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FORUM / RUGBY /  Just where are the Boks right now and what are the near future prospects

Just where are the Boks right now and what are the near future prospects

Started by Beeno111 REPLIES390 VIEWS· 26 Aug 2013, 12:03
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BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
26 Aug 2013, 12:03
#1
26 Aug 2013, 12:03#1

 If one were to believe the doom and gloom merchants like ou maaaikie, snapspeter, muncher rugganutter etc etc we are in the dwang. Mike cant see us winning another RC match etc etc. Ou maaakie couldnt see the second string Stormers winning a match. 

These guysare like yo yo's up and down they go - unstable in all their ways! Hence some much needed  sound perspective is needed.

One such perspective is that the Argies on this form could have beaten any side in the world. Can they sustain this level of ferocity or will we again see them peter out. Be assured we will not face a pack so determined and capable again jn this years RC. The biting and eye gouging were simply the evidence of extreme desparation. With oaks like CC demanding their removal from the RC they were playing for their rugby lives.

Meyer can be forgiven for not tweaking the side although a couple of changes should have been made. The more direct and physical Biissie should have started this match as should Flip. 

In the front row the scrum was solid against a strong Puma scrum. However as Mallet noted players like Beast, Jannie and Junadre do not clean out that well. Also Beast and Jannie do not drive the ball up effectively and do not last 80 minutes so sub tthem. The positive is that Coenie was rock solid at tighhead. He also adds more value outside the scrum so we can expect him to start. We have a very good tighthead in Malherbe emmerging and there are a number of promsing props such as kitshoff, Marcell Mellet.

At Lock Etzebeth continues to impress in all aspects of the game and in his discipline. I am sure he would like to deal with same of the  oaks more severely but restrains himslef for the sake of the side. When Du Toit gets going next year we will have the premier lock combo in the world. Again we have a number of locks emmerging. Pity Bekker was not there instead of Juandre.

The loose forwards are accused of losing the break down. Well what the oaks are misisng is the way the Bok forwards were fanning out and not committing to the rucks in numbers. Against Engalnd at twicks this loose trio may be fine.   Deon Fourie at 6 (Tough as teak), Vermuelen and Louw at 7 is a good option. I am keeping a watch on Willie Brits and of course arno Botha impressed.. Kolisi is not ready and lacks the skillset right now.

JJ needs to be moved t the wing but NOT because he is not an extremely promising 13 but because with JP gone a hole needs to be filled. This means Jan being thrown in at 13 which is not ideal given his youth.

Vermaak must start until Fourie can play. At the very least he  should have been on early in the second half.

Habana was very quiet. Normally he is excelleny at looking for work. Is his R660,000 a month contract with Toulon weighing on his mind?

Willie at 15 remains but lambie is challenging which is good competition.

Morne remains unchallended at flyhalf and was clealry the man of the match with his amazing goal kiking. His ratings were embarassing for ou maaakie.

So quite a lot to think about for Meyer but there is little doubt the incremental improvements are there and by 2014 we should be cooking.

Lets go down under and give the puffed up abs a severe snotklap. Last year at Dunedin we were good and should have won comfortably. This year lets slot the goal kicks, not butcher our scoring opportunities and give the abs a good hiding. No more our loosing the game rather than the abs winning it etc. We can only hope we get a competent ref/linesmanen TV adjudicators etc.

 

 

 

 

