FIXTURESNo upcoming fixtures — check back soon.
FORUM / RUGBY /  Lack of foresight by Springbok coaches leaves glaring holes looking ahead to next year’s World Cup

Lack of foresight by Springbok coaches leaves glaring holes looking ahead to next year’s World Cup

Started by Denny23 REPLIES4,053 VIEWS· 01 Sept 2022, 07:33
SHAREXFACEBOOKWHATSAPPTELEGRAMREDDITLINKEDIN
DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
01 Sept 2022, 07:33
#1
01 Sept 2022, 07:33#1

Dylan Coetzee


The Springboks find themselves in an awkward position heading into their second Test against Australia, with several enforced changes bringing to light some grave concerns for coach Jacques Nienaber ahead of Rugby World Cup 2023.


For a squad that has been lauded for its depth, Nienaber and his coaching staff have failed to address glaring question marks in critical positions.

The concern begins at hooker, where Nienaber is blessed with two world-class players in Bongi Mbonambi and Malcolm Marx, who have been mainstays since Rassie Erasmus took over the side in 2018.

Hooker concerns

Whilst the duo have largely kept a good bill of health, the nature of rugby means injuries are inevitable. Mbonambi’s injury ahead of the Ellis Park Test against the All Blacks is a prime example of this and resulted in Nienaber making a telling error by starting Joseph Dweba.

The newly signed Stormer showed promise in the Springboks set up during the British & Irish Lions series, looking odds on to grow into a quality third hooker for the world champions.

However, deciding not to start Marx, who had put in the performance of his life a week earlier in Nelspruit, for the clash at Ellis Park and throwing Dweba in the deep end backfired significantly.

Dweba’s fundamental skills were exposed in his lineout throwing and scrummaging ability. Now it is not to say that the hooker does not have potential. Still, Nienaber effectively launched the 26-year-old into a baptism of fire from media and fans alike, inevitably stunting his confidence and possibly his development.

Why not start Marx, arguably the form hooker in the world and have Dweba get 30 minutes at the back end after the hard work is done and let him make the most of the platform laid to acclimatise to the Test scene?

Then give Dweba his start against Australia full of confidence in his ability and not coming off a media crucifixion. Now Nienaber finds himself in a situation where he would rather give Deon Fourie, a flanker who had his time in the front-row, a shot on the bench this weekend instead of Dweba.

The questionable decision-making extends beyond that when looking at the 42-man squad named for the Rugby Championship, where five scrum-halves were named and only three hookers.

Fundamentally both positions are crucial, but all five scrum-halves have at least one Test cap to their name. It would make more sense to pick an extra hooker in Bulls star Johan Grobbelaar, who has been in the set-up before and was a stand-out in the United Rugby Championship (URC). Then when crisis hits, as it has now, there is a fourth hooker with a boatload of potential to call on that will put the squad in much better stead heading into the World Cup.

Fourie is an outstanding player with phenomenal skills at the breakdown and will take on a Schalk Brits role heading into the showpiece event, but he does not need to be the back-up hooker.

Fly-half crisis

Fly-half is another interesting soft point in the Springboks squad. Handre Pollard and Elton Jantjies are only two out-and-out pivots in the set-up, and risks associated with such a limited selection have already caught up with the South Africans.

Of course, Damian Willemse is versatile and will start at 10 this weekend but going forward and looking to the World Cup, how can there be only two specialist fly-halves in the wider squad?

Injury is the first concern, and this week has underlined that, however, even before considering that it is no secret that Pollard is not his vintage self that saw near perfection time and again during the World Cup win. Instead, the pivot has been inconsistent and, at times, unreliable.

Meanwhile, Jantjies, who was also thrown in the deep end to start against Wales after months out with injury, is a questionable pick at Test level. The former Lion is a fantastic rugby player and one of the best fly-halves in attack, but his style has never gelled with the Springbok set-up to the extent it did at club level.

This begs the question, what about the World Cup? Granted, there were no outright bolters for a fly-half spot in the squad from the URC like an Evan Roos was for number eight, but picking two fly-halves that are not showing their best form is risky.

