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FORUM / RUGBY /  Here’s why Springboks fans should be both happy and sad; By Armand van Zyl. the ROAR

Here’s why Springboks fans should be both happy and sad; By Armand van Zyl. the ROAR

Started by Just_win34 REPLIES620 VIEWS· 29 Oct 2016, 18:43
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JW
Just_winCaptain18,570 posts
29 Oct 2016, 18:43
#1
29 Oct 2016, 18:43#1

The life of a Springboks fan has been a terrible thing in 2016. While traditional rivals New Zealand continue to ascend Mount Olympus, we are tumbling down the molehill.

Despite the lack of success from both Australia and Argentina, these two sides look serviceable at least, whereas it’s incredible the Springboks have managed to win any games this year, let alone the four they have won.

The Springboks will take on the Barbarians on November 5, followed by encounters against England, Wales, and Italy. How they will fare against these sides remains a complete mystery.

While 2016 could still get worse for the Springboks, there are four reasons for South African fans to smile. Unfortunately, there’s also five reasons to grab some tissues and a tub of ice cream.

Bloody Poms
Springboks fans can be feeling optimistic about their upcoming clash with England, who have not beaten the South Africa in ten years. That translates to a 12-game winless streak for the Poms.

The last time England beat the Springboks was all the way back in 2006 when they emerged triumphant in a tightly contested match at Twickenham with the scoreline of 23-21. They lost against South Africa the week after at the same venue by 25-14 and have only managed a draw since which came during England’s 2012 tour to South Africa in Port Elizabeth.

The next 11 matches aren’t a good read for the Red Roses. They lost four on the trot against the Springboks in 2007, two of those losses coming in the World Cup. They lost the game in Bloemfontein, 58-10, and followed that up with a 55-22 thumping at Loftus Versfeld the week after.

Months later they faced the Springboks in the pool stages of the World Cup and lost 36-0 before being defeated in the final 15-6. These matches culminated in a total score line of 164-38, which is also a record loss for England against any team in a calendar year.

Things didn’t go much better in 2008 when the Springbok beat England 42-6 at Twickenham a year later. The next match would take place at Twickenham again in 2010, with South Africa running out 21-11 winners.

England couldn’t manage a single win in four games against the Springboks again in 2012, with the South Africans winning the King’s Park and Ellis Park Tests 22-17 and 36-27 respectively and again coming out trumps at Twickenham by the narrow margin of 16-15. England did, however, manage a 14-14 draw in Port Elizabeth.

The last game between these two sides came in 2014, where the Springboks beat the Red Roses 31-28 at Twickenham yet again.

Capping off this reason to smile is the fact that the Springboks have managed an average of 4.3 tries a game against England in the past ten years. It remains one of the greatest achievements ever by a Springbok side.

So why should South African fans feel sad about this? That winning streak will end come November.

England are now the second best team in the world, and they deserve some recognition after rising above the struggles of 2015, but credit aside, the reality of the matter is that, at present, South Africa is a rubbish rugby team.

The Kiwi and Springbok relationship
The second piece of news that should make South Africans feel all warm and fuzzy inside is that New Zealand still loves us.

Some would say that this is a stupid reason to be happy, but at this point, we should take everything that we can get. If we should scrape the bottom of the barrel, then a healthy dose of Kiwi love should make us all feel a bit better.

While Australia-New Zealand relations are at an all-time low because of angry coaches, alleged arrogance and disrespect, disallowed tries, Richetty Grubs and Pennywise clown faces, the South Africa-New Zealand rivalry – which isn’t a rivalry anymore – is still going strong.

No grubs or clowns here. All Blacks coach Steve Hansen still gets tears in his eyes when he speaks of the Springbok and has even told the South African media off when he said that we should be patient with the Springboks.

