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The end of the religious Folau'er?

Forum » Rugby » The end of the religious Folau'er?

Apr 15, 2019, 11:19

srael Folau's career was hanging by a thread on Monday as the star Wallabies fullback was given 48 hours to respond to a code of conduct breach notice or be sacked over anti-gay comments.

The deeply religious 30-year-old sparked uproar last week for a social media post saying "Hell awaits" homosexuals, with national team sponsor Qantas among those complaining.

He was embroiled in a similar row last year, but has stood by his comments and said he was prepared to choose his faith over rugby.

Rugby Australia chief Raelene Castle moved to sack him, saying he had been repeatedly warned about his social media use but ignored the overtures and refused to apologise at a meeting on Friday.

As such, his actions were considered "a high-level breach" of the Professional Players' Code of Conduct which she said warranted termination of his employment contract.

He has 48 hours to either accept the sanction or have the matter referred to a hearing. Folau has indicated he plans to fight to save his career.

"At its core, this is an issue of the responsibilities an employee owes to their employer and the commitments they make to their employer to abide by their employer’s policies and procedures and adhere to their employer’s values," said Castle.

"Following the events of last year, Israel was warned formally and repeatedly about the expectations of him as player for the Wallabies and NSW Waratahs with regards to social media use and he has failed to meet those obligations.

"It was made clear to him that any social media posts or commentary that is in any way disrespectful to people because of their sexuality will result in disciplinary action."

If Folau opts for a code of conduct hearing, an independent three-person tribunal would hear the case and determine whether he has made a breach and, if so, what punishment is appropriate.

Folau posted a banner on Instagram last week that read:"Drunks, homosexuals, adulterers, liars, fornicators, thieves, atheists and idolators - Hell awaits you."

It remains online and has attracted almost 40 000 likes.

Meanwhile, Wallabies coach Michael Cheika said Folau's actions were "disrespectful" and made it unlikely he could add to his 73 Wallabies caps.

"We had a discussion after the last time and made it pretty clear about his right to believe and our support in that, if that's what he wants, to be part of the team," Cheika told reporters.

"But getting it out in that disrespectful manner publicly is not what our team is about.

"When you play in the gold jersey we represent everyone in Australia, everyone. Everyone that is out there supporting us, we don't pick and choose."

When asked whether he would select Folau again, Cheika, who fronted the media alongside Wallabies captain Michael Hooper and NSW Waratahs coach Daryl Gibson, said it was highly unlikely.

"I think as it stands right now... you wouldn't be able," Cheika said.

Neither Cheika nor Gibson have spoken to Folau, but Hooper said he had exchanged a brief text message with his Waratahs and Wallabies team-mate.

Asked if he would still be comfortable taking the field alongside him, Hooper replied: "Like was said before, in this current state and being here and talking about this as a rugby player, it makes it hard, it makes it difficult."

"It's hard being here, we're rugby players for sure, we are trying to create the best team environment we possibly can and at national level," he added.

On Sunday Folau, Super Rugby's record try-scorer, told the Sydney Morning Herald he was ready for life without rugby, saying, "I live for God now".

"Whatever His will is, whether that's to continue playing or not, I'm more than happy to do what He wants me to do," Folau said.

Apr 15, 2019, 11:20

And the headline of the year goes to...

Apr 15, 2019, 11:33

Chippie sure has his moments.

Apr 15, 2019, 11:42

Ja, from Folau to forlorn.......... so howzat?  two of our top adversaries lose their fullbacks for the RWC .

Apr 15, 2019, 11:47

Thank heavens, we still have the incredible Curwin Bosch in the mix ... 


Apr 15, 2019, 11:55

@CC - what does Curwin Bosch have to do with anything?

@blobok - that was a really poor attempt.

Apr 15, 2019, 12:41

Hopefully, the findings are that he was banned from rugby for being a happy-clappy bible basher that sentenced most of the human race to hell. His list seems to include all other religions, atheists, and probably some reborn again Christians in his hell sentence. 


This dummy sees himself as a prophet doing the work of God. No one can reason with him, because he has confused his own opinion as the word of God. This is the most insufferable trait of a happy-clappy religion person. An Abraham in the 21st century that needs to be transported back in time. 

His contract is worth 4 million for the next 4 years. Along with other money he has earnt- this would be enough to never have to work again. When he is short of cash in the future, he may regret this - and God will not be there to top up his bank account. 

Who would want to sign him? Maybe Toulon. It seems that rugby league in Australia have already blocked the door for his return. 


Apr 15, 2019, 12:42

Poor drunks, all going to hell. I wonder if you have a glass of wine, but you are a small person that has not eaten and you land up getting drunk, does that count as hell worthy? Or is it only when you purposefully get drunk? I know of quite a few people that unintentionally got drunk...you know, that thought they could handle more than they could.....this is a very slippery slope....especially if you're drunk. 

