Jean Devilliers- Is not an Inside Center

 He cant pass, he is not a play maker, he cant kick to take of some pressure of the flyhalf.

I said ages ago that he should play outside center. He had his best Springbok games as a wing and it better suited to being an outside back than inside back. Outside Center is his perfect position.

He played well for the Boks in the series and is the Springbok captain at 13. Why is he still playing at 12 for the Stormers.

When Devilliers was in Ireland playing for Munster- Dejong and Jarque Fourie combined as the center pairing. This was the best attacking Stormers team over the last few years and the defence was allmost as good as it is now. 

Surely Dejong should be playing inside center and Devilliers outside center? They may switch positions occasionally but this is not the same.

Jean used to be a great 12, the best the Boks have had in years but he is past it. Problem is, de Jongh is anything but a 12. A 12 needs to have great distribution skills, great feel for the game, needs to be creative and set up those outside him - de Jongh is not this

Ja well great debate chaps.....but I can't recall any other South African centre pairing trumping Jean and de Jongh in this S15. Quite the contrary.

And while you chaps are convincing yourselves Jean is not a 12. ...did you watch the disasters Fransie concocted against the Bools? Charge downs, failing to pass when overlaps were in the offing? Time will tell whether this works.

That said I agree with your basic premise SB, Jean is more suited to 13.

What? Frans was huge for the Sharks - what game were you watching - in fact which games do you ever watch all round? Thing is Frans was huge for the Sharks and he was having an off day. He takes contact, makes yards and still offloads, liked the swerve he showed today at one point and yes his kicking out of hand was not spot on today, but who cares. His presence was immense

Er Dave....that was yesterday. You're getting way too emotional.....down Rover.

Why not just read what his coach has to say about him on this site. Frans was huge against England as he was for the Sharks yesterday - questioning his credentials and value at 12 is nothing short of stupid

 i would agree that Devilliers was playing better 3 years ago than he is now.

However he has never been a great passer, playmaker or kicker.

Even in the 2007 Worldcup the boks played much better when he was injured and Frans Steyn moved to inside center. This last worldcup could have been another story if Frans Steyn is not been injured. 

Devilliers is a great runner - much like an outside back. His playmaking inside back attributes have never been great. 

As for Dejong- I suppose his play making ability is not that great either. We have a shortage of quality inside centers in south Africa. Frans Steyn is one of the best in the World, but after him we do not have many play makers. Even when Frans Steyn does a crash ball he can still ofload in the tackle so he provides lots of options

Disagree, we have some good young 12's coming through starting with Baby Bok star Jan Serfontein. Whitehead prior to his injury this year was the best SA inside centre by some distance - he set up many good attacks for the Sharks. Frans Venter of the Bulls is another good prospect at 12

 Coming through is one thing or is Serfontein another Jean Devilliers- a good rugby player but is he a perfect inside center- passing, kicking and playmaking ability?

 Like the inside center mould of Carter(much of his career at inside), Sunny bill, Tim Horan, Matt Giteau, Nonu, Walter Little, Umaga etc. 

Passing ability in general of the inside tbacks is probably the only reason New Zealand are better than the boks. The inside backs of New Zealand are abit more skillful in passing and playmaking. 

Some would disagree- but then look at Morne, Braam Van Straaten, Louis  Koen, Jannie Debeer and various other flyhalfs we have had compared to Larkham, Cooper, Merhtens, Carter etc. 

If JP and Habana could get more quality ball they would get loads more tries.

Well they have to start somewhere and are all young so coming through is a start. Carter is a 10 and played 99% of his career there. Nonu was never a classic playmaker, more a 12 that imposed himself physically, Little was a very ordinary player.

