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FORUM / RUGBY /  Bok side taking shape

Bok side taking shape

Started by Saffolk 2 REPLIES210 VIEWS· 07 May 2012, 02:00
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SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
07 May 2012, 03:31
#1
07 May 2012, 03:31#1

Some tough choices will need to be made, others will be easy ones to make. 

Fullback: This would have been an easy choice had Goosen not got himself injured, for Lambie would have been the clear favourite at 15, but might now need to do duty at 10 in the absence of Goosen. The only challengers to Lambie are Kirchner, Taute and Joe. I am a Kirchner fan, I like his attacking spirit. Joe is a good player but too small for test rugby in my opinion. I'm keen to see Taute at 13, but he might have to play 15 if Lambie is at 10. Of course if I chose Lambie at 10, Frans might need to do another stint at 15. 

Wings: Habana looks like he might have another season or two of test rugby in him, time will tell. JP is always a cert as a wing if not used at 13. JJ Engelbrecht is playing good rugby and could play wing or 13. Mvovo has been good all S15 and Willie le Roux made a good impression a few weeks back but has not produced the same spark of late. Basson has been solid, but I question his ability at test level, where he has never stepped up.

Outside centre: The options here are JP, Taute, JJ Engelbrecht, de Jongh and Frans. de Jongh lacks size in my opinion, so would not make my side. None of the other candidates have stood out, but all have great potential at 13 and I'd be equally comfortable with either of them there.

Inside centre: Our best 12 todate has been Whitehead, with the likes of Jean and Olivier being good. Frans is the obvious choice here, but this depends on the selections made elsewhere.

Flyhalf: Morne gives us solid, Jantjies gives us spark and Lambie is the best of those playing. Grant has been in great form and is def a candidate.

Scrumhalf: This is an easy one, Hougaard walks it. The issue is his back-up. Pienaar is on fire in Ireland. Vermaak is handy as are Duvenhage and v/Zyl. We are a little thin at 9.

Loosehead: Beasts performance yesterday has him straight in the Bok side, he was awesome. Coenie has been damn good for the Cheetahs as has Greyling for the Bulls. One of the finds of the season has been Kitshoff, this kid has Bok written all over him. We have looseheads to burn, to think Marcel v/d Merwe and Nkanyane are pretty handy as well.

Tighthead: The Sharks frontrow booked their test spots yesterday. I never bought into all the negative that was thrown at Jannie to date. Jannie proved his test quality last year and confirmed that yesterday. I like young Malherbe of the Stormers as a back-up. Werner Kruger has been solid for the Bulls.

Hookers: This is going to be tough on the player that does not make the match 22. Bismark is the rock and Chiliboy and Strauss are in great form. Tough call to choose between them. Not to mention the form of Burden.

Locks: Etzebeth is the find of the season. I never thought we would see another Bakkies, but this kid is Bakkies and more. Bekker has been in good form and his partnership with Etzebeth is lethal. The Bulls pair of Jeandre Kruger and Flip have been good. Elstadt is a candidate, but given his performances at 7, chances are he would be better utilized here. Bresler has been good for the Sharks.

Openside: Brussouw is in great form and walks it. Daniel provides a different dimension to the role and is a real classy player. Kolisi has been huge for the Stormers and Carr looks best suited to the same role. CJ Stander has been awesome for the Bulls but is not really a 6.

Blindside: We have a number of options here. CJ Stander and Potgieter have been huge for the Bulls. Marcel Coetzee is another find of the season. Elstadt is an enforcer of note, so much so, I'm steering towards him as our Bok 7. Josh Strauss has been great for the Lions and is an option here if not used at 8. v/d Walt of the Cheetahs is good.

Eigthman: Spies has mostly been in good form. Vermeulen was pushing hard until his injury. Josh Strauss will push Spies.

