Springboks Withdraw from Rugby Championship

Forum » Rugby » Springboks Withdraw from Rugby Championship

Oct 16, 2020, 01:48

https://www.ultimaterugby.com/news/report%3A-springboks-withdraw-from-rugby-championship/630887



Media hearsay at this stage, but it appears as though the source is correct. 

Oct 16, 2020, 08:54

I think various travel restrictions for SA players in France and the UK - as well as those of SA will make it impossible for SA to participate  in any games on test level this year,   It must be borne in mind that SA players are not only playing in SA - but also for various clubs in  the UK and France and all SA Players will be in quarantine for 14 days anyway - so it would be an exercise in futility to try and get an SA team together under present  circumstances with adequate training together before a series,   I think by February next year things would have improved, depending on the progress in finding a vaccine  against the Chinese virus.   

Oct 16, 2020, 09:43

Wusses. You can run Rassie but you can’t hide. Loss of No.1 world ranking imminent!

Oct 16, 2020, 10:27

Moolaa, we only just started playing again after more than 6 months out, nothing to do with "wussing out"...no use in sending an unprepared squad...that would have been stupid.

Oct 16, 2020, 11:16

Appreciate that Draad but you didn’t see the ABs pull out of the ‘95 RWC Final even though half the team was throwing up on that day..... That’s just what’s called hardening up and getting on with the job at hand....

Oct 16, 2020, 11:43

Moolaa 

With respect that has nothing to do with the present scenario,  

Oct 16, 2020, 14:09

"Appreciate that Draad but you didn’t see the ABs pull out of the ‘95 RWC Final even though half the team was throwing up on that day..... That’s just what’s called hardening up and getting on with the job at hand...."


There are a lot of conspiracy theorists out there who believe the whole moon landing thing was a hoax. They'll present you with all sorts of "evidence" but there's one question they always dodge . . . do they seriously believe that 60 years down the line it's still a secret? If NASA did indeed film the whole thing in a studio and no-one has spilled the beans or gone to the press or written a book then I reckon that is a lot more unlikey than Apollo 11 making it past the Van Allen belt that they're always banging on about.

Same question I'd ask All Black supporters who are still whining about Suzy and the poisoning of the All Black team on the eve of the RWC final of 1995 . . . don't you think it would have come out by now? 

Huh?

Oct 16, 2020, 15:26

In a world deprived of sport.....in the spirit of the game....we should have accepted that we were disadvantaged, but played. But this has Erasmus’ MO all over it......achieve something and then run for the hills.

Oct 16, 2020, 22:14

Rooi, did I whinge at all about “Suzy” or mention anything about deliberate food poisoning? No, I didn’t think so...... The fact was the ABs were stricken with a bug of some sort, still fronted and the Boks could only win with a droppie in extra time. That victory will sadly always be tainted and the ABs will always face their opposition, unlike your blouses....

Oct 16, 2020, 22:15

Rooi, did I whinge at all about “Suzy” or mention anything about deliberate food poisoning? No, I didn’t think so...... The fact was the ABs were stricken with a bug of some sort, still fronted and the Boks could only win with a droppie in extra time. That victory will sadly always be tainted and the ABs will always face their opposition, unlike your blouses....

Oct 16, 2020, 22:15

Rooi, did I whinge at all about “Suzy” or mention anything about deliberate food poisoning? No, I didn’t think so...... The fact was the ABs were stricken with a bug of some sort, still fronted and the Boks could only win with a droppie in extra time. That victory will sadly always be tainted and the ABs will always face their opposition, unlike your blouses....

Oct 16, 2020, 22:16

Times three....

Oct 16, 2020, 23:49

Moola the All Blacks see Marx, Vermuelen, Steph DuToit in the same team and crap themselves. 
The English pack bullied the All Blacks in the semi-final even with 3 locks on the pitch. 

The Bok pack then easily outmuscled the English... Our skilful wings then ended the world cup as any form of a contest. 

The Boks peaked for the business end of the tournament. Eddie Jones said no team would have beaten the Boks in that final. 

It is a pity about the Boks not been available to defend the Rugby Championship, but they have played so few games given the lockdown restriction. 
This was the Boks opportunity to put a 30 point score over the rebuilding All Blacks. 