Apr 15, 2019, 12:54

Blobbok....I thought that was clever. But forlorn he’s not, his bank balance runneth over he will probably go preach to the masses, good for him he’s never made it a secret what comes first in his life. 40,000 likes on his Instagram so he’s not without support. Best of luck to him.

Apr 15, 2019, 13:27

Stand your ground Folau. Well done for speaking the truth to the pervs, drunks etc. 

These jokers think they can argue the toss with God Almighty!!    Are they in for a huge shock when they appear before the judgment throne of Christ as ALL must do. 

The pervs are trying now to normalize transgenderism and have made a start to do the same with pedophilia. Unfortunately the few pervs here are in full support.

There is no warning these weirdos they are far, far gone and sinking ever further into the sewer.

When though will our resident pervs come fully out of the closet.

How odd it is to have to be telling the pervs here that what they are supporting is perversion. What a huge slide there has been over the last few decades.

Apr 15, 2019, 13:28

Let's hope Folau will set a trend!!! 

Apr 15, 2019, 13:39

There a very sobering account in the old Testament about Soddom and Gomorrah. The pervs in the city lusted after two Angel's. 

To cut a long story short God completely destroyed the city. Pervs ought to read the account. 

Apr 15, 2019, 14:21

Ah yes, the good Old testament. I could do with a slave or two. I'm tired of the pesky domestic worker wages I have to pay. Don't worry Beans, I'll get a slave from another country. 


Leviticus 25:44-46 New International Version (NIV)

44 “‘Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. 45 You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. 46 You can bequeath them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly.


Does anyone else feel the love in that passage? 

Apr 15, 2019, 15:02

... or maybe he ends up suing ARU for millions of dollars ... after all, he does have the right to express his beliefs ... the right to quote from the written word of God.

If they don't like it, they'd have to censor Christian preachers across the globe ... dictate to them what they can and can't preach to their congregations ... perhaps even have the Bible declared unjust and have it banned from society.

Wouldn't that be a laugh??

We as Christians are waiting for the Bible to be made illegal ... perhaps this is the start of it all.

Imagine ... the Christian faith going underground.

 

Apr 15, 2019, 15:21

If a sportsperson that was Jewish, Muslim or another religion said this exact statement, all the Christians would be cheering for action to be taken against him. Suddenly it would not be freedom of speech anymore.... 


Folau posted a banner on Instagram last week that read:"Drunks, homosexuals, adulterers, liars, fornicators, thieves, atheists, Christians and idolators - Hell awaits you."

I doubt Folau will have any grounds for religious discrimination - when his statement is discriminatory against all other religions. 


Apr 15, 2019, 15:26

BeanDip ... the Christian faith is going to be under a lot of pressure someday soon.

We already have homos taking churches (NG) to court ... forcing them to accept same sex marriages ... forcing them to turn a blind eye to same sex couples adopting children.

The world is sick and the church doesn't have the balls to stand up to it.

It is all part of the coming tribulation. There is no stopping it.  

Your relationship with God will become a private affair, That's if you want to keep your head. It is even written that your brother will give you up in those days. Turn you in to the authorities.

So no ... forget about a trend ... or anything else. Every supporter of Folau will be subjected to the same pressures. Billy Vunipola has found that out the hard way.



Apr 15, 2019, 15:33

Really?

Where did he discriminate against other religions?


Apr 15, 2019, 15:46

Daming people to hell based on their religion is discrimination. It is the same as a Muslim calling people kaffirs (non-believers), or a Jew calling people heathen. It implies a hierarchy based on beliefs of ancient texts created by primitive people - that somehow one tiny group is God's people and everyone else is less. Primitive brain dead mentality that creates the likes of Jihad etc.


Why would a Muslim or Jew need to use social media to call people kaffirs or heathens? It is like saying a Nazi is entitled to their opinion - but if this involves insulting other people, it is infringing on the rights of other people. If he was so confident in his faith that only his crew is going to heaven - would he feel the need to express it? 

You would not understand this -as you and Beeno are bible bashing hypocrites who have no understanding how to live your lives by the positive morals that can be obtained from reading a religion. 

If Falou was following the word of God he would be going around helping people - instead of damming people to hell. If a God does exist, surely it would be a God's decision. 

Apr 15, 2019, 15:47

Hellooooooooooooooooooo ... ??

SharkShit ... ???

You there ... ???

Haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahahahaaaaa!!!

Stupid man.

I have a question for you.

How old are you?

You reason like a young child. Your thinking is somehow ... retarded. Are you slow or what? Did you have to go to a special retard school as a kid ... or is it just a matter of you being forced to struggle along with a single digit IQ?

I don't mean to be nasty ... so don't be offended ... I'm seriously interested. Your response would help me to understand just how far I'm to dumb things down for you.


