Everyone clear...

on who Kitchener is? It continues to astound me that some of you still respect the low life. And Draad, I felt your pain as the low life dragged up the horror of Afrikaaner women and children dying in the most horrible way in the worlds first ever concentration camps built by the POMS. It's something I would never mention and celebrate and neither would any half decent human being.
Anyway Kitchener, it's game over....once again your failed attempt to deceive is a laugh.

 Deny, the Boer war is old history and no cause of pain to me. The world was different back then. I certainly dont still blame the English for it.  It just irks me when someone tries to cheapen something like that to score some cheap shots. If it really is Rooi,  it's kinda sad. 

 
Nah ... Redneck may be a lot of things but a low life like this he is not.

Denise has his panties in a knot again.

Dismiss this nonsense for the trash that it is.

 "Nah ... Redneck may be a lot of things but a low life like this he is not."

Now look who's talking, the knife-wielding low life, Dirty Cut.
Alright then pugmouth....tell me, who is Kit chener?

 
Don't care, Denise!!

You are as clueless as the rest of us.

He's come aboard to have a bit fun ... and you've gone and gotten your knickers in a knot ... becoming all emotional ... trying to rally Draad's support ...

Glad to see he saw through your feeble attempt.

Now piss off.

 Denny 
A bit of history may help.  Although living on the family farm on the Gouritz River - my grandmothers maiden name was Pienaar - two of her uncles moved to the Free State and Western Transvaal before the Anglo-Boer War.  She told us two stories about the war that was a caure of lifelong hatred of the English.
Her one uncle was the father of General Dan Pienaar - the SA army commander in World War II.  He was on commando and his wife and 8 children were taken to the Pietermaritzburg concentration camp - where 6 of the children died.  Only Dan Pienaar and his sister survived the ordeal.  During the Second World War - his English commanders often instructed Pienaar to attack points where many South Africans lives would have been  lost and his favourite term used when they tried to get him to do things were "Voertsek General".  He died in a mysterious plane crash - the wreckage was never found - and my grandmother and her family always believed he was murdered by the English.
The second story was about the farm Blandsdrift where they lived.  Many people would not know that the river is a driftsand one with the only crossing over the river at the time - there were no bridges over the river then -  being at Blandsdrift.   One day an English Regiment was crossing the river and her father decided to provide the officers with coffee and refreshments.  My grandmother was about 14 years old at the time and she and her sister decided to entertain them by playing music on the house organ.  Their choice of music was the Transvaal national anthem - Kent Gy Dat Volk".  The result was chaotic - her father had to beg the English Officers on his knees not to burn the house down.
However, that was more than a century ago and is past history - I do not think many people actually still harbour any hatred for the English on that count and for somebody to use a pic of Kitchener - a mass murderer - is an insult to all South Africans.  
               

 "You are as clueless as the rest of us."
No I'm not Dirty Cut, I know who the pretender Kitchener is, that's the difference, and it only a low class tool like yourself, a virus with no moral values, who prides himself on slicing up coloured chappies, then goes onto brag about it on social media who wouldn't recognize a not so different low life like yourself. And hey sunshine, I don't need Draads support, as a matter of fact I stayed out of Draads war of words with Kitchener.... go and check thread 29 for yourself. I've only just only extended my empathy in my original thread.

Got all that, Peanut?
Now off you go and sharpen your knife will yu!?

 
You really are a silly little man.

I'm seriously amazed that you're allowed to walk around society unattended.

So we're back to the carving up coloureds again I see.

The last time I asked you to expand on this absurdity ... you went off tail firmly tucked. Didn't see a post from you for two weeks.

Plunged yourself into the deep sulks we've grown so accustomed to.

Tell me you dimwitted little crybaby ... after making a full confession ... on this site ... for all to see ... owning up to being a serial murderer ... confessing to the slicing up of coloured men ... why ... pray tell ... haven't the authorities banged down my door ... taken me away to answer for these heinous crimes??

Hmmm??

It seems I may have gotten away with it ... right?

It's either that or the meds you're currently taking aren't strong enough to chase the delusions away.

Do you suffer from night sweats??

Do you have nightmares often?

Does your mommy feature in these nightmares?

Huh?

Now ... please ... don't run away like you did the last time.

Tell me the full story of me an my escapades ... and don't leave anything out.

 


 

 
Umm ... ???

Helloooooo??!!!!!

Crybaby ... you still out there?

Can we expect a response soon??