Oct 17, 2020, 01:35

Actually, the All Blacks face Steph with a runner to pull him out of position and send an inside runner into that space. They have never shown any fear facing him. That's not a mark of a quality player, but an exploitable weakness. I can't believe Josè the super coach hasn't made some adjustment to this. Many teams have been exploiting this vulnerability. The plastics only seem to notice the affect of the overloads this creates, such as the 2 or 3v1s that involve Mostert or Thor. The culprit who created the opening never gets held into account. 

Oct 17, 2020, 08:00

Sharkbok, the ABs have never crapped themselves playing the Boks, we just get on with the job. The Poms were stuffed in the Final, having left their best game on the park in the semi and this was coupled with their prop going off early in the game. What was Eddie going to say after the Final? They weren’t the 2nd best team? Get real! The Boks were whipped by the ABs in the early round and clearly want to hang on to a false No.1 ranking until next year. If it was their chance to put 30 points on the ABs, why wuss out and run for the hills? Rassie in hiding methinks....

Oct 17, 2020, 10:54

Moolaa...I dont like Shark's big mouth either, but I don't see how you can call the AB victory over the Boks in the group stages a whipping...the score didn't actually reflect the match. It could have gone either way IMO...and by the way..the Poms didn't beat you in the semi...you lot folded for some odd reason. I still don't get why the Poms were hyped to such an extent...even the Japs gave us more of a match...:D

Oct 17, 2020, 13:37

The pool stage wasn't a whipping, but it was a good demonstration of the bluntness of the José model. They held us at arm's length, and we couldn't inflict a dent. They did what England couldn't do, match us physically. 

Oct 17, 2020, 17:20

The Erasmus model was based on not allowing the opponents any space.....much assisted by forward dominance. That model was very vulnerable if a team could find a bit of space.


The ABs did......Wales did when they got a scrum with enough space to exploit DudToit. But the Japs were not physical enough to create space and the Poms never showed.


The AB game was close......all of our games against the ABs should be close.....nothing new.

Oct 17, 2020, 21:40

All right Draad, maybe it wasn’t a whipping.....

Oct 18, 2020, 00:06

All right Moola, I accept your congratulations.  :D

Oct 18, 2020, 08:20

Apparently the players based in Japan haven't played any rugby, the Boks playing for the Stormers had their first game for the year this past weekend....just a coupe of examples as to why it was called off and that's not taking into account the logistical nightmare of gathering the european based players. Nieabar himself said that the players hadn't clocked up enough playing hours so participation was a no go in the interest of their welfare.

Oct 18, 2020, 16:58

Now News 24 is saying the Boks will be significantly disadvantaged against the Lions having played no tests this year.....we should have played this November. It’s sport not life or death.

Oct 19, 2020, 22:16

It was without doubt the right decision not to play. Oz and NZ would have played 4 tests by the time of the RC, the Boks a big fat zero

Rassie was not stupid enough to take on a losing battle. We have a record to protect - only an arrogant chest beating fool would have agreed to take on those odds.

Rassie is wiser than that. It’s unfortunate we are not playing but it makes complete sense

Oct 20, 2020, 02:22

Dave....it's just common sense. Assembling  players out of Covid ravaged europe would be a logistical nightmare and to front with a squad of local players cheapens the jumper.  I guess it's fine with those who'd still expect the Boks to win.....but won't. Besides all of that it was felt that the players welfare needed to be taken into consideration with regards to lack of game time.

SARU not Rassie made the right decision.

Oct 20, 2020, 03:54

Argentina’s domestic-based players have been in Australia preparing for the Rugby Championship. They were previously in Uruguay. They will be joined by European-based players next week. The players are to fly to Australia on Monday.

The Rugby Championship will start and finish in Sydney. Game one will be a Bledisloe Cup match on Saturday, October 31. The final game will be between Argentina and New Zealand on Saturday, December 05. In short, the majority of Argentina’s players will have been away from home from September to December.

The updated match schedule means that Argentina will play all four matches on consecutive weekends. Australia and New Zealand will have byes.

......

