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FORUM / RUGBY /  Bok squad lacks balance

Bok squad lacks balance

Started by Beeno121 REPLIES468 VIEWS· 03 Sept 2015, 09:03
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BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
03 Sept 2015, 09:03
#1
03 Sept 2015, 09:03#1
says Keo

The Springboks' World Cup squad hasn't rewarded form and isn't a victory for transformation, writes MARK KEOHANE in Business Day.

Heyneke Meyer’s preferred Word Cup run-on XV will include 10 players who started the 2011 World Cup quarter-final defeat against Australia in New Zealand (Were hugely better than OZ but he conveniently forgets the role palyed by the notorious Bryce Lawrence - nz ref of the year!!!). Six of the starting pack, if fit, will start the big games at this World Cup and four of the backs will again be entrusted with winning a World Cup play-off.

The front row, lock Victor Matfield and loose forwards Schalk Burger, Willem Alberts and Francois Louw were all in New Zealand. So too scrumhalf Fourie du Preez, utility back Pat Lambie (who started the 2011 quarter-final at fullback), centre Jean de Villiers and wingers Bryan Habana and JP Pietersen.

On the surface that’s a lot of experience to take to a World Cup, unless of course these elite players have been injured or woefully out of form for a sustained period.

Meyer confirmed a squad of 31 he described as the one he wanted. It did not include Frans Steyn, Jan Serfontein, Marcell Coetzee, Heinrich Brüssow, Francois Hougaard, Cobus Reinach and Cornal Hendricks, who have all played for the Boks in the past 18 months. It also did not include hooker Scarra Ntubeni and flyhalf Elton Jantjies, who have been among the extended Bok squad in the same period.

Coetzee and Reinach were the shock omissions, especially Coetzee, who had been the form loose forward in South Africa throughout 2015 (SURELY HIS EXCLUSION WAS ENTIRELY INJURY BASED!!!!). Serfontein and Reinach were try-scoring heroes in South Africa’s win at Twickenham less than a year ago.  Neither could make the 31.(DUE TO SELECTION PROBLEMS QUOTAS ETC)

Jantjies was South Africa’s form flyhalf in Super Rugby, yet was never given a minute of Bok game time this season. Ntubeni has seen many of Meyer’s Bok camps and tours but is yet to wear a Bok jersey.

Much has been made of Meyer having to meet a nine black player goal and that is why uncapped Rudy Paige was picked ahead of Reinach and Hougaard. Loose forward Siya Kolisi’s selection – ahead of Brüssow and Coetzee – is also clouded with uncertainty for all the wrong reasons. It should have nothing to do with colour but the specifics of what each player offers as a loose forward.

Paige’s selection can’t be explained. If the Bulls scrumhalf was integral to World Cup planning he’d have played at least one minute over four years.

Kolisi is a quality player and has always produced in a Bok jersey. But Kolisi is primarily a blindside flanker. Kolisi, Schalk Burger and Willem Alberts are a loose-forward grouping, with Coetzee and Brüssow more aligned to an openside role.

Blindside flankers dominate the selections and there is an imbalance in support of specialist opensider Louw.

Meyer could have accommodated one of Coetzee or Brüssow if he had opted for Alberts as a blindside flanker who doubles as tighthead lock. Instead he added lock Pieter-Steph du Toit to the squad as a lock who can double as a blindside flanker.

It’s the balance of loose forwards and locks I would question, more than the colour composition. It’s also the fitness – in terms of game time – that asks more questions than it gives answers. Du Toit has played a couple of games this year, Alberts has played 40 minutes in the past four months and No 8 Duane Vermeulen has not played since a neck operation three months ago.

Meyer has picked seven frontline players who have suffered serious injuries this season and have not played for a lengthy period. That is a risk.

I don’t understand the selection of Paige and unfortunately it meant the dreaded word of quotas again dominated a Springbok World Cup selection. Why, if Paige was always in the mix, did he never feature in four years?

It also unfairly shone a spotlight on every player of colour’s right to be there on rugby-based merit. The reality is more players of colour deserved to be in the squad on merit.

