Bob Dwyer blasts cheating Lions

Ex Sport 24 

Sydney - Less than a week ahead of the first British and Irish Lions test against Australia, former Wallaby coach Bob Dwyer has labelled the visitors as cheats because of illegal scrummaging and other rule infringements. (This is the guy who did such a great expose by highlighting the amazing penalties versus yellow cards that so hugely favoured the abs)

Lions coach Warren Gatland responded by saying he's sad at the "tirade of abuse" that the former World Cup-winning Dwyer's comments have attracted on social media.

Dwyer told The Weekend Australian that the Lions hookers push upwards, their props bind illegally by putting their hand on the ground for extra stability and, most notably in the case of Mako Vunipola, angle in from the loosehead side. (Well he certainly got pinged for scrumming inwards in match against Warts)

"We have a great game and there is massive scope for playing attractive rugby," Dwyer said. "It's not supposed to be a contest to see who can cheat the best. It's who can play the best." (Well we all will remember the Lions hit call when touring SA - they are always so desparate to win -and so seldom do - that they will do almost anything - reminds me of you know who!)

Gatland said after his side's 47-17 win over New South Wales on Saturday — the visitors' fifth consecutive tour match victory as they prepare for the first test next Saturday in Brisbane, that "it's a sad indictment on the media world that they've rolled out Bob Dwyer."

"I mean, I think he deserves more respect for what he has achieved in the game to be honest with you," Gatland said of Dwyer, who led Australia to 1991 World Cup.

"I don't think he knows much about Twitter or Facebook and stuff, so to see the tirade of abuse that he has now been subjected to on websites, I find that sad because he doesn't deserve that for what he has achieved in the game."

Most of the criticisms about Dwyer on social media were, predictably, from Britain-based websites. Well of course the fish and chips brigade will be up in arms. But well done to Bob for rasing these issues. Hopefully the refs will be on full alert)

A site dedicated to fans of English rugby side the Leicester Tigers had several restrained comments on its blog, including "anyone really interested in what he thinks? If the Lions are cheating as much as he says, blame the ref!"

Another said: "and they used to call us whingeing poms, getting the excuses in before they get (beaten). Poor from a man whose opinion I used to respect."

And, referring to the Lions' last visit Down Under in 2001, another person wrote: "He said exactly the same thing 12 years ago. It was rubbish then."

Dwyer also personally criticized Gatland's nationality.

"One comment I'd like to make after having seen the Lions in action on tour is that it doesn't come as any surprise they're coached by a New Zealander because they play outside the laws of the game as every New Zealand side does," Dwyer said.

(Bwahahahahahahahahaha this guy deserves a knighthood. Man we need folk who speak out like this! Give the man a bells!)

Dwyer also said the Lions' delayed shove in the scrum was illegal.

"When they put the delayed shove on, they scrummage upwards so there is nowhere for the opposing hooker to go but up," Dwyer told the newspaper.

He also accused the Lions of employing illegal tactics when receiving kicks. (Yep we have all seen that - blocking the tackler etc)

"They form a barrier in front of the catcher," he said. "At times against the Combined Country side, there were four of them in a line ahead of the catcher. One of them made an almost childish imitation of trying to catch the ball to persuade the ref he wasn't doing anything wrong.

"You can't screen the catcher. Surely that was obvious to anyone watching the game," he added. "You don't have to be smart to cheat. You just have to be a cheat."

Congratualtions to Bob Dwyer a man of courage and integrity.

Who will be reffing these matches. I would only trust unbiased and competernt SouthAfrican refs. 

 Yes first class stuff from Bob. When what he says happens again the refs will know they have to act.

I guess the kiwis are also squirming! Hahahahahahaha

Exactly Beano and this stuff just detracts from the game even more with refs already ducking for cover and wanting to please the crowd (esp in SA... Where your life hangs in the balance and your inbox full of threats, ol and of course fattys chase you around the pitch tryna take a swing lol) of course the ref would have read this and will be watching and that is kind of sad in a way dont you think?