Kudos to Argentina for upholding the spirit of rugby, which we have ignored in our craven to decision to chicken out. The Bargies apparently haven’t found the logistical issues to be a knockout factor.

Oct 20, 2020, 06:32

Another piece of idiocy blaming SARU for problems resulting from  Government issues.    

Oct 20, 2020, 07:00

@Mikey

Who are you talking to?

Oct 20, 2020, 08:38

LOL

What a joke

Comparing the "Suzy" incident to a worldwide deadly pandemic

Fucking ludicrous

Some people also seem to forget the results of the last 2 games between SA and NZ just prior to the world cup.....

One also has to look at what happened during that SA vs NZ first world cup game where the ref clearly assisted NZ with the scrums, and constantly and incorrectly penalized SA...…….it was blatantly obvious

Oct 20, 2020, 09:01

Only blatantly obvious to you DA. The Boks win the RWC and all you do is bleat on about the reffing in the pool game! Obviously it sticks in your throat the ABs beating the Boks in that tournament.....

Oct 20, 2020, 09:05

Moolaa...

I’m sure there will be lots of bleating about the NH refs once they move there. We need to take care of our Pacific nations moving forward and leave that stuff where it belongs......in the history books.

Oct 20, 2020, 10:32

 "Obviously it sticks in your throat the ABs beating the Boks in that tournament..... "

Not at all moola, you have it all wrong dude

I would easily accept the All Blacks beating SA in that game 100 out of 100 if it means that SA still lift the World Cup trophy...... when the All Blacks can't even make the final

As you very clearly already know by now.....one game.... does not make you a world champion

I just thought it best to clear that up :D

Oct 20, 2020, 10:37

Comparing a 15 man rugby side getting sick with a "tummy bug" versus a worldwide horrific pandemic...… with over 1.1 million deaths...…. is slightly obscure in my mind though

If you don't see a problem with that equation..... then you indeed do have a problem

Oct 20, 2020, 10:49

And yet when NZ decided to look after their own players because of the pandemic by having the teams play here where it was safe, we were accused of being arrogant and manipulating the competition to suit us.

Funny that.

Oct 20, 2020, 11:01

Tha Argies didn’t have a problem DA. More balls than the Boks..... And the ABs were actually sick in 1995. No-one is asking the Boks to play whilst suffering from COVID-19. THAT’S the big difference!

Oct 20, 2020, 11:19

"And yet when NZ decided to look after their own players because of the pandemic by having the teams play here where it was safe, we were accused of being arrogant and manipulating the competition to suit us."

Firstly, I never saw that.....nor did I once comment on whoever created that thread or said that

Secondly, if you still cannot see the incredible disparity between 15 rugby players with a stomach bug..... and 1.1 million people dying from a pandemic.....then you indeed have a problem

I am not making this about NZ playing rugby at all Cloudy, I am directly referencing moola's stupid statement about SA not travelling to NZ because of Covid-19..... but we must "harden up and get on with the job at hand...." just like NZ did in the 95 world cup?

This is a sick comment to make..... so do you agree with this statement Cloudy?....

Oct 20, 2020, 11:24

"Tha Argies didn’t have a problem DA. More balls than the Boks..... And the ABs were actually sick in 1995. No-one is asking the Boks to play whilst suffering from COVID-19. THAT’S the big difference"

So... they must just harden up and get on with the job at hand, risking their own life in the process..... for a rugby game

Again, you are stupidly comparing a sick rugby player, with a simple and common stomach bug.... to a pandemic that has already killed over 1 million people ….. and if these players don't take that life threatening risk and travel and play rugby... …….they are not in the same league as the mighty All Blacks who played a rugby game with a stomach bug back in 1995

Is that your take on this moola?

Oct 20, 2020, 11:31

DA....

Where did Moolaa say that SA was not travelling to NZ because of Covid? I thought the reference was because they hadn’t played enough rugby to warrant taking part in the RC. Point that out to me first then I can answer your question.