Jantjies had to be there if form and transformation were non-negotiable. I could understand Meyer selecting overseas-based Morné Steyn (flyhalf) and Schalk Brits (hooker) if they were his first choice. But both are third choice in their respective positions and that can’t be justified in the context of in-form local based Super Rugby performers like Ntubeni and Jantjies, especially given the transformation considerations.

Hendricks and Serfontein, as backs who have excelled in the last 18 months, have every right to feel wronged. Meyer has picked Pietersen who for the last two seasons has struggled to find the form that that made him a World Cup winner in 2007.

Meyer could have picked Damien de Allande as a centre/wing and left Pietersen at home to accommodate the skills of Serfontein.

Why two specialist fullbacks when Lambie was good enough to start the 2011 World Cup quarter-final at fullback?

The Bok squad lacks balance, hasn’t rewarded current form and certainly isn’t a victory for those who believe black player numbers equals transformation.

The boast has been of nine players of colour in 31, but the more accurate number is the same three of (Bryan Habana, Pietersen and Beast Mtiwareara) who started the 2011 World Cup quarter-final. This will be the only non-white trio that starts the big games.

Paige’s controversial squad inclusion has allowed the focus to be on politics and black player handouts when the real focus should be on how many veterans and injured players have been picked – players (not one of them black) who have hardly played this season yet got a free pass to the World Cup.

yET HE BEMOANS NOT PICKING cOETZEE.

oU kEO IS GETTING CONFUSED.

BUT THE TRUTH IS THREE THINGS HAVE BEEN AT PLAY. QUOTAS, BAD SELECTIONS AND INJURIES.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
03 Sept 2015, 09:50
#2
03 Sept 2015, 09:50#2
 Beeno
Although i do not normally take anything Keohane writes as serious - he somehow stumbled on the wrong selections by Meyer on all fronts.   
Meyer should never have made the following selections:-
*   Zane Kirchner*   JP Pietersen*   Morne Steyn*   Fourie du Preez*   Ruan Pienaar*   Willem Alberts*   Victor Matfield
I include Du Preez in that list based on seriously match fitness deficiency and his injury record over the past 14 months.  The rest are basically players with serious deficiency in performance.
If they were left out of contention engineering of the team to get to 9 players of colour would have been eased considerably.   Meyer could then have selected players like Mapoe and Jantjies as well as Ngubene instead of the lot he did select.  He could also bring in openside flanks - which are seriously deficient in the team at present.
Fact is sticking with players based only on reputation and not performance is bad news and is not in the interest of the team - hence my despondency  about the squad Meyer ended up selecting.         
BL
BlikkiesPro1,526 posts
03 Sept 2015, 12:26
#3
03 Sept 2015, 12:26#3

I do not have nightmares over Matfield's selection.

His presence (together with contributions from Eben and/or Loodt) will at least give the Boks a more than competitive lineout advantage. Yes, Matfield's selection will put more pressure on the rest of the forwards come ruck- and scrum-time, but it is an aspect they should be able to handle.


Matfield's selection will alleviate pressure on Meyer regarding the selection of a captain. I am not at all happy with the possibility to see Jean as a center. I would play him from the bench (as a wing) and then simultaneously swop Matfield with Loodt on the bench.

My biggest problem is with our flanks. Kolisi and Alberts are both useless, while Schalk has lost a lot of speed to be an effective cover defender or fetcher of the ball in rucks.

We are naked as far as fetchers are concerned. Poc.o.ck and McCaw will have a field time. 

