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FORUM / RUGBY /  Fransie....a revelation at flyhalf

Fransie....a revelation at flyhalf

Started by Mozart43 REPLIES679 VIEWS· 08 Mar 2014, 22:18
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MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
08 Mar 2014, 22:18
#1
08 Mar 2014, 22:18#1

This was the trick the Boks missed all along. The player who can slam down a loosie like Honiball, but also step, sling 30 metre passes and kick the ball 70 metres. And somebody who can punish an opposition penalty from beyond halfway.


Comparing a force like Fransie to the fragile Jantjies/ Goosen duo reminds one just how stupid we have been with this player. Because as a youngster he had a few kicks charged and failed to pass a few times, it was decided....indeed the player was persuaded, he was not suitable  at 10.


But he has all the equipment to be a dominant Bok flyhalf. From the moment he scooped the ball off the deck at full tilt the talent was there to see. How stupid are our South African rugby selectors. How incapable of seeing the finished product rather than the raw youth.

FO
ForeverArizonaClub Pro580 posts
08 Mar 2014, 22:22
#2
08 Mar 2014, 22:22#2
 How good was Franna at 10 today!!!!He was dominant over the pittiful jantjies.Wonder what saffuck will say nowI can only laugh.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
08 Mar 2014, 23:38
#3
08 Mar 2014, 23:38#3
Mozart
I know you rate flyhalfs only on one quality  namely kicking at goal - nothing else,  Steyns passing game was questonable - his losing of possession in contact very poor -(spilling 3 balls and giving away a penalty) and his defense poor (he made 5 tackles and missed 2 - miss tackle ratio 28,57% - which is three times higher than acceptable - even worse than Morne Steyn's)
What was proofed today that Francois Steyn is NOT a flyhalf and should no be used there - he is not a fast enough thinker to fit in in that position.   Better than Morne Steyn - but far from satisfactory other than at kicking at goal, far from satisfactory.       
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
08 Mar 2014, 23:51
#4
08 Mar 2014, 23:51#4
 I wont bother arguing with such an obviously limited view of the game OOm ....I'll just post this from Rugby 365
Man of the Match: It is between Faf de Klerk of the Lions and Frans Steyn of the Sharks. Steyn and his booming boot were decisive factors in the match and so our Man of the Match is Francois Steyn.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
08 Mar 2014, 23:56
#5
08 Mar 2014, 23:56#5
And  while you are about it, suck on this from Planet Rugby, you incredibly limited old coot

Lambie was hardly missed and Steyn thrived with the extra responsibilty, contributing 17 points in the victory via three penalites and four conversions.

The Sharks' dominance was rewarded as early as the eighth minute when Paul Jordaan crossed for the game's opening try, after the groundwork was laid by Willem Alberts and Lwazi Mvovo in the build-up.

Alberts won a crucial turnover at a ruck 15 metres inside the Lions' half and the ball was spread wide to Mvovo, who set off on a blistering run down the touchline.


CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Mar 2014, 03:45
#6
09 Mar 2014, 03:45#6
I give up on you.  The Sharks played one of the weakest teams in Super 15 - if they could not beat that one - they would really be out of contention - and suddenly everything is 100%.   It is not and this much be the first nall recovery Alberts made in the past two years - so that is foolish as well.   
You really forgot that at plus-minus minute 65 the Lions came within 7 points from the Sharks and posed a very real threat to them -  so I was not entirely satisfied with that performance of the Sharks as well.          
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
09 Mar 2014, 05:22
#7
09 Mar 2014, 05:22#7
So he was the MOM  but the opposition was weak? But they got within 7 points of the Sharks and that was the MOMs fault. Waaaaahahaa, you definitely have. some  loose wires upstairs Oom.
RU
RugganutClub Pro183 posts
09 Mar 2014, 05:33
#8
09 Mar 2014, 05:33#8
 Moz any rugby follower would have to agree with you. An absolute revelation and pleasure to see. Yes it is only one game but certainly plants the seeds of thought of what can be and should be in the style of play. An extra loosie in defense of the opposition set pieces and great on attack. There are very few sides who are going to attack that channel.
Great move Jake but it is early days yet. Mike unfortunately you don't have an argument here but please remember i said it is early days but definitely food for thought.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
09 Mar 2014, 05:53
#9
09 Mar 2014, 05:53#9
Ja, early days but potentially interesting....we are on the same page.  
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Mar 2014, 10:57
#10
09 Mar 2014, 10:57#10
 Mozart
What is lucky is that the playing of Steyn at 10 is not likely to be repeated in future - White is not going to be influenced by what he saw of Steyn's kicking at goal and make Steyn his regular flyhalf.  He will see what happened during the game and accept that it was a emergency arrangement made that did work out for the day.  But he will also note the other issues that was not satisfactory and realizes that he cannot use Steyn as a permanent flyhalf.  
Only the really stupid will fall for the "revelation"  and that would be the end of the story.  You yourself wrote in the past that Steyn is not a flyhalf and failed in that position in the past - because his decision making was deficient.   You yourself said you think his best position is at full back.  Now suddenly - because he converted all his kicks at goal - all his other deficiencies are ignored and what you wrote in the past is nullified.   
I know you are impressed by one-incident occurrences in matches and by one-match wonders.   Those things are unlikely to recur and be a permanent success story - especially if other parts of the performance are also analysed and being found wanting.
So dream on - and write prose - this one match wonder will fade away - like it should.                     
KI
kingcornPro3,695 posts
09 Mar 2014, 11:24
#11
09 Mar 2014, 11:24#11
The biggest question is, what happened to Jantjies. Whent off and the lions came within 7 points of the sharks.
Clearly not a world class 10. Boshoff should be the first choice 10 for the lions. 
I was impress with Steyn. The conditions was humid so it is expected that he would spill a few balls. Which players didn't spill the ball. As for missing tackles. It is the first time in 7 years that he played 10. 
I think Fransie can be our missing link at 10. He is only 26!!!!! By the next World Cup he would be 32. I would back him for 10. Would like to see how he does against the waratahs and chiefs.
DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
09 Mar 2014, 12:27
#12
09 Mar 2014, 12:27#12
 The point being missed here is that none of the current flyhalves are worthy of the Bok jumper i.e Jantjies, Lambie, Goosen and Catrakilis. A flyhalf just has to pass the ball for some SAFFAS to start the hyperbole. Replace Morne but replace him with better, equal is not good enough and none of the above is equal.
ST
Sun-TzuClub Pro713 posts
09 Mar 2014, 12:29
#13
09 Mar 2014, 12:29#13
 Yes, Frans did a good job for the Sharks at 10. He did even better in 2008 and again in 2009; The stats he was notching up were obscenely dominant at times. But it never worked for the Boks or the Barbarians. Don't let the fact he bettered Lambie fool you either - a has-been Butch looked like Gilgamesh by comparison last year! Then there is the fact that 10 is nout our problem, it never was and never will be. Our primary weaknesses have ALWAYS been inferiority at the breakdown and incessantly relying on solitary attackers to individually defeat defensive schemes which are perfectly designed to suppress and capture the individual. Our problems can be traced back to 1999. You can play any 10 you wish and you will fail, until for once in our lives we stop hiding behind this lie and rectify our failings at the source. The only effective attacking Bok teams in the l last 22 years have been they who used their centres properly. We were rampant in 2004 even with Jaco at 10! It proves the point. Conclusion: Frans at 12 and we must with hast settle on a 13. If we get caught up in another 10 debate and fail to do this we will make zero impact at the World Cup.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Mar 2014, 12:46
#14
09 Mar 2014, 12:46#14
 Kingcorn
The one thing I have  learned about rugby is that one match wonders do not work on a permanent basis.   
Steyn is never - even at center the best ball handler around - if you look at what happened in the matches he played in it is evident that his passes are inaccurate and his defence not all that sound.  In the Hurricanes game - when he played at center he still missed 2 of 7 attempted tackles - ie a missed tackle ratio of more than 28%. I would never call him the soundest defender around - from the start of his career there was evidence of that problem - eg in the WC final people talk about his missed tackle on Tate - but they forget that he missed 3 other tackles that day as well.  If you analyse the actual misses it is clear that he often enough miss tackles on heavier forwards and faster players.  
Yesterday his missed tackle ratio was in fact 50%.   Playing at flyhalf he would have to content with those kind of players and that is enough to scare everyone out of his wits.
It is not enough to say he spilled balls like everyone else.   A flyhalf is supposed to be a player with the soundest imaginable hands and it was sound - he spilled balls when going into contact or when tackled.  That is not the result of a slippery ball.
I am sorry I am the one that is shooting this new euphoria down - but I would rather not see Steyn ever as a flyhalf - as I said before ONE DAY WONDERS HAVE NEVER REALLY BEEN REPETATIVE.  Besides that his only "wonder" was the fact that he did not miss any kicks at goal.
There is no way that Jantjies ever really developed from his early Under 20 promise as a flyhalf - there never was any growth in rugby in evidence.    I do not think that he ever really was good enough at Super 15 and said that when the Stormers contracted him last year.  He failed at that level for the Stormers - there can be no doubt about it.   On Saturday - in his first game this year on Super 15 level - he again failed.   
We see a lot of promising youngsters like Jantjies on junior level - some develop further and become top players - others don't and end up playing Vodacom Cup and even club rugby.  Unless there are development in both the physical and mental set up of youngsters playing rugby - they will never perform satisfactorily on higher level.   Jantjies is unfortunately one of those.    

