA used to be a lot quicker. His pace fell off a cliff over the last few years.

Well here’s an example…..take the celebrated Dud try against France. He gets the ball from a 50/50 cross kick and sets off through open field. Jelonch the bulky French number 6 is parallel with him but a few meters to his left. He reacts a little bit late as Dud enters the 22. But on the 5 meter line he gets him with a tackle from behind.

Dud gets back up and gets the pass to score.

Jelonch is no speed merchant but he caught Dud….who at best is flanker speed.

Significant try in a significant match....let's downplay it...like the one he scored in the semi vs Wales in 2019....at a pivotal point in the match...pure luck.

Nobody is downplaying the significance of the try.

But we are talking about DDA being slow.

As I mentioned before, he's on the slow side for even a loose forward. Roos is faster than he is, so is Kwagga.

In his early days he had a bit of speed, but I feel like he's lost most of it.

AE as retained his pace, and his power.

How the h ell dop you kno that Plum. De Allende scored tries when long distance attacks took place - and Englebrecht is ten tes slower than him. De Allende would beat Esterhuizen by 20 meters in a 100 meter race, By the way look at the second try and where Esterhuizen scored - he was nowhere near the action and De A llende a much reaaderof the game would have been at the breakdown point to prevent the scoring of the try.

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There is absolutely no way AE is quicker than DA not even close I don’t reckon

DA has shown pace in his time, AE never

I think one only needs to look at them to pretty much work out which is the quicker - it’s fucking obvious

One does not need CHAT

Mike, whatever you wrote, I won't read it because you don't respect anyone enough to fix your retarded spelling...when it's well within your power to do so.

That is classical Drrrraaaaad thinking…we are trying to assess Dud’s speed. I give an example and he turns it into an attack on the try. Another attempt at arguing by guilt trip.

I'm way past arguing...I shouldn't even bother...there's plenty of examples of his acceleration in the video I posted ...some of the clips quite recent...ignored...it really is a waste of time to try and convince anyone who's mind is already made up...I've seen it all before...it's fine, I can live with the fact that there are people with different opinions than my own...

Spot on Draad this notion that DA is slow is a complete joke or that AE is faster - no chance in hell

Lest we forget this gem of lazy running and lack of awareness from the best 12 in the business gifting a try to Goodhue.

Yes Pakie...he fuck up at times...that is not in dispute...the software isn't always the best.

Draad

You are wasting your time posting anything positive on De Allende. Members like Plum and Mozart do not see what they do not want to see and Mozart is quite open about it and admitted as such,

Mozart has a history about false description on what happened in matches and when chalengd on one story fo his he claimed he is the best rugby evaluator in the world and see things others do not see.

His description of an incident in the WRC final in 2019 was totally false - he invented a try-scoring opportunity that never existed and Involved Le Roux carrying a ball for about 8 meters - claiming that Willie made a clean break and carried the ball 30 meters. He then claimed that De Allende did not run for Willie to pass the ball.- the problem was that on either side of Willie was ford and Farell leaving no space for him to run into. Willie got the ball on the 10 meter line and was tackled by Ford before he reached the 22 meter line. When Willie got tackled De Allende protected the ball and got it back for the Spimgboks to launch another attack. So it was the tyical kind of BS only Mozart ca come up with.

The fact is you are wasting your time posting anything positve about De Allende. Plum would not even look at it and keepmaking statements about pace and other things he invented is bad is all he would keep repeaing on site,

The first match I saw Esterhuizen played in was the Under 20 WC Final and the icident that caused the Under 20 team the match stood out for me that the ball was passed to Estehuizen - a very clean pass and not difficult to catch with an open tryline before him. He knocked on the ball and the opportunity was gone with the Junior Boks lost th final 20-19.

Esterhuizen was given the opportunity to play in tests in 2019. He was strong - but slow and in the period 2019 to date he never scored a try fpr the Springboks, However, it could have been different - a similar incident as described above happened and he repeated the same thing knocking on the ball passed to him.