 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
03 Sept 2015, 15:14
#4
03 Sept 2015, 15:14#4
 Blikkies
I am not sure that Matfield is all that essential only to be in line-outs - but then we have to remember we are dealing here with a coach with no idea about building up of a squad for the WC.   He made up his mind in 2012 whom he want in the squad and effectively only left three players out who announced their retirement from international rugby (Botha, Steenkamp and Fourie).  So we have a case where there was no real squad building and the younger players are hopelessly inexperienced.  
My worry is both at the scrummie and loosie positions.   I do not think that Du Preez is going to last through the tournament and his lack of game time over the last 14 months is seriously problematic.   Well on his way to 34 years of age that deficiency is not going to be overcome easily and I am not sure he is fit in any event.   Meyer justified his selection on the basis that he is "aware what Du Preez is capable of" in performance, but the question remains is Du Preez still capable of what he was able to do in the past.  I have no faith in Ruan Pienaar - he is pedantic and slow and somewhat inaccurate in the kicking game as well, not a shadow of the player he used to be.  
You are correct in respect of ball protection and recovery deficiency in the Springbok loosies set-up.  Both Alberts and Kolisi have no idea about what that component of the game entails - so we are not going to recover balls at breakdown situations and that is going to result in turnovers in favour of opposing teams.        
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
03 Sept 2015, 15:41
#5
03 Sept 2015, 15:41#5
You couldn't make this stuff up....now Hougaard and Jantjies are shock omissions. After demonstrating time and again that they can't perform under pressure at half back. They needed to be rewarded?

And the Coetzee lament is another joke. Where was he against Oz .... nowhere. He was totally and utterly outplayed on the deck. He is not a fetcher, not a hard yards man, not an open field tackler among the backs....what does he add but a lot of frenetic energy.

Morons as journalists breed morons as fans.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
03 Sept 2015, 16:05
#6
03 Sept 2015, 16:05#6
 Morons as fans are terrible and you are a leading example of that.  The lament of Coetzzee is mentioned - but what about Willem Alberts.   Where is he ever in games he played in for the last three years?   He is not a fetcher, not a hard yards man, not an open field tackler.  He is not a breakdown ball protector so he adds zero to team effort. That can be said of a lot of other players selected by Meyer.
I would ten times rather have Coetzee in the squad than the utterly useless Alberts.  
Morons on this site think they can breed other morons to follow their rank stupidity by  writing BS on this site and you are an expert in doing that.   
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
03 Sept 2015, 18:14
#7
03 Sept 2015, 18:14#7

Hougaard is currently on fire for the Bulls and Jantjies was our best 10 this S15 as Mallett correctly pointed out. There has never been an issue with Hougaard at 9 as any coach with substance would tell you.


Telling us Jantjies cant perform under pressure demonstrates your inability to evolve with the times......that might have been the case 2 years ago......are you not able to move on from your out of touch assessment of the player......get with the times Moz......geez comments like that make you sound old and short sighted.


Its as bad as me saying Werner Kruger is still a top tighthead or that the Boks are physically bigger than their opponents.


As for Coetzee versus Louw as opensides......its insulting to even meantion average Louw in the same sentence. When on earth did Louw do anything of note at test level.....same applies to Alberts


What do you clowns actually see in Jean, Morne, du Preez, Pienaar, Matfield, Louw and Alberts......I mean really.....it defies belief  

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
03 Sept 2015, 18:55
#8
03 Sept 2015, 18:55#8

Yes in non pressure situations they look like heroes. Put Hougaard in at the death against Ireland and Wales and he is doing stupid stuff like taking a tap off a penalty and then kicking directly into touch.

 

Jantjies was kicking so well in the S15 until he had to make his kicks to get the Lions in the playoffs and then he started missing them big time.

 

 

