In March, Telegraph Sport revealed that drugs tests of rugby players in South Africa had plunged more than sixfold in a decade.
The significant drop in testing coincided with the Springboks becoming the most dominant force in Test rugby, winning back-to-back World Cups in 2019 and 2023.
I guess all the facts will come out in the end - One way or another.
There have been major concerns for quite some time.
...But many of the most important Boks play abroad in the Japan and Europe. They're subject to the same testing as everybody else.
The local Boks have been playing in the URC for five years. Subject to the same testing as their European counterparts.
Care to elaborate?
However, I think there is a doping issue at school level. Kids are juicing until they hit 10th or 11th grade. They get huge and then if they expect to play meaningful rugby in their final year at school they come off the juice. By which time they're already freak looking and basically just keep their diet and training regiments goings so they don't really lose much.
My feeling is that from the age of 16, these kids should be tested at schools level if they are competing in contact sports.
Whether it's bent home refs, drugs or thuggery, the Yarpies have a long history of cheating.
Can't wait for the ABs to show the SteroidBoks who is still number one.
Ja, ja we know...good luck with the sour grapes ...must be hard gargling all that vinegar...
They are all black players that get caught doping. Makes quota rugby hard on these players and not many quality to chose from
Most notable, Chillie Boy, Ashanti, no Clubakanye. The list goes on.
The delusional SA rugby public think we have so much talent, however, the white population is shrinking, going abroad, most quality white players go abroad. They might not all be test players but they are better than those who have taken their places
Whether it's bent home refs, drugs or thuggery, the Yarpies have a long history of cheating.
Can't wait for the ABs to show the SteroidBoks who is still number one.
Boy those drugs sure are potent. Who would have thought they could result in the ABs being thrashed by 43 points to 10.
At home? Denial is understandable one can sense the pain.
Very harsh on Asenathi
He was prescribed the stuff by a doctor. It was all passed by the Lion's medical team and it was declared on his URC paperwork.
He was totally open about everything at every step, he trusted the professionals who were meant to be looking out for him...and now he's banned for 18 months.
At that point, I'm sorry, but I am suing my physician and the Lions medical team.
Why should he cop a ban for their mistakes!?!?!?!?
Personal responsibility still applies here. His physician might have prescribed it and the Lions medical team might have cleared it...
But every professional rugby player is ultimately responsible for what goes into their own body.
It's like someone handing you a bag of cocaine saying it's an energy supplement...do you just blindly take it without checking what's actually in it?
Or do you take responsibility and verify first? The anti doping rules are crystal clear on this. Ignorance and trust in others is not a valid defence.
Suing the physician and the Lions medical team won't help, the ban stands regardless.
The responsibility for what enters your body as a professional athlete, has always been yours and yours alone.
"Very harsh on Asenathi
He was prescribed the stuff by a doctor. It was all passed by the Lion's medical team and it was declared on his URC paperwork.
He was totally open about everything at every step, he trusted the professionals who were meant to be looking out for him...and now he's banned for 18 months.
At that point, I'm sorry, but I am suing my physician and the Lions medical team.
Why should he cop a ban for their mistakes!?!?!?!?"
THIS!
At that point, I'm sorry, but I am suing my physician and the Lions medical team.
ESPECIALLY THIS!
M
When you take your car to the mechanic, can you reasonably expect that he won't leave it in a condition that will be dangerous and cause you get into an accident? Assume he doesn't and you end up killing someone on the highway. I'm sure that you'll take full responsibility in court and have not a word to say about the mechanic, right?
You use of the word "anybody" doesn't ring correct. It's not "somebody". They are paid professionals.
Here is a list of SOME banned substances...