If pace is what they require for replacement of De Allende it would be Willese - he is faster than De Allende and is twice as fast as they clam Esterhuizen is, The fact remains Esterhuizen is a fringe test player aaaaaand onl selected to play for the Spingboks when other players are not available or are being rested,

Personally I am sure that Erasmus still sees the future no 12 being Willemse, Same as happened in 2019 - since Engelbrecht is one-dimensinal and not a thinking player - a good franchise player - but definitely not test material.

, ,

Pakie

Another example where one incident in a match is career-defining and that is all you remember about De Allende. Because of that incdent he is useless, What a discovery!!!

There are plenty of evderpove that what Mozart, Plum, Mpower and Pakie came up is total BS and not worthy of any further comment on BS is normally quite similar. Reason e provide proof and you on sht you dream up/

I believe what real rugby experts say about De Allende and and Du Toit - - not the prejudced shit the four of you came up with. I think that Erasmus and Browne knows more about rugby than you lot and accept the comments you write as B S you dreamed up.

One incident doesn't define him, but the pattern of him being lazy following play in defense has cost us during his career. In the example above he needed to stay between Beauden and the inside support. Instead he doddled after play like there was no trouble brewing. Goodhue, demonstrating the required urgency to fit the situation, blazed past him for an easy pass receive and an open tryline.

Mike your obsession with me is amusing, but do try to be just a little honest in your attacks. As for your example, that was exactly the same thing Pakie just posted about….Dud Allende showed no urgency in backing up Willie. He was 5 metres behind. If Allende did then what Goodhue did in Willie’s example it was try time.

These patterns seem to repeat themselves….he doesn’t learn. The Mo’unga honor guard he provided while the AB 10 cut us open, was exactly the honor guard he provided Nonu in 2015, resulting in Barrett’s match winning try.

Exactly, Pakie.

One of DDA's major downfalls is the unforced errors. The thing coaches hate, when you don't control the controllable.

Imagine guys like Roos/Willemse/Kwagga/AE in that exact same position. Hanekom will break off his own arm and chuck it at someone if it'll help the teams's cause. You know they're all gonna be giving it everything like mad Vikings chasing their doom into Valhalla's gates. That's what I want from every player on the field - frothing at the mouth and leaving everything on the field.

Everybody here watches all the Bok games. My subconscious is so chock full of images of DDA jogging behind play that it astounds me when people are surprised by instances like the above. When I think of DDA, stuff like that is basically all my mind conjures up.

Sachas try after he got tackled out of the air last weekend...you're having an absolute laugh if you think DDA would have been there like DDP was to receive the backhand pass from Sacha after the break.

Then you look at the diminutive chaps like Kolbe and Arendse. There's never a question about their commitment. Not a sniff of a hint of a thought that they may not be giving it 200% in every single game they play.

For me, when I zoom out, I look at the most of the Boks and its warrior after warrior. And then I look at DDA and I just can't figure out why he's even there. I really can't.

By the way, Moz made a comment on here once after/during a game against Oz...

The one where Eben held up against a couple of Ozzies, and offloaded to DDA to dive over for the try.

Moz commented that DDA's celebration was that of a man feeling the pressure.

I don't know if you remember the comment, Moz...but when people can read subtleties like that, then you know the more obvious stuff is a cakewalk.

It's actually rather amusing. Dave has to rely the "fog of rugby" and dress it in double layers of the Emperor's new clothes simply to support his arguments about basics...while at the other you have guys that are capable of seeing directly though everything and divining the complicated without even trying.

Lol it takes a lot of people to make a world

Mozxart

I am hones and trold yu eaxactl what you said about De A llene in the past and your insistence that you do not want to see anything positive about De A lelnce and Du Toit.

Fofr the record AE is a tackler that miss far re tackles than D e A llende did nd I saw some strong tackles in th e apst f him in many matches. Let me just remind you in 5 tests in 2018 Esterhuizen played in he made 22 tackles and missed 5. In a corresponding 5 tests in 2018 against stronger opposition De Allende made 42 tackles and missed 5. You can go and check the stats in those matches.

In 2019 RWC Du Toit and De Allende wrecked the attacks of the English backline in the final after they played havoc with the AB 's in the semi-final.

