Leroux?
I'd give him a 0.55 for this one.
Good player, normally solid, but he was pants today.
Leroux?
I'd give him a 0.55 for this one.
Good player, normally solid, but he was pants today.
Had the Scots more patience and discipline they'd have won. Willie wasn't great, but here was far worse. I was expecting a few issues, but I was reaching for the stars, apparently. This was not a good showing.
Kolisi also had a great game. Whew will you ever learn the game.
Beanbag, take the blinkers off... and the gimp mask under said blinkers. Thanking you kindly.
The racking of players are BS and normally associated with a team that lost a match and not worth anything at all. .
"Man of the match: The award goes to Springbok flank Pieter-Steph du Toit. The loose forward was a workhorse, he made four carries and seven tackles. He also scored the Boks’ first try." Rugby 365
Hilarious….he made 7 tackles but….er…he missed 3. Dud actually did a few useful things, but mentioning that try where Mostert pushed him over the line and his tackling is really reaching.
He was cleanly beaten several times. That doesn't turn up in the stats.
Rating players who delivered such an ungly game.
Mud pies must be exquisite meals, rate the mud.
Terminate rugby in SA.
Some accurate player ratings unlike the laughable horse shit produced by Doooos
South Africa player ratings: Siya Kolisi and Bomb Squad shine in win over Scotland
After their 18-3 Rugby World Cup victory against Scotland in Marseille, here’s how the South Africa team performed on Sunday.
15 Damian Willemse: Continued where he left off in the Boks’ win over the All Blacks at Twickenham with a fine all-round performance. Willemse was solid under the high ball and kept the Scottish defence on their toes with several strong runs from the back. Finished with 68 metres from eight runs with two defenders beaten. 8
14 Kurt-Lee Arendse: Another one who came to the fore with a fine attacking display and he continued with his superb try-scoring record at international level as he scored a well-taken try early in the second half. Eventually gained 54 metres from five runs. 8
13 Jesse Kriel: He was lucky not to be sent off after a head clash while tackling Jack Dempsey in the opening half. Was solid on defence and attack during the rest of the match. 6
12 Damian De Allende: Kept the Scottish defence busy with some solid attacking runs and gained 70 metres from 14 carries. Also used as a battering ram which gave the Boks good attacking momentum but there were times when he had to offload to players in space when he opted to hold onto the ball instead. 7
11 Cheslin Kolbe: He did not cross the whitewash but like Willemse and Arendse he proved a real handful on attack as he tested Scotland’s defence with some fine runs. Finished with a match-high 115 metres gained from eight runs which included two clean breaks and four defenders beaten. 8
10 Manie Libbok: His goal-kicking woes returned as he missed two penalties and a conversion but he was excellent on attack. Produced a moment of magic with a no-look cross-field kick from which Arendse finished off before being replaced by Willie le Roux in the 69th minute. 7
9 Faf de Klerk: Made his 50th Test appearance and showed why he is the Boks’ first choice scrum-half with an excellent all-round display. Controlled the tempo of the game and did brilliantly with some clever offloads and box kicks. 8
8 Jasper Wiese: The Leicester Tiger took the fight to the Scots with several strong carries and gave his all during his stint on the field before being replaced by Duane Vermeulen on the hour-mark. Gained 38 metres from nine carries which included four defenders beaten. 7
7 Pieter-Steph du Toit: Showed why he was the World Rugby Player of the Year in 2019 as he made his mark with an industrious performance. Did well on attack and finished with 26 metres gained from six carries and was rewarded with a try for his efforts. Also did well on defence with seven tackles made. 8
6 Siya Kolisi (c): The Boks skipper continued his superb form since his remarkable return from injury. Led by example as he was a willing ball carrier and also caught the eye with excellent counter-rucking. Was solid on defence and won a crucial turnover before being replaced by Marco van Staden after 65 minutes. 9
5 Franco Mostert: Emptied the tank as a ball carrier without making much headway and did what was expected of him in the lineouts but his biggest contribution came on defence where he made a joint match-high 11 hits. 7
4 Eben Etzebeth: Forced off the field with a shoulder injury in the 26th minute and replaced by RG Snyman but he was in the thick of the action up to that point. His scrummaging power was missed, especially shortly after his departure when the Boks conceded two penalties at the set-piece. 7
3 Frans Malherbe: Had some good moments in the scrums during the early stages but battled in that department during the latter stages of the opening half. Was penalised on two occasions at the set-piece and eventually replaced by Trevor Nyakane in the 54th minute. 6
2 Malcolm Marx: The Bok hooker was solid in the execution of his core duties with his lineout throw-ins accurate throughout but did not make a big impact in other areas. 6
1 Steven Kitshoff: The Ulster-bound front-row was his usual solid self up front although he was caught out at a couple of scrums late in the first half and he was also penalised for a ruck infringement before being replaced by Ox Nche after 53 minutes. 6
Mostert was pathetic in the physical stakes, Bok scrum late in second half was disappointing, Kriel was anonymous on attack, de Allende bashed all game, Willie looked like an old man when he came on. Wiese was strong, better than he has been in previous outings. PSDT is in great form as is Kolisi
Worrying that Etzebeth has a shoulder injury - please please let him be ok as without him useless Mostert and Orie will have to play more of a role
After that performance, I'd say we need Willemse on the wing and Willie should start.
