Bok Squad Australasia

Re News 24

Schalk Brits (Hooker, Unattached, 11, 5 - 1t)
Pieter-Steph du Toit (Lock / loose forward, Western Province, 38, 20 - 4t)
Thomas du Toit (Prop, Sharks, 5, 0)
Eben Etzebeth (Lock, Western Province, 69, 15 - 3t)
Steven Kitshoff (Prop, Western Province, 29, 5 - 1t)
Siya Kolisi (captain - Loose forward, Western Province, 33, 25 - 5t)
Francois Louw (Loose forward, Bath, 59, 45 - 9t)
Wilco Louw (Prop, Western Province, 8, 0)
Frans Malherbe (Prop, Western Province, 21, 0)
Malcolm Marx (Hooker, Golden Lions, 16, 15 - 3t)
Bongi Mbonambi (Hooker, Western Province, 18, 5 - 1t)
Franco Mostert (Lock, Gloucester, 22, 5 - 1t)
Tendai Mtawarira (Prop, Sharks, 103, 10 - 2t)
Sikhumbuzo Notshe (Loose forward, Western Province, 4, 0)
RG Snyman (Lock, Bulls/Honda Heat, 4, 0)
Marco van Staden (Loose forward, Blue Bulls, 1, 0)
Warren Whiteley (No 8, Golden Lions, 19, 15 - 3t) 

Backs:

Lukhanyo Am (Centre, Sharks, 5, 5 - 1t)
Ross Cronjé (Scrumhalf, Golden Lions, 10, 10 - 2t)
Damian de Allende (Centre, Western Province, 30, 15 - 3t)
Faf de Klerk (Scrumhalf, Sale Sharks, 16 , 10 - 2t)
Aphiwe Dyantyi (Wing, Golden Lions, 5, 15 - 3t)
André Esterhuizen (Centre, Sharks/Sanix Blues, 4, 0)
Elton Jantjies (Flyhalf, Golden Lions, 26, 215 - 2t, 41c, 41p)
Cheslin Kolbe (Outside back, Toulouse, 0, 0)
Jesse Kriel (Centre, Blue Bulls, 32, 45 - 9t)
Willie le Roux (Fullback, Wasps, 46, 55 - 11t)
Makazole Mapimpi (Wing, Sharks, 3, 15 - 3t)
Embrose Papier (Scrumhalf, Blue Bulls, 3, 0)
Handré Pollard (Flyhalf, Blue Bulls, 31, 254 - 3t, 46c, 46p, 3d)
Damian Willemse (Flyhalf, Western Province, 2, 0)

De Allende and Kriel are clearly CLEARLY better than the current combo. And to the mindless statisticians out there who like to quote metres, tackles and whatnot: The sport with the highest mortality rate is bowls, not that I'm overly optimistic about you lot witting the import. Regards, The Red Baron.

If Rassie is going to flirt with the idea of Damian and Kriel he is playing with fire. Britz and Kolbe are other worrying additions. It's the kind of selections that imply frantic shuffle ball. I hope this is not where Rassie is headed.

It is likely that Erasmus would from that squad select the following player to play against Australia:-

15   Willie le Roux, 14  Aphiwe  Nyantyi, 13  Jesse Kriel, 12   Damian de Allende, 11  Makaazole Mapimpi , 10  Handre Pollard, 9   Faf de Klerk, 8  Warren Whiteley, 7  Pieter-Steph du Toit, 6 Siya Kolisi, 5  RG Snyman, 4  Eben Etzebeth, 3   Wilco Louw, 2  Malcolm Max, 1 Tendai Mtawarira

16  Bongi Mbonambi, 17  Stephen Kitshof, 18  Frans Malherbe, 19  Franco Mostert, 20  Marcovan Staden,  21  Ross Cronje, 22  Damian Willemse, 23  Lukhanjo Am

The above squad is not really an improvement on the previous squads of Erasmus – and even though the above is likely to the probable team I am not really impressed with the loosies in this case.