There is one thing you missed ot in and that is that AE is NOT a thinking player - in numreous matches this year for ths Sharks he was out of fhe defenssive line - he was often standing around outside the defending line. Go and check those matches videos yourself,

The fact is that rugby experts rate De Allende the best 12 in the world and I believe them not the shitspreaders on site. It is the same story you had abou Du Toit - despite the fact that experts rated him twice as Player of the Year, So keep on dreaming of hings that never happen in matches and find out why in 22 matches Esterhuizen never scored a try. In the one case in a test he played in in 2018 he repeated what he did in the under 20 WC final where he also played at 12 - he knocked on perfect passes to him in similar fashion.

One thing I am happy about - we do not have you and a few other site members selecting the Springbok team - there would have been no trophies won ever if that was the case.

.

Youa assessment of players can best be described as supreme shit - you are prejudiced and see nothing positve in plasyers you dislike ad imagine things in the case of the players you like, .

Mike...I still refuses to read anything you write until you fix your spelling.

So stay as dumb as you really are in supporting a dead head to play at 12.

I bet that dead head spells better than you do...

‘There is one thing you missed ot in’…..make up your mind is it out or is it in, the lady can usually answer the question.

Mike’s head is beyond dead, it’s mummified

Mike's head is fine...his eyes are letting him down of late.

Because I belief in truth and not daydreams and illusions I am nort acceptable to the BSers on site, I do not hate any players - I just belief in what really is performance -related, For once I wil tell you one thing - the fact that Esterhuizen never scored a try is mainly related to his inability to read games and he is not where the action really is,

Mike...I still refuses to read anything you write until you fix your spelling.

What's the fuss with 63 posts already around the header when ButtPlug has it sorted with Roos playing at 12?

Roos next to Sacha.....WOW!

Everyone agree with our boy genius Hmmmm?

What shade of lipstick didn't work out for you today, Denise?

Roos next to Sacha.....WOW!

I just realised you alway use that gif, Denise.

Kindly keep you fantasies in your mind, where they belong.

I'd ask you why Roos couldn't play at 12, but we already know you never watch rugby...yet still hand about here.

Quickly copy and paste another article for us.

ChatGPT

Query: Do an assessment of the ability of a fast and strong loose forward in rugby to play in the 12 position. Create a feasibility report

Response: Feasibility Report: Transition of a Fast, Strong Loose Forward to Inside Centre (12) in Rugby

1. Executive Summary

This report evaluates the feasibility of converting a fast, strong loose forward (flanker or No. 8) to the inside centre (12) position in rugby union. While there are some overlapping physical attributes and tactical skills, there are also significant positional differences that affect suitability. The transition is feasible but would require targeted skill development, particularly in handling, kicking, and spatial awareness.

2. Player Profile Summary

Current Position: Loose Forward (Flanker / No. 8)

Key Attributes:

1. Speed and acceleration
2. Physical strength and tackle-breaking ability
3. Defensive work rate and breakdown efficiency
4. High endurance and agility

Proposed Position: Inside Centre (12)

Key Role Requirements:

1. Ball-handling skills (passing under pressure, offloads)
2. Tactical kicking (especially at higher levels)
3. Defensive organisation and midfield tackling
4. Running good support and crash lines
5. Communication and backline coordination

3. Strengths Supporting the Transition

4. Developmental Gaps & Challenges

5. Case Studies & Precedents

Several players have successfully transitioned between forward and backline roles:

1. Sonny Bill Williams (former flanker in league, became elite 12 in union)
2. Pieter-Steph Du Toit (tested in midfield in youth levels due to mobility)
3. Ma’a Nonu (not a forward, but a 12 with flanker-like physicality)

These examples suggest it is not uncommon to mold physically dominant players into inside centres, especially in systems favoring crash ball and direct running.