Apr 15, 2019, 15:50

You and Beeno would not be capable of living in a first world country with your backward religious mentality. You are an embarrassment to Christianity- and to South African's. This is probably why most of the Kiwi posters have left...:D

Apr 15, 2019, 15:50

I'm still waiting, dumbass.

Which religion did he attack?

Please tell me?


Apr 15, 2019, 15:53

The modern day Eric Liddell.

“If, in the quiet of your heart, you feel something should be done, stop and consider whether it is in line with the character and teaching of Jesus. If so, obey that impulse to do it, and in doing so you will find it was God guiding you.” Eric Liddell

....ironical really, Liddell is one of the most admired athletes who believed in a literal interpretation of the scriptures. So is Folau, admittedly with a harder edge.

Fortunately the Pom team management along with a few athletes were flexible enough to allow Liddell to win the 400 metres at the Olympics. The Aussies are botching this whole thing horribly.

Apr 15, 2019, 16:02

Speak up, SharkShit!!

I'm still waiting ... did you understand the question? I can repeat it if you like.

oh hang on .. are you looking up the meaning of the word "discriminate" ... is that why you're keeping me waiting ... ?

Fair enough. While you're at it ... look up the word "hypocrite" too.

I'll be patient.

 


Apr 15, 2019, 16:07

Where did Jesus teach one religion to dam others to hell?  Hardly in line with the character and teachings of Jesus. 

Jesus even says in the Good Samaritan parable that your religion has nothing to do with an afterlife. He says the Samaritan would go to heaven, but the religious Church minister would not. 

Like Richard Dawkins says - the Bible is a fantastic work of fiction. You can read the stories to learn what the underlying morals are. However, you can also read a book like Oliver Twist and see what the underlying morals of the story are. 


Apr 15, 2019, 16:22

Ok .. so ... Folau didn't discriminate against any other religion after all ... right?

That was just another lie you told ... right?

You've told many of those in the last few weeks, haven't you?

You know what liars do? They lie.


Jesus said "I am the way ... no one gets to the Father except through me". What does that tell you, SharkShit?

Listen ... idiot ... just because you go to church, doesn't mean that you automatically qualify to enter His kingdom. Many preacher men will find themselves cast out. Uh-Duh!!

I've told you before ... read the Bible ... stop thumbsucking your way through every post.

    


Apr 15, 2019, 17:11

@Lost Sheep, are you able type discriminate into Google?


make an unjust or prejudicial distinction in the treatment of different categories of people, especially on the grounds of race, sex, or age.
"existing employment policies discriminate against women"
synonyms:be biased, show prejudice, be prejudiced; 

The examples used are race, sex and age, but it is an extensive list that also includes religion. 

Saying one group (his group) are going to heaven and everyone else to hell is a prejudicial distinction based on religious beliefs.  It is implied he is better than anyone else because he is getting into heaven. So people have to live with this tosser while he is on earth in the meantime. 

Australia has decided he does not represent the people of their country - only his distorted view of God's word. 

You and Beeno are products of Apartheid. Relics that would not be able to live in a first world country. If there is an afterlife, I would bet money that the 2 people least likely to make it are the both of you. 

You can read the book Oliver Twist one hundred times- but you can't understand how to apply the morals in your life- so no matter how many times you read the book - you are still a below average human being. 
Basically, and lost cause, lost sheep.... 

The Church sells an afterlife insurance policy so they would not like to emphasize that other religions would also have an afterlife. (e.g. the Good Samaritan who does not worship Jesus). The Bible is full of contradiction that has been added by the Church over the years to help sell their insurance policy. 

The Good Samaritan is getting into heaven but not through Jesus. I feel like I am having a conversation with a kinder garden child. If Jesus did exist, my guess is that he would agree I am teaching you his words.
 


Apr 15, 2019, 17:51

I'm still waiting, dumbass.

Which religion did he attack?

Please tell me?


Playing semantics.

In abrahamic religions,idolators are people who worship something else than the one god.

They are any people who believe in another god (or worship stuff like rugby as it happens in SA that keep putting off the necessary termination of rugby in SA)

They are promised to hell. Unless they quit their gods and follow the one god.

Apr 15, 2019, 20:34

Sharkbok is one heck of a clown. 

How many times does one have to tell the halwit that Folau was quoting scripture. 

Scripture is very clear. Unless you repent of your sins, receive Jesus as Saviour and are born again you cannot enter the Kingdom of God. 

Tough luck if you don't like it Sharkbok but that is what the Bible plainly teaches. 

Without Christ you are LOST. 

The soul that sins shall dies. All have sinned and come short of the Glory of God. 

No person who ever lived was so attested to by prophecy. No life lived as ever been without sin like the life of Jesus was. Nobody ever did the things He did and nobody ever ROSE FROM THE DEAD TRIUMPHING OVER SIN AND DEATH. 

NOBODY IS LIKE GOD THE SON and can be compared to Him. 

The world's were made through Him. He is before all and above ALL. 

He is The VERY WORD OF GOD MADE FLESH. 