The All Blacks and the Springboks even teamed up for charity when they helped out at the LIV Village. George Moala buddied up with Juan de Jongh, Brodie Retallick with Eben Etzebeth, Sam Whitelock with Pieter-Steph du Toit, Patrick Tuipulotu with Tendai Mtawarira and so on.

While it’s beautiful to see two teams in World Rugby displaying the utmost respect for each other, it’s not good to see the touted greatest rivalry in the world brought down to a 57-15 thrashing for either one of those teams.


By all means, the beers and the lifts and the collaboration in charity work are exactly what rugby as a game traditionally stands for, but rugby is also a competitive sport and these young Boks provide little to no competition for a team that once carried the real fear of losing against them.

Whatever tears All Blacks captain Steve Hansen has in his eyes when talking about us before and after the game completely disappears come match day. You would think always being nice to us would translate in some mercy for our boys. But no. The All Blacks offer no respite even when it is begged for.

We love New Zealand and New Zealand, loves us but unfortunately, we can be sad because they don’t love us enough to let us win.

Statistical anomaly
The Springboks have won four of their nine games this season while both the Wallabies and the Pumas sit at three from nine and three from ten respectively.

South Africa beat Ireland twice, the Pumas once and the Wallabies once this year, all of which were home victories.

The Wallabies have beaten the Pumas twice and the Springboks once while the Pumas have beaten Italy once, France once and the Springboks once. That means the Springboks, with a winning ratio of 44 per cent are a stronger outfit than Australia and Argentina who have winning percentages of 30 and 33 respectively.

The only mystery of these stats remains how the Springboks managed it when both Australia and Argentina genuinely look like better teams at the moment.

I hate to be a pessimist, but the Springboks will most likely lose two of their three games on the November tour while Argentina and Australia could realistically bounce back.

In week one of the end of year tour, Argentina should beat Japan while Australia has shown enough progress despite losing to suggest that they have a real shot against Wales. The Springboks will attempt to take things easy with a friendly against the Barbarians, but they’ll most likely lose anyway.

Week two is where things might get hairy. Argentina is a big chance against Wales after pushing the All Blacks recently. Although Scotland has a point to prove against Australia, the Wallabies should run out victors and it’s likely that England will trounce the Boks.

Week three’s toughest call might be the Springboks versus Italy game. Japan orchestrated a shock victory in 2015 and there’s every chance Italy could follow suit. Australia will face France, and that is also tight to call, but I’d give it to the Wallabies. I truly believe Argentina has Scotland’s number.

Week four will be South Africa’s last contribution against Wales, who will be looking for revenge against the Springboks for last year’s World Cup exit. Based on current form that will be Wales’ game. Argentina will most likely lose against England while the Wallabies lock horns with the French Barbarians.

The point remains that if South Africa suffer expected losses against England and Wales, they will end the season with a win ratio of 41 per cent. Both Australia and Argentina can certainly surpass that.

Allister Coetzee and the Currie Cup
The Cheetahs have been crowned Currie Cup Champions in an unbeaten run that saw them destroy the Lions in the semi-final (55-17) and claim the premiership by defeating the Bulls 36-16. It is a fantastic result for a province that has fallen on hard times, and against all the odds, Coetzee’s awarded some players for form.

Newcomers Francois Venter, Sergeal Peterson, Roelof Smith and Jean-Luc du Preez have been included in the squad for the Tests against England, Italy, and Wales. Rohan Janse van Rensburg, Jamba Ulengo, Lizo Gqoboka, Thomas du Toit, RG Snyman, Uzzair Cassiem, Tian Schoeman and Cheslin Kolbe will only be considered for the game against the Barbarians first up.

The introduction of fresh blood is exactly what the Springboks need, but the problem is Coetzee’s match day selections will most likely still be poor.

It’s unlikely Coetzee, for example, will select Sergeal Peterson against England or Wales due to his lack of Test experience. He might get a run against Italy though, depending on how the England game goes.

