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FORUM / RUGBY /  Bok Team announced for Scottish Test

Bok Team announced for Scottish Test

Started by CleanCut41 REPLIES522 VIEWS· 25 Jun 2014, 14:15
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CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
25 Jun 2014, 14:15
#1
25 Jun 2014, 14:15#1


South Africa:


15 Willie le Roux, 14 Cornal Hendricks, 13 JP Pietersen, 12 Jan Serfontein, 11 Lwazi Mvovo, 10 Handré Pollard, 9 Fourie du Preez, 8 Duane Vermeulen, 7 Schalk Burger, 6 Marcell Coetzee, 5 Victor Matfield (c), 4 Lood de Jager, 3 Jannie du Plessis, 2 Bismarck du Plessis, 1 Coenie Oosthuizen.


Replacements:


16 Adriaan Strauss, 17 Trevor Nyakane, 18 Marcel van der Merwe, 19 Stephan Lewies, 20 Teboho Mohoje, 21 Francois Hougaard, 22 Marnitz Boshoff, 23 Zane Kirchner.

CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
25 Jun 2014, 14:16
#2
25 Jun 2014, 14:16#2
 
Glad to see Coenie finally given a shot at the more natural loosehead position.

About friggin time.

Pity the bench takes a dive with HouGat and Kirchner back in the mix.

Overall a better team.
BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
25 Jun 2014, 14:37
#3
25 Jun 2014, 14:37#3
Why start with Bissie and Jannie? Give the guys a bit of a break by playing them off the bench.Marcell van der Merwe needs some test experience!! Strauss must be raring to go!

Yes Coenie is a better loosehead but we heard the swop to tighthead was because it suited his kneck injury better.Good to see Burger starting. Let's see what he has. 
All eyes will be on Pollard.
JW
Just_winCaptain18,570 posts
25 Jun 2014, 14:48
#4
25 Jun 2014, 14:48#4
 As predicted Meyer has rushed Pollard into the starting line up. Let's see how he goes. Bashoff on the bench - he is a relative rookie himself. Scotland is supposedly improving, we will see.
GE
generaltitPro3,164 posts
25 Jun 2014, 14:50
#5
25 Jun 2014, 14:50#5

Agreed, Bissie and Jannie rest long overdue...Beast is rested, why not them?

 

Not a bad side however with a few old men but could be worse...why not give Reinach a go with Pollard...Pietersen still @13??? What's Wooly Booly doing on replacements....crazy. Glad to see Lood and Coenie (and Marcel on bench)...yes he must be given a run.

 

The Scotland game should have been used to blood MORE youngsters...not going to have the chance to do this against the bigger 'uns...cannot understand what goes on in HM's mindset?? 

sharkbok
sharkbokCaptain23,295 posts
25 Jun 2014, 15:04
#6
25 Jun 2014, 15:04#6
Scotland will have one game plan- the breakdown. 
They have been a nuisance at the breakdown for the Boks in recent years, and why the Boks do not get massive scores on them.
Scotland do shit in 6 nations each year, but the Boks have not put a good score on them for a long time.
Will see what effect the specialist breakdown coach Alex Gray has from Scotland for the Boks. he was recruited after the poor effort last year.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
25 Jun 2014, 15:05
#7
25 Jun 2014, 15:05#7
 Meyer must always take on step forward and two steps backwards.  What the hell does he want to do with Kirchner - I thought that ex-Bull was past history.   Will he ever learn from his past mistakes?
Then he persists with Pietersen at 13 - could he not see that he is a better wing than a center - matter of fact he is not a center and never will be.
It is clear that Meyer follows the quota instructions to the tee.   I think that Mohoje really is not suitable to be on the bench for the Springboks - he routinely is a Cheetahs bench player.   
There are indeed signs of progress with this team and I think the following are examples:-
*   Pollard at flyhalf.  Maybe Meyer would learn in time to come that the Stade Francais bench player is a disaster.
*   We have a far better back row without Fat Plank Alberts.  
*   I also bel ieve that we have a surfeit of tight head props and Coenie's move to the loos head is really a longer term solution.
*   I am delighted about the inclusion of Lewies - hope he gets some playing time.
The players who needed a rest badly -  Bismarck and Jannie du Plessis - should rather have been on the bench.    The inclusion of Matfield is a joke as per normal, but I think Meyer will persist with this one through thick and thin.  That one will definitely become unstuck in the RC and only then will we see how damaging his selection really is.
Wishing Pollard well - I am sure he is the future flyhalf SA needs so badly.  
     