Forget about any other non entity bull dusters. It is to Christ that EVERY need shall BOW AND IT IS CHRIST THAT EVERY TONGUE WILL CONFESS IS LORD.

Don't trouble me with mere men when as Christians we have God HIMSELF AND HIS WONDERFUL SALVATION, A FREE PARDON FOR OUR SINS AND AN ADOPTION INTO THE VERY FAMILY OF GOD! 



Apr 15, 2019, 20:41

CC I see you have a sound grasp of biblically what is coming. The whore church etc. 

It's really amazing how this all is unfolding as prophesized

. Look up for your redemption draws nigh. 

However we can't be among those waving the anti christ agenda on. 

Not can we be concerned about the anti Christ's beheading etc. 

So congrats again to Folau. I am sure the Lord is proud of him! Love psalm 1. Kings will shut their mouths because of Him. Those setting themselves up today to judge God will find themselves judged.

Apr 15, 2019, 20:46

There is only one way and few find it. 

I AM THE WAY SAYS JESUS. I AM THE WAY AND THE TRUTH AND THE LIFE. NOBODY COMES TO THE FATHER BUT BY ME. 

NOBODY MEANS NOBODY. 

END OF STORY. 

Apr 15, 2019, 20:56

So why is the Good Samaritan getting into heaven if he is not a Christian? 


All that you people are interested in is getting into heaven. I doubt simpleton Beeno or Lost Sheep (Clean Cut) will make the cut into heaven. So why waste your time? Lucifer waits for you to take your place alongside Hansie Cronjie. 

When is the next Sunday school sermon for you and the pee brain Lost Sheep to attend with kids with more brain capacity than you? You can quote simpleton scripture to each other in the hope that you will not be dumped into hell. 


Apr 15, 2019, 21:01

Hahahahaha haha man you are sooooo clueless. 

One really has to be careful of casting pearls before swine. 

You really have no idea why we know we will go to Heaven. 

Even after it has been explained to you. Talk about being blind!  

Apr 15, 2019, 21:04

Luke 10:25-37 New International Version (NIV)

The Parable of the Good Samaritan

25 On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. “Teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life

26 “What is written in the Law?” he replied. “How do you read it?”

27 He answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’and, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’

28 “You have answered correctly,” Jesus replied. “Do this and you will 

29 But he wanted to justify himself,F)" so he asked Jesus, “And who is my neighbor?”

30 In reply Jesus said: “A man was going down from Jerusalem to Jericho, when he was attacked by robbers. They stripped him of his clothes, beat him and went away, leaving him half dead. 31 A priest happened to be going down the same road, and when he saw the man, he passed by on the other side., a Levite, when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side. 33 But a Samaritan,  as he traveled, came where the man was; and when he saw him, he took pity on him. 34 He went to him and bandaged his wounds, pouring on oil and wine. Then he put the man on his own donkey, brought him to an inn and took care of him. 35 The next day he took out two denariic and gave them to the innkeeper. ‘Look after him,’ he said, ‘and when I return, I will reimburse you for any extra expense you may have.’

36 “Which of these three do you think was a neighbour to the man who fell into the hands of robbers?”

37 The expert in the law replied, “The one who had mercy on him.”

Jesus told him, “Go and do likewise.”



So the Christians are not going to heaven, but the non-Christian is going to heaven. So the moral of the story, is that someone can be another religion but if they are a good person they will get an afterlife.

 


Apr 15, 2019, 21:11

Sharkbokkie listen oak. The clear teaching is that there is nobody good enough to make it to Heaven. NOBODY. All have sinned and ALL HAVE COME SHORT. 

CAN you not understand why it was necessary for Christ to die on the cross. 

What do you think He was doing there? 

Apr 15, 2019, 21:16

You are not answering the question. Jesus clearly states in that parable that the non-Christian is going to heaven, but the 2 Christians are not. Can you explain this?


Jesus was murdered (if he existed). The Church has been upselling forgiveness along with an afterlife insurance policy ever since.

Apr 15, 2019, 21:20

By the way do you really believe anybody has loved the Lord you God with all your heart  soul and strength.?

Many times Jesus showed that sinful men cannot keep the law of God and that precisely is why everyone needs the atoning work, the blood that was shed to pay the price for their sins. 

Apr 15, 2019, 21:34

Shark, you are almost getting the parable,  but not quite. Keep trying, you're almost there.:D

Apr 15, 2019, 23:21

"I AM THE WAY SAYS JESUS. I AM THE WAY AND THE TRUTH AND THE LIFE. NOBODY COMES TO THE FATHER BUT BY ME. 

NOBODY MEANS NOBODY. 

END OF STORY. "

Thus spake Baboon-ou.

Interesting that Jesus is cracking so many mentions on a thread about gays.


Apr 15, 2019, 23:29

Klown, in your never humble opinion, how many of the seven seals would you say have been broken?


