Did Francois Steyn really improved since 2012

Francois Steyn in 2012 was seriously deficient at 12.  His sole contribution was to run straight at the first defender and crashballed without off-loading balls.  He looked overweight and slow off the mark.  

The question is - did he really improve in 2013?   Initially there were positive signs that there was a chance that he may be better - but that was playing against CC Divisin 1 teams - where he ran through defenders.   Then came along the last two Super 15 matches and he was back to his worst - absolutely clueless play.   His only mechanism is he must use his strength and attack the gain line - bugger the rest of the backline who gets very lscraps to play with.  I  always said Steyn was a player relying on his strength only - but Saffex said he is the player with ball sense.

I think what went wrong with the Sharks back line play can largely be attributed to Steyn.   I said last year already that if the attacking abilities of the Sharks backline vanishes in 2012 - there would only be one player responsible for that and it would be Steyn.   In both games played thus far in Super 15 - the Sharks backline was neutralized and the signs are bad.   Steyn has not improved since last year -  judging on the past two games. 

What a fiasco our backline play has become - we really are the pits. 

 Yes you ignorant twit, he was the best centre in last weeks round and easily the best centre this week as well. Unless of course you have Jean, de Allende,Jordaan, Olivier or Mapoe as being better.

Effectively none of the centres stood out, but Frans was the best of the lot with his taking Jantjies out and the number of big hits he put in. The other 5 centres on display did absolutely nothing, in particular Jean, Jordaan and Mapoe.

Get a bloody grip and open your bloody eyes - man you speak a load of shit

 Snapster I have always supported Frans and thought he would come right but he still is NOT producing the goods. 

All one can say is that no backline player  in the Stormers/sharkies match made one take note. The SA sides are off to a slow start. Lets be honest here. Cheetahs lost to sharks when Mvovo got a soft try. Bulle were bad against the Force. Stormers/Sharks match was physically hard but creativity was not good. 

However match conditions were not easy (the durbs humidity is like the altitude a definte home ground advantage) and its still early days. 

I keep telling you lot its damn difficult for centres to make an impression in the modern game. All four centres had little to do. Frans ran straight over Jantjies and put in some big hits. de Allende, Jordaan and Jean did less on the day. I never saw a single tackle broken by any of them or anything of note on defence. 

They effectively did their jobs, with none standing out - much like with the Bulls and all the S15 games.

The only centre that stood out this weekend was Rene Ranger and thats thanks to his never say die attitude, which is an attribute I like in Taute - players that are always looking to be involved and something we used to see in Hougaard

I've heard it all now Beeno! Humidity as a home advantage??????

Just teach your Stormers the first lesson we tell the kids at 5 years of age..... Catch the ball!!

You are a joke mate.

Saffex

Can I ask you one straight question and an honest answer will be appreciated.   What did Steyn do after running over the useless Jantjies durin the whole course of the match?

The way I see it NOTHING - he ran straight at De Allende - got tackled and crashballed.   Nevr an off-load in tackle situation - never an attempt even to do anything else.

At least De Allende made a significant line break and he stopped Steyn every time in his tracks - full stop.

One of the strong points of the Sharks last year was their backline play - that stop dead in its tracks this year - the guilty party being Steyn.   And don't come with the crap about defence being an excuse for defective backline play.   We all know it is a ruse used by you whenever your favourites fail during matches.  

de Allende never made a break and for the rest did nothing, much like Jean and Jordaan. Frans steamrolled Jantjies and put in some big hits.

For the rest, the game dictated that there was no opportunities for centres to create things - watch the game again bright spark

Dumbas Saffex

I did watch the game again.  The line break of De Allende was there.  He brooke the first two rackles and five meters further was tackled by two other players.   The Ball then came back to the Stormers in the maul. 

As to Jordaan did three things of significance even though he rearely got the ball because of Steyn's gluttony:-

  *   he made a dribble kick along the line - which Mvovo knocked on.  If that kick was like it should have been caught on the run by Mvovo - try under the goalpoasts;

 *   he made a break beating 2 defenders and when tackled virtually under the posts - the Stormers did no release him - penalty converted by Lambie the result;

 *   being probably the fastest player in SA, he followed up a kick by Lambie catching Pretorius in possession and the result was a further penalty for the Sharks - also converted by Lambie.  

As to Steyn he only beat one tackle  - that of Jantjies - and for the rest was tackled everytime on of before the gain line by the first tackler.   No further tacklers needed to bring him down.    .

None of the centres did much on Saturday. Fransie's selection to the  TOW is a sad commentary on the quality of S15 rugby last week.  But even then it has to be more on the basis of his tackling, de Allende outgained him and looked more dangerous. And I don't rate de Allende.

