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Boks vs England Team

Started by kingcorn16 REPLIES901 VIEWS· 16 Nov 2021, 14:14
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KI
kingcornPro3,695 posts
16 Nov 2021, 14:14
#1
16 Nov 2021, 14:14#1

15 Willie le Roux, 14 Jesse Kriel, 13 Lukhanyo Am, 12 Damian de Allende, 11 Makazole Mapimpi, 10 Handre Pollard, 9 Cobus Reinach, 8 Duane Vermeulen, 7 Kwagga Smith, 6 Siya Kolisi (c), 5 Lood de Jager, 4 Eben Etzebeth, 3 Trevor Nyakane, 2 Bongi Mbonambi, 1 Ox Nche.
Subs: 16 Malcolm Marx, 17 Steven Kitshoff, 18 Vincent Koch, 19 Franco Mostert, 20 Jasper Wiese, 21 Herschel Jantjies, 22 Elton Jantjies, 23 Frans Steyn

KI
kingcornPro3,695 posts
16 Nov 2021, 14:18
#2
16 Nov 2021, 14:18#2

Glad to see Jantjies dropped, he had his chance and failed in both. He has been hopelessly out of form all season for the stormers. Maybe too much loyalty. Rassie and  Niena will need to start kicking some  stones over next year and find some form  players and not rely to much on the group for too long or we'll end up getting knocked out of the quarters again. 

Still can't believe no Marx or Kitshoff. I don't get this nonsense of emptying the tank. A rugby player is meant to last for 80 minutes, if not longer. 

Saw some analysis of Bongi, Trevor and Ox all flagging around the 30th minute and not getting into position to defend fast enough, that is what led to the Scotland try. 

But apparently we need those window dressing numbers for the ANC. 

I would rather let them come on the last 30 min or even 10 and let Kitshoff and Marx run riot for the entire game  

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
16 Nov 2021, 14:39
#3
16 Nov 2021, 14:39#3
Yes not sure what has happened to Jantjies he is a far better player than that. Been very indecisive and poor in execution. But saying that Reinach is pretty pedestrian at the base - needs to sharpen up there. His strength is in general play. Good to see Lood back in place of powder puff Mostert who would not even make my bench, give me Moerat any day Marx should have started and Nkosi ahead of Kriel on the wing
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
16 Nov 2021, 14:40
#4
16 Nov 2021, 14:40#4
Boks go with strongest possible team against England By Gavin Rich 16 November 2021 | 11:37 Springbok coach Jacques Nienaber has resisted any temptation he may have had to go with his ancillary end of year tour goal of growing squad depth by calling out his strongest available team for Saturday’s final test of 2021 against England. There were three changes made to the team for last weekend’s clash with Scotland and two of those three changes have effectively been reversed for Twickenham, with the squad vice-captain Handre Pollard returning for Elton Jantjies at flyhalf and big Lood de Jager back in the starting team after playing off the bench in Edinburgh. In the other change, Cobus Reinach starts in the No 9 jersey for the first time on tour. Herschel Jantjies, who is on the bench this week, was backed as the starting scrumhalf in the games against Wales and Scotland in a quest to give Jantjies experience of being a starter in northern hemisphere conditions. However, Jantjies struggled in both tests and Reinach, who was the preferred starter at No 9 when Faf de Klerk was out injured for the last test against the British and Irish Lions and the first two games of the Castle Lager Rugby Championship against Argentina, made a big difference when he came on at halftime at Murrayfield. MAKES SENSE In a game of this nature, with the Boks holding onto No 1status if they win, it would be imprudent to experiment or let the other goals take priority so the decision to replace Jantjies with Reinach, with Jantjies still poised to come on in the second half, makes sense. Still, Nienaber might have given it some consideration. He has repeatedly spoken about there being several rather than one over-riding goal on tour, with the growing of depth by giving some fringe players game time being one of those. It was why Damian Willemse started the first test at fullback ahead of the experienced Willie le Roux. Le Roux retains his place in the No 15 jersey after starting there as one of the changes - coming in for Willemse - made for last week’s game. The non-appearance of Willemse in the starting line-up is either an indication Nienaber has decided not to risk returning to the initial tour plan in a game that has now taken on additional significance as the world No 1 ranking is on the line, or Willemse has still not come through the concussion protocols that ruled him out of selection for the Scotland game. The Stormers back was injured in the 14th minute of the test against Wales and as it turns out that scuppered Nienaber’s plan to use this tour to let him settle at fullback. Le Roux wasn’t in his best form against Scotland but the Boks do have the comfort of knowing that the longest serving Bok of all time in terms of the period spent in the game as a capped Bok, Frans Steyn, is on the bench as back-up. Of course, Steyn is also backing up at centre, which may partially explain Nienaber’s refusal to look at the veteran as a starting fullback even though he was the man of the match when he played 66 minutes of the game against Wales. THIRD SUCCESSIVE WING APPEARANCE FOR KRIEL There may be some eyebrows raised at the fact that Jesse Kriel, normally a centre, is getting his third successive game on the wing but he has been solid in the position and is highly rated for his defensive organisation nous. It is also true that the man who would replace him, Sbu Nkosi, has not played now since the final Rugby Championship test against the All Blacks at the beginning of October. In all there are 10 Springbok survivors from the team that played the last game against England, which was the World Cup final in Yokohama on 2 November 2009, who will be starting at Twickenham. They are Le Roux, Lukhanyo Am, Damian De Allende, Makazole Mapimpi, Pollard, Duane Vermeulen, Siya Kolisi, Lood de Jager, Eben Etzebeth and Bongi Mbonambi. The back-up front row of Malcom Marx, Steven Kitshoff and Vincent Koch will also be reliving the Yokohama experience by playing the same role they did then, as will Franco Mostert, who would have benefitted from the game time he was offered as a member of the starting team last week. Jantjies and Steyn likewise, although Steyn has fewer positions to cover at the back now that the Boks have reverted to the more traditional five/three split between forwards and backs on the bench. Although no longer the six/two Bomb Squad of the World Cup, it remains a formidable bench and with England suffering a few injury problems in the build-up to their quest to avenge 2019 it is one area where the South Africans should have a significant edge. Springbok team: Willie le Roux, Jesse Kriel, Lukhanyo Am, Damian de Allende, Makazole Mapimpi, Handre Pollard, Cobus Reinach, Duane Vermeulen, Kwagga Smith, Siya Kolisi (captain), Lood de Jager, Eben Etzebeth, Trevor Nyakane, Bongi Mbonambi, Ox Nche. Replacements: Malcolm Marx, Steven Kitshoff, Vincent Koch, Franco Mostert, Jasper Wiese, Herschel Jantjies, Elton Jantjies, Frans Steyn.
KI
kingcornPro3,695 posts
16 Nov 2021, 14:49
#5
16 Nov 2021, 14:49#5