Willie played badly on the night but we have to have them both on the park.
Ideally
9 Faf --> but I wouldn't be too upset with Reinach. Faf still has my vote because he applies more pressure than anyone else. He was all over Scotland on Saturday.
10 Pollard --> Manie's fell apart so Pollard is the obvious choice. The problem is, one can't move Manie to 15 either because he's been missing tackles too.
11 Cheslin
12 AE --> What's the word for something that is more obvious than obvious???
13 Moodie --> We need that word from above here again.
14 Willemse
15 Willie
Kriel and Williams on the bench.
Also late in the first half the Scotts pushed us back….Malherbe was a bit off in this game but he will be better… most of the time he stood strong….Eben is a massive worry and the only news so far, is that they are assessing him today…..Kleyn should be back in the Mix as soon as possible…him and RG is the only other viable solution…Mostert made a big effort on defence, but a Fit RG or Kleyn should start, with Franco coming of the bench….
Difficult to leave Libbok out though as he is so good at getting his backs going but we need more clout at 13 where Moodie is the obvious option
I’d be happy with Willemse staying at 15 with Arendse and Kolbe on the wing
To be fair there was only one poor scrum by Malherbe and that was the one that got Scotland their 3 points
The scrum penalty before that was not due to Scottish scrum dominance it was the Boks that went for the second shove that had Malherbe over extending and not being able to get his legs up quickly enough to press home the advantage
Malherbe and co rectified the scrum issue by smashing the Scottish scrum straight after half time
Manie makes points every game….when his boot is not accurate to poles, it is in a kick pass…somehow the Guy must get the Negative monkey of his back and things will flow….but he is good enough to be there and our best bet right now….i think Libbok plays better with AE/ Moodie next to him… so it couldn’t hurt to play DDA and Wilkie of the bench.
Libbok is poor. We can't always hope that his kick pass is to an area where nobody is defending. He is far too limited. Not test rugby material. Too many in the team are not test material.
How did he win MOM then you fucking idiot - if he is so poor
Do we really have to have your fucking rugby ignorance back on the board
It was a pleasure not having you about polluting the board with your fucking rugby ignorance
Now explain how a poor player wins MOM you dumbfuck - take your time
I kinda take a different stance on Manie.
His kicking will come good eventually. If he could do it at school and for his clubs then he can do it for the Boks. I'd be surprised if he leant manage to sort it out. It's purely a mental thing, not an ability issue.
But his defence is what concerns me. That's something that has always been a bit of a problem for him.
To me, teams might start targeting him and if they get through there then everything falls apart.
That wasn’t hope from Manie Deus, no it was reading play seeing the space and executing a perfect kick….come on give the guy a break….besides Pollard that might be back, you Not giving any viable replacement….it’s actually quite difficult to come to your conclusion , after watching the video footage….the man is simply not as bad as you portray him to be.
Yes his defence is not great much like Jantjies and Willie but his value in creating space for his backs outweighs his less than perfect defence
At least he fronts up to defending but his lack of size in the 10 channel will always be an issue. By either getting the tackle done or fronting up and doing half the job he gives his team mates time to assist him defensively
Wait, am I the only person here who thinks Willie is the most technical tackler in the Boks team?
The guy performs a perfect ankle noose, every time, without fail.
I like Manie but there are three things we want from him...
1) Distribution, for which I score him higher than anyone.
2) Kicking, has been very flakey and affected(off the tee). Nobody could score him highly for his place-kicking but his out-of-hand kicking has been good.
3) Defence, could be a major concern if he doesn't learn better technique. The thing is, he doesn't have to stop people in place and bounce them backward. Simply bringing them down would suffice. But he has to learn how to get around the ankles.
We'll see how he goes but we can't settle for a leaky ten with issues off the tee.
All in all, Jantjies was solid off the tee, brilliant out-of-hand, and almost as good a creator as Manie.