Oct 20, 2020, 11:42

Cloudy

Db mentioned we would not be sending a side due to us being under prepared.....and that is because of Covid,

If Covid restrictions were never put in place, we would have gone and would not have been under prepared

moola then said after my post about 1.1 million people dying from this pandemic... that that did not stop the Argies, who have more balls than the Boks.... and mentioned that the AB's were actually sick in 1995 when they played,,,,

So you tell me what he meant by that?

Oct 20, 2020, 12:04

‘Moolaa, we only just started playing again after more than 6 months out, nothing to do with "wussing out"...no use in sending an unprepared squad...that would have been stupid.’

Draad didn’t say anything about Covid.....nothing was mentioned about it until you brought it up. Moolaa never made mention of the pandemic in any of his comments and he even said that’s not what he said. My understanding of being ‘unprepared’ was the fact that you guys hadn’t played much rugby so you wouldn’t have been ready to play teams who were already match fit, hence his reference to the ABS being sick and still playing a full game.

Perhaps Draad could allude to what he meant by ‘unprepared’ that might clear the whole thing up.

Oct 20, 2020, 12:18

 "My understanding of being ‘unprepared’ was the fact that you guys hadn’t played much rugby so you wouldn’t have been ready to play teams who were already match fit"

Cloudy, please explain to me why we have not played much rugby at all, which has directly led us to not being prepared at all for the RC...…. does it have anything to do with

player availability?

Injuries?

Time and dates?

TV Schedules?

Logistics?

Covid…….. Oh shit

Oct 20, 2020, 12:32

DA...

Covid wasn’t mentioned and it’s common knowledge that you guys had a concern of not being match fit. Unprepared to me is just that.....doesn’t mean you might get sick with Covid. How do you get all of that out of one word???

‘Covid..... Oh shit’

Your words,

Oct 20, 2020, 13:14

Ja, I think it was the right choice, not an easy one given that our world class players have been playing in Europe for long enough. 

Although, our Green vs Gold matches was absolutely diabolical which proves that we don't have much in reserve. 

People forget how strict the SA government has been on training and sports and that people in SA have in lock down for much longer. 

Being stuck indoors for 3 months, no contact or any training structures. All of this contributes to match readiness 

The difference with Bargies is that they simply don't have a choice but to show up. 

They don't have a local product to protect, their Skitso team are basically the same on paper. 

Where as SA Currie Cup is the oldest comp in the world, it has been taking a back seat for the stupid conference system, but if you look at the history of the Currie Cup, then it is far more important to SA then risking your best players, reputation and your own domestic product for a schekkals

Taking 50 players out of your Currie Cup completely dilutes it to a sub standard club competition. 

The local teams have gone through massive cuts pre-covid and no longer have the player depths (Not that they were there before)

So I for one are happy that we go the curie cup going again, looking forward to the local matches and enjoying some of the local talent getting form. 

Looking forward of watching rugby again every weekend on teams that I'm actually interested in. 

Don't forget either, the big curry cup matches use to get 40 000 plus fans. You don't get that anywhere in Europe or the rest of the world. 

I for one support that we get back there, put us in a position of bargaining once we get over Covid

Oct 20, 2020, 13:24

Some good points Korn.

Oct 20, 2020, 14:36

"common knowledge that you guys had a concern of not being match fit"

Precisely, because of Covid….. nothing more, nothing less

"Unprepared to me is just that"

In any other year I would 100% agree with you...… but this is 2020 and we all know exactly and precisely why we are "unprepared", so stop hiding from it..... it is Covid, period

"doesn’t mean you might get sick with Covid"

So all of our players are not risking their lives, to go and play a rugby game in another country.... spending days in a sealed off pressurized plane...… exposing themselves to countless other outside factors...… just to go and play a game in NZ

Is that your stance.....?

You are just trying to defend some stupid and insulting comments from moola

Oct 20, 2020, 14:38

Brilliant points Korn, well said

Oct 20, 2020, 14:59

Ask Draad what he meant you’re just making a mountain out of a molehill. Moolaa said he never meant that ...if you can’t accept that and let it go...then you have the problem.

Oct 20, 2020, 15:02

"Don't forget either, the big curry cup matches use to get 40 000 plus fans. You don't get that anywhere in Europe or the rest of the world. "

That's not true. The Champions cup matches particularly the later rounds get massive attendance.
The highest was over 82,000. Only in the first and third years (96 and 98) of the competitions was the highest attended match below 40,000.