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
25 Jun 2014, 15:06
#8
25 Jun 2014, 15:06#8
  Beeno1

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10358 RE: Bok Team announced for Scottish Test
June 25, 2014, 12:37:32 Why start with Bissie and Jannie? Give the guys a bit of a break by playing them off the bench.Marcell van der Merwe needs some test experience!! Strauss must be raring to go!

Yes Coenie is a better loosehead but we heard the swop to tighthead was because it suited his kneck injury better.Good to see Burger starting. Let's see what he has. 
All eyes will be on Pollard.



Bismarck and Jannie are so over-played that a one week break will make no difference in their condition. Nothing. They need a proper long break. Something like no rugby for the remainder of the season, after the S15.
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
25 Jun 2014, 15:28
#9
25 Jun 2014, 15:28#9
Its still a shit side but far better without the likes of Morne, Pienaar, Steenkamp, Flip and Bakkies.......but that's only down to availability - clueless Meyer would have continued on his slippery slope had these washed up players been available  
BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
25 Jun 2014, 15:50
#10
25 Jun 2014, 15:50#10
 Windpomp any rest is better than none. In addition, we need to find a tighthead. Malherbe is in contention but injured. Hence giving Marcell a go was a must. 
What in the world is wrong in starting the rested Strauss????? He is an excellent hooker.
Perhaps if things go well Meyer will give the bench decent time on the park.
BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
25 Jun 2014, 15:51
#11
25 Jun 2014, 15:51#11
 Seb I would have liked to see Reinach play. Man that would be quite a pacy backline!
DA
Devil's AdvocatePro7,008 posts
25 Jun 2014, 16:22
#12
25 Jun 2014, 16:22#12

Clued up Meyer is clearly doing a horrible job

 

What barometer are you using to measure him SafeSex?

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
25 Jun 2014, 17:38
#13
25 Jun 2014, 17:38#13

This side is a bit of an insult to the Brawny Scots.  There is no way HM would have played this team against Wales. Pollard should have played off the bench. How long do we persist with Stepfontein. Coetzee is not test material. Botha comfortably outplayed Lewies a few weeks back. Hougaard is really a shadow of the player at the RWC. Kirchner is the worst tackler I have ever seen in Bok colours and that includes the mummy Pierre Spies. Now Coenie is a loose head again! And we chose the wrong van der Merwe....the Golden Lions chappie worked Marcel's case.

 

Oh Flower Scotland when will we see your likes again

who came and died for you wee bit hill and glen

and stood against them, proud Meyers army

And sent them homeward tae Think Again.

 

We should still win on Saturday but things could get testy. One can't help but feel all the negative press has finally got to HM and he has chosen a team to appease the stupidissimo set.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
25 Jun 2014, 18:56
#14
25 Jun 2014, 18:56#14
 Mozart
As I said above - the team has positives and negatives.  The greatest positive is that Morne Steyn is not in the team.  The second improvement is that Alberts is out - Burger is a slight improvement - but really also past it.  Coetzee is fine.
I would have preferred Reinach ahead of Hougaard - but both are at this stage better than Pienaar.  
The problem case is still at 13 - where he persisted with Pietersen and also with 5 where he keeps slapgat Matfield in the team.   Lewies would have been an improvement.
Meyer has chosen a team that is not their to appease the public - there is still too many geriatrics in there - but he has chosen on balance a better team than the one that played last week.  