Jean-Luc du Preez of the Sharks probably won’t be selected over either Oupa Mohoje in the starting lineup or over Willem Alberts on the bench. Roelof Smith and Francois Venter might have a real shot, but both Jaco Kriel and Lionel Mapoe stand in their way, so a bench capacity might be all they’re looking at.

But you never know with Coetzee at the helm. His selections have been everything but predictable. In the Rugby Championship, he selected a scrum-half at wing (Francois Hougaard), a fly-half at fullback (Patrick Lambie), an outside centre at inside centre (Juan de Jongh), a fullback at outside centre (Jesse Kriel) and a left wing on the right wing (Bryan Habana). It’s confusing, but perhaps it can confuse the opposition.

What do you think Roarers? Should South Africans be happy or sad leading into the end-of-year test matches?


JW
Just_winCaptain18,570 posts
29 Oct 2016, 18:51
#2
29 Oct 2016, 18:51#2
 Poms will be a tough game for the Boks, it would give me great pleasure to see the Boks prove me wrong but I think Eddie will prevail.
Boks fans should be happy because the Kiwi fans and the ABs love them True I have not heard kiwis taking much pleasure in the current troubles of the Boks but it may be a bit rich to say Bok fans should feel happy about this. I'm sure they would rather have a few more wins. Coetzee as the coach, he is a mixed bag & we will see how he does on this tour. Boks have to have some wins & show a sense of direction in terms of strategy and player selection. We will see.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
29 Oct 2016, 20:08
#3
29 Oct 2016, 20:08#3
Just warched the CC final......the standard of play is concerning.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
29 Oct 2016, 20:13
#4
29 Oct 2016, 20:13#4
 Sure it is in your book concerning - there were too many facets where balls were kept in hand and not kicked away aimlessly as per the Jake-balling you so strongly support.



QU
quacky96Club Pro196 posts
29 Oct 2016, 20:58
#5
29 Oct 2016, 20:58#5
Mozart must be high or something...I think he watched the SAvNZ game again thinking it was the CC final!
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
29 Oct 2016, 23:57
#6
29 Oct 2016, 23:57#6
No I watched a game where by the second phase the defensive lines of both teams were in disarray going back to the very first move in the match. Classic stuff....great running rugby through gaps you could drive a truck through. The result a bunch of new flavour of the day players are promoted.....only to fail when they meet a real defence. The Cheetahs played well on attack, and Rhule was dangerous with the ball....they deserved to win. But it shouldnt be confused with real rugby.
WA
WardadPro6,663 posts
30 Oct 2016, 04:05
#7
30 Oct 2016, 04:05#7
 Must be handy to play all your home games at one venue like the Poms do ,unlike SH sides who like to spread the luuurve ! Should have been pointed out to the poms when they snarkily said that other countries should build bigger stadiums ,pretty easy when you only have one venue to build .One major factor in the ABs success has to be the selections ,I know the Boks have it harder with the quota bizzo but even within that framework there seems to be a lot of contentious selections.Bit hard on us Kiwis not being able to p!ss and moan about player X,Y,Z not being selected instead of players A,B or C!
CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
30 Oct 2016, 08:17
#8
30 Oct 2016, 08:17#8
 He probably watched a netball match and thought it was rugby.
That's where the poor fools been going wrong all these years.
Just a word of advice, Mozart ... doubling up on your meds isn't going to help you get better any sooner.


  
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
30 Oct 2016, 08:59
#9
30 Oct 2016, 08:59#9
Mozart 
What in your book is real rugby - is it Jake-ball or what?   Is keeping ball in hand and scoring of tries still in your book major sins in rugby?   Is defense all a backline is there for?    Is ball-hogging and crashballing the only game in town? 
Is aimless kicking still in your book a real requirement?
What you have advertised on tis site is real rugby is why Japan beat the Springboks last year.    A bit of thinking rugby killed the Springboks - Jones said it and Hansen said that some of your favourite players are 100% predictable - what can be worse rugby?    
     