 Must say,  I don't think it is Rooi.

 IIRC, there is/was a tool running a blog on Sport24 called Kitchener. Same avatar, same abrasive type of p@epol, same line of arguing. 

 I have noticed that the plank has changed his avatar on Sport24.
http://talk.sport24.co.za/forums/topic/yarpie-refs/

 Ceradyne: looks like you have found him. If he would talk rugby & drop the historical nastiness he would be tolerable.

 Ceradyne
He is still using a pick of Kitchener from his younger years and that remains the same donkey brain.   Maybe he should remember that  Kitchener got his deserved punishment for murder of thousands of women and children when a ship he was on was blown out of the water during World War I and that the rumour has been ever since that the Germans were tipped off by a South African about where and when he would be on the ship.      

Kitchener a vile piece of history...from a Winston and Vic toria fan... murderer of Boer women and children...deserved his demise...the lobsters of the Baltic fed on this creature when his ship went down...not a true man Becs, let alone an Englishman of the true breed....a smudge and weakling that hated women...not manly at all... met his fate and judgement... real Brits are aware of this charlatan..

 Seb 
I had a look at the history of Kitchener and came across a bloke by the name of Breaker Morant - an Australian.   Morant was accused of murder of Boer prisoners of war and two civilians - a missionary by the name of Heese and a Black youth that accompanied him.   However, what was interesting is that Morant and all commanders were aware of an instruction of Kitchener to "take no prisoners" and an instruction by Kitchener to murder prisoners of war.   Mor ant acted on the instruction and shot and killed 8 POW's and then shot the missionary and a black youth who saw the execution of the POW's and was on his way to report the atrocity  to the Pietersburg Commander and demand action be taken.  
Kitchener was in hot water as a result of the order he gave to kill POW's and a show trial of Morant and a few other officers were ordered through a court marshal.  Morant and another officer was sentenced to death and executed two days later.   
If the ICC existed at that time - Kitchener would have served a life sentence in jail for crimes against humanity.   He was a smudge on the history of England and he deserved to die the way he did.             

 He does have the same writing style and sense of humour as a couple of other posters on this board who I also believe are multis created by the same man.

 Personally, I do not think for one moment he is Rooinek. I certainly did not think he was Duke either ! And I do find a number of anomalies in his writing that make me wonder if he is actually even English. If he is, he is certainly not of the social class he is trying to emulate in his posting. 
As for Kitchener himself, he is a highly controversial character and one who, rightly, provokes strong feelings. He was not a " weakling ", by any stretch, Seb, and had a long Military career; coming to be seen ( prior to the time you are so rightly fixed upon ), as the type of man who " got the job done. " When he went to his death, he was partaking in manoeuvres because others had declined to take part in such a task. And it was during a time of War, when millions were losing their lives simply because families cannot play nicely together. 
Kitchener was also Anglo-Irish, having been born in Ireland to parents with English heritage. Many have always said he saw himself as Irish and he has been referred to as " One of Ireland's most famous sons " So make of that what you will. 
I am saying no more as, regardless of my viewpoint, whatever I do say will, no doubt , be disregarded as I am English and therefore guilty of all past sins of my country. If only that were true of all nations. 

 becs
I do not have strong feelings about Kitchener or for that matter I m not Anti-English at all.  matter of fact there is many good and beneficial things the English has given mankind.
However, I can understand the strong feelings the English generated in SA in people like my grandparents.  They went through a horrible period in history and came out of it with feelings of bitterness which lasted throughout their lives.   
Kitchener was a curse-word insofar as they are concerned - a murderer and criminal.  If he lived during our time he would have faced charges of crimes against humanity.   However that is past tense and should not interfere with present circumstances.
I think using the user-name of Kitchener on this site is in extreme bad taste and is a seriously bad reflection of a stirrer who uses the name of Kitchener to stir up feelings that should not be raised on a forum like this.          

