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FORUM / RUGBY /  Finally … The reason why South Africa lost the 2023 Rugby World Cup bid to France

Finally … The reason why South Africa lost the 2023 Rugby World Cup bid to France

Started by Denny22 REPLIES2,124 VIEWS· 18 Dec 2022, 15:35
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DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
18 Dec 2022, 15:35
#1
18 Dec 2022, 15:35#1

Johannesburg - The president of the French Rugby Federation Bernard Laporte has been found guilty of corruption, and immediately the minds of South Africans revert to that extraordinary day in November 2017 when a rock-solid bid by South Africa to host the 2023 World Cup mysteriously went to France.

The three contenders were Ireland, South Africa, and France, with the latter finishing a distant second to SA in the vitally important technical review while the Irish dropped out of the race.

This meant that SA earned the recommendation from the Board of World Rugby to host the World Cup and then the matter went before the World Rugby Council for a round of (anonymous) voting, which is usually a rubber stamping of the earlier recommendation, only for France to emerge as shock victors.

I recall very clearly World Rugby chairman Bill Beaumont’s embarrassment as he read out the winner and I will never forget Laporte’s gleeful fist-pumping …

And why wouldn’t he be thrilled? He had been a busy man over the 24 hours between the announcement of Word Rugby’s recommendation and the second round of voting.

It is known that Laporte met with delegates to persuade them to switch from South Africa to France and while this is not illegal, what cannot be proved is if anything was promised to those who jumped the SA ship and pinned their colours to the French mast.

But let’s be frank … how could Rugby Africa, for instance, who are sponsored by SA Rugby and even have their office at SA Rugby’s headquarters, suddenly ditch their benefactors and vote for Laporte’s France?

And also contradict the independent report of World Rugby?

If William Shakespeare had been a reporter covering that World Cup process, he might have written “there is something rotten in the State of France” — he in fact wrote this in 1601 about Denmark in Hamlet and it has become a phrase synonymous with corruption ever since.

On Tuesday, a French court sentenced Laporte to a two-year suspended prison term after he was convicted of showing favouritism in awarding a jersey sponsorship contract for the national team to Mohed Altrad, the billionaire owner of Top 14 champions Montpellier

He was also banned from holding any rugby post for two years, but this is suspended pending an appeal.

Shockingly, Laporte is also vice-chairperson of World Rugby, who have said that they are processing the developments and will make an announcement shortly.

The court found that Laporte ensured a series of marketing decisions went to Altrad — who was given an 18-month suspended sentence and €50 000 fine — in exchange for a €180 000 image licensing contract that was never carried out.

In October, another French administrator, Claude Atcher, was sacked as Rugby World Cup general manager after a police raid on the World Cup headquarters revealed misconduct.

Interestingly, Atcher was the bid committee chairperson for the France 2023 bid …

Nothing is going to change the fact that the World Cup will be held in France next year — it is too late to change the venue — but the stink emanating from French rugby administration will surely have Francois Pienaar’s SA delegation of 2017 shaking their heads in renewed exasperation and saying “we told you so.”

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
18 Dec 2022, 23:27
#2
18 Dec 2022, 23:27#2

I would not be surprised if bribery and corruption is the reason why the French got the votes to get the Rugby WC.    It is unfortunate that as long as bribery and corruption is not directly done in France - it is not even investigated.

The problem is that in the modern world in so-called democratic countries entails bribery and corruption being vehicle to attain and remain in power.     

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
19 Dec 2022, 00:03
#3
19 Dec 2022, 00:03#3

Spoken like a man who used to regularly spend time in client boxes while part of the process approving their project. 

DE
Deus Ex LemurPro2,355 posts
19 Dec 2022, 00:06
#4
19 Dec 2022, 00:06#4

France, again? Can't that vile cesspit fade away like a stale fart into the wind? Might give this a miss. 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
19 Dec 2022, 00:07
#5
19 Dec 2022, 00:07#5

You are a lying  BSter and sheister of note - you, prejudiced bastard.   Prove to me that I received any money ever from anybody in my work environment.   It is a shallow and stupid personal attack without any proof whatsoever.             

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
19 Dec 2022, 01:43
#6
19 Dec 2022, 01:43#6

I never said you received money….did you? But by your own words you spent time in client boxes, you bragged about it. Clearly unethical behaviour. Do you think they invited you just because of your good looks?