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
30 Oct 2016, 19:55
#10
30 Oct 2016, 19:55#10
Well real rugby is certainly not a bunch of young newbies losing 5 out of 9 tests this year, 4 of those 5 losses coming in tests we were trying to play "expansive" rugby. I told you this year was going to be a disaster, but naive chaps like you and Carbuncle told me I was dead wrong. Sadly I was dead right. We had a team of so called fossils in 2014 which scored 12 tries in 6 RC tests. In 2015 we scored 9 tries in 4 RC tests. In 2016 with our new 'expansive' approach we score a third less, 8 tries in 6 RC tests. If you look at most Bok test tries in the last 10 years they originate from turnover ball, not phase play. Changing that is a fool's errand...but then again you and Carbuncle are fools. Belligerent rugby morons.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
31 Oct 2016, 00:42
#11
31 Oct 2016, 00:42#11

Look BSter I did not say that  this year was not a disaster - unlike you who never admitted that  the EOYT of 2014 and the whole scenario of 2015 were in fact disasters.    I said that the real disaster has been the appointment of Coetzee and his selections - more than anything else.    What I did say is that in comparison with the 2015 test record  the performances of the Springboks  in 2016 other than the case of the AB’s  the performances in 2015 was no worse than in 2015,   The lies on your part never stops.

So  lets evaluate the rest of your BS.

The story of the five losses out of nine tests played is a fabrication.  Other than the last ten minutes of the second test against the Irish there was no expansive rugby played by the Springboks in the five lost tests in 2016.   The four lost tests you referred to were all lost because  of playing Jakle-ball –  definitely not playing rugby at all.  That was admitted even during the recent indaba by rugby representatives, who clearly decided that the disastrous playing style of Coetzee needs to be changed.       

There were NO four RC tests played in 2015 - the second test played in Argentina was NOT part of the RC - that is the first point extensively discussed earlier on this site, but the lie is continuing,   SA played in three RC tests in 2015 and lost in all three.     

There was  no expansive approach in any tests played in 2016 as stated by you.    This is in fact merely a repeat  of the Mozart myth already dealt with.    The story about the best tries over the last ten years is equally interesting.    Lets face facts – the turnover story is BS.    SA is notorious for not being able to affect as many turnovers as their opponents since their breakdown protection and recovery are  normally poor,   It was poor this year – but no worse than under Meyer and  De Villiers.   Scoring tries from turnovers is in the main only possible if it is followed by keeping ball in hand.        

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
31 Oct 2016, 00:53
#12
31 Oct 2016, 00:53#12
 Well let me stop you right there......lets exclude the AB games in NZ. In that case in 2016 we score 8 tries in 5 tests....in 2015 we score 8 tries in 3 tests. The same number of tries in 60% of the playing time.....case closed, no need the drone on in your boring way. And exclude the Salta test if you wish that makes 6 tries in 2 tests in 2015 vs 8 tries in 5 tests in 2015...divide to get the answer, if indeed you can divide.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
31 Oct 2016, 02:11
#13
31 Oct 2016, 02:11#13
 Mozart
Let get this straight - when the issue of serious deficiency in try-scoring this tear was discussed - your comments on that deficiency was never really indicative of your support that try0scirub us the real objective of the game. 
When after the Aussie win test in Pretoria was discussed it was clear from your comments that try-scoring in that test was not an issue at  all.    In that test there never was a threat about the Springboks scoring a try - something not expected to happen in any event with the Morne Steyn at 10 and De Jongh at 12 combination.
The classic De Jongh comments by you are just indicative of your ignorance,   He was according to you in the Aussie test organizing the defense - what you failed to admit that in the process be missed nearly half of his tackles and in the AB test you left his name out of your list of players who missed more than one tackle.   Your subsequent excuse was also BS.  Before you published your list I wrote a thread giving the real missed tackle ratio's and De Jongh missed 30% of his tackles in that test -   7 tackles made and 3 missed.    
When the issue of Goosen scoring tries and assisting in scoring tries was discussed  you never once admitted that try-scoring was an asset.  
Now suddenly the over-riding issue is the scoring of tries,  but you still have it wrong.   The 6 tries was scored in 3 tests - not two - last year and the majority of those six tries were scored by the players you constantly denigrate.    And the two tests in which the Springboks scored no tries were not dealt with by you in any event.   Your hero Morne was the flyhalf and with him in that position any backline is dysfunctional.
However, there is another issue that I would like to comment on as well.   When teams keep the ball in hand and attack with comprehensive rugby it is very difficult to defend in that case.   The AB tests should be a clear indication about that issue,   When the same thing happened in the CC final and the Cheetahs played  a ball in hand game - it according to you was poor rugby.  
My advice to you is to stick to Jake-ball - it is the only format you understand - hence your support of duds like Fat Fransie and Morne.         
  