MD
Monkey D LuffyPro6,277 posts
25 Jun 2014, 19:06
#15
25 Jun 2014, 19:06#15
agreed with comments regarding giving the shartks/Boks front row a break.

disagree with ceradyne though, one week of rugby is not nothing even though need more.

jake white has a real chance to do the right thing now by giving the sharks trio a [proper rest and maybe play them come finals time only, but club before country has always been the saffa rugby way.

white has a chance to earn some serious uchiha brownie points with how he handles the frontrow workload.
GE
generaltitPro3,164 posts
25 Jun 2014, 19:49
#16
25 Jun 2014, 19:49#16

 Mozzie cannot see being tested by a side that just managed to clip minnow Canada (the Cannucks have improved vastly and can be spoilers) by 2 points at the eleventh hour...as much admiration I have for the tough Scots...rugby being relatively minor there and I'm proud of my Scots blood on my mothers side.

 

Indeed the Flower of Scotland...they have managed to clip us more than twice as well as the Wallabies but never the AB's.

CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
26 Jun 2014, 12:21
#17
26 Jun 2014, 12:21#17
 
The Bokke should thump the Scots by 50.

This could be the wake up call Meyer is in dire need of. Talented youth vs experienced pensioners.

Pity about HouGat and Kirchner weakening the bench.

Would also have preferred a center at 13 in place of the outside back selected. Someone like Jordaan or Sithole with JP at 14 in place of the useless Hendriks.

Not too sure about Mohoje. Will reserve my comment till after the match.

Hope Marnitz gets some decent time on the field and has a cracker of a match.

Goooooooooo Marnitz.



 
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
26 Jun 2014, 16:06
#18
26 Jun 2014, 16:06#18

Moz you sure are turning into the perfect Meyer clone, lets just hope you don't start reacting like him when we start getting our arses kicked against Oz and NZ in Aug?

 

Pollard off the bench - why, he is twice the player useless Morne is......Pollard starting is a VAST improvement. Goosen is injured as is Lambie........Boshoff is not going to set the test arena alight.

 

 

You persist with Serfontein because he is good, had a great first test against Wales, your hero Meyer intimated as much. Geez if you see no good in this lad why don't you just chuck in the towel on SA rugby in general.

 

 

As for Botha outplaying Lewies, you seem to keep hanging onto this complete load of rubbish. Given how passive Botha generally is and how active Lewies is, how on earth do you conclude that Botha outplayed Lewies and comfortably at that? What did Botha do to outplay Lewies? Lewies has been one of the finds of the season - is far, far better than useless Matfield for a start. The Boks will improve when he hopefully replaces Matfield on the day.

 

 

Coetzee, not test material - that is the joke of the year, I wonder if your other hero Jake would agree with you on this given how much Jake raves about this guy. Last year he was solid at test level playing out of position at 6, this year he has learnt the art of the position under Jake and has been one of our standout loosies in the S15.

 

 

What on earth does Louw offer that Coetzee does not. Coetzee has now mastered the art of the turnover and at least provides some input with ball in hand, something Louw hardly ever does. Coetzee is a far better player than Louw, but you and Meyer will tell us otherwise until you eventually wake up to the cries of we told you so.

 

 

I'd rather have Hougaard as a shadow of himself than the useless Pienaar who for some time now has not belonged at test level. As for Hougaard, he has got better and better all S15 and will upstage average du Preez when he comes on as he is a better player.

 

 

Geez how ignorant are you, you want the Lions v/d Merwe ahead of the impressive Marcel......what a bloody joke. I'm still waiting for your reference to the Lions loosie getting the better of Marcel but as per usual this has never materialised for it never happened - it was not even close. The only thing that happened in those scrums was that when Mellett replaced Greyling at loosehead, the Bulls marched the Lions scrum back with interest. Up to that point there was nothing in it.

