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FORUM / RUGBY /  Form is never DISPOSITIVE

Form is never DISPOSITIVE

Started by clevermike5 REPLIES177 VIEWS· 10 Jan 2014, 16:29
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CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
10 Jan 2014, 16:29
#1
10 Jan 2014, 16:29#1

There are some members on this site - especially Mozart -who writes about form not to be used as a norm for selection - especially when the form of players are bad.   He then try to prove that form is not a criterium - since according to him Super Rugby form is not indicative of form displayed in tests in 2013.


Sasue then pointed out that the following top performers in Super 15 turned out to be top performers in subsequent tests:-


Ben Smith, Duane Vermeulen, Brodie Retallick, Eben Etzebeth, Sam Whitelock, israel Folau, Steven Luatua, Liam Messam, Keirean Read, Matt Toomua, Micheal Hooper


I then suggested that Willie le Roux and Charles Piutau be added to the list.


The reason for the song and dance is that player performances on club level and in the Super 15 should  not to be taken into account when selections are made - because they perform well on test level.   There are a few players around whose Super 15 form was not really all that good (Habana being one) - but those are extremely rare exceptions.


The opposite is true - virtually 95% of the players who fail to perform at Super 15 or club level - will fail on test level.


The whole argument started because Morne Steyn struggles to make the Stade Francais starting line up and when he plays his performances are piss poor.  


According to some members  form should not be a norm in the selection of test sides and that experience is the only norm.   When queried about recent form of players they go back to player performances in matches as long as ten years ago to prove why certain players should still be in the test side.


The only norm for selection to test sides should remain PRESENT PROVEN GOOD PERFORMANCE ON A CONTINUOUS BASIS - not one-match wonders - and if proven performances are equal the more experienced member should be given preference.


That applies to all tests sides and should be the norm all along - any deviation normally leads to inexplicable losses or to teams battling desperately to win tests which they should otherwise win with ease.


It is for that reason that we should keep our eyes wide open and see who are the performers on Super 15 level in particular.    Although NH clubs play on a lower level than is found in Super 15 - Meyer has a tendency to run to NH club players with whom he is familiar for selection to the test side.  So we must also know how his favourites perform on club level.


Anther issue is the playing conditions - generally SH sides play 75% of their tests in the SH.   NH field and weather conditions is of less importance in selection strategy.  So playing conditions are of minor importance - the real performances are the key.   A plodder in Super 15 and Club level will be a plodder in all matches - whether played in the NH or in the SH.        

    

AO
Admit OneClub Pro389 posts
10 Jan 2014, 18:38
#2
10 Jan 2014, 18:38#2
 You my friend deserve more likes!?
MD
Monkey D LuffyPro6,277 posts
10 Jan 2014, 21:44
#3
10 Jan 2014, 21:44#3
@mikey,

charles piutau to be added on that list for sure, he slipped my mind there.

willie le roux dosent come close to making it though, his attack in the spXV which was outstanding was matched by his shocking defence, i can remember him on the fantasy watchlist making negative points on at least 5 different occassions due to all the miss tackles he was making.
i also think willie hasnt proven himself at test level but accept hes a work in progress worthy of the gametime investment, but ive never seen such shit defnece as what le roux pulled out vs the All blacks in ellis park when he made zero tackles from 5 attempts which is unacceptable by Bok standards.
at least is should be unacceptable, accoding to some Bok standards have dropped quite a bit recently compared to yesteryear.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
10 Jan 2014, 22:00
#4
10 Jan 2014, 22:00#4

 Sasue


I was generous in this case.  I left some NZ players in that had some real shockers during Super 15 - Whitelock and Messam being amongst those - they had yo-yo form.   When it came to fantasy selections whenever I put in either Messam or Whitelock in  after top dispays the previous week - I had to lick my wounds because of poor displays by them.   Messam was brilliant at the Ellis Park test - Whitelock not so noticeable despite the fact he was playing opposite Kruger.   A decent opponent and he is not on par.  


Talking of Super 15 - when will the fantasy competitions come on line for registration purposes?  I would really like to see how they group players - last year for instance they had Luatua as a lock - a position he never played in once.   The same applies to a lot of other players.   That messes up selections badly.   Am also interested in the opening prices.      

 

MD
Monkey D LuffyPro6,277 posts
10 Jan 2014, 22:11
#5
10 Jan 2014, 22:11#5
@mikey,

comes back normally around three weeks, as u have already signed last year, foxsport will send us all an email notification to let us know when we can head back in there.

wont be too many changes price wise, the big performers will go up as usual, labuschange, piutau and toomua wont be bargain prices like last year anymore, but there will be others for us to look out for and what have u.

i think u can register on testrugby now though??? havent tried it out, but i think i remember reading somewhere that u could.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
11 Jan 2014, 00:19
#6
11 Jan 2014, 00:19#6

Sasue


I looked at the Test Rugby site.   They haven't got Super 15 on yet - but they have 6 Nations.   May compete in that one - but the problem is we may not get the full teams with ease - making selections very difficult.  


Are you going to join that one?  


 

— END OF THREAD —

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