 
    

FI
FirstFiveRookie75 posts
09 Mar 2014, 12:47
#15
09 Mar 2014, 12:47#15

 When I first saw Jantjies 3 or so years back in his Lions debut I saw some promise. He reminded me a bit of Giteau, small guy who could see the opportunity, throw the flat pass and if he sniffed a gap had a lot of gas. Last night he was nothing of the sort, and did little  more than shuffle the ball between the 9 and 12.

 

Steyn had a good game considering he was a fill-in at 10. I don't think if I would rush him into the Bok 10 spot (don't know who I would in fact) but great to see he has the adaptability to step in.

KI
kingcornPro3,695 posts
09 Mar 2014, 12:51
#16
09 Mar 2014, 12:51#16
 Good point Sun, the cheetahs did well last year even though they kept losing their flyhalfs, the all blacks were the same. They were down to their 5th choice and still managed to be unbeaten. SA teams play way to flat, they never create that V you need to run on ton the ball. One on the reds tries over the weekend was great, cooper just pop iit wide, even though the ball bounced the player managed to get to it. 
SA teams need to learn to get quick ruck ball and have better depth. That said, I think the bulls did really well yesterday. Best I have seen them play all year but ran out of gas towards the end. Good signs though. 
ST
Sun-TzuClub Pro713 posts
09 Mar 2014, 13:05
#17
09 Mar 2014, 13:05#17
 You make a vital point KC, coming onto the ball at pace and from depth. It allows greater manipulation of running lines and gives the 10 some ammo to fire. Attacking movements are like the planets lining up outside the sun, all the right pieces must play their part and align perfectly at the point of incision. No wonder New Zealand's 5th choice has succeeded, they have an endless production line of test quality centres, they always have. I would wager that New Zealand have produced more test centres than we have test quality backs overall! I'm also in favour of developing 3 man plays that can manipulate and make a successful hit at any point of the defensive line. Always look back to league for the answers. It takes a minimum of two players to create space, not one miracle 10.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Mar 2014, 13:13
#18
09 Mar 2014, 13:13#18
 Kingcorn
I do not agree that Steyn is really the answer at 12 - as a matter of fact I think De Allende is better than him in any event.   De Allende is a better ball distributor and a better defender as well.  His speed is definitely faster.    He has one ability Steyn misses - namely he does not run straight at defenders - he always run at a gap between defenders and can consequently draw in more defenders and off-load balls more efficiently.
Elsewhere Mozart wrote De Allende is a "Jamy Roberts center with speed"  - Steyn is a "Jamy Roberts center".  Get the message?
The second issue is quick breakdown ball recovery.  The situation is plain and simple. We have to choose between two types of loosies - the slow and strong ones without real ball skills and the skilled quicker and effective loosies who can protect an d recover balls at breakdown situations.   The problem is that our loosies are relatively immobile and not really capable of doing that.  In other words we are deprived of a weapon that we should have because we cannot get away from the idea that a loosie must be an additional tight 5 player.    That is one reason why I do not rate a player like Alberts as a loosie.         
ST
Sun-TzuClub Pro713 posts
09 Mar 2014, 13:26
#19
09 Mar 2014, 13:26#19
What you are advocating is nonsense Michael. DA runs at gaps? Gaps at test level or in competitive Super rugby do not exist anywhere near the inside centre! You either run at the defender head-on and setup the next phase or you attack the inside or outside shoulder. Frans is highly adept at attacking the shoulder and presenting the offload. He is the only 12 in South Africa who offers this threat. DA is not even close to to either Roberts or Nonu, he is another myth. And of all the centres we have none have the power of Frans or the capacity to draw defenders; opponents tackle him in 2s and 3s. Your interpretation is loose and wild at best.