 

 

Moz when will you stop lying to yourself - my guess is that you will be forced to come clean come end of the RC when the Boks compete with the Argies for the wooden spoon

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
26 Jun 2014, 16:27
#19
26 Jun 2014, 16:27#19
 Saffex
For Mozart there is no player under 30 who is any good - players must have expereience - irrespective of how they in fact perform.   That remains a problem since he slant his reading of games to shpw performance by his favourite players - even f they bugger up comprehensively.   
Any player he does not like he woould try and imagine sonehow that his performances were poor.   Lets for example look at the past weekend - he says the scrumming was worse and even ask whether the reason was not the absence of Bakkies Botha.  How he saw that one nobody knows.   I assume he was referring to the scrums when Flippie was off the field.   
Mozart has another problem- he looks at one incident during games and that suddebly becomes the be all and end all of the performance of a player during that game.  For instance there is hugh hoo-haa about Matfield saving a try - but there would not have been a try since Jones knocked the ball on.  A while later Matfield gave away a penalty converted by Biggar - but nothing is said about that one.    Morne made bugger up after bugger up on Saturday - but the silence on that is deafening - he must go for Serfontein.  
I think that Mozart is hearkening back to 2007 and he forgets about the poor performances by the players he is strongly supporting despite the fact that they were poor in 2010 and 2011 already.   When you ask him about that one - he does not respond.   
I think a person should really not cxare to much about what eh carries on about - since he cannot really assess player performances without serious bias against certain players.   
I am really looking forward to the game on Saturday - I think it will be a good one despite the inclusion of a player like Matfield.       
         
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
26 Jun 2014, 16:41
#20
26 Jun 2014, 16:41#20
Hey Maaikie, how is your analysis of Matfield coming along?
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
26 Jun 2014, 16:43
#21
26 Jun 2014, 16:43#21

Dave the reason I suggest Pollard off the bench is I remember what happened to Goosen and Gaffie du Toit. I also remember what happened to the Boks when we put your man Jantjies into a test we were leading, before he was ready....not that he'll ever be ready!

 

I also recall your theory that Coenie was going to be a test tighthead.

 

That Coetzee was going to be a great two years ago....Louw is so much better.

 

That Hougaard was the best scrumhalf in the world.

 

That JJ is better than Conrad Smith

 

That Greyling was the next Bok loosehead etc.

 

And by the way I'm not suggesting Marcel get replaced by his namesake. For heaven sake, why would you put a loosehead at tighthead, unless you are Dave and the player is Coenie Ooosthuizen! I' m just telling you the lad from the Lions dominated Marcel.

 

We have been here before....best read my piece again and try to grasp what I'm telling you.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
26 Jun 2014, 17:11
#22
26 Jun 2014, 17:11#22

Well last I checked Goosen had a blinder against Oz on debut but got injured. Reality is these guys only have to have average games in order to add more value than Morne.

 

I am yet to see an issue with Coenie at tighthead. Looks to have converted pretty well to me, one only needs to look at last Saturdays game.

 

Nope Coetzee was thrown in the deep end as a 6 at test level having never played there before, he is twice the player now and Louw is not even close. Louw is a very average loosie.

 

Hougaard had a poor patch, that was a year ago

 

JJ outplayed Conrad both at test and S15 level - FACT

 

Greyling was the next Bok loosehead - bullshit, who said that - for it sure as hell was not me

 

I am telling you you are speaking shit about the Lions loosehead dominating Marcel, its complete bullshit - not even close. No loosehead has dominated Marcel and that's the very reason Meyer has rewarded him - Meyer gets a few selections right, but they are far and few between.

 

We have never been here before, your takes are wrong, not even close......the investment in old players is imploding on Meyer, evidenced by 1 point win over Wales thanks to a suspect penalty try and will be confirmed after losses all round to Oz and NZ

 

 

A question, do you think Meyer's side against Wales, add your hero Jean ahead of Jan for good measure, will beat Oz and NZ this year? My call is that we will lose all 4 comfortably

 

 

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
26 Jun 2014, 17:28
#23
26 Jun 2014, 17:28#23

Sure Dave....that why the commentator said they were bringing on your former man Werner Kruger to shore up the Bools scrum. Marcel was being worked!