6. Tactical Fit

This transition is most feasible in teams that:

1. Employ a direct running 12 role (e.g., England's old Farrell-Tuilagi combos)
2. Use the 12 as a second forward in midfield, especially on short-side phases
3. Play less kick-oriented rugby, minimizing the need for a dual-playmaker

Less suited to:

1. Teams relying on dual playmakers (e.g., All Blacks or France)
2. Systems requiring frequent distribution or tactical kicking from 12

7. Recommendations

Feasibility: Moderately High

Best Suited For:

1. Physically dominant, power-oriented teams
2. Lower-tier or developmental sides experimenting with hybrid roles
3. 7s rugby or high school/club levels where versatility is an asset

Action Plan:

1. Skills Training: Emphasize handling, passing off both hands, basic kicking.
2. Game Awareness: Include in backline pattern drills, defensive scenario training.
3. Trial Period: Introduce in controlled settings (e.g., second half or against weaker opponents).
4. Video Review: Use analytics to fine-tune positioning and reads.
5. Coach Consultation: Ensure alignment with team’s strategic identity.

8. Conclusion

A fast, strong loose forward has several physical and mental attributes that can translate well to the inside centre role. With deliberate development in technical backline skills and game sense, the position switch is feasible and could offer a dynamic edge, especially in teams prioritizing direct, physical midfield play.

Note without any particular prompting, it suggests that a power based team will benefit the most from this type of positional switch.

When you look at the skill set required for a 12 at the top level, you notice that Roos already has numerous to a high level.

Outside of kicking, this feasibility report is basically saying that the Boks should ply a loosie at 12.

Of particular note = his transition is most feasible in teams that:

1. Employ a direct running 12 role (e.g., England's old Farrell-Tuilagi combos)
2. Use the 12 as a second forward in midfield, especially on short-side phases
3. Play less kick-oriented rugby, minimizing the need for a dual-playmaker(all teams kick a lot these days but not much through 12...and I wish DDA had some malady that prevented him from ever kicking anyway)

I'm ready for your rebuttal, Denise...

The above is pure BS as expected, Fact is the only center that made a serious impact in tests in which Sacha played was De Allende and he showed enough pace to make a meaningful contriution to Sacha in the Aussie test, Looking at videos of strings of matches there is no doubt that De Allende is a better defender with more pace than Esterhuizen.

This was proved by stats as well. In 2018 Esterhuien played in 5 tests and made 22 tackles and missed 5 tacles, In 5 tests against stronger opposition De Allende made 42 tackles missing 5. Those are factual figures and none of those change since then,

Erasmus gave Esterhuizen opportunities to prove himself in 2018 and 2019 but in 2019 Erasmus left him out of the 2019 RWC squad and when Kriel was injured Erasmus called up Wilemse and played him at center against minor teams. Since then Esterhuizen was selected for the 2023 RWC and allowe to play in matches against Gergia and Tonga, If he was a half-decent center with sufficient pace he had the opportunity to at least score a try agains very weak opposition. In fact Esterhuizen in 22 tests never came near to scoring any try - bar in one case whee he knocked on a good pass to him with an open tryline ahead of him.

There are two deficencies in Esterhuizen and those are rugby thinking ability and lack of pace, He is rarely in a position to be part of an attacking team aince he is not where he shoud have been - that being the explanation of his inability to score tries - and his pace deficiency, When in 2024 Erasmus and Brown started to change the way the Springboks attack teams they gave Esterhuizen a chance to play at 12, Dumbo got red-carded and banned for 4 matches as a result. So in the test the Springbok had to play with 14 players, Sacha was playing in the test and if Esterhuien was not dumb he would have shown it in that test, All he did was to show idiocy in playimg.

Another comment by a rugby expert in 2024 was that when De Alledne played for the Sringboks they win more matches than they lose - when he does not they lose more matches than they win. I am no expert - neither are any of the site members - so I believe in what experts came up with and not the drivel people came up with on site, There is zero proof that Esterhuizen adds more pace than De Allende - fact is videos indicate othersise,- so that factor is unproved by facts, What is clear though that De Allende is where the action is with the result he can score tries - Esterhuizen is not, The difference cannot be of pace alone - it also indicates reading of the match and being in a podition where he can score tries or contributes to scoring of tries.

With Willense available I cannot see how Erasmus and his coaches will pick Esterhuizen to be in the Springbok squad - he has been given test playing opportunities aplenty and never contibuted positively in those, At 31 years of age he is not performing better in club and franchjse level than De Allende is, Against the weak teams the Springboks play in July - the chances are that Willense will be the inside center of choice with potential back=up by Kriel or Hooker - who can play as inside centers or other backline positions as well. In recent matches Hooker looks vulnerable - Kriel did not, So lets wait and see what the Springbok squad for the July 2025 tests will look like.