Ja, I'm not sure why Kriel is on the wing, Nkosi had a few blips in the champtionship but that is just because he hardly had any games under his belt and the currie cup doesn't count as our teams have been severely exposed against the irish teams. 

I agree on Reinach not being the fastest around the ruck, but if you look at the irish 9, he never hung around the ruck, so quick to get the ball away from the ruck, quick in and out with very accurate short passes to the forwards that led to their try. 

Need to see better tempo and get our big forwar ds over the line

KI
kingcornPro3,695 posts
16 Nov 2021, 14:50
#6
16 Nov 2021, 14:50#6
On another note, final match up between Etzebeth and Maro Itoe-jam. Given that  Eben has been named as the best players by a kiwi scribe
MP
MpowerPro5,061 posts
16 Nov 2021, 15:45
#7
16 Nov 2021, 15:45#7
Not to take anything away from ox, bongi and Trevor, but Kitshoff, Marx and Koch is our best front row at the moment.....but on the other hand them coming up as the “ bomb squad “ has had good results. With lood they adding weight to the pack not much else. I prefer Mosstert as he is a good mobile lock with good linking skills and high work rate....Kriel is fast but his preferred position is centre....Cobus reinach is a consistent player and in better form than Jantjies. Maybe would have been nice to see Fassi on full back as Willie is past prime, and backup needs to be build for WC.
sharkbok
sharkbokCaptain23,230 posts
16 Nov 2021, 17:42
#8
16 Nov 2021, 17:42#8

Pretty much the same team as last week.
Why are they persisting with Jessy Kriel?  

Maybe they see him as the backup outside centre to AM and want to give a run and keep him in the systems. He does not have the attacking prowess for a wing. 


AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
16 Nov 2021, 20:10
#9
16 Nov 2021, 20:10#9

Kriel did things against Scotland that Nkosi can't do. He was a nuisance in the air, he was strong at the breakdown, securing the ruck that led up to the first try with a massive clean-out. He was never a centre to begin with, and should never be a centre again; his instincts and skills are of an outside back. Nkosi had a very brief spell in 2019 where he was playing well, but his base line is poor. Kriel was also better defensively. This wasn't something I expected to be saying, as I questioned the decision to play him on the wing, but it worked. 