 I absolutely understand, Mike, I really do. As I said, he is rightly viewed in that way amongst so many of you and I have no reason to argue or question that ! I never have. 
I was set to head over to the Museum for research purposes into the Boer War, but became too unwell and the rest, as they say, is history ! I wanted to get as much information as I could from your sides perspective; that has never been the way I work and it hasn't always gone down well with Tutors etc, but ? History is facts, not bias, I'm afraid. 
I'm sure Kitchener knew exactly what he was doing and that's precisely why he did so. The best, but hardest, thing would have been to ignore the name and picture and just treat him with as much humour as you all could muster ! But that was never going to be the case. 

 becs
I think that Kitchener became really sick about what was going on in SA while he was in charge here.   Initially the English and especially Lord Roberts and Kitchener thought the Anglo Boer War would end once they cities and bigger towns were occupied by the British, but I do not think they were prepared for the guerilla war that followed that phase.   They then decided that the farms must be wiped out since the Boers got supplied by their families with food and supplies - so they decided to burn down the farm homes and take the women and children to camps  thinking that that would bring an end to the war.   It did not work out and thousands of women and children - virtually half of the white women and children at the time living in the Free State and Transvaal died in the camps through disease, malnutrition and deficient health facilities.  
Kitchener after more than two years of war was sick and tired of what was going on and he sent a message to Generals Botha and De Wet suggesting that a peace treaty should be negotiated without Sir Alfred Milner knowing about it.   A truce was agreed upon and the 60 top commanders of the Boers were summoned to Vereeniging for consultations about a possible peace agreement.  Behind the backs of Milner he told Botha and Smuts that the English was tired of the war and said that he believes a Liberal Government will take power in England after the next elections in England and that they would grant self-government to the Republics.   He also agreed to compensation for damages to be paid to farmers for property losses - but that was not enough to prevent generations of poor whites in SA.
Be it as it may - Kitchener was a person that caused major problems for the majority of Whites in SA - and not only for Afrikaans speaking people.  There were also English speaking locals fighting for the Boers and that also created a problem - when they were caught they were summarily executed, despite the fact that they were citizens of the Republics and not of Britain.
You may be interested in one aspect of the War which is not generally known.  In a letter dated 22 May 2001 Tzar Nicholas II wrote as follows in a letter to King Edward VII:-
"My dearest Uncle Bertie
Let me once more express my joy at your lucky escape during the trials with the Shamrock.  Having read the details in the papers one cannot but wonder that nobody on board was hurt.  Pray forgive me for writing to you about a very delicate subject, which I have been thinking about for months, but my conscience obliges me to speak openly.  It is about the South African War and what I say is only said as by your loving nephew.
You remember of course at the time when war broke out what a strong feeling of animosity against England arose throughout the world.  In Russia the indignation of the people was similar to that of other countries.  I received addresses, letters, telegrams, etc. in masses begging me to interfere, even by adopting strong measures.   But my principle is not to meddle in other people's affairs especially if it does not concern my country.
Nevertheless all this weighed morally upon me.  I often wanted to write to dear Grandmama to ask her quite privately whether there was any possibility of stopping the war in South Africa.  Yet I never wrote to her fearing to hurt her and always hoping that it would soon cease.
When Misha went to England this winter I thought of giving him a letter to you  on the same subject, but I found it better to wait and not to trouble you in those days of great sorrow.  In a few months it will be two years that fighting continues in South Africa - and with what results?
A small people are desperately defending their country, a part of their land is devastated, their families flocked together in camps, their farms burnt.  Of course in war such things have always happened and will happen, but in this case, forgive the expression, it looks more like a war of extermination.  So sad to think that it is Christians fighting each other.  
How many thousands of gallant young Englishmen have already perished out there?  Does not your kind heart yearned to put an end to this bloodshed?  Such an act would universally be hailed with joy."
There also were Russian volunteers fighting for the Boers in the War and the Tzar was obviously aware of the situation.            

             
      

 Oh I know, Mike. He was tasked with ending the War quickly and, quite erroneously, saw this as the method to do so. As you will know, the outrage here at home was pretty vocal and reached the highest echelons of society. 
Thousands of British soldiers were dying of malnutrition/disease, let alone in battle.
I had family over there in various guises, one was a War Reporter. 

Dark times indeed. 

 Redvers Buller stuffed up big time in the 2nd Boer war although he did predict that the Boers would go to guerilla warfare .A brave [ VC against the Zulu] but stupid man .Kitcheners methods have been emulated by many down the years ,seperating the  Maos "fish" or fighters from the "ocean" or supporting populace only the methods vary .Kitchener was methodical and ruthless using blockhouses placed along rail lines with patrols in between like the French in Algeria or the US with their fire bases in Viet Nam .I wouldnt blame anyone for helping a U-boat send the prick to the bottom of the Irish Sea .