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
19 Dec 2022, 07:05
#7
19 Dec 2022, 07:05#7

I received nothing and you do not know that through 5 years my proposals to council the economic growth resulted in an increase of revenue of the Municipality grew from R350 million to R1,2 billion and for 36 months approval of building plans amounted to more than R2 billion a month on average,   

The Government sent endless numbers of deputations to the Municipality to learn what was going on.   I had to give lectures about economic development in two countries in Europe and at numerous conferences in SA.

So that was my job record of which I am proud.   I have zero to be ashamed of.   So F-O BSter.       

DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
19 Dec 2022, 08:19
#8
19 Dec 2022, 08:19#8

It's pretty normal to be invited to corporate box offices, I speak from experience and as CEO of a Popcorn company ou Pompous would have had his fair share of invitations and it certainly wasn't because of his looks.

PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
19 Dec 2022, 08:40
#9
19 Dec 2022, 08:40#9
Let me get this straight. Organisation heads cheat but refs don’t. I’d love to know where they get these refs from. They appear to be a cut above the rest of humanity, and indeed those within the same organisation. Ruby refs are the most corrupt officials in sport as far as i’m concerned. Why? Because the way rugby is officiated lends itself to it.
DE
Deus Ex LemurPro2,355 posts
19 Dec 2022, 11:54
#10
19 Dec 2022, 11:54#10

Rugby refs have been used to police aesthetic, and that's where it all went wrong. Are they the worst? No, football refs are the worst. Their calls are as if done by a beta version of Fifa 95. Rugby does seem to be about scratching certain backs at times. South Africa is welcomed north and all of a sudden they are the primary beneficiaries of bad calls? It seems a bit odd. As odd as NZ's run up to the farcical 2011 season. It just be stated that officiators are seldom of ever big money makers. They receive threats etc. And I'm not talking about pressure from the general public. Bryce had a near breakdown over what happened in 2011.

KI
kingcornPro3,695 posts
19 Dec 2022, 13:21
#11
19 Dec 2022, 13:21#11

World Rugby is still stuck in the ammeter days. Rugby as brand have not really grown nor has it managed to attract more viewers. Our game has now become a stop start affair with more time being wasted with the man in the middle and how to provide them with mental counselling. 

At the root of it all is the way the laws have been governed.

Time to create a new world rugby order that is purely based on professionalism and the development of grass root rugby. 

I would vote for a world Test series league where by all the top team play each other at least twice, home and away. Test matches need to have meaning and Rugby is at its best when it is a test match 

Drastically reduce the rugby season. I think Japan has got something there that is worth looking at. There schedule doesn't interfere with test matches but the players also gets some great down time not to mention getting some decent Doh. 

So much rugby fatigue going on. But I blame the the European model of trying to squeeze every ounce out of the game with cups, plates, kitchen sink, just to get more bums on the seats. 

Club seasons should be not more than 5 months. 

But look at all the dodgy business dealings happening at all these "Professional Clubs", how on Earth does French clubs have so much budget? Not from sponsors or fans that I can tell you. 

DE
Deus Ex LemurPro2,355 posts
19 Dec 2022, 14:03
#12
19 Dec 2022, 14:03#12

There's technically more ball in play time than ever and play is faster paced. That's what the casuals wanted. All of this goes to show that any attempt to artificially engineer the aesthetic w ill fail. 

TH
TheTraditionalistPro4,003 posts
19 Dec 2022, 14:16
#13
19 Dec 2022, 14:16#13

If written by a journalist, that is another manifestation of a sycophant.

Instead of looking at the situation, excuses are being invented.

Already stated, the SA rugby bid was the most deserving. Instead of wondering how it failed, SA rugby supporters prefer the words of sycophants.

It took less than ten seconds to question one point made in the article about Rugby Africa.

Just went to their page to see the list of partners (french union and  companies are listed)

From this little check, the fact that SA rugby are also sponsors is moot.

SA rugby got bitten. They have not promoted rugby in Africa, not even in SA. Their rugby looks like an apartheid 2.0 version, that is an oppressive power compelled to compromize in order to keep going.

As SA rugby have not promoted any African rugby, but european rugby interests, the vote of SA rugby is not tied to African interests. Rugby Africa simply voted for a European country.