The front rows? Only Marx is fit enough to play more than 50 minutes. He is actually playing better than he did at any other point under José. The errors that cost him his place in the team are gone, and he is playing to a very high standard. The others are patchy performers who don't seem to be able last longer than a half. Kitshoff is playing better than Ox for now, but he was pretty poor most of the season. Some concerning downward trajectories. 

Reinach is good enough getting to the breakdown, and has been the best Bok 9 this season. He has been the most accurate with the boot and, unbelievably, his passing has been as solid as I could reasonably expect. He is miles ahead of Jantjies and well ahead of Faf. 

Pollard at 10 would be expected to be the logical choice, but he has not played well at all this season. This is probably the most disappointing aspect of the Boks right now, as he was only just starting to show an ability to command a game before he got sucked into the mediocrity of the José game. He has been outclassed pretty much by every opposing 10. I'd have slotted him in at 12 and have Jantjies at 10. That would improve the midfield, and give us the option to play off our 10 and 12, with more varied kicking options. And much more intelligent attacking play, with solid defence. 

I'd have gone Frans at 15, but he is on the bench, so I can't argue too much with that. 

Wiese needs to start. There's no reason to Kolisi at 6; Kwagga at 6 with Wiese at 7 massively increases our potency. 

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
16 Nov 2021, 20:18
#10
16 Nov 2021, 20:18#10
Kriel had a good game against Scotland but is no match for Nkosi on the wing Good old yellow belly omelette is speaking utter horse shit as always about Nkosi Stupid ignorant prick
AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
16 Nov 2021, 21:44
#11
16 Nov 2021, 21:44#11

Nkosi is passive and lazy. His positional play is actually very poor. Kriel went looking for work and made an impact. In key phases where the Boks beat the Scots, Kriel was often a key contributor. Nkosi will never give you that. At most he can jink occasionally past a defender when the shuffle ball reaches him. Nothing more. Being aggressive in the air alone gives Kriel an edge as that's the life blood of our game. 

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
17 Nov 2021, 00:56
#12
17 Nov 2021, 00:56#12
As I said old yellow belly is speaking utter shit re Nkosi He is pure class - one of the best wings in the game
AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
17 Nov 2021, 06:44
#13
17 Nov 2021, 06:44#13

Yellow belly? That's rich coming from you. I back myself up, you squirm and scurry around avoiding having to actually man up. You're a chihuahua, making a lot of noise, but when the moment comes to show what you are worth, you bottle it. Each and every time without fail.

Now Nkosi is one of the best wings in the game. Never mind his poor defence and errors. Where has he been in the big games? Where are those big moments? Far and few between. He was a stop gap until Kolbe came back, but now Josè found something better. Clearly "the best coach ever" doesn't agree with you. If course, you being the blaggard that you are didn't stop to think about that. 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
17 Nov 2021, 07:01
#14
17 Nov 2021, 07:01#14

Lets face facts - after three years the Kindergarten Imbecile has learned nothing from what happened since Erasmus became Director of Rugby.   The concept of usage of players for specific purposes has gone over his head totally - but so did everything else on rugby issues.

The idea is that the tight 5 has to ensure that the opposition gets poor balls  from  the word go and that is what happened in 2019 and is still happening at present.    The reason why Marx is used as bench player is that he adds massively to the strength of the Springboks facing the second string bench players of the opposing teams and that is when Marx is at the top of the order when it counts.  

Problem is the  KI has proven zero in all his total garbage been backed up by facts - the idiot would not recognize facts if it hits him in the face.         

   

AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
17 Nov 2021, 07:11
#15
17 Nov 2021, 07:11#15

That was feeble Lügnerin.

  1. Tight 5 must give poor ball from the word go.
  2. Marx is only good because he is better than second stringers on the opposing bench and shouldn't start.
  3. I don't provide facts, but the absence of any facts from you is a sure sign that you are factually correct.
I'm assuming that a night of heavy drinking has you misfiring a little more than usual, just a little, so I'll overlook the awkwardly hashed up splutterings. 

BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
17 Nov 2021, 10:31
#16
17 Nov 2021, 10:31#16

Happy with the side although I would probably  have had Wiese starting at 7. The tight 5 plus Vermuelen give the side considerable grunt so perhaps we can afford Kwagga?

Org you can't play two guys at 6 - "There's no reason to Kolisi at 6; Kwagga at 6 with Wiese at 7 massively increases our potency".    What is the loon on about????

AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
17 Nov 2021, 12:00
#17
17 Nov 2021, 12:00#17

Sitzsack, what on earth are you going on about? 

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