One can expect an avalanche of attacks on Erasmus on team and squad selection by the site members - si lets wait and see what hapens.

, . . .

,

.

Mike...

Fix your pathetic grammar if you want anybody to read your posts.

At leat I will try to overcome mistakes on site - but you have a major problem to remove the batshit that control your rugby thinking in evidence as to your brainless contributions on site. What is on this thread contributed by you show little interest in real issues pertaining the number 12 position and promotion of AE showed the same deficiency as to rugby thinking play as is evident in AE. That si why in 22 tests he enver scored a try because of not being where the attacks take place,

B the ay in the 2019 RWC final De Allende and Du Toit destroyed his attacking ability of Farrell and he has never ecovered from that shock, However he showed how idiotic AE really is in isolating himself in that November 2018 tests and Farrell stopped an attack that could have helped the team to beat England. Remember that one - it caused him not to be in the RWC squad in 2019. .

"B the ay in the 2019 RWC final De Allende and Du Toit destroyed his attacking ability of Farrell and he has never ecovered from that shock"

There, I fixed it for you.

Now kindly explain the same to Dave who apparently believes that this hasn't been PSDT's job all along.

De Allende and Du Toit combined in that effor and it was repeaedly mentioned by the England commentatirs during the final.

Remeber that incident in November 2018 involving Esterhuizen which caused his removal from the 2019 RWC squad. Total brainless run that isolated himself with none of the Springboks expected what he did to happen. Go and look at that incident during which Farrell brutlaized him and he lost possession of the ball. So end of a promising attack which could have resulted in the Springbok victory - but because of Esterhuizen it ended in a loss of 11 - 9. . .

Umm you mean when Fag Girl shoulder charged AE?

...the no arms hit that should have been a penalty?

That one?

Go and look at that incident during which Farrell brutlaized him and he lost possession of the ball. So end of a promising attack which could have resulted in the Springbok victory - but because of Esterhuizen it ended in a loss of 11 - 9. . .

"Promising attack"? The scrumhalf rolled a pass to no one 10m behind the advantage line where Esterhuizen collected it. There was no "promising attack", it was a shambles.

And it wasn’t Farrell who was targeted by Dud Toit…..Farrell was playing 12. It was George Ford at 10. By the way Mostert who only came on in minute 22, made 15 tackles….Dud made 11. Facts, they provide so much clarity.

lol this is apparently where AE screwed up so badly.

a "promising attack"

one can only laugh

The most legal tackle the world has ever seen...

Now for the last arrow in Mike’s quiver..,,,that’s not Esterhozen

Now Mart is aback to his shit about Mostert's tackles, Ke ade stackles but to bring players down he needs help from other players, Mster is a shot defender in open play defense and people have on occassions ran straaight through him. Du Toit is much better than Mstet has ever been. That is one of the reasons why twice Du Toit was the Rugby Player of rhe year a xaase where Mostert would never have qualified,

So you gonna talk us through your previous comments, Mike?

Are we just gonna ignore that despite you telling us we are spreading BS, you were the one spreading BS about the incident above?

Like the opposite of what you said happened is what actually happened.

And he just lied about Mostert in the post above….

Mostert does tackle just NEVER dominantly

He tackles like a girl

"Mostert is renowned for his exceptional defensive skills and work rate on the rugby field.

For instance, during the Rugby World Cup 2023 knockout stages, he made 49 tackles without missing a single one, showcasing his reliability and tenacity in defense.

In the Autumn Nations Series match against Wales, Mostert not only contributed defensively but also scored a try, further demonstrating his all-around capabilities.

Such performances highlight Mostert’s status as a key player in the Springbok lineup, admired for his consistent and impactful contributions."

Mostert is SHIT

DDA is great because Rassie is a genius and selects him.

Mostert is shit despite Rassie selecting him.

Rassie loves Mostert and Rassie loves Wiese.

I guess he must just be a clueless rugby ignorant.

Spot on plum….I guess some people have no shame In making untrue statements to deceive.