Immobility at the breakdown was debunked throughout last year. In fact we were the most dominant test nation at the breakdown last year overall. Try to stay with the times Michael, and to rub salt into the wound, it was Alberts and Vermeulen working in tandem who were the real revelation.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Mar 2014, 13:40
#20
09 Mar 2014, 13:40#20
 Sun Tzuu
There is always A GAP BETWEEN THE TWO OPPOSITION CENTERS AND THAT IS WHERE PLAYERS SHOULD AIM AT. 
My interpretation is not wild - it is based on facts - not the hallucinations you are spreading.   I am not buying BS as facts.   De Allende is anytime as strong a ball carrier as Steyn and he is more adroit and more difficult to tackle - and he does have speed - which Steyn lacks.  He is definitely a better defender as well.
The real revelations insofar as Alberts is concerned is   he does not recover breakdown balls and the only revelation is a low tackle count coupled to a ridiculous missed tackle ratio and an inability to pass balls - which he virtually never does.   
ST
Sun-TzuClub Pro713 posts
09 Mar 2014, 13:45
#21
09 Mar 2014, 13:45#21
How many loose forwards and locks has DA run over? None. Case closed. Michael the nonsense you speak is on par with that of Peter De Villiers, a crackpot. He also knew stuff all about backplay.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Mar 2014, 13:55
#22
09 Mar 2014, 13:55#22
 Sun Tzu 
You  in fact KNOW LESS than the crackpot De Villiers did
 I have not once during the past two years seen Steyn running over locks and props, but I have often seen them running over Steyn - that is where he missed most of his attempted tackles.  He missed plenty though - yesterday it was a 50%  missed tackle ratio - in the Hurricanes g ame it was over 28%.
ST
Sun-TzuClub Pro713 posts
09 Mar 2014, 14:04
#23
09 Mar 2014, 14:04#23
Provide the evidence Michael. You are a well known liar, so some proof, however scant, would be a good start in backing up that mouth of yours.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Mar 2014, 16:27
#24
09 Mar 2014, 16:27#24
Sun Tzu
First of all the footage are there for all with open eyes in the games I referred to and if that is not enough - you can also consult the ESPN stats.
I suppose the ESPN  Stats are lying as well.   Then also the Fospsport stats Who gave Goosen 31 points for his performance - as against the 22 points awarded to Steyn. They also gave De Allende 40 points for his performance yesterday.
Interesting enough - in foxsport in the three games  Steyn played thus far he scored 42 points - average 14 points per game.   De Allende scored 88 points - average 29,3 points.  Does that tell you nothing?   It tells me something clearly.  Thus far his year De Allende was twice the center Francois Steyn was.         
Steyn's main problems were erratic passing, poo ball handling and deficient defense.   Players get penalized for those - believe me.
I suppose we all lie in your dreams - because all sources confirm the same thing which you do not want to hear.     
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
09 Mar 2014, 16:42
#25
09 Mar 2014, 16:42#25

Trouble is, the first time Frans makes a mistake, the negative stuff will start. If White wants to try this path he will have to put up with a lot of ignorance. But here's the truth....Lambie will never be anything more than a sensible player at 10. He doesn't have the speed or strength to do anything against modern 10 channel defence. Hell he is a small slow chap, saved by having a good rugby brain.

 

Trying Fransie may fail....but then again, it might also give us a real force at flyhalf.