I Libbok but he has to improve, and quickly.
Dave
I watching the map it was clear that Mostert was pathetic - he was tried to be the key director of a driving maul after a line out and it ended in disintegration of the maul and in a Scotland penalty. His contribution to ball protection was pathetic - he just does not have the physical strength to contribute to that component of the game.
To credit him for pushing Du Toit over for his try is just another Mozart invention. If Mostert was the ball carrier he would have been pushed back 5 to 6 meters - as happened in previous tests.
I was not entirely satisfied with the Springbok performance - the backline was not functioning well enough in attack .- to much passing of the ball when the Scottish players was to nea for any possible attacking play,
There are elements in he game that should improve and I hope to see them improving as the series progresses. However, the win ensures that the Springboks will go through to the play-offs . I still would support Williams to play at 13 instead of Kriel though.
By the way the jeremiads of Mozart, l'Grande Merde and a few others over the past year about how Scotland will beat the S Springboks was not fulfilled - so at least we know that they were talking supershit all the time.
/ .
.
Willie is on par with Manie defensively he makes many technically good low tackles but sometimes gets blown away like he did in NZ against Fitz
Willie is like Mostert these guys have never built themselves up physically so a guy like Willie sometimes gets physically blown away while players like Mostert can’t impose themselves physically
Libbok looks like he does gym work but was so small from the start that even the work still leaves him looking a bit flimsy
Mostert is not meant to be a big-hitting impact tackler or runner. His role is as a smotherer who makes the most tackles in the team. This is what he has always done, and unlike some players, his stats are there as evidence, week in and week out, showing that he is fulfilling his role. High volumes of ruck attendance and a high tackle count...that's his job guys.
His constant high work rate tires out the opposition and in so doing maximizes our forward dominance. That is the purpose of his role and the sole reason for his selection and exactly why he never went to the gym and put on those extra 5KGs that would make yall so happy. It's not what he's there for...its never been what he was there for. It's not how he plays. It's not what any of the coaches at any of the teams he plays for ever wanted from him. Because they understand the value of a lock with his tank.
The crazy thing is that you guys think it's impossible for him to simply chow some protein and get bigger. Like he is completely unaware that he's a bit lite.
A guy that tall would put on 7Kgs in the off-season with minimal effort. But guess what that would do...?
It would affect his gas tank and ruin his best attribute.
Here, I'll try and put it in simple terms...
Do you think our forwards are generally dominant because we are simply stronger than the other teams? Or do you think it may be because Mostert helps to sap the energy out of the opposition?
I can assure you that we don't bench, deadlift, curl, or squat on average more than other teams do. We dominate them because we have guys like Mostert who make sure they are more tired than we are.
Call him a powder puff all you want...but I guarantee you the Bok side would laugh at the idea that he didn't add irreplaceable value to their efforts.
Mostert was his usual energetic self putting in 11 technically sound tackles and taking some line out ball but every time he ran with the ball into contact he makes zero impression or coughed the ball up
All those tackles is not the job of a lock especially if none of them are imposing
I want to see our locks physically imposing themselves in traffic like Eben, Lood, RG, Kleyn and PSDT do. They get over the advantage line even if it’s half a metre at a time, it’s forward momentum, it’s phase creation
de Allende a centre is far more effective in traffic than Mostert is who is a fucking lock
The Bok pack is a physical one even with powder puff Mostert on board, but his presence compromises the assertive physical edge we should have
A pack that has Eben and RG or Lood as the locks is more physically imposing than one that has Mostert at 5 or 7 and that’s a fact
I just don’t get why Rassie and co don’t see this or more to the point, they do see it and that’s why Lood always starts and I’m guessing by quarters time RG will be starting as he builds up on his comeback
I just don’t get why we have not moved on from Mostert and we keep going back to him when the likes of Lood or PSDT get injured.
There are so many better physical options at both 5 and 7 to choose from but Mostert knows the system, is clearly a good team man, has heart and energy and is durable. The coaching staff choose this over a new more physical player who should be playing ahead of Mostert
It’s very frustrating to watch
Wrong Plum, the likes of far bigger men like PSDT or Eben put in just as many tackles a game, so your 5 should be doing that but also adding physical value thereby making your pack that more effective physically
When all the players are fit like PSDT, Lood and RG then Mostert does not make the starting side and would not make the 23 if the 6/2 split involved 2 loosies
So the coaching staff know that Mostert is their stop gap player
Yes we dominate them because we are bigger, stronger and more physically imposing than any other side
It’s exactly what Jim Hamilton said in commentary yesterday. He said hands down we were naturally just bigger beasts
10 tackles by Mostert that are not imposing is not going to sap the opposition’s energy nor is hitting each ruck like a girl
That stands in direct contradiction to what Swys says about Mostert.