No need for a sermon, the answer I request is simply a number between (and including) 1 and 7.

Thanks in anticipation.

Apr 15, 2019, 23:35

Klown, have you ever read a book called "Good Omens" by Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman (in collaboration)?


If not, you should really read it. I'd actually recommend it to anyone but I suspect you in particular would resonate with the themes . . . and it's possibly the funniest book ever written since Catch 22.

Apr 15, 2019, 23:53

Flying Spaghetti Monster........Official church stance of homosexual marriage

Published January 19th, 2011 by Katie

Fellow Pastafarians,

I am writing about the official church stance of homosexual marriage (i.e. none). I am concerned that this stance is in direct contradiction with the will of the FSM. You see, I received a vision from the FSM this evening while (as is often the case) I was cooking a grilled cheese sandwich.

During his appearance he told me that homosexuals are gay because He has touched them with his noodley appendage. This is the reason that “experts” have had so much difficulty pinpointing what makes someone gay. And since gays and lesbians have been chosen by Him, to deny them the right to get married is an abomination in His eyes (meatballs). Of course many have argued that no major religion has ever accepted homosexuality. It should obvious to any FSM follower that the real reason homosexuals are shunned from mainstream religion is because of blatant prejudice towards those who have been touched by Him. A bigotry that I know many of my fellow Pastafarians have experienced first hand.

I am especially concerned because of the state of gay rights movement today. Too often gay activists argue that should be given the right to marry because of court precedent that says marriage is their “right as a human being” or essential to the “dignity ” of a relationship. Then they rely on the 14th amendment to say that they deserve “equal protection under the laws” and that under constitution gay people are “equal to” straight people.

Well I think to time to put these arguments to rest. Gay Pastafarians should sue because not allowing gay marriage is a violation of their first amendment rights since it is commanded by the FSM as relayed to me in my vision. Of course He works in mysterious ways and we may never why He commands that gays get married. But there is no question that He does.

Now if I know my fellow Pastafarians, you want proof. Attached is a photo of the grilled sandwich I was cooking when He appeared to me. I think it speaks for itself. I hope that it is satisfactory proof to convince everyone that we should amend the CotFSM’s stance on gay marriage to supporting it. Only then can gay Pastafarians demand true religious freedom and marry as the FSM intended.

May you all be touched by his noodley appendage,

Katie



375 Responses to “Official church stance of homosexual marriage”

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  3. P michael Halden says:

    Haha – This is awesome! Thanks so much for writing it.

    And here’s a link to why Christianity is more unnatural than Homosexuality.

    Best.

    http://therantinstitute.blogspot.com/2016/04/holy-homophobia-batman.html

  4. sil says:

    As usual this site confuses me but in a good way
    I to am subject to visions that come upon me before my second coffee in the morning but I listen with confidence to my secret friend who translates the wishes of my unicorn in reference to the wisdom of the dragon.
    Gary

    • Keith says:

      That’s always a good way to start the day.

  5. Erik says:

    This message was written back in 2011. Now gay marriage is legalized in the U.S. It clearly PROVES that the flying spaghetti monster words is The Truth and that His Power finally win regardless of what other people say.
    Because his words is objective moral truth.

    But gay marriage is not only founded on faith, but also on reason. If you discard the flying spaghetti monster, you discard carbohydrates. If you discard carbohydrates you discard your health. If you discard your health you discard your life. Therefore, gay marriage is vital for our survival. Checkmate, christians.

    Ra’men!

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Leave a Reply

Apr 16, 2019, 00:06

Ramen!

Apr 16, 2019, 06:36

Good Omens was a good read, should go a d read it again.

Apr 16, 2019, 06:54

Folau is being kind and nice,if one gay person turns from their life of sin due to his stance then the angels in heaven rejoice.
For me the gay evilness is from the "pit of hell" fullstop.

Apr 16, 2019, 11:24

Redneck ... no ... I've never read it.

I will look for it. Sounds interesting.

Thanks


Apr 16, 2019, 11:46

Redneck ... regarding the seals ...  no sermon, huh?

Ok ..

None ... so far.

I realize that the number zero didn't fall within your required parameters.


Apr 16, 2019, 14:22

Zero?


I understood the first seal to have been broken when JC died and I'm finding a lot of sites which claim we're already up to 5 seals broken and only 2 to go.

But you say zero? 

Okay . . . thanks . . .

Apr 16, 2019, 14:37

Pleasure!


Apr 16, 2019, 21:29

@ Beeno

Sodom and Gomorrah!?

Where the village people want to shag the angels. 

I've never met and Angel. Can't imagine busting a nut would be anywhere near my mind if I did though. 

That's one he'll of a perverted town. 

Also, the angels seem rather too mortal. The host offers the village people his children for sodomising purposes instead. 

Either way there was some sick shit going on.  Clearly the angels could have defended themselves. Their omission resulted in rape/sodomy/pedo action.