Bweeno mate it's tough at the top and we all know "cheating' in rugby circles has become a euphenism for being "woefully unable to score tries or unable to compete with the World Champion Kiwis".

So the more i hear the word cheat directed at us by dumbarse Australians or some jealous yarpy the more confident that our domination of world rugby by our awesome coaches and ABs is now complete,

Ah Cmon Polyboy did your forget about Laurie Mains?

  @Steinlager.

Last time I checked your WC tally is the same as SA and the Aussies. And we gave you lot a 8 years head start. 

Well spotted Spoony and but for  Bryce Lawrence and Craig Joubert nz would still only have 1 world cup - where of course the Boks were absent!!   

Does anyone know how the refs were in that intial world cup?

Man I really think that Bob Dywer deserves a kighthood. He obviously is a man of high integrity who won a world Cup fairly for Oz.

But one can argue that Tri Nations and any toher tournament before a WC is used to build a team for a WC.

I said Laurie Mains due to that silly food poison excuses they made rather to come out and tell the truth and accepted like Mehrtens did they were beaten by a more determined side and they kak off at the higher altitude as the game went on.

@Beeno

Bryce Lawrence is a cock but we could only blame ourselves for that exit. At the end off 80 minutes the scoreboard said NZ was the World Champions and I say deservedly so as they did three things really well.
 

First, they used the ball in their Exit Zone before launching their kick chase team.
Second, they were ruthlessly efficient at building pressure in the General Play Zone.
Third, they were deadly with their execution and play selection in the Red Zone.
 

Spoony firstly, every side deserves a fair deal - we were robbed blind by Lawrence. We went through all this in detail before you joined us so I dont want to go into it again lest we all die of boredom. I mean I can quote you NZ journalists etc on this one. Hands in ruck five times when we were close to the line in full view of Brycy etc etc etc.

Secondly the Frogs were shafted by our Craig Joubert. Have look at this clip which Moz first brought to our attention.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PuIuXrwPCcc&feature=youtu.be

Hi there Poly. If we want to go back in history how about pre isolation. I and others have documented the problems we have faced in coming back to international rugby so also no repeating them yet again.

Beeno we were but seeing that the breakdown is a free for all why didn't we settle down and drop everytime we get in range? If we did that we would have won 60 - 11 

 Spoony one can always say we could have done this or that. However the fact is we played enough rugby to win comfortably given a fair competent ref. Why should we need to do more than that!

No beeno we did not do enough. Our inability to adapt showed up here as well as our decision making. Especially shocking from a team so experienced. No plan B. Lets look out through history

1995 - NZ No plan B

1999 - SA no Plan B 

2003 - Australia No plan B 

2007 - NZ no plan B

2011 - SA No plan B 

2007 NZ lost to France. Did not take a drop when they had the chance. Contreversial forward pass and blaming of the march official. Sounds familiar

I think we should accept the fact thtat the best side won the WC and that we should blame ourselves. 

Also I think we should be better than the Kiwi's in rather than pointing fingers at officials and conspiracy theories we should stand up and say It was our own fault. We should have drop kicked the shit out of the Aussies that day. Morne should have broken De Beers record

True Spoony, if we want to blame someone for that game we should start with John Smit and then move on to Victor, Jean, Morne, Scalla,etc...etc..

Most experienced Bok team ever and the can't win a game with 70% possession and territory AND they had arguably the best drop kicker of this generation @ 10. We gave Bryce the power to screw us...actually we can be thankfull of old BL, without him we would only have ourselves to blame.

No thanks necessary Draad - the pleasure was all mine ....ooooh look the Junior ABs have just scored against England...

Poly in 1986 we had a golden genration and players at their peak. I am not saying they would have won the WC but I can say that it was a really talented squad who can score from anywhere on the park. Due to isolation they lost out so did or cricket team in the 70's who smashed everyone in front of them. 