Abiraterone
Acetazolamide
Adrafinil
Adrenaline
Aicar
Ajmaline
Albuterol
Aldosterone
Amfetamine
Amiloride
Andarine
Androstenedione
Androstenediol
Anastrozole
Arformoterol
Armodafinil
Atamestane
Bambuterol
Becaplermin
Benfluorex
Benzphetamine
Betamethasone
Boldenone
Bolasterone
Bolazine
Bromantan
Budesonide
Bumetanide
Buprenorphine
Buserelin
Calusterone
Cannabidiol derivatives
Cannabis
Canrenone
Carboxy-THC
Carbuterol
Carvedilol
Cathine
Cathinone
Celiprolol
Ceritinib
Chlortalidone
Clenbuterol
Clobenzorex
Clomifene
Clostebol
Clenpenterol
Cocaine
Codeine
Corticorelin
Corticotropin
Cortisone
Cropropamide
Cyclazodone
Danazol
Darbepoetin alfa
Dehydrochlormethyltestosterone
Desoxymethyltestosterone
Dexamethasone
Dexamphetamine
DHEA
Diamorphine
Dienolone
Dihydrotestosterone
Dimethylamphetamine
Drostanolone
Ecdysterone
Enobosarm
Epitrenbolone
EPO
Ephedrine
Epinephrine
Eplerenone
Esmolol
Etamivan
Etilefrine
Etiocholanolone
Exemestane
Fenbutrazate
Fencamfamin
Fenetylline
Fenfluramine
Fenoterol
Fentanyl
Finasteride
Fluoxymesterone
Formebolone
Formoterol
Furazabol
Furosemide
Gefitinib
Gestrinone
Glucocorticoids
Gonadorelin
Growth hormone
HCG
HGH fragments
Higenamine
Hydrochlorothiazide
Hydrocodone
Hydromorphone
IGF-1
Insulin
Isometheptene
Ketamine
Landiolol
LASIK masking agents
Lefamulin
Leuprorelin
Levomethamphetamine
LGD-4033
Lisdexamfetamine
Loperamide abuse derivatives
Lorcaserin
Meldonium
Mefenorex
Mephentermine
Mesterolone
Mesocarb
Metandienone
Metenolone
Methadone
Methamphetamine
Methandriol
Methasterone
Methenolone
Methoxy polyethylene glycol-epoetin beta
Methylephedrine
Methylhexanamine
Methylphenidate
Methyltestosterone
Metolazone
Mibolerone
Modafinil
Morphine
Myostatin inhibitors
Nabiximols
Nandrolone
Nebivolol
Nikethamide
Norandrostenedione
Norbolethone
Norclostebol
Norfenfluramine
Norethandrolone
Octopamine
Ostarine
Oxabolone
Oxandrolone
Oxilofrine
Oxprenolol
Oxycodone
Oxymesterone
Oxymetholone
Pemoline
Pentazocine
Pentetrazol
Perindopril abuse derivatives
Phendimetrazine
Phentermine
Phenmetrazine
Phenpromethamine
Pirbuterol
Prednisolone
Prednisone
Prasterone
Probenecid
Procaterol
Propranolol
Prostanozol
Pseudoephedrine
Quinbolone
RAD-140
Raloxifene
Recombinant EPO
Rimonabant
Ritodrine
SARMs
Salbutamol
Salmeterol
Sibutramine
Sotalol
Spironolactone
Stanozolol
Stimulants
Strychnine
Tamoxifen
TB-500
Temazepam misuse combinations
Terbutaline
Testosterone
THC
Thiazides
Thymosin beta-4
Toremifene
Torsemide
Tramadol
Trenbolone
Triamcinolone
Triamterene
Trimetazidine
Tuaminoheptane
Turinabol
Ulobetasol
Vilanterol
Xipamide
Zeranol
Zilpaterol
Zipaterol
And many more designer steroids, peptide analogues, metabolites, and experimental compounds.
It's why people are paid to check this stuff.
...and why those people are not simply classed as "somebody".
Firstly show me exactly where I used the word anybody in my post...because I didn't. So already you're debating something I never said...
Secondly your analogy is actually weak and here is why...when I send my bike in for a service or to fix a problem, I ask for every old part, every old filter they removed.
I want it all back so I can verify with my own eyes that new parts went in. That is called personal responsibility and verification.
Now apply that same logic to Asenathi...you are a professional rugby player. Your career, your livelihood, your reputation depends entirely on what goes into your body.
You have access to that entire banned substances list you just posted. Before taking anything prescribed or cleared by anyone...you verify it yourself.
Saying oh but the professionals checked it is the same as saying oh but my mechanic said it was fine so I never looked at what he did myself. That is blind trust with your career on the line.
If Asenathi had taken ten minutes to cross reference what he was taking against that list...he would have found it. That is exactly the point.
The responsibility always lands with you in the end. Not your physician and not the Lions medical team.
"Secondly your analogy is actually weak and here is why...when I send my bike in for a service or to fix a problem, I ask for every old part, every old filter they removed.
I want it all back so I can verify with my own eyes that new parts went in. That is called personal responsibility and verification."
...an if you are not someone that is able to asses car and bike parts?
What then?
Well, I would suggest going on Google and researching what that specific part for your make and model of vehicle looks like when it’s worn.
Save the pictures so you can compare them with the old parts your mechanic removed. Another option is to take someone with you who can assess those parts.
