It's obvious that his omission is not about his rugby only.
It's obvious that his omission is not about his rugby only.
Rassie is dead wrong in not playing him more...he can cover 6,7,8 and 12/13 from the bench. He should be in the 23 every match.
Rassie will weather the storm from supporters but will stand by his decision not to pick Roos.
Once the noise dies down, fans will slowly calm and become less vocal about Roos.
By then, Erasmus still won’t have selected him, and the real reason behind his dislike for Roos will no longer matter.
Also... if you have two really good 8s...why did you invite Trokkie, Roos and Dups?
Why, during Wiese's ban, Dups and Trokkie;s injuries, did you never call Roos up when he was clearly in line.
The only reason Rassie had him in the alignment camps was to make it appear as though Roos is in the running. He never was - and that's why none of Roos' current form is being taken into account and why Rassie would rather go on EOYT with Wiese as his only proper 8.
There is no excuse for excluding Roos from the squad. None.
Despite my reservations, I can't deny that he deserves a crack at proving his worth.
Rassie’s treatment of Roos is piss poor
Why, during Wiese's ban, Dups and Trokkie;s injuries, did you never call Roos up when he was clearly in line.
Exzekerly.
My thoughts as well.
Is Dr. Lucky really concerned about how his decisions affect the players’ mental state?
I don’t think so. If he truly cared, why wouldn’t he play Jean-Luc after picking him countless times already? Or Jean Kleyn, Swampie Swart, Nico JV Rensburg…
Why would he tell Roos to improve on certain aspects of his game, but then not select him? After all that hard work, all Roos has is the standby list….
He tells himself he’s doing them an honour, but in reality, he’s embarrassing them.
It must be the worst feeling — being selected, yet not trusted to play.
In my opinion, his motivation in cases like this, including Roos, is driven by his egotistical nature.
Yes, Dr. Lucky can appear humble, but a big part of him thrives on narcissistic and self-centred traits.
Mpuff have you met Rassie in person - for it sure sounds like it
Davies, no, I haven’t met Rassie — and I said clearly it’s my opinion.
But you don’t need to share a braai with someone to see patterns in their behaviour.
Rassie shows enough of himself in pressers, interviews, and how he treats players for anyone with half a brain to read between the lines.
What’s funny though, is how you also take shots at Rassie when it suits you — but the moment I turn up the heat, you fold straight back into your Groupie routine.
Pick a side, Guy. Either you’re critical, or you’re a cheerleader. You can’t be both!
Oh fuck off I’m not stupid enough to label someone the way you have based on some half cocked opion
If there was evidence out there from players he had previously coached etc then fair enough, you would be entitled to formulate the opinions you have
Rassie comes across as a genuine great guy and his players are on record saying how good he is with people
If he was everything you say he is, people would have picked up on that ages ago and he would not have achieved the success he has being a dick
So go shove your ignorant opinions up your arse
I take issue with his selections not him as a person
Try wake up and work out the difference
"Pick a side, Guy. Either you’re critical, or you’re a cheerleader. You can’t be both!"
It's not about being cheerleaders, it's about acknowledging exceptional achievement, reviewing actions and commenting on issues. Nobody will be right all of the time and will be pleasing everybody all of the time...including exceptional performers like Rassie...he also is prone to his own bias...it depends on how we express our disagreement...calling probably the best Bok coach ever a lucky and egotistical/narcissist doos is not only disrespectful in the highest degree, it's also petty, unreasonable and totally detached from reality...any attempt at spinning it into some sort of reasonable criticism is laughable horse manure and should be answered with the contempt it deserves.
I think eople have to rhe ri g ht to doiffer from the decisions of Erasmus and in my book Kwagga this ear t hus far was nt the layer he used to be last year. He is 32 years old already and if Erasmus is really clear on issues he s hould npt pick Van Staden in any loosie position position - he si nopt a loosie's arse,
Performance wise if he above is correct he ould not pick Hanekom either - so what is clear here there is csoemthing amiss in Erasmus viewpoint on Roos.
Spot on Draad
Davies, you seem a little worked up there, Guy.
For someone who claims to “take issue with selections, not the man,” you sure don’t mind throwing a few personal insults around.
It’s always the same story with you — free to swear at and belittle others, but the moment someone digs deeper into Rassie’s behaviour, suddenly it’s “ignorant opinions” and “go shove it up your arse.”
