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FORUM / RUGBY /  How different the Bok side is to mine

How different the Bok side is to mine

Started by Saffolk 18 REPLIES1,821 VIEWS· 18 Oct 2019, 21:23
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SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
18 Oct 2019, 21:23
#1
18 Oct 2019, 21:23#1
I’d have gone with Rassie’s choice at 15 with Willie and Gelant as backup. My wings would have been Nkosi and Dyanti but given the Dyanti demise I probably would have gone with Duhan vd Merwe Rassie’s choice of Kolbe has been brilliant and certainly trumps my call My centres would have been Serfontein and Kriel. I’m not sure how injured Serfontein is so given it’s a close call between de Allende and Serfontein, I’m more than happy with Rassie’s choice at 12. I rate Am and would have included Janse v Rensburg in my squad. I’m with Rassie at 9 & 10 including the back ups in Elton, Reinach and Jantjies At loosehead Kitshoff walks it with Pierre Schoeman as backup. Marx at 2 regardless of a slight dip in form. Bongi is a great backup. Wilco Louw is my obvious choice at 3, why Rassie selected him and then lost faith is beyond me. The guy is a rock. Nyakane and Malherbe are good. Locks are hard to choose when it comes to Eben’s partner, which includes PSDT at lock. Tough call between PSDT, RG and Lood. I’d go with the most talented being RG At 6 it would be Kolisi or Jaco Kriel, Id go with Kolisi. At 7 it would be between JL du Preez and Jacques du Plessis, with the bigger du Plessis getting my call At 8 it would have been Marcel Coetzee or Dan du Preez, with Marcel pipping it but only just. Rassie’s call of Vermeulen has been solid and physical so no complaints there My side: 15. Willie 14. Nkosi 13. Kriel 12. Serfontein 11. Duhan vd Merwe 9. Faf 1. Kitshoff 2. Marx 3. Louw 4. Etzebeth 5. Snyman 6. Kolisi 7. du Plessis 8. Coetzee That’s 9 different calls - only Kolbe trumps my original choice and I’d certainly pick him now ahead of vd Merwe
SH
sharkbokCaptain23,217 posts
18 Oct 2019, 21:28
#2
18 Oct 2019, 21:28#2
Only 2 non-white players would not meet strategic transformation nation-building objectives...
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
18 Oct 2019, 21:54
#3
18 Oct 2019, 21:54#3
I’m happy to fail in that department Shark!!
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
18 Oct 2019, 23:17
#4
18 Oct 2019, 23:17#4

Stepfontein and Coetzee are nothing and always were nothing. Beast is a far, far better scrummager than Kitshoff....that's why he is in the team. Deysel twins are just great lumps of beef, with tiny brains in their tiny heads.


But I agree on Wilco and Snyman.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
19 Oct 2019, 00:02
#5
19 Oct 2019, 00:02#5
Bullshit Serfontein is a class act who keeps useless Frans on the bench at Montpellier It’s absolute rubbish that Beast is a better scrummager than Kitshoff never has been never will be. Kitshoff made pool team of WC, Beast never got a mention - politics dictates None of the loosies selected have the brute strength that the du Preez twins have and Marcel has been huge in the last year for Ulster as he was last weekend again. Dan du Preez outplayed Vermeulen most weeks in Super rugby and has just made the English club team of the week 2 weeks in a row These 3 are far superior to Rassie’s selections especially your mate Louw who is utterly useless My side is better than Rassie’s as it has a creative 12, one of the best 13’s in the game, a real tighthead and some balance in the loosies instead of a lock at 7 and an old man at 8 and a waste of space coming off the bench
SH
sharkbokCaptain23,217 posts
19 Oct 2019, 00:38
#6
19 Oct 2019, 00:38#6
It would have been good to have seen Serfontein play under John Mitchell at the Bulls. Kriel certainly improved his game as a specialist outside center in the one season with Mitchell.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
19 Oct 2019, 00:39
#7
19 Oct 2019, 00:39#7

Your sides are always better.....except when you look back in  history, and you see how they did. Here's a typical Dave team:

Kirchner.

Mvovo.

JJ.

Vorster/Meisiekind.

Taute.

Lambie/Goosen/Swiel.

Hougaard at 9.

Marcel van der Merwe.

Chilli Boy.

Coenie/Greyling

Flip

Quince.

Watson/Kolisi

Deysel.

Strauss.


..........

All of these guys were class acts at one point.....er...in your books. And here's the thing, Stepfontein, the Deysel twins, Lomp, Coetzee are just more of the same.