Ok so its Lambie, Taute or Frans at 15 for me. JP, Habana, JJ or Mvovo on the wing. JP, Taute, Frans or JJ at 13. Frans or Whitehead at 12. Jantjies, Lambie, Morne or Grant at 10. Hougaard at 9. Beast, Coenie or Kitshoff at 1. Bismark at 2, with toss up between Chiliboy and Strauss for bench. Jannie at 3 with Malherbe as back-up. Etzebeth and Bekker at lock with Flip on the bench. Brussouw at 6 with Daniel or Kolisi as back-up. Elstadt, CJ, Josh or Coetzee at 7. Spies at 8 with Josh as back-up.

So mine at a push would be:

15. Lambie 14. JP 13. Taute 12. Frans 11. Mvovo 10. Jantjies 9. Hougaard 1. Beast 2. Bismark 3. Jannie 4. Etzebeth 5. Bekker 6. Brussouw 7. Elstadt 8. Spies 16. Pienaar 17. Whitehead 18. JJ.Engelbrecht 19. Coenie 20. Chiliboy 21. Josh 22. Coetzee

Bismark, Etzebeth and Elstadt would bring some serious physicality to the Bok pack and with Elstadt in the side he can double as the lock back up, leaving the option of playing two loosies on the bench. I'd be equally happy with CJ or Kolisi ahead of Coetzee, A.Strauss ahead of Chiliboy and Kitshoff or Malherbe ahead of Coenie 
  • 0

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
07 May 2012, 07:43
#2
07 May 2012, 07:43#2

I like your tight five....but they are pretty obviously the best picks. 

 

Our loosies are unclear at this point.....Potgieter, Stander and Coetzee have been very impressive....Spies and to some extent Brussouw, who was embarrassingly stripped by Pocock, have been disappointing...Schalk is injured.  I think Brussouw gets the nod, but nobody else is certain. I wouldn't choose Elstadt, we need more mobility and it's time to offload Spies, he simply doesn't produce.

 

In the backs, Habana and JP would be my wings....with JP on probation. Frans and Jean are massively more qualified than your flavour of the day centres. Morne understands how to control a test....Jantjies can't control a S15 game....Morne is the obvious pick. Goosen would have been my bench player prior to his injury, with an eye to his succeeding Morne over the next 18 months.

 

Players who wouldn't be in my squad of 30 include Taute, Mvovo, Spies, Whitehead, Coenie, Josh Strauss . None of these players can compete effectively against the likely NZ/OZ counterparts. Why choose players who will certainly lose their personal battles?

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
07 May 2012, 21:18
#3
07 May 2012, 21:18#3

 Moz what is clear from your comments is that you have not been watching much S15 rugby have you? For a start Whitehead has been by some distance the best SA 12 in the S15 this season. He is the only 12 who has looked dangerous with ball in hand and certainly made more breaks than any other 12. Your take on him is the biggest load of nonsense I have read in ages. Right now he is better than Jean, no contest.

It is clear you have not seen a Lions game for a while for if you had you could not have declared that Taute and Josh cannot compete against their NZ/Oz counterparts - what complete rubbish. I take it you never saw Taute's try last weekend, if that was not beating a few defenders then I dont know what it, what of Josh's display and try this weekend. What makes these two players more remarkable is the fact that they stand out in a side getting its arse kicked week after week. Its a joke that you would play a hasbeen like Jean out of position against a young fresh quality player like Taute.

Brussouw was better than Pocock on Sat, no deliberation needed over that one. They probably won equal turnovers, but Brussouw owned Pocock in general play - what game were you watching?

Take it you missed Mvovo's display of pure speed when he scored one of the tries of the S15 this year?

As for Spies, the man is back in form and a proven test star - no debate.

What you base your take on when it comes to Coenie, is beyond me - the guy like Kitshoff is a class act, solid in the scrums and adds so much in general play.

We really do not watch the same games - Whitehead, Taute, Josh, Mvovo and Coenie are up there with the best SA has to offer. Whitehead is the best 12 in SA right now, Taute is the best 13 in SA right now, Habana is no better than Mvovo, Josh is up there with our best loosies and right now I would def select him ahead of Schalk, especially after this weekends performance. Coenie and Kitshoff are on par, both perfect back-ups to Beast. Spies is a proven star, no debate required

 

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