Dontcha get it Dave? These guys all have player DNA that is quiet but not dormant....just waiting to trip them up under pressure. No player had more chances to make Bok 9 his spot than Hougaard. Frankly I think he has an issue which is not public. Look at the crowd he was hanging around with.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
03 Sept 2015, 19:24
#9
03 Sept 2015, 19:24#9
 Mozart
Just be more explicit - who is the crowd Hougaard has been hanging around with? And why should that be an issue or what is the issue you are hinting at?  
DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
03 Sept 2015, 21:22
#10
03 Sept 2015, 21:22#10
 Mike,  Reeva ring a bell?  Couldn't have been easy. 
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
03 Sept 2015, 22:48
#11
03 Sept 2015, 22:48#11
 Yes I know about Reeva - but Mozart made a comment and I believe Reeva is not what he has in mind.  There was nothing dishonourable about being involved with her. Wonder why he made a comment and now ignores my question.  
BL
BlikkiesPro1,526 posts
04 Sept 2015, 04:34
#12
04 Sept 2015, 04:34#12
Mike, The prosecutor opened the case with a video showing Hougaard and Oscar at a target shooting exercise and it seems from that that the 2 were/still are? close friends. Can you imagine how the tabloit press will haunt him during the world cup? ... and the Boks don't need that type of distraction. 
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
04 Sept 2015, 05:16
#13
04 Sept 2015, 05:16#13
Blikkies
Look - the prosecutor made a balls-up of the case and if there was any friendship between the two of them - it would have evaporated before the murder of Reeva by Oscar.  Fact is that Reeva was at one stage Hougaard's girlfriend and then left him for Oscar.  
Let the arch asshole answer the question I put to him clearly himself and let me repeat the question I did ask:-
"Just be more explicit - who is the crowd Hougaard has been hanging around with? And why should that be an issue or what is the issue you are hinting at?" 
The coward ran away from those questions because he would not be honest and reply to them.   
           
  
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Sept 2015, 05:26
#14
04 Sept 2015, 05:26#14
I never ran away from any question Perv...everybody else gets the connection, if you don't and cant see the problem, I can't help you.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
04 Sept 2015, 05:35
#15
04 Sept 2015, 05:35#15
 You ran away coward.  What is the ISSUE which Hougaard has which is not public?  
GE
generaltitPro3,164 posts
04 Sept 2015, 11:59
#16
04 Sept 2015, 11:59#16
 Hougaard and Jantjies and Marcel Coetzee (injury would have healed in no time at all) ommissions are a surprise to me...I prefer Hougie at wing but he is a very competitant no 9 as well...a dual purpose player that can slot in , in emergency can be very useful...like like Lambie, De Allende and Kriel can play different positions.

Remember players in NZ like Jeff Wilson...a brilliant full back and wing and there are many others.

I think too Jantjies was very unlucky...his game has come right and is a very good flyhalf...imho deserved a call up.
CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
04 Sept 2015, 12:11
#17
04 Sept 2015, 12:11#17
 
For a moment I thought you'd prepared a righteousness piece for all of us to enjoy.

How disappointing to see it's only the usual clueless twaddle being spewed forth.


BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
04 Sept 2015, 12:41
#18
04 Sept 2015, 12:41#18
 Sebbie ignore wee cc he is a angry, nasty twit at times!
GE
generaltitPro3,164 posts
04 Sept 2015, 12:52
#19
04 Sept 2015, 12:52#19
I do ignore him...he hates that...he lives by the blade and should be eliminated by the blade...hence clean cut...he's not a bad guy, I'm only joking.

He's got serious issues...should go to Oz permanently and live in Alice Springs...he'll fit in there perfectly...maybe take a Walkabout and discover that life is not so bad.
GE
generaltitPro3,164 posts
04 Sept 2015, 12:56
#20
04 Sept 2015, 12:56#20
I do ignore him...he hates that...he lives by the blade and should be eliminated by the blade...hence clean cut...he's not a bad guy, I'm only joking.

He's got serious issues...should go to Oz permanently and live in Alice Springs...he'll fit in there perfectly...maybe take a Walkabout and discover that life is not so bad.
BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
04 Sept 2015, 17:54
#21
04 Sept 2015, 17:54#21
 Great idea a crocodile Dundee type down to his last dollar!  He needs the solitude of the bush to sooth his very troubled mind!
DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
04 Sept 2015, 20:48
#22
04 Sept 2015, 20:48#22
 Aag ou CC  is not too bad.  A bit brash,  but his blunt approach is much more palatable than the PC correct drivel that gdts shoved down our throughts daily. We need more people speaking their minds without the worry of how it would affect their image. 
— END OF THREAD —

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