In the Pro 14, the Leinster-Munster matches typically get in access of the 40,000 while the Welsh do a double derby (called Judgement Day) with crowds typically above 60,000. I don't have figures for game attendance in English Premiership or Top 14 but I would surprised if they didn't have a few games with big attendance figures.

Oct 20, 2020, 15:33

"Taking 50 players out of your Currie Cup completely dilutes it to a sub standard club competition."

The Currie Cup is a sub-standard club competition. 

Oct 20, 2020, 15:56

Most CC teams will beat the NF Cluib teams easily - another stupid AO Comment.   When wioll you ever learn about rugby dimness? 

Oct 20, 2020, 16:34

Moz - spirit of rugby my arse. You don’t take on a losing battle unless you are stupid which is clearly what the Argies are - they won’t win a single test in the RC

Stuff the logistics and assembling players, the overriding issue is lack of game time at test level.

Taking on Oz and NZ away after each has played 4 tests would be suicide and plain stupidity

Thank fuck Rassie and co have common sense

Oct 20, 2020, 16:50

Fully agree Dave

Oct 20, 2020, 19:49

Stavanger is correct, the crowd numbers are very high in the NH. 


Highest in an English match is 82,000; Quin’s vs Wasps 2018. 

Oct 20, 2020, 20:18

"Stavanger is correct, the crowd numbers are very high in the NH. "

Good news!

Oct 20, 2020, 20:26

In 1960/61 the Boks were touring the UK.....we had an unbeaten record of 28 wins and one careless draw against Midland Counties with one game to go.....a match against the Barbarians. 

The Boks were on the cusp of matching the Invincibles with  a harder itinerary. 

And the ultimate hurdle was a Barbarians team that supposedly was going to look like a Lions outfit.

Shamefully the Bok management decided to chicken out. The Boks made the suggestion the game be played as a festival game mixing players from each team.

Rightfully the Baa Baas rejected the idea and the match went ahead. But the damage was done, the Boks lost the mental edge and lost the game. It was sporting cowardice.

Pulling out of this tour doesn’t rise to that level....but it comes from the same mindset. We might lose so let’s not play. None of the facts have changed over the past six weeks, we knew back then our players would be undercooked.

So we dithered, watched an AB/Wallaby contest and chickened out. I think this decision was a 100% in Erasmus’ hands  and he made the decision I would have predicted of him.

I don’t believe the ABs would ever have done this, which is why they will continue to be the World’s rugby team and we will remain interlopers regardless of our WC win. 


Oct 20, 2020, 20:39

Rubbish - Rassie is spot on in his decision and it’s the same call I would have made and which 90% of the supporters would have made

There is no glory in making stupid no win calls

Oct 20, 2020, 20:41

"We might lose so let’s not play. None of the facts have changed over the past six weeks, we knew back then our players would be undercooked."

No it does not. Due to factors totally out of our control, we will be totally unprepared It will do injustice to a more than a century old rivalry...the spirit of the game is about  competing on a level playing field...this isn't about chickening out, it's about not accepting a loaded deck.... let NZ, Aus and Argie come to South Africa and let them do the month of quarantine...or postpone things a month or two...don't call us chicken for not accepting the sh!t end of the stick in a sh!tty year. We are the incumbent World Champs after all. It should count for something, right?

Oct 20, 2020, 20:47

It's like asking the heavey weight boxing champ of the world to fight a fully trained previous champ, totally unprepared. It's totally absurd even suggesting it. This is professional sport, not sibling rivalry...we have a duty to protect our brand...asking for a bit of common ground is not unreasonable. 

Oct 20, 2020, 21:06

I’m surprised Moz does not get this but I guess his agenda is really about Rassie being a chicken in his eyes - but thankfully in his eyes only

The rest of us see the obvious and smart in Rassie

Oct 20, 2020, 21:55

So if you’re on a tour and 4 or 5 of your key players are injured, you just call no mas  and don’t play? We could field a team, by the third test they should be match fit...we may not win but we could compete.


I tell you what Draad the world championship is already tarnished after this decision.