That Springbok team ran the Kiwi's off their feet. Altough it was not the official AB team it was still mostly the best players in NZ. Players who did not give a fuck with politics but who just want to play rugby against the best opposition possibly. Yes they received money for coming out but I don't think it was even near enough to what they risked for coming out. The punishment for it was far greater than the reward which was money. But they wanted to beat SA in SA and they wanted to say they did it. They were motivated and the punishment did not outweigh the reward anymore. Just that tradition and pride and a goal changed it. It meant more than money or anything else. 

In the end they wanted to go home as they lost the series and a test was still to follow. That was a truly great SA side and the WC would have been epic if we did play in it. I do not say we would have won it but I could assure you we would have put up a much better fight than the French.

Let me come back to 1995. We all saw Jeff Wilson spilling his guts on tv. Food poisoning? Nope

Rewind 1992 a SA side with players who seen its best days lost to NZ by 3 points. NZ were always ahead but last 11 minutes they made the score look better. AB fell asleep, Not at all they experienced the thing that is responsible for the Bulls having such a great record at home. Altitude. They were knackered. If that was a fitter younger SA team NZ might have been in trouble.

Then in 1995 they played Scotland at Loftus. Won but let in 30 points. They were knackered as its at high altitude. The game the Kiwi's played was not the best suited for high altitude. Cause you run the Ball 60 meters only for the opposition to kick you back to half way or further down the field.  It happened in the final as well. You will note sometimes in Bulls matches they have waterbreaks. In 1995 final there was no waterbreaks I can remember. 

AB played england at Sea level then flew to high altitude couple of days before the final. BIG MISTAKE. You need at times a week to get use it. Also we had a number of players in our team who were from the high altitude provinces. So their oxygen transport in the blood is a bit higher than people not use to it. Playing 80 minutes in the highveldt sun is already a challenge doing extra time added NZ had no chance when it reached that stage. Mehrtens missing a drop from 30 meters infront the posts was not him folding under pressure he was tired. 

Back to Wilson spilling guts. Effects of dehydration?

High levels of dehydration increase the risk of nausea, vomiting and diarrhoea during exercise and slows down the rate you can absorb fluids. Jeff was poisoned just dehydrated. 

 Most of the entire AB team got nailed by it in practice. Cause they stayed in Cape Town too long.   Food poisining is big in NZ. NZ have the highest rates of it in the world. So they used a desease well known to them and just ran with it. But if you look statemens do not add up and the way they answer questions about it. They avoid going into finer detail about it which is the thing one can pick up when a lot of people is commenting in a incident. 

Reds I think the kiwis are ending a run of ref inflated results including a burgled wc.

Firstly resistance is building to their unethical approach.

Oz is bringing in some polynesian talent and that will lift them. Oz is one to watch

The Boks - if we can stop our players getting injured are potentially very strong. Both the Sharks and Stomer should this year have been in top 6. Our other problems are, as have been noted, losing players overseas and quotas in both players and staff. Coaching not up to standard. So quite a lot wrong.

Backlines are being neutralised by excellent defences.  ab forwards are not the best. Does basket ball type rugby win hard tests when your pack is being bested. I dont think it does. The fundamentals of foward domination remain vital. Baby Boks got drilled at scrum time and it cost us the match. Are the nz forard really up to it i sthe big question for them - we saw what happened at Dunedin and Twicks

(The pack we fielded against Scotland only had two forwards in it I would play - Stauss and Etzebeth.)

The nz backs used to be more dominant but other sides are catching up and defences can shut them down. Sides are more mobile, backs are bigger nd defences more efficient. Space is at more of a premium and backlines need good go foward ball provided by dominant forwards. Hence my total amazement at France fielding a 858 kg midget pack and expecting to win against nz in particular.

A question of course is nz selecting the right type of forward. Should they be playing an Aletua to give their loosies some clout. Ie do they have the resources but are not using them. The pack they used against France should pose no problem for a full strength Bok pack. On the othe rhand the nz pack will cope relatively well against the bok pack fielded against Scotland. So we need some injured plyers back and Meyer to get this selections right.
My Bok pack:

Coenie, Strauss/Bissie/ Malhebe

Etzebeth/ DU Toit

Louw/ Vermuelen and Labbers/Alberts

Labbers could be the key player to bring the correct balance to the loose trio. Alberts could come in or another big loosie like Elstadt if we need to beef up in NH wet conditions or against sides like Samoa etc.