That double standard says more about you than it does about me.
You’ve also had plenty to say about Rassie in the past — but now that I’ve called out the person behind the performance, you crawl back into the fan-club tent.
Typical Saffolk the Fake: full of bark, no consistency.
And Draad — easy there, big guy :)
Nobody’s denying Rassie’s achievements. But acting like success automatically cancels out criticism?
That’s the kind of blind loyalty that turns sharp rugby talk into groupie gospel.
So relax, both of you. I’ve got my opinion, and I’m not here to join the Groupie choir :)
Mpuff crawl back under your rock.
Next time you point fingers at someone try rely on some material evidence instead of sucking that load of ignorant shit out of your dumb arse
Its pretty obvious that Rassie is none of the insulting traits you label him as - only a fucking idiot would come up with shit like that
Someone who is very dumb
Porker , you and your little groupie circle are seriously blind if you can’t see the ego dripping off Rassie these days.
You call him “a great guy,” yet this same “great guy” openly swore at players in the World Cup changeroom, belittling them for giving away a penalty — and you think that’s leadership?
That’s not humility, that’s ego dressed up as passion.
Then there’s his hypocrisy in selections: guys like Jean-Luc, Roos, Ruben V Heerden, Reinhardt Ludwig and other white forwards get rotated, benched, or ignored…
while players like Bongi, Nyakane, Kollisi, Moerat keep getting endless chances, no matter their form. If that’s not double standards, then what is it?
But I guess you, Draad, Rooi Tit and the two Old Lunatic Cheerleaders Beeno and Uncle BS, prefer not to notice — because questioning Saint Dr. Kak Lucky, isn’t allowed in the fan club, right?
So carry on worshipping the man if you want. I’ll keep calling it as I see it — without the green-tinted glasses:)
Let’s face it this Roos omission is personal and that dishonest response is disrespectful to fans. If there’s something in Roos’ game that doesn’t fit our playing style, he should just say so. But if it’s personal and coaches have the right to exclude players they think are disruptive, don’t pretend he’s suddenly going to be playing for the Boks in a WC year.
Fuck me Mpuff you are really are profoundly thick
So now a coach swearing in the change room is belittling - wow you really are both thick and a wet blanket
Your take on Rassie has zero credibility and serves only to evidence how pathetic you are
I guess every coach has his bad selection where he simply doesn't a player in his team for what ever reason. No matter how good they are.
Jake left Gary Botha out for many years and he was probably better than Smit but he was captain. Side mention to Luke Watson but we all knew how toxic he was for the environment. More so his Dad and the ANC cadre that ruined his rugby career by reinforcing him with political BS.
Meyer left Vermeulen out for many years before he was picked or was it Snorre.
So there are some players that could feel hard done by.
I think Roos is one of those.
I think Rassie doesn't want to an attacking 8 and doesn't suite his game plan. He wants a stamper at 8, basher
Not so much Gary Botha it was more Bismark missing out to Smit
Bismark was so much better than Smit - Smit was eventually moved to tighthead which never worked
"But acting like success automatically cancels out criticism?"
No we don't, we question a lot of his selections, we just don't attack his character like you and Moz do...and stop attributing his success to luck...and mocking his honorary doctorate? What's the point of that if not petulant spite?
They use the word lucky exactly because there seems to be a failure of logic when getting you guys to admit that 3 single points win in knockout games is by definition about as lucky as you can be...as anyone has ever been.
You hear arguments like "But the Boks scrum was dominant, how is that luck?" or "You can't say it's lucky because rugby is all about random things happening." Obviously illogical arguments that demonstrate a clear failure in the ability to understand basic language.
If a car narrowly misses you as you cross the road...you say "I am lucky to be alive because that was very close." Right? Well, why? Because the smallest change in timing could mean that the car would have hit you...obviously.
You call it luck because at that tiny margin, the smallest incident can sway the result.
The same logic applies when winning a game, or three games, by the closest margin possible.
If a car wizzes down the road twenty minutes after you crossed, you don't call it luck when you "survive"...because it wasn't close. Arriving at the road a bit earlier or a bit later would have zero impact on whether the car would have hit you.