Mostert is a very good player...almost great, but he hasn't been 1st choice for the Bokke in his position for the last decade...beeeeg difference.

This board has it's very own axis of stupidity . . . giMp, Moffie and ButtPlug . . . still trying to pretend that all Rassie's achievements are due to luck.

What a weak cop-out is all I can say . . . by three very weak individuals.

Keep on being lucky, Rassie.

Go Bokke!

Stupid is as Stupid does….

Well Vaccine thought the explorers were vaccinated in 1600, you don’t get much more stupid than that.

No dumbfuck - Rassie is rugby genius but he is not perfect for if he was we would not have lost a single test

Part of his imperfection is his blind spot when it comes to locks

Selecting physically inept locks is his failing, in particular powder puff Mostert - but he is slightly forgiven in that after initially starting him, he eventually realised a proper lock like Lood was better and again of late with RG

Unfortunately the injuries to Lood and RG had Rassie mistakenly believing powder puff could do the job - so what we got was plenty of heart and energy, loads of process tackles but unfortunately we saw zero physical productivity - the essence of a Bok lock

But unfortunately Rassie has a blind spot when it comes to locks - Mostert, Orie, Nico Janse v Rensburg and of late Ruan Nortje - ignoring talented young proper locks in the process

Thankfully we have had Eben and Lood and of late RG. It’s just such a shame we have had so little of RG for had be been fit over the years, we would never have had to endure the physically inept Mostert for the Boks - it would have been the Eben / RG combo with Lood off the bench

Oh and why the fuck has Wiese come into the equation - does it imply that some dumbfuck has me not rating Wiese?

Just to be clear...

Rassie is a mega uber genius with otherworldly rugby vision and guile.

Rassie was also a Bok forward.

...but he just doesn't know what's required from a test lock and Dave could teach him a thing or two.

Is that about right, Dave.

"still trying to pretend that all Rassie's achievements are due to luck."

More weak sauce from the residents slime.

Mike....

hello?

Read what I wrote about provincial issue in rugby as it used to be.

I think that we do not know enough about the inner situation as te coaching, team selection ad the game plan issue and seu p and how and why playes were selected or omitted from the team to really make a contribution on player selections. I like what I saw of Sacha and wrote about him two years ago after I saw him playing in the Under 20 WC and when people was arguing about Libbok and others to be played at flyhalf I wrote about him being he solution and I believe I was right about him as was finally proved in franchise rugby n 2023 and in the few tests he played in in 2024, His alst to matches this year ws sensational,

The oher flyhalf I prefer as a supporting flyhalf includes Wolhuter - he had some really good matches for the Lions this year - if Sacha or Polalrd is not avaiable I would pick him as replacement or back-up flyhalf,

As to AE I just cannot see what others on site see of him. He is defnitely slower in pace than De Allende who was part of long distance attacks that led to scoring a number of tries in tests - which I see as a positive,

..

Mike

What we don't see is the promising attacking play you were talking about.

Before you spin us a yarn, remember that you used that specific incident above as your reasoning for why AE fell out of favour.

Are you gonna pivot and find another reason that you swear he's so bad and unacceptable to everyone?

Andre has been better for the Sharks than DDA has been for his club side. And the URC is a tougher competition.

Don't be surprised if you see Rassie use AE much more this year.

Plum

I will indeed be surorised if he 31 year old Esterhuizen who played in 22 tests without ever making a real positive impact in the matches is selected as replacement of De Allende, If De Allende is not selected or avaibale the next candidate would be Willemse followed by Kriel and Hooker as third and fourth choices,

That incident in the November 2018 test was a law contravention by Farrell -my problem is Esterhuizen tried to run around the back of the Springbok wing - a stupid miove at his deficient pace and it even surprised the other team members and caused him to be isolated - he would have caused possession loss anyway irespective of what happened in the Farrell tackle - there were othe supporting players around Farrell and AE would have been dead meat. .

"That incident in the November 2018 test was a law contravention by Farrell -my problem is Esterhuizen tried to run around the back of the Springbok wing - a stupid miove at his deficient pace and it even surprised the other team members and caused him to be isolated - he would have caused possession loss anyway irespective of what happened in the Farrell tackle - there were othe supporting players around Farrell and AE would have been dead meat. ."