 Redvers Buller stuffed up big time in the 2nd Boer war although he did predict that the Boers would go to guerilla warfare .A brave [ VC against the Zulu] but stupid man .Kitcheners methods have been emulated by many down the years ,seperating  Maos "fish" or fighters from the "ocean" or supporting populace only the methods vary .Kitchener was methodical and ruthless using blockhouses placed along rail lines with patrols in between like the French in Algeria or the US with their fire bases in Viet Nam .I wouldnt blame anyone for helping a U-boat send the prik to the bottom of the sea .Strange how the U-boat knew just where to lay its mines .....

 Draad FYI ...... if you open the link and you're still not sure who Kitchener is then I'll start drawing some pictures.  Under the header:Google -  Rooiaas returns as a vegetable

http://www.ruckersforum.com/forum.cfm?threadid=2619#inscore_ifheight_xdc_500

 Denny
So Rooinek turned out t0 be Jalapeno pepper - which later admitted and he participated in Test Rugby under the same name ie "The Lightbringers".   I gave no problem with that identification.
From the above it is clear that Kitchener is somehow also tied up with that debate - so I assume he is the same character.   What I find obnoxious - as you pointed out - is the usage of a user name of a criminal guilty of crimes against humanity on this site.    
However, using other user names is not foreign on this site - Mozart used Dr Ikey as a user name himself at one stage,   
We have other characters who pops up every time with different User Names - like the departed Desert Goc has done - just wonder what his next name is going to be?

       

 With respect Becs,weakness comes in many disguises...on the surface and disception...on the exterior...tough, ruthless and unfeeling but morally and ethically lacking...he fooled many dignitaries including dear Victoria...but his deeds told the real story...inside he had no feelings for the defenceless....he was a misogynist...probably was impotent and probably took his frustration on the weak and defenceless...in my dictionary a poor excuse for a man...a smudge....when you think of great Brits like Churchill.

Mike thanks for your interesting input and yes Wardad I feel the same..

 
Wow ... what an upheaval this chap has caused.

Like ants pouring out of an anthill that's being pestered by a little boy with a long piece of grass ... scurrying here and there.

All a fright ... in a state of panic.

Upset ... indignant ... "gasp!!!!" ... the horror of it all ... how dare he speak to us this way.

We will find this horrible poster and then we'll ... yes ... and then you'll what???

Teach him a lesson!!

What a bunch of whimpering little girls you all are.

You all sound like the puffy lipped, sulking, limp wristed Denise ... crying cause he said this and cause he said that ... how dare he change his name ... how dare he post under different names.

As if he needed your permission!!!!!

How disappointing!!!

Though we were a little tougher than this.

Mike ... for god sake ... grow a pair!!

Oh and by the way ... Redneck would easily call you a "twat" ... a "small cock" ... and an assortment of other inventive names ... and he would do it without a second thought ... but I have never seen him bring your mother, your father, your wife or your children into the mix.

Not once.

One would think that you'd know this after so many years.

How muc h longer must a person post on this site before you learn something about him?

Denise comes aboard and points his finger and like the saps you are you give his absurdity consideration.

I have no qualms about discussing your mother or any other member of your family on this site.

Perhaps I'm Kitchener!!

FFS ... Grow up!!!!!!!

 Seb
I thought you and your wife would be interested in the above.  Just one thing further - On 11 October 1899 his sister Xenia wrote the following letter to Tzar Nicholas:-
"We are terribly interested in the war in the Transvaal and are right behind the Boers and wish them every success in the war.  I think there can be no one (except the English) who isn't on this side."
One can only wonder whether that did not impact on the decision 17 years later for the refusal of the English to grant asylum to the Tzar and his family at the time of the Russian Revolution?  They could not refuse to grant asylum to the Empress Minnie - after all she was the sister of Queen Alexandr a of England - but the refusal of the English to even think about doing the same for Nicholas, his wife and children remains a mystery to many.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              

Deny OK, it seems that Jalapeno=Kitchener...=Rooi. I see it is easy to change your profile name on this site.
Becks, like I said earlier, the South African war is old history and the world was a way different thing back then. War is always ugly and results in collateral damage that leaves scars for years to come. The Japanese are still very much affected by the bombings of Nagasaki and Hiroshima 70 years ago, but who knows what would have happened if the war carried on for another few years and what the cost of that would have been? 
The same goes for the Boer War. I blame the pig headed Boer leaders just as much for what happened. A twisted sense of honor dumped this country into a war they could never win with the repercussions still being felt over a century later. The English had a costly war at hand and had to fight to win...which they did. There aren't rules for war. IMO, the Geneva Convention is the most stupid thing ever. Orderly rules for making war in a humane way. What a crock of BS. It only helps the victors write history to suit them after the fact.
Having said that, without needing a opinion about who was right and who was wrong way back then, using these things take shots at certain groups now, is not something I will just let go by.
Kak style Rooi, never took you for so much of a bigot...but who am I to judge anyway?