No Mike de Allende made no line breaks and Jordaan has been a massive disappointment in his two games to date.

He has some serious work to do if he ever wants to sniff a Bok selection. Right now lets hope JJ is back for the Bulls next week so we can see some clout at 13 and maybe the Stormers should select Taute at 13, that way we might see the only two real Bok 13 contenders fight it out this season.

What is clear is your pathetic bias.......you like Jordaan and de Allende, so no matter how little they do you see so much regardless. You cant stand Frans or Jantjies so you just bullshit about their contributions.

Dont ever insult us again with your declaration of objectivity - you dont know what the bloody word means and I can see straight through you.

Moz is correct, none of the centres stood out and that is the reality of the modern game - its tough for a centre to make an impression. Frans was the best of at best a solid display by the centres

 Three players have disappointed. All were potentials greats. Spies, Frans, and Hougaard.

Will any of them shine this season.We shall see.

I do though have a lot of sympathy with SA backline players. They are badly coached and are expected to score trys without any engineering taking place. Also the defense of the top three SA sides is generally very good.

Saffex

Why do you always run away from facts?   I gave you three examples what Jordaan did in the game after getting only three balls passed to him by Steyn.   Without balls no p[layer can perorm and Steyn's game was hopeless in that respect.   And what de Allende did was a line break - any advance over the gain line by five or more meters are classified as such and the gain was definitely more than ten meters in any event.   

Steyn regularly got caught on or behind the gain line - that is why his crashballing does not constitute any line break. 

I definitely described exactly what happened on the field of play as far as De Allende and Jordaan is concerned - do you really deny that it happened?  Go and watch the game again and if you are not blind to facts you will see what happened.

You really love generalized statements and no facts - do you?  

I have no bias in favour of any player and no dislike for any one as well.  I see the good points and the bad poits of players and try and get a picture of what they do on the field of play.   Neither Steyn or De Allende contributed anything to the outcome of the game at all - matter of fact they were much more on par than anything else.   The only difference in fact was that line break that you refuse to recognize as such.   Jordaan made a major contribution to the outcome - since he contributed directly to the two penalties that was converted by Lambie and in fact was the winning margin in the game.   That put him streets ahead of De Villiers and the other centers today.

Hougaard is my prime method of getting you mad - he was not as bad as I said he was - fact is he this week was the best scrummie in any of the SA Teams.  LOL   However, there are things he needs to touch up on.  Did you see what I said elsewhere about Meyer and Ludeke's coaching?

. 

Mike, a 13 putting through a grubber is not impressive, I never saw a single break from Jordaan and chasing a kick is hardly impressive.

What I did see from Jordaan was him getting tossed about like a rag doll. He is not able to impose himself physically and its something I feared from the start. He has yet to convice me he is anything close to Bok material and that is purley down to his lack of size.

I hope he proves me wrong, to date he has fallen well short

Watch Danie Gerber or John Gainsford on You tubes if you want to know role models on centres...something that seems to be either misunderstood or forgotten by saffa coaches. The backline is played in NZ but not here...do not be too proud to confess our weakness's and learn from our major opponents that are still masters of the backline play. We have gone the way of the Pomies...boring defensive rugby instead of following the guys that set the pace for open ,attacking and interesting rugby.

Saffex

You like to denigrate players with somethig that did not happen.  Jordaan got the ball exactly three times from Steyn and he was never thrown around like a rag doll.   In two cases he was tackled going forward and the ball was not lost in the process.   He never missed a tackle - so where did you get that "rag doll" rubbish from?  Do you deny that Jordaan was directly responsible for the two penalties that was deciding the outcome of the game?

And that grubber kick showed ball sense - but then you do not know what that means - because you are totally blinded by prejudice.

I am fully prepared to accept fatcs from you on incidents on the field of play - but inventions without any ground can only be treated as a joke in bad taste.  If you keep to facts - than people will believe you.  In any event - go and watch the second half of the game again and see what happened.   Maybe you will become aware of what happened in that game.

Did you even read what I said about Steyn and De Allende?   I said they were on par with each other - very little to differentiate between them and they contributed nothing to the outcome of the game.    Those are facts not fiction and what I said about Jordaan is not something I invented - but what actually happened on the field of play.   Following up a kicked ball and forcing a situation that leads to scoring of points for your side is a positive - not nothing as implied by you. 

I do not expect a reasonable reply - since you cannot deal with facts and believe the moon is made of green cheese and some other such illusions - so lets forget about this debate.