His words were that it's very difficult to stay fresh with Mostert hanging on your leg all day long.
A few simple facts:
Mostert is always in the right place to make a contribution
Our bomb squad front row scrums better than the giants who start
Dud Toit plays like a lock and can’t tackle in space
Faf has better kicking technique than Libbok
Libbok can’t tackle and a flyhalf who can’t tackle is a target
Dud Allende had heaps of good ball and never made one thing happen
…..
There aren’t good answers to all these observations, but can’t we just be honest for once and accept they are true.
Here’s one more.. .Mostert packs behind the loosehead and we rolled them up from the loosehead side every time. And when we got in trouble it was always on the tighthead.
Mostert is in no better position than anyone else
Our starting frontrow is the best in the game, one poor scrum does not change that nor does our bench frontrow scrumming against the Scottish bench frontrow validate your claim
PSDT is on fire right now, yes he will get beaten like a lock does now and again but it’s not the job of a 7 to operate in space. Powder puff Mostert would do no better a job in space
Libbok was fine defensively bar one miss and is no worse than Russel or Biggar or Smith or Ford or Richie or Ntamack defensively
de Allende took the right options, was huge physically and created plenty of go forward - more so than any other Bok player on the day. When there was space he passed - he had a good game
Rubbish it’s not always on the tighthead side and are you implying Etzebeth is not providing enough grunt behind the tighthead? The scrum is about the sum of the 8. A Bok scrum that has Eben and RG in it, just has to be better than Eben and Mostert - it’s not up for debate
Plum, how is Mostert hanging onto legs all day if he’s made 10 tackles most of which will be low non engulfing?
His presence in a ruck or maul is no different to any other players except for the fact that most add more grunt than he does
Lewis Ludlum was on the field for 15 mins in our game. The ball was in play for 7 of those minutes. He made the fourth highest number of tackles in that time with 12.
10 tackles isn’t really that good a stat, is it ?
There is zero evidence that the scrum is better when Snyman or Lood scrummed behind the loosehead. Yes the scrum is a unit comprised of 8 parts…..actually 6 parts, the flanks are peripheral. Use one weaker part and it should be apparent.
Do I think Lood pushes harder than your man Lomp….you betcha!
De Allende never offloaded in the tackle once…it was up to Snyman to show how to do that and just how effective it can be.
It’s nothing special - certainly not game defining - it’s good though. Mostert makes his tackles - have never had an issue with that
I just have no time for a Bok test lock that is not physically imposing
There are unwritten rules in my book of a Bok pack or any pack for that matter
Your 1, 3, 4, 5 and 7 need to be physically imposing to the max with your 2 and 8 less so and your 6 even less so. Mostert fits in the mould of a 6 - his physicality is less than Kolisi’s but on par with say Kwagga’s
It’s not the job of the 7 to make tackles in space….gosh I never knew that.
de Allende has never been big on the offload and the Bok coaches know that - he was there to take it up which he did more effectively than any other player
Now that is energy sapping - trying to stop DA all day unlike what Mostert does
Much different when you're only on for a short period, Becs.
Like fighting only 1 round, you can throw 5 rounds worth of punches.
No I said it’s not the job of a 7 to operate in space, sure he will find himself there now and again and given his size it’s going to happen that a more agile player will beat him at times - so what - his all round contributions right now are huge
Habana in the studio said he should have won MOM yesterday and is in the form that won him world player of the year - very true
It was pretty good going though, Plum.
Moz of course you will think powder puff pushes harder than Lood - just not sure what he would be pushing with as he is so weak
Lood, RG, PSDT are all bigger, stronger and make far more of a physical impact individually than Mostert does and therefore by my reckoning these players would add more value in the scrums than Mostert does
We don’t have evidence of that as scrumming is not an individual thing but science tells me it’s pretty obvious
Mostert lacks power, that we do have evidence of, all 10 years worth
Agreed, Becs.
England played very well on the whole.
I'm pretty sure that must be the biggest winning margin for a team down to 14 for that long. Once in a life time type stuff.
I do hope for you guys that the result gave them some confidence.
Thanks, Plum 
Well it was a good old backs to the wall type of performance.
Hopefully we can get out of the Pool stages now !
Lood and PTSD are weak. So too Damian. We are losing the physical battle game after game because we are built around weaklings with no skills or rugby IQ.