 Nooit, K'ner aint Rooinek .............. K'ner comes here having a pop at all & sundry . Rooinek has specific targets & they're normally fully aware when he's on board . I've seen K'ner posts, identical in style & content, on SA blogs occasionally over the years .

 "All a fright ... in a state of panic.

Upset ... indignant ... "gasp!!!!" ... the horror of it all ... how dare he speak to us this way.

We will find this horrible poster and then we'll ... yes ... and then you'll what???

Teach him a lesson!!

What a bunch of whimpering little girls you all are."
Exactly, and in a nutshell. This plank has been around on forums for ages and his MO is always that same. Attack South Africans and their history and cause a stir and then just keep on stirring the pot. That is why I haven't even bothered to read his essay of BS, the moment that I recognised him. I am very sure that he is not Rooinek. Rooinek has never taken the Anglo-Boer route to provoke discourse . 

 Vlag and Blobbie, believe want you want, if after reading the link I posted, but tell me this, I've taken 1 of the threads from the link for you to compare with the current posts of "Kitchener".....are you still saying it's not one and the same poster?        Kitchener

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 612 RE: RooiAAS arrives as a vegetable.
October 11, 2012, 10:06:48

Patience Wigboy. Ill answer yr question as soon as u answer mine that I asked 1st.

 

On an earlier thread u said that jaco Taute (and I quote) "rushed inside way too early leaving Conrad Smith with a trot in try". Since then u said that Taute stood like a pylon during that incident which is v confusing. Plz clear up this confusion. How can Taute cut in too early and also stand like a pylon? Why was it such a big deal when u thought it was taute who cut in too early but when u found out it was F Hougard (after I skooled u) then suddenly it wasnt such a big mistake?

 

R u ignoring my questions cuz u think they unresonable?

                    

 Exactly, I do not think for one moment it is Rooinek !! 
And CC, you will see, in my comments to Mike, that I said this chap ( whoever he is ) knows exactly what he is doing and really wants to get a rise out of you all. The best thing ( but a hard thing for many ) would be to ignore him or speak to him about Rugger, in the manner he has addressed you all !! But that did not happen and here we are now. 
As for the Tzar and his family, no, I do not think it had anything to do with South Africa !! 
Seb, I think you need to realise that this War was one instance in the long career of this man. And no-one, myself included , is saying he was correct in this matter. But this was a man who would not hesitate to kill his own men if he had to, so he would have no compunction in acting the way he did. He was, after all, copying the new German model from South West Africa, which was supposed to be the blueprint for a new approach to this type of thing. Was that acceptable or was that too an abomination ? The men you think were heroes for killing Kitchener and, of course, the men who used this method to far greater effect in later years. 
And yes, Draad, History is always written by the victors ! Unless some of us add some balance to proceedings !! 

 @Denny. Yep. He caught me out. He must clearly have read "the other" Kitchener's posts on other boards because he really came across as that Kitchener. Credit on the one hand to "copy" the other Kitchener's MO but rank stupidity to just change his own forum name to Kitchener, forgetting that the forum system changes his name and avatar for all forum posts, past and present.  He should have created a new profile to make it stick. 
Of course he will probably come up with the excuse that he did it deliberately to see if he would get found out. 

 
"Of course he will probably come up with the excuse that he did it deliberately to see if he would get found out."
Yep. 
Or that other little cracker .... "I was just having some fun."

Ceradyne
 
Status: Rugby Legend 
Posts: 4713RE: Everyone clear...
September 01, 2015, 11:31:07

but rank stupidity to just change his own forum name to Kitchener, forgetting that the forum system changes his name and avatar for all forum posts, past and present.  He should have created a new profile to make it stick. 

 

And therein lies the gem

 Good spoof all the same...I had to see the "proof" to believe it! Cera, more probable is that Kitchener is only one of many aliases,  including Rooi, Jalapeno AND some of the other multies on this,  and other sites. Won't surprise me if some of his "enemies" are also his own alter ego's. Imagine having fights with yourself on the internet ! 

 And therein lies the gem".... Indeed Devil's,  indeed!