Louw is over hte hill and i am afraid Whiteley is not physically up to standard.   I would rather move Du Toit to play  at 8 and play Mostert at 7, with Kolissi at 6.

Louw was so sub-standard – the only role he can play is the same that Erasmus will assign to Brits – namely as some sort of advsor.      

The bigger disaster would be to continue flirting with Esterhuizen and Am 

Britz is the biggest joke under the sun. He left out Ackers, for old time pensioner who in his prime was not Bok material. He is a small loose forward playing hooker. He has/had good dancing feet and skills, and great at club level- but is not test standard, and never was. Probably would have been better as an inside center. Another one of our wee loosies that should have been converted.

Jake White was the first to identify that he lacks the scrummaging ability for test level. A hooker needs to be almost as strong as a prop to have a robust front row. Think Marx and Bismaark.

Snor Devilliers tried Britz but dropped him like a cold when he got exposed at test level, along with Puke Watson. 

Britz is now even weaker than he ever was, and looks so scrawny. He is quickly losing the limited muscle mass that he had. Jean Schalk van Claude

Britz was exposed against Italy in 2008, in a wet game. A perfect test to prove himself.

More quota players and smaller and smaller.

Despair from SA rugby or a move to block that player and prevent him from joining another side.

Guy should claim injury as the other NH SA players do when they are called.

A really poor selection of players.

I cannot believe that coach Erasmus is persisting with so many proven failures.

Bongi, Britz, Thomas Du Toit, Kolisi, Malherbe, Franscois Louw, Notshe, Whiteley, Am, Cronje, De Allende, Esterhuizen, Jantjies, Mapimpi and Pollard.

That's 50% of the squad.

I though he intended throwing the kitchen sink at them? 

Not with that miserable squad of players .

I'm not amused.

Pollard a failure? What has Esterhuizen done wrong g? Louw had a good first test, but I concede he needs a big game.

Mapimpi hasn't been bad, Am has been too quiet. 

Mind you, this comedy of a squad is going to be a box office attraction when it hits the road.

We cannot afford to throw easy points away like that. It's vital that we take what's on offer. You and I both know that Jantjies would have slotted those kicks. 

Mapimpi is poor in the air. We need someone solid under the high ball. We can count ourselves fortunate that Folau is out injured. Oh and not "been bad" isn't the parameters we're looking for when it comes to selecting a Springbok rugby player. We have too many "not bad" players in the team. .

If you can't see what's wrong with Esterhuizen then I honestly don't know what to say to you.

Frans Louw is no longer the man he was. He should consider retirement, or going to Japan.

I do not think that Pollard is a failure.  He played in 4 tests and was very good in most aspects of the game - bar the failure of his boot in the first Argentine test and a og-ordinary performance I Mendoza..

Who can be elected in his place?   Jantjies was a complete failure in all tests he played in since 2012.   Willemse could do with more experience.

Now as to Esterhuizen - he played in 4 tests - was average to poor in three of those and just about average in the fourth one.   Has a low tackle count for a center and got run around a couple of times.    He had in the four games two good line breaks - for the rest he was in the main a crashballer and ball hogger.   Lucky to be in the squad at all. 

I tink Erasmus wants to look at Kolbe - and would not be surprised if he does not want to try him out as a scrummie.   

I agree with Dragon as to Jantjies, Louw and even Whiteley.       

There will be a time lapse between the oldies losing against  a  string of teams ending against Japan and the newbies to be built into a proper winning team.  The two dead heads we had as previous coaches caused the present ,malaise.

Esterhuizen has been very solid. Hasn't had a bad test yet. Run around? When? You make statements with no reference to where these things occurred. Tell me when and where. I've logged every ruck, every set piece for the Pumas tests and the England tests, so tell me where these flaws are. It won't be any trouble for me to bring it here in a new thread for all to see. 

OA

Keep on the BS mania you have about rugby.   How come the Springboks lost three of the four matches that Esterhuizen played in this year.   Was he not part of the problems encountered in those tests?