ST
Sun-TzuClub Pro713 posts
09 Mar 2014, 17:18
#26
09 Mar 2014, 17:18#26
 I'd say what Lambie lacks most is the brain for 10. I want to see what Swiel can do. 
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Mar 2014, 17:20
#27
09 Mar 2014, 17:20#27
 Mozart
Does Steyn have the speed?    He definitely is slower than Lambie and he has other deficiencies as well - as was clearly illustrated yesterday and statistically confirmed.
I do not see Steyn ever being used again at flyhalf.  Problem is that both alternative flyhalfs were not available and when Lambie had to be replaced on short notice alternative arrangements were not possible..  That is why a repeat of usage of Steyn at flyhalf is unlikely to ever   happen again.     
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
09 Mar 2014, 17:32
#28
09 Mar 2014, 17:32#28
 Sure Oom his deficiencies were clearly demonstrated....but, er, oops.....then he won the MOM. Steyn is just as fast as Jamie Roberts....enough said. There has never been a true power player at 10, at the top of the game. It could be eye opening and is worth a serious trial.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Mar 2014, 18:22
#29
09 Mar 2014, 18:22#29
Mozart
A trial will be g ood - but if yesterday was anything to go by seriously dangerous.   Wild passes behind the backs of players and  misdirected ones basically too difficult for players to catch - lead to loose balls lying around on the field of play - very dangerous.
Add to that spilling of balls and you have an unacceptable situation.
Steyn has physical assets - but he has a the same time limitations - one of the most serious is defective ball distribution.  That has been the case for years and is not going to change by playing him at flyhalf.
Sad to say - but you are barking up the wrong tree here.   I still think he may ultimately end up as a full back - despite the lack of speed.   That would give him more time to think and then take options.   At flyhalf and center his thinking process is too limited to allow for options - so he routinely charge straight at his opponent - easy way out.           


BO
BoklogicPro1,978 posts
09 Mar 2014, 21:02
#30
09 Mar 2014, 21:02#30

 Mike, just admit it bro..You will never like Frans and will always find a problem. Remember my words pre-season..I said best you get over your prejudice against Frans and Alberts because they are going to prove you wrong all year and land you with egg on your face.

So far, I have not been wrong.

 

Fransie just needs to get "less excited" about that long bullet pass of his and use his backs. He loves to "show off" his long ball but in Durban at this time of year, you do that often to your detriment as we saw a few balls from him find grass and you are right, that can be extremely dangerous in terms of counter attack but all in all, Fransie had a pretty good game for a man who has not seen a 10 jersey in years.

He is worth perservering with at 10 to see just what he can do with game time there but we need him more as a 12 and Lambie seems a more natural 10 at the moment.

Surely we can not fuck Lambie over again? Would be unfair to drop him as we were comfortably 2 from 2 with him there.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Mar 2014, 22:06
#31
09 Mar 2014, 22:06#31
 boklogiic
Someone wrote on he Sharksworld programme that Steyn occassionally take brilliant decisions - but those are rare and his other decisions are "bizarre".   I have generally no problem with Steyn when he plays constructive rugby - I praised him for that in the first Super 15 game.   His decisions in te second fame (against the Hurricanes) stretched the bizarre to extreme limits,   
I cannot see him developing as a fllyhalf and to my mind he is a candidate for 12 or at full back - personally I believe the latter is his best position.
Whether people like it or not De Allende is developing rapidly into the situation where his candidancy for the number 12 Springbok jersey will not be easily beaten and he is already an extremely serious threat to present incumbents.   Steyn would have to show much more than he did thus far in Super 15 to beat a De Allende selection and there is yet no sign of that around,
Alberts will always be Aberts - loafing through games - making a few carries to impress the media - but his tackle count is always low and his miss tackle ratio a nightmare.  I have never been impressed by him as a loosie - he is a tight 5 player masquerading as one,   I would not mind him as a lock - but he is not athletic and his role in line out play is zero.  Frankly I am not impressed - but will be once I can see evidence of a normal work rte expected from a loosie and the day Alberts start performing all the functions of a loosie.              

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
09 Mar 2014, 22:11
#32
09 Mar 2014, 22:11#32

Lambie can be a Morne....a reliable steady Eddy.....perhaps with better defence but less nerve on the crucial kicks.
Goosen is a wiry chap, who has had enough injuries to affect his play. Two years ago Goosen, put away by Willie would have scored himself. On Friday he bottled out and gave the ball back to Willie. But even if he holds up, his defence is pretty much a knockout factor....he will be a huge target for opposing loosies.