SA rugby could not have played even the race card as Rugby Africa is probably in the hands of Magrehbis. Who may even be former players in the french league.

Problem for SA rugby: they are only related to the Africa continent through location. Other than that, they relate first and most to Europe. And in a such way that European countries may relate more to African countries than SA rugby.

Instead of taking the situation into account, claims of corruption are preferred. Which by the way wont improve the standing in Africa.


TH
TheTraditionalistPro4,003 posts
19 Dec 2022, 14:20
#14
19 Dec 2022, 14:20#14

But look at all the dodgy business dealings happening at all these "Professional Clubs", how on Earth does French clubs have so much budget? Not from sponsors or fans that I can tell you.

People do not even try.

It is plain to see that French sides benefit from a large fan base and numerous sponsors.

All it takes is to watch the stands in one of the games.

TH
TheTraditionalistPro4,003 posts
19 Dec 2022, 14:25
#15
19 Dec 2022, 14:25#15

Club seasons should be not more than 5 months.

Club seasons should be as accordingly to the number of clubs a country may support.

That being stated, it is clear that domestic and international stages should be seperated.

The international stage should run on their own resources. Which means that each union should have a squad contracted to them (something like 35 players or so)

Then these squads would be free to engage in any type of competitions like a test rugby league or whatever) without being bothered by the number of games played by  domestic leagues.

It will never happen as it means ending the free use of rugby players and would severely  impact SA rugby that keep overproducing rugby personel.

TH
TheTraditionalistPro4,003 posts
19 Dec 2022, 14:31
#16
19 Dec 2022, 14:31#16

That's what the casuals wanted.

Probably not. What was offered was a sort of quantification instead of qualification.

Already stated, people coming to sports want emotions, they want stories etc

Rugby games, especially involving SA rugby, are dull. 65 minute ball in play time, stops never more than 5 seconds wont change the deal. Watching two teams stuck in the middle of a field is what it is: dull.

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
19 Dec 2022, 18:45
#17
19 Dec 2022, 18:45#17
If you went to the corporate box of a vendor or a project applicant, you had a conflict of interest. And no Quisling I never did that . I didn’t need to with our own corporate boxes at Spurs, all the Chicago teams, the St Louis Blues etc. It’s a great life running a pop corn factory
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
19 Dec 2022, 20:05
#18
19 Dec 2022, 20:05#18

I never had a problem as described by Mozart.    I believe that economic development represents a partnership between the private sector and the local authorities concerned.   The partnership is based on the private sector investing in developments and the municipality benefitting  financially from development with a very important additional issue of major increase in employment opportunities in the municipal area.   That partnership was very successful and entailed not unnecessarily obstructing development by the private sector.     I was respected by the developers and that was very important in the partnership - they know perfectly well what norms I set and even when I left Ballito they named me Mr Municipality as a sign of that respect.   

I can give many examples of the kind:-

*   Ballito Business area and a housing development was stalled by Council because they did not include the proper conditions of establishment.   I worked through the night and compiled a comprehensive report on the development conditions  and the same month Council approved the development. 

*     I did the same type of thing in the business part of the development and convinced Council to change the rate policy to provide for investment not being over-taxed and placed under major economic stress.   The result was that in five years time over R10 billion was invested in the area, 

*     There has been numerous applications submitted to the Provincial Government for a license to operate a private hospital in Ballito and was stalled by Province.  After some intervention by me the license was granted within 3 months.

There are many other examples I can quote and the result was that developments in the area was phenomenal.    I did not do anything that would lead to bribery and corruption and had many invitations to attend conferences and meetings as a result.   I think that appreciation of my approach towards economic development led to invitations to rugby matches as well - even though I had my own season ticket at Kings Park.                

         

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
19 Dec 2022, 20:05
#19
19 Dec 2022, 20:05#19

Duplication.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
19 Dec 2022, 20:05
#20
19 Dec 2022, 20:05#20

Duplication

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
19 Dec 2022, 20:05
#21
19 Dec 2022, 20:05#21

Du plication

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
19 Dec 2022, 20:05
#22
19 Dec 2022, 20:05#22

Dup lication

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
19 Dec 2022, 20:05
#23
19 Dec 2022, 20:05#23

Duplication

— END OF THREAD —

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