 

As for the Boks losing to NZ and OZ in both games. Hell you predicted we were going to do that last year....then we were going to lose against Wales and France on the YE tour....then you were predicting we were going to lose against the Worlds and Wales.

 

Are you such an atomic peanut that you can't support the team when your pathetic favourites aren't chosen? Man up Dave and act like a Bok supporter.

GE
generaltitPro3,164 posts
26 Jun 2014, 17:53
#24
26 Jun 2014, 17:53#24
Talking about old players...Frank Bunce was pretty old when he played in that great Sean Fitzpatrick's side. One should way up each individual separately...there are 'old' players and there are OLD players....http://youtu.be/hhV0uqLaToI
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
26 Jun 2014, 17:58
#25
26 Jun 2014, 17:58#25
 "We have never been here before, your takes are wrong, not even close......the investment in old players is imploding on Meyer, evidenced by 1 point win over Wales thanks to a suspect penalty try......."


How about......:

"We have never been here before, your takes are wrong correct, not even close......the investment in old players is imploding on working well for Meyer, evidenced by 1 point 38 - 16 win over Wales thanks to a suspect penalty try......"

TT
The_TruthClub Pro471 posts
26 Jun 2014, 18:06
#26
26 Jun 2014, 18:06#26
 Saffex: "Well last I checked Goosen had a blinder against Oz on debut but got injured. Reality is these guys only have to have average games in order to add more value than Morne."

Oh, for fuck sakes, get real... Goosen had an average game... Bryan Habana scored three brilliant individual tries where Ms. Jo-ann Glassen played no part in at all...

In NZ, he managed to change a possible draw into a loss. In SA against NZ, he got injured after a few minutes, where he and your other hero Elton managed to secure us one of our worst defeats in history. In 5 games, this great saviour of Bok rugby have only managed to score a full 8 (eight), yes only eight points. This year, after a good start to a game, he gets an opportunity to shine from a nice platform and he managed to last a mere 2 minutes. Not really a CV to be proud of...

As if such a useless failure is going to do any good for the Bok side... The little poofter isn't even able to jog the width of the field in a test without getting injured
BE
becsPro4,378 posts
26 Jun 2014, 18:17
#27
26 Jun 2014, 18:17#27
" poofter "? Blimey, have we just returned to the 1970's or has that word finally reached certain other territories ?  
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
26 Jun 2014, 18:21
#28
26 Jun 2014, 18:21#28
 So, I assume that the choice of the wor d "poofter" is the only critique on the post.
BE
becsPro4,378 posts
26 Jun 2014, 19:11
#29
26 Jun 2014, 19:11#29
I think that someone using a term like that doesn't really merit a discussion with.  
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
26 Jun 2014, 19:23
#30
26 Jun 2014, 19:23#30
Rubbish he did not say anything of a sort, he said that he was sure it would be soon that Kruger would come on as Marcel had done 60 min about standard for a prop.......he said stuff all about shoring up the scrum......the co-commentator laughed that his timing was spot on and it related to two substitutions that had been made......it had NOTHING to do with the standard of play at the time and everything to do with regulation substitutions   
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
26 Jun 2014, 19:35
#31
26 Jun 2014, 19:35#31

The Troof, you really are one stupid prick......so Goosen did not effect a great break and did not have all and sundry raving about his performance against Oz.......including the coach who was so taken by the performance that he played him injured against the AB's the following week.