God already knew what kind of place it was. Did he need a final bit of evidence before sending the fireballs?

Then some lady got turned into a pillar of salt for turning to glance at what must have been quite a pyrotechnic display.

All very harsh, outlandish, and also petty.

Actual butt sex isn't mentioned though. Wasn't there something about it being interpreted as such, as opposed to actually mentioned?


Apr 17, 2019, 08:50

No, Plum ... common man. Are you drunk? Had a bit to much weed?

Don't be like Stupid.

Firstly ... the perverted horde weren't aware that they were angels. Do I really have to explain that to you? Seriously?

Secondly ... they were offered his daughters ... in other words, females ... you know, with vaginas. Uh-Duh!!

Thirdly ... they saw the men (angels) arrive and could see that they were male ... hence their intentions to have "butt sex" ... so friggin obvious ... wake up man. No interpretation necessary.

The "lady" was told not to look back ... she was told that there would be consequences if she did ... there is a lot more to it than God being petty. And I though SharkShit was ignorant.

Yes God did know what type of place it was ... he gave them time to repent ... many chances to make right ... to correct their ways. Abraham even pleaded their case. The same kind of thing happened to Pompei. The same kind of perversion.

We all know how much you love sodomy, Plum. I'm sure your girlfriends gets a regular run through ... and what was that word you used for using a dildo anally on yourself ... or do you get your girlfriend to stuff it repeatedly into your pooper?

You reject God ... and yet believe in little green men zooming around space in flying saucers ... and yet here you are calling into question what we believe in?

Really?

 

 

Apr 17, 2019, 10:03

Lol CC

Nah, I only smoke before gym and sometimes with the guitar.

Anyway, just a weird story in my opinion.

As I've stated before, I don't reject any religion out of hand. Do I have questions and problems with some of what the varoius doctrines espouse, sure.  

As I've stated before, I have to look past many things to do with religion if I intend on keeping the big picture in mind. And that is what I do.

The sad thing is that large part of the "looking past", is to do with not paying attention to people that claim they are religious. In fact, most of them are worse examples of faith than atheists are.

I have a cousin, same age as myself and I remember asking my mom when I was about eight years old if he was gay because he wasn't like me, or any other boys I knew. Surprise surprise, he turned out to be a raging homo. 

Do I condone condemning his his soul/spirit/energy to hell on the basis of something that he didn't choose?

No.

Do I reserve your right to believe and say that?

100% yes. 

See, my world allows for you views. Your world however, doesn't allow for mine.

And that's the consistent theme across many cultures, over much time and largely to the detriment of the world.

Always remember, atheists and agnostics never killed 500million people because people didn't agree with them or because their doctrine was blasphemed.

You dislike Islam, so do I. The reality is however that Christians have been responsible for countless more murder than muslims. Not just murder but the dark ages, the censorship of information and all the evils that were derived from it.

The only difference...right now is that you don't live in a time when that is happening.

My scepticism isn't just based in the bible and it's words. It's rooted in the actions of men, and women, that claim to have the Lord living inside them. 

To me, empathy is the most divine trait that humans are endowed with. It's as close as we get to alturism. 

When I see Christians happily condemning gays to hell, I don't question their right to speak, I question their faith.



Apr 17, 2019, 13:35

I am aware of what the Christian faith has brought to the world. It includes all that you say and much more. We have homo preachers molesting boys in the Catholic church openly ... and getting away with it.

The world turns a blind eye. Homosexuality is after all a natural act, right? It’s been accepted across the world. Same sex marriages being allowed to adopt children ... perverting their views ... brain washing them into thinking it’s natural ... so why not a little hanky panky with a 7 year old boy?

I’m sure they’re all just misunderstood. I must show a little empathy ...  be a little more sympathetic.

Of course you'd want me to give you the thumbs up for sodomizing your girlfriend. You practice it regularly. It's who you are. It's what you do. You enjoy having a dildo probing your anal cavity ... having it rub up against your prostate.

Anything goes with you. Drugs ... anal sex ... who knows what else. I wouldn’t be surprised if you’ve had a one on one session with some stranger in a toilet cubicle at the local train station.

You are right ... there is no room in my world for that.

Apr 17, 2019, 14:25

...and i respect your right to both believe and say that.

Apr 17, 2019, 18:43

That homophobic prick has served only to highlight what a fuck up Christianity is.

He has done the world a favour - he has exposed religion for what it’s worth - a big fat ZERO, a dying art. It’s so pathetically out of touch - I wonder why?

Apr 17, 2019, 19:52

Fat Dave the arch perv arrives on the scene his love for homos ablaze. 

Zip it you disgusting little blob! Time you were off to your gay club Davie boy.

Plum one thing you need to distinguish between is false Christianity and Biblical Christianity  

Those pedophiles and that wolf in sheep's clothing Pope are not Christians at all. Folau on the other hand appears to be as he holds to the Biblical truth dispite a very hostile perv environment and great cost. I commend his fighting back. 