Stick with moz 





SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
19 Oct 2019, 01:24
#8
19 Oct 2019, 01:24#8
No Moz you are speaking rubbish - my chosen 15 have never taken the field as a team so it would be impossible to judge them. As for the list let’s set the record straight Kitchner was a good player but never my first choice Never had much to say about Mvovo you have me confused with someone else. In his youth he was good but probably 6th choice JJ was very good when he was a Bok comprehensively outplaying Smith - but ii acknowledged he lacked the hard edge hence not lasting - a bit of a Pierre Spies. You loved Jacobs - enough said Big fan of Vorster - I see what Will Greenwood (great rugby brain on Sky) does. An inside centre with brains - runs great lines.....a more gifted Crotty Would definitely have won a few Bok caps if I was coach. Olivier was very good stand by him big time but never ahead of Jean or Frans back then. Taute had a good few caps at 13, good player where injury got in the way Lambie and Goosen were both class acts. Swiel was brilliant at school a complete failure as a pro and I said as much Hougaard at 9 has been one of our best 9’s. Brilliant attacking 9 never a wing. No worse a service than Faf or Reinach Marcel vd Merwe was very good another Wilco Louw. Hell you used to like useless BJ Botha - enough said Coenie was one of our best loved him in his prime. Greyling and Chiliboy - nope thats nonsense - never rated them you have me confused with someone else again Flip was very good - big grunt lock Quinn never smelt any of my sides Watson was a class act, Kolisi is world class Deysel is another Greyling, Chiliboy and Mvovo - confusion reigns - not me Joss Strauss great player and brilliant leader who has won many caps for Scotland. Never a first choice of mine
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
19 Oct 2019, 04:58
#9
19 Oct 2019, 04:58#9

Point is  Dave we  all have likes and dislikes. Eraser has chosen a team close to the consensus view....I wouldn't start several of these players, but the proof is  in the result. And despite one's reservations I hope he is right.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
19 Oct 2019, 08:26
#10
19 Oct 2019, 08:26#10
Agreed and most of Rassie’s selections are good - they might not be my first choices but they are close - I can live with that
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
19 Oct 2019, 09:06
#11
19 Oct 2019, 09:06#11

Dave

I prefer Willemse to Gelant and Steyn.   He is the future and is at this stage already twice the player Steyn is at present.   Anyway I also prefer Serfontein to Steyn.

As to the issue of the loosies I always worry about two issues - namely pace and ball sense,  That is why I prefer Du Toit as a 7 to some of the players you listed,  

You will remember how bad Meyer's selections became an abomination with at least 8 unplayable players in the WC squad in 2015.  You may remember how Mozart supported all 8 duds and moaned about players like De Allende, Kriel, Du Toit and De Jager then and still moans about them at present,  It was even clear that talented players lost their mojo when Meyer was coach.  Some players improved massively when playing in NH clubs - some deteriorated.   

De Allende is going north after the WC and I am sure he is going to do well - he is already much better with Erasmus as coach than he was with Meyer and Coetzee.  

Whenever anybody suggest players Mozart would immediately starts to find fault with them without even never seeing them playing  before and if they made very good performances would discover deficiencies to falsely blamed them for problems.  

On the whole some players listed by you  some have gone off form - but then at the time they did were better than they are at present.       

 

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
19 Oct 2019, 16:29
#12
19 Oct 2019, 16:29#12
I like Gelant especially when he sticks to attacking and not kicking Big fan of Willemse but I’m not sure what his best position is
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
19 Oct 2019, 19:21
#13
19 Oct 2019, 19:21#13

Still think he might be used at flyhalf  in the Super Rugby series next year and we will then get a clearer idea where he will be used in future.  

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
19 Oct 2019, 19:26
#14
19 Oct 2019, 19:26#14
Makes sense that they use him there as du Plessis was very disappointing
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
12 Oct 2024, 00:07
#15
12 Oct 2024, 00:07#15

Dave here is proof ….just before the RWC 2019 finals….you wouldn’t even have picked Dud Toit or Dud Allende. So you too have only recognized Dud Toit as a flank after the WC final in 2019.

How embarrassing, you wouldn’t have chosen either Dud, Kolbe, the Beast, Am or Vermeulen the MOM in the WC final.

Let this be the final chapter of you as a selector…you are hopeless.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
12 Oct 2024, 09:57
#16
12 Oct 2024, 09:57#16
Um hellooooo that was 5 years ago - PSDT had hardly played any games at 7 so I still saw him as a 5 Was always a big Serfontein fan so can see why I wanted him 5 years ago But a few months on from the WC I would have certainly changed my mind on PSDT at 7 and DA at 12 It’s not like a did not rate them back then now is it Moz up your game man - for fuck sake that was 5 years ago
BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
12 Oct 2024, 12:45
#17
12 Oct 2024, 12:45#17

Had poor Mozzietard changed his mind about Du Toit, Allende and Rassie he would not have lost his credibility. 

There are other issues where he has been proven to be drastically wrong but he can't change his stand.  It's hilarious to observe! 



MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
12 Oct 2024, 15:59
#18
12 Oct 2024, 15:59#18

What nonsense….here is Dud Toit’s  first Bok game as a starter:

19 Sep 201523FlankJapan

And he was bloody awful in that game. He started  on the flank 18 times before WC 2019 and at lock 12 times. Clearly you wanted to play him as a lock.

Dud was more or less useless before Harrassmiss gave him first tackler role in the 2019 WC final. You obviously agreed with that observation.

Dud Allende has remained useless, Dud Toit has become effective in an unconventional narrow role. Which works as long as others do the hard work on the deck.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
12 Oct 2024, 19:17
#19
12 Oct 2024, 19:17#19

Who was supposed to play and selected by Meyer in that match as no 7?    Du Toit was informed of Fat Alberts cannot play because he had a fat tear half an hour before tha match,  Did no play at 7 for three yeaars before that.    So talking shit again.   .

    

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