Oh what crap we won because we were the best side at the competition as we are now
We won because the game is played over 80 min by 23 players - it’s a culmination of so much before the end whistle
Luck comes into every aspect of life but to say we won all three games in a row by luck is both insulting to the players and evidence of pure rugby ignorance by those that advocate we won thanks to luck.
Calling our coach Dr Lucky on the strength of this ignorance is beyond insulting but we know how you lot roll - nothing changes there
Imagine true Bok supporters putting our WC triumph down to luck especially considering it was the toughest route to the final ever
"Luck comes into every aspect of life but to say we won all three games in a row by luck is both insulting to the players and evidence of pure rugby ignorance by those that advocate we won thanks to luck. "
Nobody is saying it was all luck.
Luck in this instance = a small random thing deciding who wins or loses when both sides are nearly the same.
Which is not the same as walking down the road and finding a wad of cash on the ground...that's pure luck.
If those were 50/50 games winning 3 of them in a row has a probability of 12.5%.
There it is again, the Rassie Groupie Choir in full voice.
You two act like questioning the man’s ego is the same as disrespecting the jersey. It’s not. It’s called having a balanced view, something both of you clearly struggle with.
I’ve never once denied the Boks’ achievements, but pretending that luck didn’t play a role in three one-point wins is pure fan fiction. Rugby isn’t just about effort; it’s also about margins, momentum, and yes — a bit of luck.
As for “Dr Lucky,” that nickname fits perfectly. He’s built an image of humble genius, while behind the scenes he plays favourites, swears at his own players, and sells himself as the saviour of SA Rugby. That’s not leadership, that’s ego management.
But you groupies don’t see that. You’ve built your little shrine to Rassie, and anyone who questions the man gets called “ignorant.”
Maybe try looking past the trophies for once — and you’ll see the cracks behind the act:)
The best side won - that has little to do with luck
Luck to the Boks was having the Kiwi’s down to 14 men
Luck to the Kiwis was the Boks losing Bongi in the first minute and being replaced by a flanker
Luck to the Kiwis was them being awarded their try when a forward pass was clear
Luck to the Kiwis was Siya fucking up a clear overlap to not put his team mate away for a try
Luck to the Boks for the Kiwis missing kicks
But for the rest of the game it was about striving to get the upper hand, which is what the Boks did in all those games - especially towards the end of the match when it counted the most
Mpuff are you seriously stupid enough to take issue with a coach swearing in the change room?
Because that applies to every coach at every level dumbo
With the score at 12/11
South Africa winger Cheslin Kolbe was the fourth player to be yellow-carded seven minutes from time but New Zealand's Jordie Barrett struck the subsequent 48-metre penalty attempt wide of the posts
With the score at 13/15 Freddie Steward launches a disastrous up and under instead of kicking deep to the corner. The Poms knock on, we dominate the scrum for a penalty and at minute 78….
Replacement flyhalf Handre Pollard kicked a last-gasp penalty as South Africa somehow found a way to get past a dominant England on Saturday and claim a 16-15 victory that sent them into a World Cup final against fellow triple champions New Zealand.
…..
The French game we won via Eben’s splendid try, but with a one point lead France was camped on our line ….any error the ref thought he saw could have ended the game in France’s favor.
…..
You don’t have to call all these things that went our way lucky to accept they were largely out of our control and certainly not the result of genius coaching. The coaching put us in an arm wrestle in 3 successive games, at the end a few players like Snyman, Etzebeth, Ox and Pollard did enough, but only because the opposing players didn’t take their chances….not in any way because the coaching got us out of those 3 deep holes.
No but it’s the coach that instils the belief in these players to go the extra mile, to fight the harder fight and win when it counts
Its what this team does time and time again
Will you all please stop reminding me how close we came to beating you in the RWC ! It’s distressing ;)
It would be a nice gesture if we sent Freddie a year’s supply of biltong!
Yes it would ! It’s the least you can do…….
Stort biltong in Bishop Storford hosted the Bok coaching group to a braai and plenty of biltong before the Argies match at Twickers.
Its was a brilliant marketing gig for them. They capture Felix Jones saying it was the best biltong he had ever tasted, Rassie and Thor were big fans. Rassie said the fat on the biltong was better than back home in SA.
There are plenty of biltong producers here now, it’s really popular, especially amongst the sportsman.
I have a mate who has a biltong business, I exchange ice cream for biltong - his biltong is not that great, but I won’t tell him that :)
We call it “ roadkill “ here……
Bullshit
Nope. It’s been called that for years….