Bringing in Bulls fly-half Chris Smith could have been an option. The 27-year-old is not quite ready for Test rugby, but his fundamentals are brilliant, and he offers a similar package to Morne Steyn with solid kicking out of hand and at goal. Get him in the wider squad to train at high intensity and learn the systems because when disaster strikes, Smith would be far closer to the level he needs to be.

Willemse is a solution at fly-half and will likely excel this weekend, but if the 24-year-old suffered an injury or suspension for this week, Nienaber would be clutching at straws. Of course, there is always Frans Steyn to fill the void, but with all due respect to the legendary Springbok, it would be difficult to defend a World Cup with the 35-year-old at fly-half.

The situation is not as dire as this write-up suggests, but the consequences of decisions made now by the Springbok coaching staff will be magnified heading into France 2023, and Nienaber needs to be spot on if his side is to defend the title. There is a reason the Webb Ellis trophy has only been defended once.


MS
Mrs SearlePro1,533 posts
01 Sept 2022, 10:01
#2
01 Sept 2022, 10:01#2

There is so much yarpie horseshit in that shit smear of an article no wonder you fucks think shit about the Blocks... Marx is form hooker in the world? Dullard was perfection in the world cup? Willemse will likely excel on Saturday? Marx was fucking patchy against the Kiwis... skew throws not much improve in scrum and shitty handling and defence. Even when talking about problems yarpies do it in a way that they still suck their own cocks. Nauseating bullshit. 

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
01 Sept 2022, 11:30
#3
01 Sept 2022, 11:30#3
So true - our blind faith in the likes of Vermeulen and Frans Steyn is madness along with investing in Deon Fourie - the guy is 36 for crying out loud URC in form hooker Grobbelaar gets snubbed and Dweba gets thrown to the sharks. Dweba is a talent, a real handful to stop with ball in hand. Throwing him in the deep end at test level has reduced him to looking out of his depth, which he is not. My guess is that Neinaber wanted to expose him to the pressure to see what he’s got - pretty fucking unfair if you ask me. Introduced him off the bench to see what he has got. Our side currently is playing with players out of form in Mapimpi, de Allende, Pollard, Faf, Herschel Jantjies, Elton Jantjies, Mbonambi, Nyakane, Ox, Kolisi, PSDT and Vermeulen. Then we have passengers in the squad like Frans Steyn, Mostert and Orie. We ignored in form URC players like Gelant, Tambwe, Zas, Senatla, Libok, Zak Burger, Morne vd Bergh, Gerhard Steenkamp, Grobbelaar, Thomas du Toit, Ruben Schoeman, Buthelezi, Roos, Elrigh Louw, Marcel Coetzee and Vincent Tsituka. We have pretty much ignored in form Andre Esterhuizen We continue to overlook the likes of Serfontein, Rohan Janse v Rensburg, Wilco Louw, Aker vd Merwe, Jason Jenkins, JD Schickerling, the du Preez twins, Ackerman and Liebenberg Frans Steyn was too old and past it for the 2019 WC yet these fools still think he has something to offer 4 years later, it’s fucking insulting - his display in the last test was an embarrassment yet we find him on the bench again this weekend. Surely Esterhuizen would have been a far better bench option with Willie covering 10 if need be Poor selections Poor game plan Players out of form And a head coach that is not a coach
CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
01 Sept 2022, 11:57
#4
01 Sept 2022, 11:57#4

The media is filled with this kind of horseshit!!

We apparently have vast depth ... and two world class hookers in Bongi and Marx.

Haaaaaahahahaha!!

It goes on to tell us that Elton Jantjies is a "fantastic" rugby player and Dweeb is a man for the future ... all 4ft2 140kg of him.

What a crock!!

We have all seen what Willemse brings at 10 ... but according to this article, he excels there.

Funny ... that's not what I've seen when he played at 10 for the Stormers. 

Now that it's in print, it must be true.

Like lambs to the slaughter.



MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
01 Sept 2022, 14:13
#5
01 Sept 2022, 14:13#5

We were uniquely well positioned after the WC with more depth than most of our competitors. But instead of seizing the moment we acted as if we were anointed. A laughable coaching set up. But it all started to implode with the chicken run.

No worries though, the losses to Oz were laughed off after a last minute win over the ABs. The England loss a nothing burger.