Strauss if you want more mobility and Bissie if its power.So tweak your hooker and number 7 depending of what is being faced.

Poly I did not predicted anything I said it would have been a epic battle. They were fukk of World class players but those players were smashed in SA when they played as the Cavaliers. 

Poly we had one stint without political interference quota's and we were using our top players. We won 17 games in a row. 

And Poly?  Telling you what to eat suddenly gave them extra talent? Did you watch the 87 final? Grant Fox did not much feed the backline or anything they kick and chased most of the game. 

Ja ja we heard it all before. Same was with Lomu suppose to be unstoppable. What happened?  As for fitness well altitude and playing there gave us a advantage over other teams. And the fitness levels would be higher playing at lower altitudes.Just check the record of NZ vs SA before 1992. Enough said

Poly I seem to remember Mike saying that Lomu's health problems stem from taking banned substances.

Pre isolation you were second best - and will become so again if we can solve our problems that are not related to talent.

Stain larger the more you hear the truth the more you bury your heads in the sand is how I see it, Bwahahahhahahahahahaha

Poly there was a time when it was more transparent. There were numerous cases where politicians complained about there not being enough players of colour and quota numbers were bandied about.

Now its less clear as no numbers, as far as I am aware, have been laid down. Nevertheless you see its effects. The classical case was the appointment of pdv. It was admitted by SARFU that  he was not the best candidate available and there were other reasons for his appointment. You saw what a joke he was. Loubscher is another. The Bulle backline coach is slap chips - Pieter Rossouw - their vodacom backline coach is Loubscher. How in the world was he picked. We desparately needed a top man - why in the world would Meyer pick a vodacom coach when he could choose the best available from anywhere in the world.

How in the world also did Aliistair Coetzee become the Stormers head coach when he had flopped as a backline coach for the Boks and Jake had to bring in Eddie Jones - immediate improvement in backline play.

What happened with the Kings. They got in on a promise that they would advance black talent. They did not get there on merit. They never played a challenge match against the Lions etc.

There are not that many black players - blacks much prefer soccer. A lot of Blacks are very small and simply dont cut it - we have had a number of these. Some like JP are of course fully deserving. Beast was very good when he first came onto the scene. Habana has been outstanding. However there is pressure on the coaches to field black players. Note how Meyer pushed kolisi and labbers never got a shot - who had the better Super 15 - labbers by far.

You have to understand that everything in SA is race based. I mentioned that South African Airways is refusing to train while pilots. There are jobs in government that they dont fill as there are no black candidates. If you are white, Indian or coloured you have to have higher marks to get into University etc. Many job adverts reserve positions for blacks as do corporations trying to fulfill quota requirement laid down by law. Businesses have to hand over equity to anc connected blacks etc etc - unless you have such and such a number of black sharehlders you dont get any govenment contracts. Our instuitution will only buy from vendors with certain BEE points.

Its as racist as anything under apartheid. It causes huge, huge damage. Billions have fled the country and the talent drain has been enormous - not only rugby.  ANC cadres are appointed in positions of responsibilty and all they do is loot state coffers and foul up big time. State parastatls loose billion s and have to be bailed out by the state. Convicted fraudster s are reappointed to postions where they can recontinue their looting.

Competent people were got rid of in municipalities and now we have corrupt anc officals looting the municipalities, fouling up generally and we have service delivery protests that are getting more violent.

All this has to be factored in even for our rugby players. Make money overseas- leave it offshore as they may need to pull out as they and their kids face endless dicrimination.

Our mining in this country could have contributed enormously to our well being and there would be no deficit on our current account if it had been handled correctly. Instead due to disasterous governmental policies on labour and talks of nationalisation etc our mining secotor languises. Education is a complete shambles with the government refusing to discipline the teachers and their union SADTU. State hospitals -well you risk your life going to most of them.

