SHSharky54
Club Pro247 posts
SHSharky54Club Pro247 posts
17 Nov 2014, 20:21#3
JP Pietersen sucks. He has had his time I think.
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
17 Nov 2014, 20:25#4
Take all the time you need. While you are at it though, you might check Jean and Step on the interception try. Jean doesn't hit the accelerator when Step does, he has to register the switch in possession. But by the time the try line is reached he has not only closed the gap by two or so paces....he has moved laterally to Steppie's other side, to protect the runner. To me it looks like old man Jean would be about 5 metres faster over the 100.
Thanks for introducing this interesting theme.
BIbiltongbek
Club Pro749 posts
BIbiltongbekClub Pro749 posts
17 Nov 2014, 20:26#5
No, I mean a time on the game clock, when it happened
SHSharky54
Club Pro247 posts
SHSharky54Club Pro247 posts
17 Nov 2014, 20:27#6
Cobus Reinach will be about 5 steps quicker over the 100 than either one of them.
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
17 Nov 2014, 20:40#7
Hell Biltong it happened one second before Farrell gassed JP. I have to disagree Sharkie, Reinach would be 5 metres faster than Jean and 10 metres faster than Step. He is our fastest back, maybe about equivalent with Hendriks. Is he a pressure scrum half though....I remain unconvinced.
AGAgPleezDeddy
Club Pro900 posts
AGAgPleezDeddyClub Pro900 posts
17 Nov 2014, 21:07#8
I'm inclined to agree with Biltong insofar as his stance on JP. I think JP has had a long, successful springbok career but the pace drop in him has been surprising. Unfortunately it looks like Habana has dropped some speed too, so going into a match with him and JP may not be too wise.
I'll hold my hands up and say that until recently I had JP down as my first choice 14 but I don't he has it in him anymore. Hendriks is someone who gives us a great edge in attack, and also would love to see Senatla given a chance.
SHSharky54
Club Pro247 posts
SHSharky54Club Pro247 posts
17 Nov 2014, 21:11#9
Are we talking about pace or something else ?
Jean De Villiers would look like a forward chasing a back in that race....
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
17 Nov 2014, 21:16#10
Mozart
The issue s how slow was Jp - he was slow - he was behind Serfontein when the latter followied up the ball - so he was slower than Serfontein.
Your assumption foteh speed of Jean de illiers based on the try ofserfontein is not suibstantoiated by fact - but another Mozart fiction - "To me it looks like...." is just another sample of Mozart's prejudiced garbage - totally unproved by fact.
Nothing will ever convince you that reinach is a good scrummie. Unfortunately you have been writing rubbish on this site about him endlessly and now you are too block-headed to relize you were wrong.
SHSharky54
Club Pro247 posts
SHSharky54Club Pro247 posts
17 Nov 2014, 21:20#11
Jean De Villiers is (or rather was) deceptively quick. I recall him chasing down Lwazi Mvovo which came as an extreme surprise to me.
How much of that pace the old dog still has, who knows. None of us have the 100 meter sprint times for the team.
One thing I can tell you though - even without those number is that De Villiers is getting to the point where he might be one of the slowest backs in the team. Unfortunately no matter the quality of the player, pace does start to impact. We saw that with Butch James too. Still had the game in his head, but the body would not cooperate. Slower than most modern loose forwards = time to go.
AGAgPleezDeddy
Club Pro900 posts
AGAgPleezDeddyClub Pro900 posts
17 Nov 2014, 21:31#12
Yes Sharky54, I remember something that said in the official stormers mag that had JDV's speed at 4.8 seconds over 40 m, which was 0.03 seconds quicker than Gio Aplon and only 0.03 seconds slower than Habana, who at the time was the quickest Stormers player!
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
17 Nov 2014, 21:44#13
Assertions Sharkie...look at the incident. Jean is way faster than Steppie.
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
17 Nov 2014, 21:48#14
As far as the wings go, I think our next shot at a great wing is Senatla. A bit smaller than Terry Thomas, he has the same kind of explosiveness. And he seems sturdy enough to take the contact. Hendricks is great on attack but his bottle outs against Savea and the Irish were pretty bad. Mvovo has never performed against top opposition. we seem to be horribly short of top class wings and centres.
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
17 Nov 2014, 22:23#16
I agree with that. I'd rather see Senatla get a shot. We won the 2007 RWC because of our pack, and because Habana was the most dangerous long strike threat at the tournament. Senatla could be that player in 2015.
SASaffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SASaffolk Captain30,741 posts
17 Nov 2014, 22:24#17
Um Moz.....Jan was jogging on his way to scoring his try.......once he knew he was clear which was seconds after his intercept he strolled to the try line....Geeeez
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
17 Nov 2014, 22:48#18
He was flat out till about 10 metres from the line....and appropriately so. And I suppose he was jogging when chasing Farrell.
SASaffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SASaffolk Captain30,741 posts
17 Nov 2014, 22:51#19
Rubbish he was jogging for most of his trip to the try line and that is a fact. He had no one chasing him.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
17 Nov 2014, 22:58#20
Mozart
The way Serfontein looked around and raised his hand at the 22 indicate he was not running flat out. That assumprion was countermanded by the video itself. A player would not run flat out doing that.