Was it a promising attack, though?

Can't say we didn't predict the pivot...

Yes Rassie’s record with locks is kak - I could definitely do a better job of selecting locks

Thankfully he has got the main ones right in Eben , Lood and RG

The rest are substandard - not real locks - a bunch of powder puffs

You heard it here first...Dave can teach Rassie a thing or two!

So could anyone - there is no way in hell that Mostert, Orie, Nico Janse v Rensburg and Ruan Nortje have been the best lock options available

Lol

Lomp is not the answer. He has been out of it to long and never in his whole career, has he been as influential as Mostert.

So for the sake of future development, Erasmus should start picking the younger inform locks.

Ruben V Heerden, Reinhardt Ludwig, Ruan Vermaak, Cobus Wiese etc..…..is all options that need investment now and not later….

Mpower

At last a eaaningful comment and I agree with you. In the case of locks the situation is not clear at all This yeaar thus far Etzebeth played only in one match and a week klater did not play - so there are questionmarks wth him as well, Maybe the idea with Esterhuizen is the ame - play him rarely in tests only and for the rest be rarely used to prevent injuries. I think the same applies to Pollar as well.

In teh caase of Sacha part of his injury problem was caused by imself last year and the oher part was die to Dobson being a village idiot playing him at 12 - which exposed him to play in a position he should never play, The latter position is for thinking players more physical than Sacha is. He is dangerous at 10 and a liability subject to injuries played at 12.

Np aabck to thee lock situation - I think we have enough younger locks that should be given more playing time opportunities, With Etzebeth in a situation he is in - they shoud play Wiese at 4 and for the 5 positin hei is a long list of locks available. I like R van Hererden, But their is anther Van heerdenplaying fro the Sharks as well. You mentions Ludwig as well - he can also pay at 7 making him a particular player whose roe model and hero is P-S du Toit.

In the July test series I think that we will see less of Kolisi amd Du Toit in the thee tests and moe of Roos and Hanekom as 8 and 6 respectively, Wiese at 6 is a payer makig little impact at 8 insofar as attacking play is concerned so for me the likely loosies likely to play in July wille indicative of the future role as learner coach be expected from Kolisi.

Interesting enough is the fact that both Erasmus and Browne believe that the idea of the past is that loosie are an extenion of the Tight 5 is not applicable anymore, Loosies has to link up i providing help to the backlines in playing attackng rugby in future - a winning formula for many years siccessfukky used used by the All Blacks. Despte all the negative comments on this site in 2024 that system was successfully used by the Springboks who scored more tries than the other top ten teams in the world, That s why the comments of some site members that they did not see any difference in the style of play is really ridiculous, There will be some players who are established playrs in the July teams and amongst those is likely to be Ox and one of the hookers like Bongi as well as Du Toit and Sacha, De Allende and Willemse - with Moerat also in the mix, On the wing Kolbe and at full back there wil be no changes. Who will be on the scrumhalf will also be an issue, I think Kriel as a good goalkicker may be involved.in the bench selection. That is where playes that can play in multible positions will also be involved,

In the meantime it would be better to forget about players in the past will be in the mix. Those playes has had their opportunities like Easterhuizen and did not perform up to standard in the tests they played in will not be in the mix in future,

We will have to wait and see what happens as to squad and team selection over the next two months who wil;l actually play in the July tests,

.

, .

Super Springbok Sacha dubbed a generational talent

4 min read • 09 May 2025

Sacha Feinberg-Mngomezulu has been hailed as “a generational talent” by his DHL Stormers boss John Dobson.

The Springboks star has been in sparkling form of late, scoring 50 points, including four tries, during Cape Town victories over Connacht Rugby and Benetton Rugby in the last two rounds of the BKT URC.

He is sure to be a key figure for the sixth-placed DHL Stormers as they set their sights on making a big impact in the play-offs.

Giving his thoughts on the 23-year-old fly-half, Dobson said:

“I am the coach of the team he plays in, but I can’t claim to have coached him for a second. He is a generational talent.