The facts are we have no new tactics after the WC, no new players that are confirmed as test class. None! Think of that after 3 years.

This all comes down to the character flaws of Erasmus….his penchant for declaring victory and avoiding competition. His lack of seriousness….his lack of ambition, he should have been trying to build a dynasty. Instead it was time to jol after the WC.

Kneeknocker looks like a nice chap and a competent technician….but he has no real ideas for moving forward. It’s all a bit of a balls up.

KI
kingcornPro3,695 posts
01 Sept 2022, 18:00
#6
01 Sept 2022, 18:00#6

Agree with all of the players mentioned Saffex, however, not the right colour. Dee be over Grobbler. 

We also have to note that the out of form players are Bok mercenaries who bolted to go get some big dosh. The only player to have kept their form was Marx and to certain extend Le Roux. The rest like Faf, pollard and De Allende all dropped in form, although Pollard was injured and his club got fed up with him. 

Etzebeth was the only other player that showed his value when he wasn’t injured to his club. There were only a handful of players from abroad that also exceeded for their clubs. 

It was blatantly obvious!!! 

I don’t have a problem with foreign based players but they need to shine there, not come back because they know the system. 

I would have picked this side with a majority URC form players. 

  1. Kittshof / Ox
  2. Bongi / Marx / Grobbler
  3. Mahlerbe / Du Toit
  4. Etzebeth
  5. Lood / PSDT
  6. Coetzee / Kolisi ( Kolisi would not make my team but their as he is the captain
  7. Louw
  8. Roos ( kwagga or Liebenberg ) 
  9. Zack Burger / Hendrikse
  10. Libbok / Pollard
  11. Madosh 
  12. Willemse / Esterhuizen
  13. Am
  14. Kolbe 
  15. Gelant 

AJ
AJHPro3,183 posts
01 Sept 2022, 19:10
#7
01 Sept 2022, 19:10#7

Make Am the Captain  drop Kolisi and make Kwagga the #6 and I would prefer the #9's brother at fly-half with Pollard starting.

That way you still meet the COLOUR quota demands and the captain mandate.

We are going to have to life with the choices already made unfortunately.

Miracles do happen but this next game is also going to require assistance from above.


CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
01 Sept 2022, 20:01
#8
01 Sept 2022, 20:01#8

how about selecting on merit ... ?? 

how about not bending to their racist demands ... ?

how about showing a little integrity ... ?

a little character ... ?

that would he nice. 

rather a dead Bok than one filled with unworthy dregs an subsequent embarrassment.



MS
Mrs SearlePro1,533 posts
01 Sept 2022, 20:30
#9
01 Sept 2022, 20:30#9

Here's where it gets fucking tricky... the whites aren't hot shit themselves. It's pretty obvious that Kwagga is way the best Block 10... but the rest are not so clear cup... and sometimes the darkie is best. Stop looking for excuses. Quotas are not an excuse anymore when the total player pool is dog shit. Wake the fuck up... Duane, Faf, Dullard, de Jager, de Lindy, du Toit, Malhurbe, Willie and even Ebenezer have been roadkill. Ebenezer hasn't had an edge over any opponent since 2018... maybe. No leadership either. Scowling and trying to be the big fucking hard man is not leadership... how about putting a full shift in and actually doing some graft for a change. Botha wannabe. Too many reputations... all shyte. 

CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
01 Sept 2022, 21:22
#10
01 Sept 2022, 21:22#10

Still waiting for you Augie to cure all our woes.

You clearly have  all the answers ... so put your money where your loudmouth is. 



DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
01 Sept 2022, 22:18
#11
01 Sept 2022, 22:18#11

Rudeneck is probably the only arse clown on the planet not rating Eben as the top lock in WR....and Rosie.

DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
01 Sept 2022, 22:20
#12
01 Sept 2022, 22:20#12

...if it walks like a duck...