Also, rely on friends and family to recommend a trustworthy mechanic, that they've built up a good relationship with.
New Zealand are now our bitches... we own them....
The All Blacks are no longer even the 2nd best team in the world.
Their tight five is so weak that the last All Black coach was considering fielding their cheerleader girls in the bomb squad. If New Zealand do not get off to a good start, the pack just falls away in the 2nd half.
Super Rugby has become a netball competition, and is not good preparation for test rugby.
On their day, the All Blacks are still good - but they will struggle in a tournament because they can't string together 3 back to back matches consistently.
Sounds like a brilliant idea, M.
You should probably tell all those people that have lost professional liability cases your strategy.
I guess, if I go to the doctor and his treatment ends up killing me. I shoulda known better.
Ai jaai jaai man, anti doping regulations operate under strict liability. That means regardless of who prescribed it, regardless of professional negligence, the athlete is responsible for what is in their body.
That is not my opinion. That is the rule every professional rugby player signs up to. And your doctor analogy is again weak.
Medical treatment carries inherent unpredictable risks...A banned substances list is publicly available, clearly published and every professional athlete is obligated by contract to know it.
Those two things are not remotely comparable. You are confusing professional liability law with anti doping strict liability.
They are completely different frameworks and both can apply simultaneously.
It does appear SA have had a disproportionate number of doping cases over the years. Why is this, do you think ?
The Georgian found guilty as well has been banned for eleven years !
Yes, we all know that the player is ultimately held liable. That was never in dispute.
But there are people that are paid to make sure that outcome didn't occur.
...hence my opinion that I would sue the physician and the Lions' medical team.
...and also my opinion that the sentence was harsh considering the circumstances.
Remind me again, what is your point?
Is it just coincidental that the 2 countries in the world with the best scrums (Georgia and SA) are currently the ones with much publicised drug abuse incidents??
It's no coincidence bro. They're drug cheats. Dunno about the Georgies but the Yarpies have been cheating for decades. Everyone knows it.
"That was never in dispute."
"Remind me again, what is your point?"
Honestly bro??!! Open your eyes and read properly...End of story, thanks for proving my point...
here, I asked Chat GPT some questions...
Query;
what is the role of medical teams at sports clubs in relation to medication and supplements.
Response;
at most professional sports clubs, the medical and performance staff are responsible for reviewing and approving medications, supplements, and recovery products used by athletes.
That usually involves a combination of:
Their role is partly about health and partly about compliance with anti-doping rules from organizations like the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA).
Typical responsibilities include:
This matters because athletes can fail doping tests even if:
Under most anti-doping rules, the athlete is still ultimately responsible for what enters their body (“strict liability”), so clubs create approval systems to reduce risk.
Many elite clubs require athletes to:
In top-level football, rugby, cycling, athletics, MMA, and Olympic sports, this process can be extremely strict.
Query;
What about URC teams ...the rugby league
Response:
Yes — URC clubs are generally very strict about this.
The United Rugby Championship itself follows the anti-doping framework of World Rugby and World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA).
At most professional URC teams, players are expected to clear:
through the club medical department before using them.
Typically the process involves:
Many teams maintain:
This is because rugby anti-doping rules use “strict liability”:
if a banned substance is found, the player is still responsible even if:
So elite rugby environments tend to be very cautious.
For example, World Rugby guidance specifically warns players:
South African URC franchises like:
all operate within the same SAIDS/WADA/World Rugby anti-doping structure.
In practice, players in those environments usually message the medical staff before taking anything new.
_____________________________________
So, as I said, the medical professionals failed in their duties and now Asenathi will miss the World Cup.
And he should sue them...bro
Shame the critics blogging from NZ are desperate to find any excuse to find fault with the Springboks.
All one eyed pricks.
Pity that they cannot believe and accept the depth of Springbok rugby and the fantastic young players coming up from the junior ranks.
The talent pool for RSA is great while the NZ team is struggling with a Coach and quality players.
Shame, but just shows they are all biased ONE-EYE JACKS seeking any excuse for the thrashing of their once great All Blacks.
Unfortunately.
It's called a dominance hangover, AJ.
They once had a good team and it's difficult for them to accept that they're now on par with France and the like.
Meanwhile the South Africans are churning out professionals like it's going out of fashion.
While there is obviously no policy in Bok rugby to enhance performance with drugs, the fact that we are seeing a higher incidence suggests some sort of investigation should probably be made. For NZ it’s harder. When the Bok incumbent will be picked ahead of the AB incumbent more than two thirds of the time, it’s obviously a test level talent issue.