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
31 Oct 2016, 03:04
#14
31 Oct 2016, 03:04#14
Look its quite simple, no need to write a book. You made a point about try scoring, I simply showed the Neanderthal' playing style of HM with all the old fossils produces more tries per game than the expansive style with flavour of the day players. Which is no surprise to those of us who understand the game.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
31 Oct 2016, 07:36
#15
31 Oct 2016, 07:36#15
 Mozart
Stop writing BS.  There was NO expansive game this year under Coetzee.   If there was it must have been in your imagination only.     
PA
PakieCaptain17,321 posts
01 Nov 2016, 11:30
#16
01 Nov 2016, 11:30#16
Before you published your list I wrote a thread giving the real missed tackle ratio's and De Jongh missed 30% of his tackles in that test -   7 tackles made and 3 missed.   
Well Mike, I see you again have your mouth full of calling other people liars on this board. Yet here you are, repeating yet another one of your endless string of lies even after I corrected you the first time you tried to sell it.
De Jongh made 12, missed 3. Not 7/3, like you just lied for the second time. 

DA
Devil's AdvocatePro7,008 posts
01 Nov 2016, 11:53
#17
01 Nov 2016, 11:53#17

As per usual.... Pakie comes along to set the record straight


Mike, you should know by now that fabricating stats to discredit a player does not bode well for you.... when Pakie is in the house  

CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
01 Nov 2016, 13:01
#18
01 Nov 2016, 13:01#18
 Aaaaaaaaaaaah ... the man of integrity comes along and sides with another to gang up on Mike.
The big brave Dumb Ass.
How awesome it must be to know you!!



RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
01 Nov 2016, 13:24
#19
01 Nov 2016, 13:24#19
". . . the man of integrity comes along and sides with another to gang up on Mike."

Yes, I wonder how many more they need to take on ou Maaik?

I learned a very, very long time ago that there is nothing (and I mean nothing) you can do or say to change ou Maaik's mind on any subject so I gave up trying and instead now I just have a laugh at his single-minded bias while appreciating him for his rugby passion and the invaluable contribution he makes to Fantasy and Prediction competitions on this board.

Seems Moffie and his Gimps have yet to cotton on to this very basic fact about ou Maaik and they're at him day and night like a pack of attack dogs, ridiculing him, belittling him, mocking him and calling him names while he just swats them away, sending them and all their stats, reasoning and logic into orbit.



You go ou Maaik!
DA
Devil's AdvocatePro7,008 posts
01 Nov 2016, 13:39
#20
01 Nov 2016, 13:39#20
CleanCut

Status: Rugby Legend
Posts: 4574 RE: Here’s why Springboks fans should be both happy and sad; By Armand van Zyl. the ROAR
November 01, 2016, 13:01:05

 

Aaaaaaaaaaaah ... the man of integrity comes along and sides with another to gang up on Mike.
The big brave Dumb Ass.
How awesome it must be to know you!!