Do you know that in 2018 in France over 800 churches were vandalized. 

Plum it is the Godless, fascist, globalist left that is trying to ram LGBT down everyone's throats and who will not tolerate anybody saying it's not right. Just like they try to silence their political opponents. 

Pervs like fat Dave are part of the problem. But it appears to me normal sane people are finding their voices and telling pervs like fat Dave to get lost. :D


Apr 17, 2019, 19:56

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Apr 17, 2019, 19:56

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Apr 17, 2019, 20:40

That homophobic prick has served only to highlight what a fuck up Christianity is.

He has done the world a favour - he has exposed religion for what it’s worth - a big fat ZERO, a dying art. It’s so pathetically out of touch - I wonder why?


Ja Dave, you keep on believing that. What did Stalin, Lenin and Mao's anti religion do for the world? Wake up.... Hitler and Napoleon weren't Christians either...bu that's a different story....

Apr 17, 2019, 20:51

  1. See, my world allows for you views. Your world however, doesn't allow for mine.
  2. And that's the consistent theme across many cultures, over much time and largely to the detriment of the world.
  3. Always remember, atheists and agnostics never killed 500million people because people didn't agree with them or because their doctrine was blasphemed.
1. Plum, go read the gospels and then come back and tell me who preaches tolerance in today's world...Jesus or Atheism?

2.Intolerance is the human condition and has nothing to do with religion. Religion gets infiltrated and perverted for the "Evil One's" ends. Jesus turned the other cheek.

3. Stalin and Mao killed a few too, but the Church of Jesus never killed a soul. I'ts non Christian to "cast the first stone"... PS, where do you get that figure from? All Church killings were really in the name of Satan, but that's another story too.


Apr 18, 2019, 09:14

Draad

My problem is not at all with the message, well the new testament at least. It does indeed promote many good qualities.

One of my problems is supposed religious people.

Hence my statement that I have to overlook most Christians if I wish to keep the big picture in mind.

We're on the same page there.

500 million is the figure attributed to the amount of deaths caused by the Catholic church. 

My further point is that the dissenting voices are necessary. It's only when ideas are allowed to be opposed that society can hold them in balance. 

And this opposition is met with aggression by pseudo religious people. 

Apr 18, 2019, 09:35

Problem is I did not want to get drawn into discussions,   In SA for years teams elections has ben influenced by the "political correctness"  of selection totally disregarding performance as a norm.  

No it seems that Australia has fallen into the same trap and it can only damage them as a team.   What the hell has Folau's religious beliefs got to do with his performances as a player?   Zip - I am afraid. 

As to politics there is no way I would ever agree on what Stalin and Mao did in their respective countries.   Real statistics about those two are slowly emerging,   Stalin and Mao was responsible for the killing of 52 000 000 and 75 000 000 people in their respective countries.   I do not know where the 500 000 000 killed by religious beliefs came from.   The Black Plague killed 40% of the European population in the 14th century and that figure was given as 40 000 000.   

Before the 20th century armies were generally smaller and weaponry ineffective for mass killings.    When there were major wars in Europe especially before the 20th century it was more political and economically based than religious.

In the case of the Islamic regimes the situation was much the same as in Western Europe.   Communication made the type of killing of millions of people unlikely.   In the worst religious atrocity in the 20th century the Armenian murders by the Turks  did not even resemble 20% of what Mao and Stalin and Lenin  did to their own people.

Another real problem is that the theory of communism stemmed from the Ancient Jewish  economic system - that is why such a high percentage of Jewish people all over the world supported the Communists in the 20th century.   

Be it as it may a religious and political mix is a deadly combination.   

But I stay with what I wrote above - political correctness is a cancer when it takes precedence over performance and counter the democratic beliefs in freedom of speech,           

         

Apr 18, 2019, 09:50

Whether atheist or religious, people serve their own interests. Stalin, Mao, etc served their own interests, just like churches serve their own interests, just like governments use gods to justify their power in order to serve their own interests (and this goes for all gods, pagan and otherwise, whatever holds sway with the masses at the time).

No Christian believes in JHWH or even the Jesus of the Bible. You may think you do, but you don't. Biblical JHWH has long since been replaced by the concept of a "personal god" with whom you have "a relationship". What that god likes or dislikes tend to coincide with and support whatever each individual likes or dislikes. You believe in a version of god that works for you, and in a Jesus that works for you.

Look at all these right wing conservatives loving Jesus. Yet much of what Jesus preached would today be considered liberalism: turn the other cheek, look after the poor, blessed are the merciful and the peacemakers, love your enemy and pray for those who persecute you, invest resources in helping others instead of hoarding it, easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than the rich man to get to heaven, etc.