Jantjies  is a poor Quaalude clone....with even the tattoo on the arm. He, like Lambie is another small, slow chap....he won't ignite our backplay, with his frenetic chipping and passing. And like Goosen his defence is unacceptable.
Boshoff off is a tough chap, mentally and physically. He is not afraid to take on the defence...but he is not a natural runner. More of a tougher version of Morne...he could be a dependable test 10.

But if you want a flyhalf who can prise open defences, you are left with the slight hope that Goosen resolves physically.....or seeing if we haven't missed a trick with Fransie.
Test rugby is a brutal meat grinder, so I'm a little more optimistic about Fransie. A few long passes that missed the mark, makes Fransie no different than Quade Cooper. I'd be more concerned about the onetime he was trapped on his left foot near his line, and decided to take contact. That aside, he looked very good.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
10 Mar 2014, 01:37
#33
10 Mar 2014, 01:37#33
Mozart
You really love to write unsubstantiated  crap about players - now don't you?  All this rubbish about certain players you like and others you dislike.  The funny one is about defense of players is ridiculous.
Lets look at the missed tackle ratios of the following flyhalfs on Saturday:-
Steyn  -   50%Goosen -    0%
So you are so optimistic about Steyn's defence - are you daft about things or what? I we look at all games played by the two players mentioned, the missed tackle ratios of the two players for all games played this year:-
Steyn   -   26.3%
Goosen  -  17,2%
So Steyn is a better defender than Goosen - what a joke.   I assume the more tackles a player miss - the better defender he is?
Then about that pass to Le Roux - are you a half-wit?  Goosen could run into the last defender with two other Reds players closing in and lose possession of the ball - in other words he could do something standard to what Steyn did in his games this year.   The alternative was to pass the ball to Le Roux and allow the move to go on. 
That is not chickening out - it is using his brain to see whether there are not better options than the attack losing its momentum as a result of him being tackled without support near enough to ensure ball protection in that  case and possible loss of possession.
I thought you would try and find something to use against Goosen - but this is ridiculous - it is more than that - it is nutty.   In both the defense argument and the chickening out bullshit, you really are making a fool of yourself.
Personally I am much more confident that Goosen will tackle am attacking  player than Steyn would.   And as to loss of possession of balls in tackle situations - the odds are heavily in favour that Steyn would lose possession more and give away more penalties than Goosen would.
So try again and not raise silly and unsubstantiated rubbish next time around.           

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
10 Mar 2014, 03:04
#34
10 Mar 2014, 03:04#34
So much rubbish in that posting, I will respond to just one piece of nonsense. When Goosen bottled out there was nobody in front of him to run into....the field was wide open. 
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
10 Mar 2014, 06:10
#35
10 Mar 2014, 06:10#35
 Mozart
Most of the times you invent things to discredit players and this time you were caught out again.   Distortions never pays off and suddenly your attack went awry.   "So much rubbish in that posting, I will respond to just one piece of nonsense."   What rubbish?  The tackle issue which you stated as a major reason why Goosen should never be in the flyhalf position is proven to be a standard Mozart lie.

You may think some  people will swallow an outright lie on this site if you write it.  Nobody is stupid enough to believe a player will bottle out of a run with an open tryline in front of him - you are twisted and making up something which never happened after being caught out writing bullshit.      

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
10 Mar 2014, 07:08
#36
10 Mar 2014, 07:08#36

 Let me present the facts again. Goosen had the ball on the Reds 10 metre .....three Reds players were in the picture, one to his left and to the left of Willie, was even with him. Two cross defenders were way to his right and deeper. In front of him nothing.....nada...niks. He runs about 15 m and still with no player near him, he slows and passes back to Willie. In short he bottles out. Hard to believe I agree, I had to replay it a few times before I could accept it.....hell he never even tried to commit a defender.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
10 Mar 2014, 07:34
#37
10 Mar 2014, 07:34#37
Lie after lie after lie - the full back was in front of Goosen.   Stop your bullshit PLEASE.
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
10 Mar 2014, 10:18
#38
10 Mar 2014, 10:18#38
 Let me start by saying that I have not seen the game yet and had to rely on following live commentary of the game and what I read. There has  been a lot of praise for Frans all over the show bar, of course Ou KakpraatMike who has once again been trying his utmost to  discredit Frans Steyn. He has also been trying to predict that Jake White will recognised the failed emergency measures of using Steyn at flyhalf. I have previously posted White's opinion of Steyn and why he hangs on to him but ou Maaikie is convinced that Jake will see where he has  missed the trick. Maybe we should get it from the horse' mouth:

Jake delighted with Steyn form 2014-03-09 13:40

Durban - Sharks director of rugby Jake White has hailed the performance of Frans Steyn following the Sharks' 37-23 victory over the Lions on Saturday, saying his showing at Kings Park was also an eye-opener for the Springbok selectors.

As it happened: Sharks v Lions

The versatile back, shifted from centre to flyhalf a few hours before the game after Patrick Lambie was taken ill, turned in a match-winning display capped by 17 points, including two penalties from inside his own half.

"I think he was fantastic," White said afterwards.

"He got told just before kick-off he's going to be at 10 and again he just showed how good he is.

"I've got confidence in him and it's amazing, he just slotted in, did what he had to do and it wasn't just his kicking, it was the way he played the whole game." (Boom, goes the theory that the only thing he did well was the kicking. Read and learn, drol)

Steyn was also crucial on defence and his boss felt it was coming together at the right time as the 26-year-old seeks a return to the national team, 18 months since he last featured in the green and gold.

"It's the third game in a row he's played 80 minutes and obviously that's very pleasing not only for myself, but I'm sure it's pleasing for the South African selectors as well," White said.

Lambie, meanwhile, fell ill on Friday night and White said there was no point risking him for the game.

"At this point in time we're not sure what it is," the Sharks boss explained.

"He got sick overnight when he developed swollen glands.

"We're not sure whether it's an outbreak of flu or something, so we weren't going to risk him and decided we were going to keep him in bed today."

They still coped well against a plucky Lions side, scoring four tries through Paul Jordaan, Cobus Reinach, Odwa Ndungane and Bismarck du Plessis, who scored on the final hooter, to move top of the table.

The visitors did manage two late tries to reduce the gap to seven with just over 10 minutes to play and White admitted the comeback was partly due to his early substitutions, although it was something he thought he could learn from. (...and there, DomdrolMike, is the reason why the Lions came back later in the game)

"I probably jumped the gun a bit with all the substitutions," he added. Jake White is taking the blame for that himself. He has never been one to shy away when he has made a  balls-up. Remember when he took all the blame for the 49-0 fiasko against Australia.

"At 30-9, I think as a coach if you don't have the confidence that you could put guys on then when will you have it?

"Not taking anything away from those that did come on, I think we probably just disrupted the whole rhythm of what we had and then we let them in.

"Once they smelt that, we were pushed backwards and had to defend."

Lions boss Johan Ackermann praised his players for their ability to fight back.

However, he admitted that their poor first half ultimately cost them.

"It would have been nice to take a point out of it, but it wasn't meant to be and that was probably because we didn't play well enough in the first half," he said.

"I'm very proud of the way we came back, the guts and character we showed was great, especially from the forwards."



I am not posting this to start a debate with ou Domdrol. It is no use. He is too stubborn and stupid to admit when he has it wrong. So, ou Maaikie, I do not care whether you respond or not. I am not interested.
ST
Sun-TzuClub Pro713 posts
10 Mar 2014, 11:41
#39
10 Mar 2014, 11:41#39
"Let me present the facts again. Goosen had the ball on the Reds 10 metre .....three Reds players were in the picture, one to his left and to the left of Willie, was even with him. Two cross defenders were way to his right and deeper. In front of him nothing.....nada...niks. He runs about 15 m and still with no player near him, he slows and passes back to Willie. In short he bottles out. Hard to believe I agree, I had to replay it a few times before I could accept it.....hell he never even tried to commit a defender."

He did the same for the Boks, and has done the same with the Cheetahs even as far back as 2012. Nothing new under the sun.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
10 Mar 2014, 13:45
#40
10 Mar 2014, 13:45#40
 Sun Tzu
Do you fall for Mozart's distortions and lies?  Obviously you would - since you are equally adapt at distorting what happened on the field of play.      
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