 

You dumb fuck  

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
26 Jun 2014, 19:38
#32
26 Jun 2014, 19:38#32
 The Trooth Fairy
Which New Zealand test are you talking about?  The one where Morne missed five kicks at goal - so Goosen lost the test for us?   Morne was so poor that the commentators said two so-called strategic kicks was absolute Bullshit.  
Morne was dropped form the side as a result - he was useless in that test and worse in the AB tests last year - that is a fact.  Goosen wit6h one hand tied behind his back is better than Morne Steyn would ever be - and so is Lambie, Pollard and Boshoff. 
Pollard will show what is really expected from a flyhaklf on Saturday - not the BS that Morne routinely comes up with  which is the reason for him being the bench player fo r his club.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
26 Jun 2014, 19:44
#33
26 Jun 2014, 19:44#33
 Ceradyne
Talking about being wrong - Meyer is wrong with his constant selection of his pals - Matfield and Bakkies Botha.  The latter was piss poor in the 1st Welsh test and was not much good in the tests last year as well.
Matfield is a joke.  He does not enter mauls - he stands around behind them.  One would think that the work of a Tight 5 player is to help in that regard - he never ever does.  He is weak in the Tight 5 component and that is what makes him a real negative in the team.   He loves moonlighting in the backline - still does and thn play a role in scoring of a try - but he leaves the hard work to the other tight 5 players and the loosies.  That is - as Saffex says - going to cost us dearly in the RC.  
 


CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
26 Jun 2014, 19:49
#34
26 Jun 2014, 19:49#34

becs

Status: Squad member
Posts: 546 RE: Bok Team announced for Scottish Test
June 26, 2014, 17:11:43 I think that someone using a term like that doesn't really merit a discussion with.  
Book....... judging...... cover.
TT
The_TruthClub Pro471 posts
26 Jun 2014, 21:08
#35
26 Jun 2014, 21:08#35
 Ah yeah, the huge break... That led to a penalty to the opposition and had no effect, as they comfortably cleared....

5 games.... 8 points!
TT
The_TruthClub Pro471 posts
26 Jun 2014, 21:22
#36
26 Jun 2014, 21:22#36
  " poofter "? Blimey, have we just returned to the 1970's or has that word finally reached certain other territories ? 

Apparently YOU have returned there (the 70's, or maybe even earlier?)... There are other meanings to the word poofter, used in a specific context, like when describing a weak and fragile player/person like that...
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
26 Jun 2014, 21:58
#37
26 Jun 2014, 21:58#37
clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 11359 RE: Bok Team announced for Scottish Test
June 26, 2014, 17:44:27  Ceradyne
Talking about being wrong - Meyer is wrong with his constant selection of his pals - Matfield and Bakkies Botha.  The latter was piss poor in the 1st Welsh test and was not much good in the tests last year as well.
Matfield is a joke.  He does not enter mauls - he stands around behind them.  One would think that the work of a Tight 5 player is to help in that regard - he never ever does.  He is weak in the Tight 5 component and that is what makes him a real negative in the team.   He loves moonlighting in the backline - still does and thn play a role in scoring of a try - but he leaves the hard work to the other tight 5 players and the loosies.  That is - as Saffex says - going to cost us dearly in the RC. 
 




More unsubstantiated bullshit. Where is your analysis. Your opinion is the only joke.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
27 Jun 2014, 01:19
#38
27 Jun 2014, 01:19#38
 Dowwer Doos 
Go and qwatch the whole game and see what Matfield did.  That is the proof you need. I did not realise it until I followed all he did in the game on Saturday.   He loafed through most of the match    
I will watch our what he does on Saturday.  He actually was worse than Albert in that respect.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
27 Jun 2014, 02:05
#39
27 Jun 2014, 02:05#39
Produce the proof...I say Matfield owned the Welsh in most tackle situations....prove me wrong.  
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
27 Jun 2014, 02:08
#40
27 Jun 2014, 02:08#40
You are still ducking and diving. You were the doos who committed. If you were so sure about yourself, why did you not told me to piss of when I first challenged you to come up with that comprehensive analysis with the timestamps and the comparisons with the other tacklers. As I have said on another thread.... you have discovered that you were talking kak. Your broad generalised bullshit is not going to cut it.
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