Mozart
Hall Of Famer
47,134 posts
Oct 23, 2025, 18:34
If those were 50/50 games, winning 3 of them in a row has a probability of 12.5%.
Talk about beating the odds, a team of champions....
----------
The last World Cup was arguably the toughest ever draw - at least for the better teams.
The Boks had the toughest draw - having to play Ireland and Scotland in the opening rounds, then France in the quarters - at home. France were arguably the favourites to win the 2023 World Cup- and then England, who are good in wet conditions on the day, and then the All Blacks in the final.
Since then, the Boks have ranked top of the IRB ratings, which proves the 2nd Rassie World Cup was not a fluke.
"You don’t have to call all these things that went our way lucky to accept they were largely out of our control and certainly not the result of genius coaching. The coaching put us in an arm wrestle in 3 successive games, at the end a few players like Snyman, Etzebeth, Ox and Pollard did enough, but only because the opposing players didn’t take their chances….not in any way because the coaching got us out of those 3 deep holes."
Some luck, might even argue extreme luck, but luck wasn't the only factor, not by a long mile...3 deep holes in a row...we had to have some luck, but the 95% had to be there first to make the 5% luck count.
"You don’t have to call all these things that went our way lucky to accept they were largely out of our control and certainly not the result of genius coaching. The coaching put us in an arm wrestle in 3 successive games, at the end a few players like Snyman, Etzebeth, Ox and Pollard did enough, but only because the opposing players didn’t take their chances….not in any way because the coaching got us out of those 3 deep holes."
Some luck, might even argue extreme luck, but luck wasn't the only factor, not by a long mile...3 deep holes in a row...we had to have some luck, but the 95% had to be there first to make the 5% luck count.
"Nobody is saying it was all luck."
No, some of you are implying it's mostly luck..
Most of the Rassie fans agree that there were some luck involved...the all-luck-crowd are all in because they hate to admit that there was some exceptional preparations involved too...mostly by the coach...
You can prepare perfectly, but you can’t coach a last-minute knock-on, a missed kick, or a TMO call that goes your way. Those are the fine margins that decided all three knockout games.
Acknowledging that doesn’t take away from the achievement — it just gives an honest reflection.
It looks like you guys can’t handle any viewpoint that doesn’t praise him like he walks on water.
Rugby’s about balance — both on the field and in conversation.
Idiot
Rex, your Hereford bull (if you even have one — you lie so much it’s hard to tell) could’ve come up with a better reply than that. :)
Becs do you guys really call Biltong roadkill?? That’s not very nice:) Only good meat gets used for Biltong….
Do you like eating Biltong?
Mpuff what have I lied about you retard?
Provide the evidence or shut up
Unlike the criticism of Jake White I read on here all the time, I don’t think Dr Lucky is incompetent. He is clearly a professional and a competent forward coach. Time and again during the ‘expansive’ period I suggested we needed to get back to defense and forward dominance. Lucky pressed both those buttons.
But he is inherently very conservative, witness Roos, and he wasn’t willing to move far from his winning formula. We prevailed in 2003 and after that double win he acknowledged our strategy was outdated, criticized Schmidt for supposedly implementing it in Australia.
Schmidt, however, has improved Wallaby performance against the Lions and away against the Boks. That perhaps shows the strategy is not that outdated.
So it will be interesting to see if we are committed to Brown ball. And our tactics against the Bargies at Twickenham looked a lot like our tactics in the Oz second test.
Also Erasmus in almost 8 years at the helm, including 2020, hasn’t got any finger prints on backline tactics. It’s not his thing. That makes it hard to make a revolutionary change given the coach hasn’t got much to add. To in effect outsource coaching. A substantial loss in the second AB test might have killed it.
But credit to him for having the guts to throw all the balls in the air….few coaches would have done that given the Boks won the last 6o minutes at Eden Park. Which makes the reversion back to an arm wrestle at Twickenham, decided by a coat of paint, that much more disappointing.
Completely inaccurate that Rassie is only a forwards coach - under Rassie the only time we played a boring kicking conservative game was post Covid against the Lions given we had not played for ages
For the rest we scored as many tries in the backs as any other side out there, with as many defenders beaten or clean breaks made
Evidencec by the strike rates of our wings. Rassie is clearly an all round coach, renowned for researching opponents, tactically very astute and a very good player manager - the players love him, buy into his rugby philosophy.