By the way the heading of the thread refers to JP - but there is zero discussion about you on the JP pace issue here - it is all about Serfontein?. Coming from you - should the heading not have been "How slow is Serfontein"?
SASaffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SASaffolk Captain30,741 posts
17 Nov 2014, 23:01#21
Exactly, he stopped sprinting soon after taking the ball after he realised he was in t he clear
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
17 Nov 2014, 23:02#22
Jogging look back of his shoulder? Just looked at it again, he was flat out at least till he raised his hand about 15 metres out....and I see little signs of slowing even after that. You just think he is jogging, that's max pace.
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
17 Nov 2014, 23:04#23
Esterhuizen? Are you in your cups again OOm?
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
17 Nov 2014, 23:11#24
How slow is Serfontein --since all you discussed relates to Serfontein - not a word about JP. Sorry I do not kow what wade me write Esterhuizen in this case. I merely referred to the fact that you used the wrong heading for the topic.
By the way did you - or did you not - write at one stage that there is nothing worng with Pietersen's pace. I believe you did make a statement to that effect when I pointed out his pace deficiency on the wing.
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
17 Nov 2014, 23:15#25
Ag have another dip you old coot.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
17 Nov 2014, 23:20#26
Noo answer toi the question bout JP's pace? Are you running scared again?
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
17 Nov 2014, 23:26#27
No I don't want to embarrass a fellow poster.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
17 Nov 2014, 23:46#28
Did you or did you not make s a statement like that? Simple question - yes or no
SASaffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SASaffolk Captain30,741 posts
18 Nov 2014, 00:01#29
Oh what utter rubbish he was coasting - sprinting my arse. It's your usual prejudicial bullshit.
Serfontein was jogging for most of the way and that is a fact. He was looking around, no expression of determination to put his head down and sprint for the line
DEDezertFox
Pro2,288 posts
18 Nov 2014, 13:17#30
JP used to be a quality wing, never a speedster, but a solid wing who could make big game changing tackles. In 2007 WC he was magnificent. In 2008 he was invisible, with the exception of his heroic defensive displays on the EOYT which saved the the campaign. In 2009 he scored a wonderful try against the Lions in the second test. From there onwards he was completely ordinary. Then came 2012, and he made that incredible run through the England defence from deep inside his own half and finished off a couple of phases later with a try; we all thought he was back to his best, but he has shown nothing since. We don't see that same defensive solidity that we used to. His slower pace for a wing never used to be a problem, but the game is faster than it was seven years ago. We have better players, a new generation with higher skill sets and pace to burn. Why JP is still selected beggars belief, clearly Meyer wanted to shore up the wings with stout defence, but JP missed 4 tackles on Saturday.
Meyer is starting to ruin his tenure with wishy-washy selections where he should be backing his initial gut instinct . We don't have time to prepare next year, the likes of Hougaard and Hendricks would be better served with experience on this tour. Likewise we should be giving Pollard as much game time as possible in these conditions if we want him to start ahead of Morné in the World Cup. I think this tour will prove to be Meyer's undoing. He is filling the team with failures to appease the fans. It won't be the fairytale ending ala Jake.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
18 Nov 2014, 13:41#31
Something realistic from the unexpected corner of Letsal. The failures in Meer's set-up is slowly being reduced - but the list is till too long for my liking.
He seemed to get over the Morne Steyn saga after repeated failures by Morne. He is pretty certain to use Pollard as the number 1 flyhalf in the WC - but wanted to see what his back-ups can produce - he is likely to use Goosen in the flyhalfposition on Saturday and Pollard will be abck against the Welsh. It is noit wise to go into a WC with only one pony without back-ups - so that seems to be the situation.
I think he tried Hendrick in a few tests on the wing - am surprised about that one since he was a Cheethahs bench player. He is fast - but his defense is porous to saythe least. To my mind Pietersen - never a fast player - has lost even more pace in Japan. He is a player that used to have strong runs with bakll in hand - but as you stated not enough pace for a wing. Hopeheisphased out as well. I wish they could see whether Senaatla is up to standard for the 15 man game - sure he will be speedwise - but the problems may be under the high ball and in defense.
Insofar as other has-beens are concrned - I think Bakkies Botha, Gurthro Steenkamp, Willem Alberts, Jannie du Plessis and Matfield head the list of serious under-performers. Botha and Alberts are plain lazy and low work rate players, Jannie and Steenkamp have scrumming problms more often than not and they are useless performers outide of scrumming. Matfield looks good in line outs and tackling (poor quality tackles being in his case the norm) - but he has physical deficiencies that reduce the rest of his game to sub-standard
In summary the players that will ensure a loss for SA if they are in the WC squad next year are Pietersen, Jacque Fourie (another carthorse-speed character), Alberts, Botha. Matfield, Jannie du Plessis and Steenkamp. Seven sub-standard players are 7 too many in that squad.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
18 Nov 2014, 13:45#32
Mozart
You carry on ad infinitum about Serfontein's lack of pace - but just one question. Is your favourite Jacque Fourie faster or slower than Serfontein?
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
09 Feb 2019, 19:09#33
Notice how I chase Biltong off the site.....