“He is such a good guy and so level headed.”

Dobson says that’s all the more important with the hype surrounding the versatile young back having gone stratospheric.

“We had that with Siya (Kolisi) when he was here before he went to the Sharks,” he said.

“He would walk into a petrol station and you would have people howling and dropping their pumps!

“It feels curious for the team. When one player is elevated by hype above the rest of the team, it’s sort of contrary to rugby values. That worries me a little bit from a team perspective. It’s a tricky one.”

Reflecting on what the future holds for the eight-times capped Feinberg-Mngomezulu, Dobson said:

“Probably our biggest challenge is to make sure he stays on the field.

“That’s not something we control.

“It’s nerve-racking stuff because he has done his knee twice.

“We have to be very careful about his body without changing who he is.

“You can’t say to him ‘Listen, you have been tackled six to eight times a game, it’s too much for a fly-half’ because that would take away who he is.

“It’s a real tightrope the whole Sacha project, but brilliant to have.”

The Cape Town-born Feinberg-Mngomezulu scored a scintillating hat-trick of tries in the narrow 34-29 victory over Connacht and then crossed again in the 56-5 demolition of Benetton.

He also landed nine shots at the sticks against the Italians - six conversions, two penalties and a drop goal - and demonstrated his astute tactical kicking game.

“It was entirely clinical and mature, the way Sacha and Warrick (Gelant) kept drilling the ball into the corners in the second half. We were so territorially dominant, so in charge,” said Dobson.

The DHL Stormers coach was in a far happier mood after the Benetton game than he had been following the nerve-jangling win over Connacht.

He had described the defensive performance against the Irish province as their worst in years, so he was delighted by the response from his players.

“There was a lot of emotion after the Connacht game even though we won,” he said.

“We knew we had to change dramatically and show we are a championship team. It was a big week.”

The Stormers certainly stepped up to another level against fellow play-off contenders Benetton, running in seven tries.

“It was everything we wanted and planned, a really, really good performance,” said Dobson.

“It was almost flawless. We were so clinical, so mature and we were really good defensively.

“It was our best performance in the URC by a distance.”

What was also impressive was the crowd of 18,474 at the DHL Stadium, following on from 18,211 for the Connacht game.

“There is something brewing,” said Dobson.

“You see the amount of blue in the crowd, jerseys, not just flags. It’s just going up and up and up. It’s becoming like a soccer crowd. They are fully invested.

“It was a great crowd for the Benetton game, a really good experience and we entertained them, which is our theme for the season.

“We are playing rugby that suits our DNA and the people resonate with it and they are coming along. It’s a really good space with the crowd numbers.”

The DHL Stormers now have two more home games to round off the regular season, with Dragons RFC (this Saturday) and Cardiff Rugby (Friday, May 16) the opponents, as they look to secure their play-off spot.

“If we keep going like we are, I think we will finish fifth and stay local in the quarter-finals,” said Dobson.

“We will go to Durban to face the Sharks, which is something we will do with great relish. That derby would be a nice one for us.”

Dobson just waffles...

He plus the guy at 12...but the. He says things like this...

"“You can’t say to him ‘Listen, you have been tackled six to eight times a game, it’s too much for a fly-half’ because that would take away who he is.

“It’s a real tightrope the whole Sacha project, but brilliant to have.”"

This while literally every fan in the country knew Sacha should never be played at 12 where he is far more likely to sustain an injury and did indeed get injured.

Dobbo loves his own Kool-Aid far too much.

You guys forget very quickly that Dobbo is the only SA coach that have won the URC title….just like Rassie he is very loved by his players…..a great motivator and tactician.

Stop hammering on the man for the mistake with Sacha, he clearly is invested in Sacha at 10 and in Sacha the man.

You go Dobbo and get us that trophy again ! Go Stormers!!

The team needed him at 12 at the time...he should be just a regular player...we are going to spoil him if we protect him too much...Sasha is big enough and skilled enough to play at 12...10 is his position, but he can play anywhere in the backline...rugby is a team spirt...he shouldn’t be elevated above the team just because he is potentially a generational talent.

Going to the match today...dis eendeweer in Die Kaap, so it won't be a running fest.