Well, it would be nothing unusual for you, as we all know by now.... you know.... openly supporting someone who is dishonest, deceitful etc etc.... because you know, that is a sure sign of integrity


I have challenged Mike before over his blatant misrepresentation of stats or facts, as have many many others on here.


So go ahead CC, do what you are so good at, support the liars on here.


Eish, you sure seem to believe you have a lot of that integrity going on..... LMFAO 


What a real man you are.... your moral and ethical compass changes direction on every topic, every hour.


LMAO



DA
Devil's AdvocatePro7,008 posts
01 Nov 2016, 13:41
#21
01 Nov 2016, 13:41#21

I smaak it


P!ss Mint always professes to never give a sh!t about certain posters on here, but will post long and time consuming posts on here about those exact same individuals.....


Too funny 

RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
01 Nov 2016, 13:45
#22
01 Nov 2016, 13:45#22
"LMFAO", "LMAO"

The funniest thing about Dumb Ass isn't his self-righteous finger-pointing, his class-monitor style "telling-on" threats or his admittedly scary obsession with me and everything I've ever said on the internet . . . the funniest thing about Dumb Ass is the fact that he expects people to believe he's having a little laugh when we all know he is almost exploding in a purple-faced fit of rage!

LMAO (For Real!)
DA
Devil's AdvocatePro7,008 posts
01 Nov 2016, 13:48
#23
01 Nov 2016, 13:48#23

So two posts were made by individuals that Denny independently destroyed in separate chess challenges......


Look at how they almost beg to get a chance to play him again.......


That loss is eating you up CC..... it's clear as mud


It's so obvious in your posts, you must be losing sleep..... shame

 
DA
Devil's AdvocatePro7,008 posts
01 Nov 2016, 13:51
#24
01 Nov 2016, 13:51#24
Rooinek

Status: Rugby Legend
Posts: 4190 RE: Here’s why Springboks fans should be both happy and sad; By Armand van Zyl. the ROAR
November 01, 2016, 13:45:14

"LMFAO", "LMAO"

The funniest thing about Dumb Ass isn't his self-righteous finger-pointing, his class-monitor style "telling-on" threats or his admittedly scary obsession with me and everything I've ever said on the internet . . . the funniest thing about Dumb Ass is the fact that he expects people to believe he's having a little laugh when we all know he is almost exploding in a purple-faced fit of rage!

LMAO (For Real!)

 

After so easily showing you and CC up for the complete moronic idiots you both are, in these last few days, trust me, I'm having a ball with you two.