Surrounded himself with trusted deputies - Neinaber, Felix Jones, Human etc. Has recognised the need to change things up and with that we have seen the introduction of Brown and Flannery
We have seen much evidence of Brown ball with subtle changes until it was fully unleashed against the Kiwi’s in NZ - but with that we saw a completely different backline who are better equipped to implement Brown ball
But unfortunately that was cut short by the injury to Fassi - where Willemse the catalyst at 12, had to move back to 15
It makes sense that when it’s a must win game we resort back to the tried and tested method - 2nd test against Oz, the second test against the Argies but that was more of a lapse as for the first 20min of the second half we looked like we would run away with the game
Until we have the right players in place on a regular basis implementing Brown ball, we will see us revert back to the old at times - it’s perfectly understandable
In a way I’m frustrated Rassie is not looking at a way to ensure Willemse stays at 12 regardless and this can only happen when there is a plausible back up to Fassi at 15
Mpower……yep, Roadkill it is :)
Well I don’t eat meat so none of that for me !
Ok Becs. Are you vegetarian or Vegan?
Vegan.
And your aunt?
Rabid meat eater…..:)
That’s interesting Becs. I myself don’t eat much Red meats… mostly chicken and Fish, lots of Veg. Also fruit.
Sometimes I will eat venison, also lean meat.
"Erasmus replied: “My friend he is a world-class player and will play many Test matches for the Boks, we just have to really good eights in Jasper [Wiese] and Kwagga [Smith], and in my opinion, they are still delivering at a higher level than Evan!! So, who to drop.? One thing is a given, he is a Test match player and will probably make it in 2027.”
The more I read this statement the more it annoys me.
1) Claims Evan is world class - but goes on EOYT with one proper 8.
2) Claims Evan is world class - but doesn't consider that he could cover the side of the scrum...the way Kolisi covers 8. Doesn't even want the supposedly world class player as part of the squad, a squad that is known for including long term prospects in it over long periods to acclimatise them to the "Bok way". Apparently Roos isn't even good enough for that!? If he isn't, then who is? Oh, right, the 21 year old prop that nobody has ever heard of. He can be included. He won't see game time but let's include him...but for sure let's leave this "world class" player who is in his prime at home.
3) The workload expected from Wiese is unacceptable - why does the 8 position seem to be immune to rotation? Wiese has started every single game that he has been fit and available for this year(after coming back from a neck injury). So what, we're gonna start Kwagga at 8 against Japan and Italy. Excellent, I'm sure the veteran will learn sooooo much from that. What happened to giving younger guys a chance, Rasman? I guess that doesn't apply to positions where the candidate next in line to be given some time is someone that you don't like.
4) The jab about 2027 is basically a snide way of saying he'll get in when I say so and it doesn't matter how well he performs until then - "Your career depends on me, not you." Imagine being Roos, playing like he is playing at the moment, and then hearing the coach say it'll be two years before you get in. Even if that's Rassie's plan, why say it out loud when all it does is serve as a gut punch to the player? The inclusion of that time frame was intentional. It's a jab, directly at Roos and his dad.
As mentioned, I find his "100% war" attitude enduring even if I think he could play smarter with what he does, and I believe he'll find more success that way.
...but now, seeing how he's basically being victimised by Rassie, I want Evan to win MOTM in every single game he plays.
Hanekom is coming back, and we already know Rassie, like the rest of us, rates him.
...where does that leave Roos?
Well, very obviously, in the camp of never being picked while Rasman is boss. It doesn't matter that he's a better loosie than Kolisi and PSDT. A spot at flank won't be found for him and there will always be some reason for not having him with the squad.
Somebody needs to explain the logic to me;
You pick a guy to be in the alignment camp. You put him on standby. Everything happens that should see him selected, you don't. He goes back his club and plays his socks off. You still don't pick him and you instead rely on having a single proper 8 in your side, on a tour where you're playing two of the best sides in the world.
Evan should pack his bags, piss off to France and earn big bucks there. His style of play will be lapped up by the French. He'll be working in much more professional conditions and be better looked after than he is in SA.
Playing for the Boks is first prize but ripping it up in Europe, getting massive exposure and retiring rich isn't a very distant second.