Do we see any of those characteristics in our resident upstanding disciples Beeno and CC? Nope, none. Mostly they exhibit hatred, judgement and contempt, but they think they're doing the will of Jesus. And of course they are - only they are doing the will of THEIR PERSONAL Jesus who is in full support of their thinking, not the biblical Jesus.

If Jesus walked the earth today, he wouldn't be hanging with the likes of Trump in that godawful gold plated penthouse of his, nor would he be on social media or internet forums bashing the gays. He would far more likely be standing in an alley around a fire in a drum comforting the poor and dispossessed.

Apr 18, 2019, 10:43

@Pakie, that pretty much sums of things.


The Bible is filled with self-contradiction. So people choose the options they identify with- and then believe it is the path of Jesus. They create Jesus in their own image

For example, on the topic of how to get into heaven, there are two viewpoints expressed by Jesus.

1. Only through me(Jesus) can you get into heaven - (Being a Christian)
2. The good Samaritan of a different religion who Jesus says will go to heaven (and not the Jewish priests). 

So in the first option, Jesus says only Christians go to heaven, and in the second option completely contradicts this and says that good people go to heaven regardless of religion. He says nothing about praying for forgiveness - but actions speak louder than words.

You could get figurative and say that being good is Jesus way -so Samaratin is actually being Christian even if he is not a Christian. 
Once things start to leave literal to figurative- you can bend anything how you want it to be.
That disregards other religions -and the good people within these religions - or non-religious good people. 
The Church sells the afterlife- and you spend time at Church asking for forgiveness. The whole story about him dying on the cross is figurative- created by the Church to sell guilt.

If Jesus was alive today he would be left wing and democratic in his ideals. He would make real contributions instead of spending his day being a hero on social media damming people to hell.  Not that all left wing people spend their time making contributions - but at least they don't BS themselves. I also doubt he would recommend spending all the time in Church praying for your own salvation - instead, he would recommend helping others.



Apr 18, 2019, 10:46

My bad. Was going on something I read some time back.

The number is upwards of 50 million.

Apr 18, 2019, 12:30

Go to the New Testament and show me where Christ commands His FOLLOWERS to slaughter opponents. Go and read the whole New Testament. Then report back with your findings.

Man, the level of ignorance on display, the lack of understanding is incredible.

Apr 18, 2019, 12:52

Plum

Even through the centuries the 50 million could be a huge over-estimate not actually easy to verify.   The major problem is there is no real statistics  and the 40 million could be based  on what the past injustices could have on present populations.

The main abuse of religion can relate to the following:-

*    The conquering of South and Central America by the Spanish and the Portuguese - resulting in wiping out of a huge percentage of the huge population

*     The Roman Inquisition and the religious wars between the Catholics and  Protestants

*     The Hun and Barbarians attacks on Western Europe

*     The attacks of Vikings on parts of Europe

*     The attacks of the Golden Hoard especially iro Russia and the Balkans

*     The genocide in  Armenia

*     The Sudan situation and genocide committed.

The invasion of Europe by the Barbarians, Hun, Vikings and Mongolians over centuries became assimilated into the European nations and changed their original religious beliefs.

I must also state that the indigenous populations of the Americas was largely killed off by diseases against which the populations have no natural defense - eg polio, leprosy, TB and plague - and where medicine  to combat those diseases were gradually developed, those medicines were not available in the continents mentioned,      

  
 

Apr 18, 2019, 13:57

Beeno

The point is not that the bible says people should be killed.

People kill people and religious views help people to justify killing others through the way they interpret scripture.

That's what has happened historically.

And my view is that dissenting voices and varying ideas are the best way to keep personal beliefs from causing harm on a large scale.


Apr 18, 2019, 14:15

'A year later, Columbus built his first town on the nearby island of Hispaniola, where the Taino numbered at least 60,000 and possibly as many as 8 million, according to some estimates. But by 1548, the Taino population there had plummeted to less than 500. Lacking immunity to Old World pathogens carried by the Spanish, Hispaniola’s indigenous inhabitants fell victim to terrible plagues of smallpox, influenza, and other viruses.'

.................

Correction Mike.....the wipe out of the South American Indians was mostly because of diseases brought by the Europeans.

Apr 18, 2019, 14:42

Moz

Saw something a while back where they said that the first estimates were that 50% of the population died of smallpox. They then said it was closer to 90%.

The Spanish often times walked into empty villages where the virus had spread to before they got there.


Apr 18, 2019, 15:35

Exactly Plum....to equate this with what happened in Hitler's Germany, Stalin's Russia, Pol Pot's Kampuchea, or Turkey's Armenian genocide.....is incorrect. This was largely a series of massive epidemics....not deliberate genocide.

Apr 18, 2019, 16:15

Mozart.....there’s a series playing on cable called Einsatzgruppen: The Nazi Death Squads. Only up to the 3rd episode but it’s just so horrific. Sorry if this is not in line with the thread you just reminded me when you mentioned Hitler’s Germany.

 
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