It's been fun... and it still is


Long may it continue


LMFAO




MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
01 Nov 2016, 17:48
#25
01 Nov 2016, 17:48#25
So not telling the truth is a virtue, forgiven no actually promoted under the heading of 'passion'. The passion of the 3 barking dogs....CC who wants the Boks to lose, Oom Tokkie who always predicts the Boks will lose....notably this year in the Aussie test at Loftus, and the snide Rooiurinal who still cant accept our WC victory under Jake. If that's passion I'll take a pass.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
01 Nov 2016, 19:03
#26
01 Nov 2016, 19:03#26
 I never said anywhere that I do not accept the 2007 world cup win and any statement to the contrary by Mozart is a lie.
I also said that I was for White's retention as coach at the time and found his dismissal inappropriate,   However, his case was influenced subsequently on behalf of Meyer by the Northern Bulls supported by the Cheetahs.
I was however, shocked about what White did as coach of the Sharks and the way he wanted to play rugby based on a seriously defective and out-dated game plan and the relationship problems he caused at the Sharks.   That is why he was effectively fired by the Sharks.
I was not impressed by the Pretoria win that I thought would not happen.   My main reservations about the game was clear.   The Springboks scored no tries (they never threatened to score a try) and the Wallabies lost because of their own indiscipline through penalty kicks.  
That type of game can ultimately not win matches and it is clear that Coetzee wants to have the Springboks play Jake-ball and not rugby.            
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
01 Nov 2016, 19:22
#27
01 Nov 2016, 19:22#27
Are you now Rooiurinal to add to your other faults? As for the fairy story about HM tanking JW, HM came 4 years later, Inconvenient I know but Indisputable.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
01 Nov 2016, 21:16
#28
01 Nov 2016, 21:16#28
 Mozart
You never followed the White replacement reports now did you.   The Bulls and Cheetahs ganged up together with the Cheeky Watson crowd to get rid of White = when they got majority support for the White decision the issue of replacement came up and Meyer and De Villiers was nominated.   That caused for De Villiers getting 17 votes as against 16 for Meyer.
Some of the Unions who was with Jake White on the issue - got sick and tired of the Bulls shenanigans voted against Meyer.   Since De Villiers made a bugger-up of the job and was fully controlled by the senior players and in desperation they turned to Meyer.
That also turned to ultimately let down of  SA Rugby - Meyer put a brake on squad development and  rugby development as a whole by a crazy out-dated game plan.  His team selection ultimately resulted in a loss against JAPAN.    That was the lowest point ever in the history of SA Rugby.   
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
01 Nov 2016, 23:08
#29
01 Nov 2016, 23:08#29
 Actually White was fired on a technicality.....he never re-applied within the stipulated time frame, less than 10 days after he won the WC for South Africa.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
01 Nov 2016, 23:21
#30
01 Nov 2016, 23:21#30
 If you believe that you will also believe the moon is made of green cheese.    White refused to apply when the post was advertised - but he believed that he did not need to.
However, he realized that it would serve no would not get appointed because the majority of the SARU members did not want him.   He actually was right - when it was proposed by WP that he be re-appointed the proposal was rejected.
The whole scenario was set up by the Bulls, Cheetahs and Cheeky Watsons crowd who did not want White at all.    There was no question that the Bulls wanted Meyer to be th e coach - and then the scenario as described above resulted.  
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
01 Nov 2016, 23:35
#31
01 Nov 2016, 23:35#31
You never know how the votes will fall until you test it with a live vote....Jake never had a shot because the Bureaucrats at Saru found a technicality to disqualify him. A technicality he bitterly disputed. That changed it from Jake being part of the consideration set, to Jake having to be re-admitted against the supposed rules that had been set. A much more difficult task when you have factions that are against you. This was engineered by Saru who wanted a quota coach. All the other bs is bar room talk.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
02 Nov 2016, 05:36
#32
02 Nov 2016, 05:36#32
 Mozart ot as not barroom talk as you say.   Watson wants to have White out and so did the Bulls and the Cheetahs.   The latter two unions happened to be the chief organizers of the Anti-White campaign - they wanted Meyer as coach.   If the latter was not the case White would have survived.
However, when they formally put up Meyer as candidate he lost the ballot since some of the provinces was sick and tired of their shenanigans.    That whole story came out in the newspapers at the time. 
However, that is spilt milk and White's subsequent conduct at the Sharks and his effective firing by them ruined his chances of coaching the Springboks.
That does not take away from the fact that both De Villiers and Meyer were bad news for different reasons.   It may be argued that White would have been an improvement on his two successors, but White stuck to the Jake-ball game and that  would have caused similar disasters for the Springboks.                 
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
02 Nov 2016, 06:30
#33
02 Nov 2016, 06:30#33
Yadi yadi yada.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
02 Nov 2016, 07:20
#34
02 Nov 2016, 07:20#34
 Hit for another 6 and the response is comical
KI
KiwinOzNewbie3 posts
02 Nov 2016, 08:22
#35
02 Nov 2016, 08:22#35
Does anyone know a good live streaming site for the Chicago game all blacks and Ireland.  Bloody Foxtel not playing any of the games in oz.  cheers
— END OF THREAD —

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