Yep, the evidence suggests a big Dislike of Roos….almost to the point of a Fuck You, not while I’m the coach…..
Dr.Lucky is the only so called Genius, that is simultaneously a Poephol:)
It's gonna turn nasty now M.
Roos is gonna keep playing very well and the public are gonna get even more behind him than they already are.
We'll see how Rassie responds, but I wouldn't be surprised if stuff kicks off
Yep, the evidence suggests a big Dislike of Roos….almost to the point of a Fuck You, not while I’m the coach…..
Agreed, my thoughts as well. I'm not sure what he's got against Roos, it's madness, almost like his in denial about the kid's amazing ability.
Even more weird when you think that the kid would waltz into any of top national sides in the world.
None of this makes sense - it’s literally bullshit
Telling us Kwagga is an 8 when we all know he has never succeeded starting at 8. He will then say Kolisi is an 8 if need be, which is bullshit.
You choose a squad of 36 to play 5 tests and you only select one specialist 8 in Wiese.
You have Roos knocking down the door and he can’t make the squad. Rassie’s response was who should he drop to include Roos - what crap, 36 could easily have been 37, in fact given there are 5 tests and 3 are easy he should have taken 40 players
You have the Roos situation at one end and then the selection of Zac Porthen at the other. The 21 year old has done nothing to merit selection given he has literally started one game for the Stormers. Then you also have the return of BJ Dixon to the squad - he is only just back from injury and been at best solid. Nothing compared to the form Roos has shown.
Rassie is fucking up when it comes to the non selection of Roos - he deserves all the heat thrown at him over this - it’s piss poor
Sometime a player just doesn't fit in the environment and for all we know, there may be issues with some of the more senior players which is why Rassie says there will be a place for Roos later.
As much as the Boks like to try give the impression that theyre all one big happy squad there will be cliques. There always are.
Yes, X...let's hope this gets sorted soon.
Any reason for that, Mpower ? Just don’t like it or is it for health reasons ?
I like a steak now and then…. But it always feels like lead in my tummy. I feel better after lean meats…..can’t handle a lot of fat.
And yes it’s a healthier lifestyle…..you are what you eat :) Hope you well otherwise Becs, enjoy your Weekend.
I’m liking this Aunt …Becs please give her my best.
Mpower…..well, good to know you eat what suits you :)
Yeah, I’m ok thanks. How are you doing ?
Mozart…..I will do. She’s a good sort :)
I’m ok to Becs, thanks.
Good to hear :)
Why '27 ... who's to say he won't have an outstanding '26 ?
30,292 posts
Erasmus explains Evan Roos' omission from Bok tour squad
By Warren Fortune
Thursday 23 Oct 2025
11
REACTION: Springbok head coach Rassie Erasmus took some time on social media to answer questions about one particular position ahead of his side’s end-of-year tour.
The debate around Evan Roos and the No.8 jersey has continued this week after the Stormers star was left out of the Bok squad for matches against Japan, France, Italy, Ireland and Wales.
Roos has been a key player for the Capetonians in the opening rounds of this season’s United Rugby Championship. He has also scored four tries.
However, he could only make the Springboks’ 10-man standby list for the upcoming tour, and some fans wanted answers from the Bok coach.
On X, one fan asked: “What happened between you and Roos, oom? You need to clear the air because this isn’t a normal situation.”
Erasmus replied: “My friend he is a world-class player and will play many Test matches for the Boks, we just have to really good eights in Jasper [Wiese] and Kwagga [Smith], and in my opinion, they are still delivering at a higher level than Evan!! So, who to drop.? One thing is a given, he is a Test match player and will probably make it in 2027.”
Meanwhile, another fan wrote: “Kwagga is a world-class player and individual, but he hasn’t excelled in the No.8 position. With all due respect and no arrogance meant, he wouldn’t be a starting 8 for any top-tier provincial or international side. You’ve gotten this selection completely wrong.”
Erasmus again took time to reply to that statement.
“Obviously, we are not always right, and I hear and understand what you say!! Thanks for the way you discuss these things! I appreciate it! Ras,” was the Bok coach’s response.
The Springboks will begin their end-of-year tour against Japan at Wembley Stadium on November 1.
Bullshit Rassie - the fans are right - Kwagga is not an 8 and no player needed to be dropped as 36 could easily have been 37