Oct 20, 2020, 22:22

Being on tour with 5 players injured is vastly different to the whole squad having not played a test match since the WC victory and taking on sides that have played 4 recent tests against each other.

We have a record to protect, it was hard working getting there. Why the fuck would you risk throwing that away? All that confidence, self belief and momentum jeopardised for what?

Oct 20, 2020, 22:40

No we have a record to create....and this is the first step backwards. This was a classic case of lose and you lose nothing, everybody can see the handicap .....but win and your argument is indisputable.

Oct 20, 2020, 23:00

Nope lose and you lose the momentum and the confidence that took 2 years to build up

Losing on a level playing field is life, choosing a losing battle to fight is suicide

The only backwards step would have been playing the RC

Oct 20, 2020, 23:09

There are very few level playing fields in life. Competitors take on the challenge. When Musk went to the US it wasn’t a level playing field. Do you think his success was more likely than Bok success in NZ. It didn’t deter him, he’s a competitor.


Nor were any of the RCs we won achieved on a level playing field....we had a huge travel disadvantage and often a reffing disadvantage. We won anyway.

If we are looking for a level playing field don’t look for it in the Six Nations where we will have a seasonal disadvantage to go along with a similar travel disadvantage to the RC.

Compete for the joy of it, that’s what the ABs do and that’s why they are embraced by world rugby.

Oct 20, 2020, 23:14

Difference is, the sides then were test prepared they would not be close to that if they played in the RC.

Joy plays a part but is certainly not the defining factor unless you are playing for your pub 15

Oct 21, 2020, 07:40

"let NZ, Aus and Argie come to South Africa and let them do the month of quarantine...or postpone things a month or two...don't call us chicken for not accepting the sh!t end of the stick in a sh!tty year"

Well said

Oct 21, 2020, 07:41

"Being on tour with 5 players injured is vastly different to the whole squad having not played a test match since the WC victory and taking on sides that have played 4 recent tests against each other"

I have to agree......

Oct 21, 2020, 07:43

"Nope lose and you lose the momentum and the confidence that took 2 years to build up"

Fully agree, just watching the docu series shows just how very important this aspect of the game is.... and it took Rassie a while to get the confidence back up there....

Look when Rassie demanded that they get to within a bonus point of the All Blacks, by going for poles.....and the players said "fuck you" to Rassie and went for the draw...…

The belief and confidence to do it, was there

Oct 21, 2020, 13:51

Loved that confession by Rassie saying his side told him to fuck off they were going for the try and a draw - not a losing bonus point

Great belief and relationship with the coach

Oct 21, 2020, 15:05

It was awesome hey Dave, I agree

Oct 21, 2020, 16:20

By the time we play test rugby again the whole WC aura and many of the players will be gone. This is wasting it, just as much as letting White go after 2007 was wasting it.

I understand it’s not a level playing field and you guys make some good points, but I think a loss under these circumstances wouldn’t be unexpected and wouldn’t sting as badly.....and a win would be monumental. 

This was our chance to grab the rugby world by the throat....instead we begin, undercooked and disconnected from our WC win next year against the Lions. If we lose that series we go all the way back to 2018, 2019 will seem like it never happened.

Huge mistake.

Oct 21, 2020, 16:42

Wrong Moz, best decision in a long time was getting rid of Jake the snake post the WC as he could not hang onto Eddie forever to prop him up

It’s sad that we will not be seeing our Boks in action this year but I completely get it

Oct 21, 2020, 16:43

Some very goods points all around actually...….


Oct 21, 2020, 16:46

"Wrong Moz, best decision in a long time was getting rid of Jake the snake post the WC"

I agree with moz on this one 

I think we lost a lot of impetus that White brought into the team..... I am not saying he should have stayed for a few more years..... but the timing of White leaving was not in the best interest of SA rugby at the time

Oct 21, 2020, 16:57

I had no time for White so was happy to see him go. He was utterly useless leading up to that WC and without doubt Eddie saved his arse

Oct 21, 2020, 17:06

Yes DA a civil discussion by posters with differing points of view...good stuff!

Oct 21, 2020, 17:15

LOL @ moz

 
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