 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
26 Aug 2013, 13:21
#2
26 Aug 2013, 13:21#2
Beeno You really are a nut case - you know. You go off about Fourie and how good he is - but lets ask you one question? In his last three matches on CC level - Fourie managed to give away 10 penalties. That being on CC level - how many will he give away on test level. Six per game??? Fourie is a very active player - but he has serious limitations as well. Although he played often enough at hooker - he did have a very low tackle count in Super 15 - even compared to other hookers making only 81 tackles in all the matches he played in. That equates to less than 6 tackles per match. He is a good ball carrier - but lost possession of the ball 20 times and was penalized 15 times. On balance his statistics for Super 15 is bit flawed and that is going to count heavily against him for selection as a 6. There is one element of the game where he is good at - ball carrying - one element where his game is average - ball recovery in breakdowns (averaged out by poor discipline and penalties given away) - and one element where there are serious question marks - namely defence. An above average Super 15 and CC player - but a real risk with question marks as to his playing on higher level - it would indeed be a gamble to select him. I do like the idea of moving Louw away from 6 - but there remains a serious question mark about his replacement. Sorry - I cannot go along with your enthusiasm on Fourie - it is way to big a gamble. I think that Kolisi is more mobile - but he is an impact player more than anything else. He has a very poor ball recovery record from breakdowns as well. Coetzee has his deficiencies - but he is probably a better bet on international level than most. I was thinking about the possibility that Louw should perhaps move to 8 - he is more mobile than Vermeulen - whose performance at 8 is not really the answer. That would leave the issue of whom to play at 7. From a comparative point of view with the Aussies and AB's loosies - there is in reality only one player that springs to mind and that is Labuschagne. Throughout the Super 15 - he had the highest tackle stats of all the loosies in the competition - he took more line out balls than any other SA loosie in Super 15 - was more effective in actual ball handling skills than the other loosies and his ball carrying was just slightly below that of Fourie - 71 carries by Fourie as against 64 by Labuschagne. However, in the process he lost possession of the balls a third of the number of ball losses by Fourie and gave away less than half the number of penalties given away by Fourie. For me he is the best choice at 7 at present. The other candidate with twice the statistical achievements of Alberts - could be Elstadt - but here there are also question marks about the mobility factor. Then we have the backline. Pienaar has to go - he brings nothing to the game and had a questionable and slow service this year - especially also for Ulster. The dream to half Fourie du Preez is not realistic and will not materialize. That leaves us with a few younger players - ie Vermaak, Van Zyl, Schreuder and Reinach. The latter was only used by the Sharks in the CC as a bench player - and consequently showed very little since his injury. Vermaak has had his moments in Super 15 - but is also on his way out to France - nothing special at all and average at best. Hougaard is injured - but was poor in most games he played in this year. Van Zyl did not show much - when he came on to replace the injured Vermaak and was very average in the CC since the tests in June and Schreuder - who was good thus far in the CC competition. There is not much difference in the level of performance of these players and I think that Schreuder may yet be a surprise choice by Meyer. Hard to blood in a youngster against teams like Australia and New Zealand - but something drastic is required in this case. I would replace Kruger asap. He has no grunt and is questionable in virtually all phases of the game - Flippie is no real alternative - he has more grunt, but less sense and is liable to give away penalties. I hope to see Pieter-Steph back this weekend in CC and he is the answer - and I would still like to see him together with De Jager in the squad. Morne has been Morne again on Saturday. His goal kicking has not deserted him on Saturday - but it was back to his one-dimentional game of standing too deep in the pocket and being a very passive flyhalf - no pivot for a backline that has the ability to attack if they get proper balls. His kicking game turned out to be only a means to hand over possession - and his passing game became the standard "hospital pass" game of the past. Time to move on and get rid of him - he just is not the right guy for the job. Put Lambie at 10 and bring in Marais and Visser on Board to cover the full back and flyhalf positions. Then there is the question of Engelbrecht. I was always dithering about the issue of whether he should play at 13 or 14. My instincts always tend to tell me he should be a wing and not a center - basically also taking into account his defensive deficiency at 13. . Personally I still think that he would be very good on the wing - much better than Basson can ever be - so he should be moved to wing and Serfontein be played at center. Serfontein is a natural center - something Engelbrecht is not. I wish Malherbe was back from injury - he would have made a huge difference to the squad - especially the prop situation.. However, I do not expect any real changes by Meyer - he remains a dolt anchored in the past and not really able to see why his theories do not work. So all we can hope for is that he would start seeing where things are going wrong - but that is a hope that will be lost on Meyer.
CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
26 Aug 2013, 13:39
#3
26 Aug 2013, 13:39#3

 

They are in shitville at the moment and are going to remain there till Meyer takes his walking shoes.