In terms of other factors, not being tested at forward in the club game has probably been the single most significant factor in NZ’s decline.
Well he can sue them, nobody said he couldn't...not sure it will lift his ban though...
"This is because rugby anti-doping rules use strict liability:
if a banned substance is found, the player is still responsible even if:
1. the supplement was contaminated,
2. the doctor made a mistake,
3. or the product came from the club.
So elite rugby environments tend to be very cautious."
Your own ChatGPT research confirms this...
Ironically his possible legal case against the Lions medical team and his physician would have been so much stronger if he had taken personal responsibility first and checked what he was taking before taking it...a much stronger case for negligence.
M, glad you established that Asenathi suing his physician and the Lions' medical team wouldn't magically nullify his ban.
A claim that nobody was making in the first place.
Why should he cop a ban for their mistakes...your words. Not mine, Bro...
Yes right - Fonged to the eye balls.
World rugby are catching up............
Moz you’ve confused me!
What do you mean by “When the Bok incumbent will be picked ahead of the AB incumbent more than two thirds of the time”??
...he means that if you were to select a combined Bok and AB side, 8 or less of the 23 would be All Blacks. And he's probably right.
BlackAndRed, it's just a numbers game. There are a ridiculous amount of schoolboys playing rugby in SA. And that number has grown drastically over the last ten years. Other counties are choosing from far smaller player pools. Schoolboy rugby here has become huge, it's televised now and seeing 20k spectators at a school game isn't out of ordinary.
If I get to select the strongest from 100 random Saffa guys and you to select the strongest from 1000 Kiwi guys, you're guy is likely gonna be stronger.
In Johannesburg alone, on a Saturday morning in winter, there are upward of a 150 schools fielding rugby teams. And some of those schools have teams from A to E at every grade.
AI seems to think that SA has 200% to 400% more schools teams playing rugby than New Zealand does. And that gap is widening.
But you guys have one huge advantage over us...IQ. And I don't know if that will ever change. Rassie has bucked the trend for now. But I can assure you the moment he leaves, some numbskull will takeover.
Look no further than this URC season as evidence that our coaching is abysmal.
Have a read of tonight's Lions match thread for evidence of what I am talking about.
Well argued Plumpster. It's absurd that a player is banned after professionals have passed the medication being taken by the player. The professional should be penalized.
The wee AB supporters must realize Bok scrumming has always been good. We have always had big strong men. The Afrikaners have them in abundance.
But to make matters worse for wee abs we are these days getting powerful black forwards as well. Eg Ox.
It is clear that black players are particularly fast. Take a look at our sprinters winning on the Workd stage.
Plump I also agree about IQ. We have the occasional great coach but all too often they are average or worse.
But even here with so much professional rugby being played our coaches are improving.
I think the value being added to the Boks by black players these days increases our chances of being top dogs. Black talent hasn't been fully exploited yet either.
Right now we are at a difficult place. Our great RWC winning team has aged and our replacement are not fully on line and up to speed. But if anybody can negotiate this changing of the guard it's Rassie, unquestionably the greatest coach in world rugby. So we still have a chance of beating the wee abs but it could be tricky. But I admit I am not too well acquainted with AB rugby these days. Look forward to seeing the kiwi ballarinos in action.
Perhaps the most rediculous thing is these kiwi bird brains accusing us of cheating.
Nobody and I mean nobody has ever cheated as much as the wee abs. Think of the the whole get the Jarpie saga. The terrible bent down under refs. The main reason I was so glad we went north.
Ah, we are getting close to the test match series between the Mighty Boks and the formerly good All Blacks.
We will see won't we.
Talk is very cheap..............
The inside information in South Africa is that Schools rugby is full of drugs.
Players having to take drugs to try and get ahead.
Yes, it is, BR.
Something needs to be done about it. Not only for sport but also for the health of these kids. Some 15 year-old guy has almost zero life experience or ability to ensure that what he is getting is not some nasty shit that will mess him up. I don't think a kid should suffer for his entire life for a mistake he made when he was barely old enough to think for himself.
I don't think doping a major issue at pro level because the controls are very tight but at school level there has been a crisis brewing for some time.
-
Lots of Bok fans are very high on our own Kool-Aid.
Grace will always elude the worst winners.
I look forward to the games this year and know the ABs will be up for it.
That's enough for me.
...well, actually, not quite. Moz, Paks, Draad, Rooi and other regulars on the match forum will be required too.
Then I'll be happy.