Bwhaaahaaaaa Doos is back
Unfortunately
The thing is Dave, we can find big men to play flank that have mobility and can change direction to make open field tackles. Take Danie Rossouw 1.98 metres to Dud’s 2.0 metres….120kgs to Dud’s 116 kgs. Depending on the variable a bigger man.
Yet Rossouw was able to get out to the wing and put Cueto into touch probably saving our WC final. Dud would never have made that tackle…he lacks explosiveness.
Yes Moz but I also saw Danie miss tackles in open space - he was very similar to PSDT in every respect and let’s face it hardly made a lasting impression as a Bok
What about PSDT taking that NZ wing out down the touchline at Twickers the other night, that was explosive pace
Why would we want to replace PSDT when he is easily the best blindside in the game right now?
You see so much positive in Mostert but zero in PSDT - I don’t get it. It’s clear to see right now, PSDT’s contributions each game are huge. They are very apparent versus scraping the barrel to find the apparent positives by Mostert
Apart from his tackles and line out takes what positives does he bring in traffic. I watched the game again this morning and his physical contributions were practically zero. He is a Bok lock for goodness sake - there needs to be some physical grunt to go with those tackles and running around full of heart and energy
Good post Dave...I agree 100%...immediately thought of PSDT catching the NZ winger when I read Moz's post...it seems like he's looking/hoping for his pet hates to make mistakes, but seems to think his bias is justified...bizarre...he seems to always need a few pet hates in the Bok side...was a Jaque Fourie hater too...
Moz has many pet hates in the side but that’s no match for ignorant Doos who practically hates the whole Bok side - why he even pretends to support Bok rugby is beyond me
I have the odd pet hate and those pet hates are born out of players not measuring up to certain physical prerequisite for test players but I’m more than happy to concede on those hates when the players contributions defy their lack of physicality
Let’s face it most test wings are close to 100kg these days so when the likes of Kolbe and Arendse came onto the scene I was sceptical. But boy both proved me wrong but both also took the effort to build themselves up physically and both punch above their weights and are brilliant players
I can’t say the same for players like Mostert, Orie, Albert vd Bergh, Rob Kempson, BJ Botha, Juan de Jongh, Adi Jacobs, Paulse, Aplon etc
Some Boks have just been super shit players like Braam v Straaten or Ross Cronje
Let me explain again Draad. I don’t hate the man, I hate the hype. The only player I genuinely disliked was Luke Watson. Dud Allende and Dud Toit strike me as inoffensive, ordinary blokes. Neither of them are rocket scientists, but so what.
Nor are they totally useless rugby players ….Dud is a perfectly decent lock…..and Allende could have been a decent center if he developed his skills.
With SBW as a model back in 2014 he was actually offloading effectively. He has totally abandoned the offload, unlike Kerevi who offloads brilliantly and so he is just a Stampkar center where so much good ball has gone to die
We win, but we win in spite of having a primary forward ball carrier who can’t beat a tackle and in spite of having an inside center than can’t create anything for those outside him.
What I do really hate is our new jersey which deliberately ignores a 100 years of Rugby history.
Incorrect DA has beaten defenders by attacking space when the opportunity presents itself
He has a great skill set as Schalk Brits mentioned
He does not offload as it’s not part of the plan - he takes contact, drawing defenders in, setting up the next phase
If he was instructed to offload, we would see him doing it regularly
Did we see Esterhuizen offloading in the tests he has been playing for the Boks recently? NO
Since when do blindsides and locks strive to beat tackles, it does happen from time to time but for the majority of the time we see the likes of Eben, Lood, RG, PSDT, Wiese and Vermeulen running into players so I’m not sure what your point is. Please don’t tell me you think Mostert beats tackles when he plays 7?
Oh that new kit is vile, Mozart. I’d refuse to wear it !
The new kit is some bullshit relating to colour blindness or something
It is to do with colour blindness but the kit is one of the most hideous I’ve ever seen ! The pattern is awful and the colour ! Well, what does spearmint have to do with your national colour ?
So when will they get to wear the Normal green and gold?? No thought whatsoever has gone into the design of that puke green outfit. What a disgrace.
Exactly, Mpower.
England keep being made to wear their change strip which is blue. That has no bearing on our flags colour scheme !
"It is to do with colour blindness"
That's the official line, but whoever decided on the colour policy doesn't understand the 1st thing about colour blindness.
So I wonder how many of the players participating is colour blind ?
It’s for the viewers, Mpower.
Oh ok : ) thanks Becs.
My pleasure, Mpower
Ha, Ha
Colour contrasts for accessibility on the TV to see shades (e.g dark vs light)
Ireland is also green, so who will be playing in green?
2,348 posts
Springboks