 

Nothing is going to change. The team will remain the same. No matter how far we plummet down the ranks... Meyer will stay true to his conservative approach.

 

It's friggin hilarious just how foolish this man is.

 

 

 

 

DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
26 Aug 2013, 14:11
#4
26 Aug 2013, 14:11#4

The short answer to your question??....stuffed!! Take that physical thing, supremacy or whatever else you want to call and piss on it.....we've been stuffed for the last 5 years and we'll continue to be until we find a half decent replacement for Meyer. It's not like he doesn't know...........it's the fact that he doesn't know that he doesn't know is what worries me!

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
26 Aug 2013, 14:21
#5
26 Aug 2013, 14:21#5
Denny A classic that one - "he does not know what he does not know" LMAO
PO
polyboyClub Pro601 posts
26 Aug 2013, 14:27
#6
26 Aug 2013, 14:27#6
Beeno, there are times I enjoy reading your posts but your total lack of respect of the AB's borders on the psychotic. Are you completely serious that the AB's don't engineer wins against the Boks or is it for 20 years there has been a conspiracy by rugby officialdom to hamper Bok supremacy.
CA
carpetmuncherPro1,667 posts
26 Aug 2013, 14:36
#7
26 Aug 2013, 14:36#7

with all due respect beeno you have been licking meyers shaft ever since he took office. truth be told you pro meyer harpies are just full of it as meyer. as they say in the land of the blind the one eyed is king.

 

hahaha epic post denny and what meyer seems to know and what bother all of us.

 

if you call this type of rugby rugby beeno then i am afraid yoou have lost hte plot a long time ago

 

CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
26 Aug 2013, 15:06
#8
26 Aug 2013, 15:06#8

 

Yeah it's true ... Meyer doesn't know, that he doesn't know.

 

How friggin scary is that?? It seems he's not prepared to listen either. He honestly believes he has the best 23 players in his team .... he just doesn't know that there's a lot of untapped talent at his disposal. The man has passion, of that there's no doubt. Sadly we need a lot more than that in a coach 

 

Regarding the All Blacks ... The biggest difference between us is that they play with intellect. There is thought in their play. We on the other hand blunder ahead and hope for the best. We're an open book under Meyer. No surprises ... completely predictable.

 

Look what they did to the Wallabies with their 4th string 10. What would have happened to us with our 4th string flyhalf ... against a useless Argentina?

 

A beating I tell ya ... a beating!!!!

 

We're in big trouble with Meyer at the helm.

 

 

 

CA
carpetmuncherPro1,667 posts
26 Aug 2013, 15:19
#9
26 Aug 2013, 15:19#9

AB has developed there pattern of play over the last 15 years or so into a well drilled pattern of play that comes second nature....while if you rewind back to the current bok game pattern it seems like i am watching another rerun of old footage from 30 and 40's bok archive....

 

the crud we are forced to watch every week is not true bok rugby but a side track pony show of what we are meant to see. it hurts to say this but our rugby has a long way to go

CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
26 Aug 2013, 16:30
#10
26 Aug 2013, 16:30#10

 

The All Blacks a few years ago had a potent squad of players that they could call upon at any time to represent their country. Anyone within the squad would be brought in at any time and the scary part is that they delivered as though they were regulars.

 

We are too damn afraid to upset the public by making a few brave calls. Blooding some of the fine talent is a definite no no ... let's rather go fish out a hasbeen or three from overseas, preferably a bull, instead of bringing in a young hungry talent and expose him to test rugby.

 

That would mean that the coach would actually have to do what he was hired for. To coach and to manage our young guns.

 

 

CA
carpetmuncherPro1,667 posts
26 Aug 2013, 17:59
#11
26 Aug 2013, 17:59#11

spot on cleancut spot

 on....and we the public must be happy with meyers delusions and saru rubbish management decisions..

SP
SpooonyClub Pro718 posts
26 Aug 2013, 20:31
#12
26 Aug 2013, 20:31#12

 Where are we? Top of the TRC log at the moment.

— END OF THREAD —

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