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
01 Sept 2022, 22:36
#13
01 Sept 2022, 22:36#13
The most obvious observation is that the wheels have certainly come off since Rassie’s enforced extraction from the side Rassie’s faith in his buddy Neinaber has bern completely misplaced There is no ways the players respect Neinaber as their mentor. They don’t believe in him. All coaches have a history of hanging onto players that win them titles - we see this with the current Boks Too much faith in hasbeens like Frans and Vermeulen and not bringing in enough youngsters in place of poor selections like Morne, Koch, Orie, Nortje, Nico Janse v Rensburg, Mostert, Fourie and Elstadt
CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
01 Sept 2022, 22:47
#14
01 Sept 2022, 22:47#14

sad hut true.

we saw Meyer do the same.

cost us dearly. 


DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
02 Sept 2022, 03:48
#15
02 Sept 2022, 03:48#15

The most obvious observation is that the wheels have certainly come off since Rassie’s enforced extraction from the side

I find it hard to believe that Rassie has no input or influence on the side not only because of who he is but by evidence of his role as the "waterboy" and by his presence in Oz at this very moment as we speak. 

Why else would he be with the team here in Australia ?

DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
02 Sept 2022, 06:59
#16
02 Sept 2022, 06:59#16

You going to the game tomorrow Denny?

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
02 Sept 2022, 09:48
#17
02 Sept 2022, 09:48#17
He definitely still has an input but it’s clearly not totally hands on given he is not allowed to be with the team on match day My point is that our demise coincides with Rassie being banned
MS
Mrs SearlePro1,533 posts
02 Sept 2022, 09:53
#18
02 Sept 2022, 09:53#18

Wow, this is precious! Fucking dumpy Bilbo tells us these elite specimens need hands on training. Is this a squad of players or a fucking nursery? Bwahahahhaa! Silly little Bilbo blows his own moronic argument apart like a monkey with dynamite and a match... a hefty monkey to be sure! BOOM! Bye bye little monkey! XD! Stupid yarpies need to have coachy woachy holding their dear little hands and walking them through their little plays... maybe the secret to the recipe is nap time. Maybe that's it! Ebenezer isn't trying to be a hard man he just wants to go noo noo. XD! Fucking... hilarious... as always! 

DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
02 Sept 2022, 10:34
#19
02 Sept 2022, 10:34#19

Ja, have no takers so I'll have to but I'm inspired by your "Boks by 8" 

MP
MpowerPro5,061 posts
02 Sept 2022, 11:43
#20
02 Sept 2022, 11:43#20

Everything that happens in Bok setup Tassie has his hand in the mix....the stupid dumb game plan, piss poor team Selections etc etc....Rassie is the one making those calls......he most probably don't even know himself what to do.....I like mostert, but its proven he is not good at Flank, why oh why does he get picked in that position.....same counts for Dda and Kriel??? DDA is totally out of form and Kriel is not test quality anymore!! But like dumb brain dead fools they burn there fingers over and over and over again.....stupid stupid stupid!!! The Bench with over the hill fat Frans & Thor??? R&N , useless Davids and Stick, needs to get there heads read and quickly.... or better yet, just go and stay away from anything to do with coaching.....they will keep on taking us down just like this Government, there butt buddies.

DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
02 Sept 2022, 11:55
#21
02 Sept 2022, 11:55#21

It's the worst loose trio and backline ever in one team. 

MP
MpowerPro5,061 posts
02 Sept 2022, 12:19
#22
02 Sept 2022, 12:19#22

Kollisi must go and Kwagga start @ 6......franco on the bench as lock backup start Elrigh louw 7...Esterhuizen 12 with Willemse 13.....Pollard 10....Gelant on the bench instead of Frans and Roos for Vermeulen.....but ja R&N shit for brains dropped Roos go figure.....Tassie and Kneeknocker is stagnating our Boks, making them like old blue cheese... the old farts in the team sure as hell gives them that stench 

MP
MpowerPro5,061 posts
02 Sept 2022, 12:22
#23
02 Sept 2022, 12:22#23

Go OZ, give them a hiding !!!! Help us get rid of R&N and Co!!!!

DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
02 Sept 2022, 12:36
#24
02 Sept 2022, 12:36#24

Too late now, they had a golden moment to grow the team with the RWC as the ultimate objective and they also had the chance to grow their style.....how they expected to succeed with a basic gameplan all too familiar to the opposition is just dumb.

Begone with the lot.

— END OF THREAD —

More from Rugby