Objective assessment indicates he was and his contribution was in most respects in three of the tests sub-standard.   The only thing that picked up in the last test was he made two good line breaks and he crash-balled 12 times ineffectively - some of those was real ball-hogging - his passing and off-loading represents only 36% of the total number of times he handled the ball.

And his talking was four made 1 missed - while the Argentinians ran circles around the Springboks backline.   Not good enough in defense either.   So where do you get your inflated daydreams from?      

Esterhuizen was not the reason why we lost to Wales, England or the Pumas. In fact, he was regarded as one of the high points of the Welsh game. He was good. Against England in the third test, there were a variety of problems, none of which centred on Esterhuizen. The Puma loss was yet again not his fault. He was very productive. I did note his excelllent diving tackle in space to bring down the Puma 13, w hich makes a complete mockery of your claim he was "run around". As I said before, reference when and where he was run around. Tell me when and where he "cost the Boks". Why can't you answer such a simple question. I'm giving you the opportunity to defend your position. I'm willing to learn something, if you have something to share with us. 

By whom after the Wales test?????????  

He still made only 4 tackles and missed 1 against the Pumas last Saturday.   That for an inside  center is totally inadequate.  Fact is the Pumas backline played the fool with the Springbok backline and loosies last Saturday and the problem is reflected by the tackle stats.

Further fact is the maligned often makes cover tackles - Esterhuizen never does,   That is why in his last 4 tests the much maligned De Allende made 12 more tackles than Esterhuizen made in his 4 tests.   They in fact missed 5 tackles each in those tests.

I have some real problems with some aspects of play of Esterhuizen - but his deficient pace makes him a carthorse and ineffective.  

Damian has no examples of making cover tackles. Name one if you disagree. I don't mean a shoulder rub either. 

Which moments in the game should Esterhuizen have made more tackles? You can only tackle what comes your way Clever Mike. If you think he was a problem on defence, cite an example. 

I would not name one - but there are dozens of examples.  Do you know what cover tackles mean? The problem with tackle stats mean that that cover tackles are more difficult to make and often leads to more misses.   

The other problem with tackle stats is that it des not reflect cases where no tackles are attempted.  That si when opposing players have a free run with the ball - since defense is neglected.   This si normally caused by deficient pace of tacklers and Esterhuizen is pace-deficient.   

Just go back to the English test where Esterhuizen made 4 tackles missing 3 - against the same opposition De Allende made 8 tackles missing 1.   That clearly illustrates where the problem lies as to the defense of Esterhuizen.        

I would not name one - but there are dozens of examples.

Foeitog

Read my comments on the WP game last night.  There is no  chance that Erasmus on factual basis will select Esterhuizen ahead off De Allende in the upcoming tests.   Much sympathy with you.      

Mike nobody can know who Rassie will select for centres...we are still casing him out as a coach/selector and some of us are patient others not...in any event I'm not that optimistic and I doubt if any body with sanity here expects the Boks to win...the ultimate goal must be the future and long term goals make the job possible and experimenting (short term goals need to be sacrificed for long term bigger gains).

Rugby fans in SA want instant results...that's impossible to do, you cannot burn the candle at both ends.

If he uses De Allende and Kriel first against Oz and it results in disaster then he might revert to Esterhuizen and Am against NZ...this he could do the other way around.

I'll be interested to see how Argentina goes against NZ...will get a rough picture how strong we are in comparison

Speaking of factual basis, please cite one example of Esterhuizen not making a tackle attempt when he could and should have done so. Just one.

Furthermore, it's funny how the one who boasts of how he assesses performance when evaluating players now asserts that Currie Cup rugby supercedes test rugby as a measure of aptitude for test rugby! 

Chabal, Argentina will be more sternly tested defensively. New Zealand probe for an opening and are very organised doing it. That said, their backs can be a very big problem if they get into the game. I heard Ledesma will be making changes at centre, I hope that isn't him anticipating a defeat and making a negative change. It could be a good test. I hope both teams show their best rugby.