While being able to kick as a 12 is handy, its not that important - the 12's key role is creativity and distribution, which Serfontein has shown he has these attributes

Yep well Fransie almost lost the 2007 RWC final missing Mathew Tait. He does have the ability to offload in the tackle ....which is good....because he never offloads until he is tackled. And he does have the ability to make a heavy hit.....if he makes contact. In Tait's case he missed him completely. This Fransie at 12 thing is still going to go through many twists. And he was poor against the Bools.

Our Bok centres didn't do much at the RWC07, if you don't count the two tries Jaque Fourie gifted Fiji. The damage was done by Habana, JP and above all Fourie du Preez. But this myth of the Jaque/Fransie partnership will no doubt persist.

 The AllBlacks outside backs- the runners get the ball more than the Springbok outside backs. This occurance must be attributed to some factor. When the boks have inside backs in their prime like Honiball, butch james, Lambie etc it is more of a 15 man show- instead of the Morne kick and chase. The only way for the boks to be number one is vary tactics and have a multi-dimensional game plan with players that have the ability to implement this. 

A Lambie/Frans Steyn axis for the 4 nations is the way to go. Morne standing in the car park with his 10 man game plan is a waist of time,

Boks set at 12 for a long time with Frans Steyn. DeVilliers is a good pairing with him on the outside.

He's playing at 12 for Stormers because there aren't better options 

Agreed de Villiers is a natural 13 not 12 but was so good he made a relative success at 12. He had the pace for 13 and the creativity. Unfortunately Jaque Fourie was a 13 and never a 12. So the die was cast.

I was disappointed with Frans. How fast is the guy these days.Lots of mistakes against the bools as well. I hope he is going to sharpen up a lot! Where is that jink that bursting through a gap etc?

Given that young backs can play senior level rugby easier than forwards they should take Jan Serfontein on tour and start him in a few games off the bench and see how he goes.

the real truth is jean has never had great passing skills or the abilty to created space when he played for the boks. his style is very much on off pop pass to create space for his 13. so a hard line running 13 will compliment jean's playing style a lot better. where as fransie can play both the roll of a creative wide passing 12 and the bust up offloading style 12. the latter gives less options on attack than the former. truth be told we dont have decent centres because players are being forced into playing outside of there positions. de jongh is a natural 13 playing sometimes at 12 which destroys the cohesion of the backline. the real issue is our coaches dont understand the fine detail that underlines the fact that a 12 is a specialst position and requires a different skill set than a 13. generally the 13 channel one has more time and requires less vision. franna played 10 for a big part of his career so the switch was a lot easier for him.

this country must learn to identify players for the skills and pick them in the correctly positions on the pithc. the 12 and 13 might be right next to each other but the rolls and skills could not be more different from each other.

with our juinor players coming through we might see the end of the mindless donkey 12 and see a smart player thinking for creating chances for his outside backs. we really need more depth in that department. we are really lacking

Carpet muncher Jean is very creative as his recent WC performances showed. However you should not use a player like Jean to crash the ball up - that is not his game. The trouble is this is the role a SA inside center is given.

Of the young centers I like Serfontein, Jordaan, Taute and even Small Smith.  Add Frans to that and we are well covered for the years to come.  Serfontein and Jordaan could make a very good pairing so Frans had better get his A game going.

the limted game time jean has at the WC was at the back end of most games where the opposing teams where already tried. i can recall one good stepping moment when he used his feet for the first time in about 5 years.

i mean to disrespect jean has done amazing work but when he went to ireland he played a few games only to be benched for some unkown 12. he was moved to 13 and ot wing !!!! franna gave him a wake up call...much needed to be honest. franna is the first choice for years to come barring injuries or major drop in form. serfontein is the only real other 12 option. the other players are not 12's to be honest.

franna will always be a better option than jean. it just depends on how the coaches use franna. he is big but he is used as phase starter when i feel he can used to create a lot more.

jordaan is line runner as well as taute and small smith....serfontein on the other hand is a lot more creative but is still lacking in ball speed and passing abilty. if he works on it he will be a complete player and wil cause a lot of problems for opposing defences