The country like the Boks has huge potential but is very badly governed by the corrupt and inefficient anc.

Our rugby two has its problems and your central contracting is the way we should go but vested interests stop any progessive initiatives.

To conclude our speciality is shooting oursleves in the foot and throwing away a winning hand.

Recently a new black party called AGANG has been formed. They have a very capable leader and it may lead to an eventually change of government which is desparately needed.

Excuse the rant but one can only throw ones hands up in the air at the way this place is run. In rugby terms it is amazing really that we remain competitive. That really is about the raw talent here.

"the corrupt and inefficient anc" sounds like another excuse Beeno!

Hakwa try and understand the difference between excuses and facts.

Given Bob Dwyer used to Coach the biggest cheats in the English Premiership, Leicester Tigers, and did nothing to improve their saintliness on the pitch, one would say his comments to the Press regarding anyone else's alleged cheating were simply rank hypocrisy. It's also nice to see Australia are slightly rattled and trying their usual dirty tricks to get ahead in any way possible prior to the First Test.

If you're that good, you shouldn't need the dirty tricks, the hooting of horns outside hotel rooms to keep players awake all night before the big match etc etc.

All quite sad really.

I have had a " conversation " with Mr Dwyer myself at a Northampton/Leicester match. Said " conversation " was forced upon me by him and his incessant whingeing throughout the match. Suffice to say, it didn't end well....for him and he was the one to depart. I gained a round of applause from the Saints fans.

No, Beeno. I'm not biased at all....that would be you and you're incessant excuses and blame laying.

I'm afraid your new oracle Bob Dwyer was talking rubbish and he had no answers to a mere girl who pointed those facts out to him. Maybe I could Coach a team to winning a RWC ? What do you think ?

What he has done, if you need it spelling out to you, is point out areas where Australia are weak and has made accusations of cheating by the Lions. That, in itself, is pretty low and petty. It's hardly showing much faith in your fellow countrymen if you have to sow some seeds of doubt in the Officials before the Tests, simply to try and get a foothold, now is it ? Beeno, you really shouldn't need this spelling out to you.

I couldn't care less what Clive Woodward says. I have never rated his opinions before, I certainly won't start now. He himself, almost caused the death of the Lions, so he really shouldn't be asked to comment on anything related to them, the England team won that RWC themselves, not him and he left our team in such a mess that we are only just beginning to re-build English Rugby all these years later. He is also a friend of your hero Mr White and thus, has an agenda. He is hardly impartial in that area.

I do not have to agree with anything he has to say on any topic, least of all this one.

But, as I said, if your hero managed to use some form of hex to render Rory Best incapable of throwing straight or Captaining the team full stop, made the forwards incapable of playing and Stuart Hogg very poor indeed, then I'm sure he can be praised to the hilt. Even though, I think the use of magic might be illegal full stop.

No, I'm not a fanatic. I was just having my enjoyment of the match ruined by him and, after enduring it for quite some time, I had to shut him up. Thankfully it worked, where all others had failed.

I always stay humble, Beeno.

You're the braggarts, not me.

So what have we here. Sir Clive knows nothing, Jake another world cup wining coach knows nothing and a third world cup wining coach Dywer also is way out.. The Brumbies are crazy for choosing a dud like Jake and so were South Africa in choosing him as the national coach.

Well I am amazed who would have thought that.

The turn around in the Brumbies just happened and their beating a side of inrternationals with 12 first choice palyers also just happened as did other lauded aspects of Brumbies play. THe brumbies already have achieved a home semi i the super15 and no thanks to jake. And please no excuses about the Lions going down they were outplayed by the smarter side

Come on Becs give some credit  where its due. You are just being very mean to Jake and to Sir Clive and poor Bob!! I trust you didnt use your brolley on the poor fellow! I suspect some pride is showing itself as well - all other failed!  In the light off that I have to dismiss the mere girl bit as window dressing.

Anyhow enjoy the test tomorrow and no getting mean if you lose!