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FORUM / RUGBY /  Lambie/Morne tackling stats

Lambie/Morne tackling stats

Started by Mozart11 REPLIES911 VIEWS· 04 Nov 2013, 09:06
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MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Nov 2013, 09:06
#1
04 Nov 2013, 09:06#1

Here's a little surprise. We hear all the time how Morne can't tackle. So what do we find if we look at all the games Morne and Lambie played at flyhalf in the S15?

 

Well we find Morne makes a total of 121 tackles for an average of 8.06 tackles per game. Lambie makes 103 tackles for an average of 7.3 per game.

 

And in terms of success rate, Lambie scores a very admirable 90.3% success rate. And Morne? Why he has exactly the same 90.3% success rate.

 

Here ends Myth Number O ne.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
04 Nov 2013, 10:07
#2
04 Nov 2013, 10:07#2

Another misleading use of stats - what was the made and missed tackle ratio - which is of essence in evaluating real value in this case.   Morne made the same percentage of missed tackles as Lambie - but the massive myth you created of Morne being so much superior ends here.

 

The only thing Morne was really superior in was his goal kicking percentage of 79%  against the 75% of Lambie.   But even here the 50% success rate of Morne  in the pressure semi-final game of the Bulls contributed massively to the loss of the game by the Bulls.   Here we must add the miserable relieving kick of Morne as a defensive matter - which ended up as a try for the Br umbies - the final nail in the coffin of the Bulls. 

 

The latter info is not a myth - it is reality.

 

 

XT
XtramickClub Pro103 posts
04 Nov 2013, 10:14
#3
04 Nov 2013, 10:14#3
Mike you know that success rate equates to tackles made/missed ratio. You must have been thinking of something else because you generally have an excellent grasp of statistical measures 
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
04 Nov 2013, 10:57
#4
04 Nov 2013, 10:57#4

Xtramike

 

Sorry - but I think it was clear in this case.   Mozart said that Morne made 121 tackles as against the 103 of Lambie.   He gave the success rate as 90.3% in both cases.  Lets accept the said scenario as correct.

 

So for a 90,3% success rate it means statistically that Lambie missed 10 tackles as against the 14 missed by Steyn - really an insignificant number in the series as a whole and is not really of major statistical or practical value in this case.     It does not prove anything as a major difference between the two players - a difference Mozart tries to assign as of particular value to Steyn as being superior to Lambie.

XT
XtramickClub Pro103 posts
04 Nov 2013, 11:04
#5
04 Nov 2013, 11:04#5
I think most people would say there isnt much of difference between the two, Lambie has declined since the kicking directive he received last year. He is starting to find his feet again, but unfortunately the days of thinking Lambie would be world-class are gone, he can be brilliant but moreover his game is now designed to be solid. He is still inconsistent and there really would be much of an argument to be made for the view that he is better than morne.  
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Nov 2013, 16:46
#6
04 Nov 2013, 16:46#6

Let me make things plainer for you OOM.

 

1) The null hypothesis is Lambie is a better tackler than Morne. That's what you and Dave have been claiming over and over. This test just deals with that issue. The sample size at 14 plus games is very adequate....so we can have some confidence in the data.

 

2) The results show that their success rate is exactly the same at 90.3% of their attempted tackles made. A very high number.

 

The only significant difference is Morne attempts 8.93 tackles a game and makes 8.06......Lambie attempts 8.14 tackles a game and makes 7.3. To me over a long season of tackling, that difference, of 11.5% more tackles per game by Morne than Lambie, looks significant.

 

So the null hypothesis is defeated....if we wanted to do more work and calculate variances in tackling success and tackles attempted, a confidence level for this statement could also be calculated....but it will be well north of 90%. The null hypothesis is toast.

 

The numbers do not prove that Lambie is a better tackler than Morne. That's all.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Nov 2013, 16:50
#7
04 Nov 2013, 16:50#7
I am after Morne's test tackling stats, not his S15..........for a start he missed 4 in one match against NZ, 3 of which lead to tries  
ST
Sun-TzuClub Pro713 posts
04 Nov 2013, 16:54
#8
04 Nov 2013, 16:54#8
Don't forget the two occasions in 2011 when Lambie backed off from an attacker against Australia and let them past him. They were both nearly shoulder-to-shoulder and poor Adi Jacibs stepped up both times and grounded the threats. I always said Adi was a poor defender, but at least he had heart and the courage to put his body on the line. Lambie is a coward. It was also the same game that he had three charge downs and he screwed up a try when he and Aplon were up against one defender in the opposition 22. He actually came away from this game a hero in the tabloids. That's the level of dishonesty of the Bok supporters. He made 0 tackles, beat 0 defenders, had three charge downs, blew a try to turn the game, but he is the hero. How sad. These people are pathetic really. It has happened all the time since. Now we have a season where Lambie has a tragic Super campaign, poor test presence yet the CC is the turnaround. No medication is potent enough to save these folks, off to the loony-bin then go. Immediately if you please.
ST
Sun-TzuClub Pro713 posts
04 Nov 2013, 16:56
#9
04 Nov 2013, 16:56#9
 @Sannex: You point to the worst defensive performance by the entire Bok team as evidence. Wake-up you silly old fool.
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Nov 2013, 16:59
#10
04 Nov 2013, 16:59#10
Oh so you are selective in your stats are you, you stupid prick?  
CW
cwvdmerweRookie50 posts
04 Nov 2013, 17:02
#11
04 Nov 2013, 17:02#11
 "for a start he missed 4 in one match against NZ, 3 of which lead to tries"

Vir 'n begin is jy verkeerd. Daar was 5 duikslae gemis en nie vier nie. Drie het geen effek gehad nie. Die ander twee was as volg: Een wat onsukselvol was, was toe twee spelers saam deur hom gedryf het vir 'n drie (wat feitlik geen speler sou kon keer nie). Die ander een voor 'n drie was waar jou draadtrek fantasie JJ in 'n beter posisie was om 'n duikslag te maak (met twee hande reeds om die speler) en dit gemis het. En dit nadat Jean uit die lyn uit opgeskiet het.

Blameer liewer jou liefste ou JJ vir 'n absolute kak poging nadat hy reeds twee hande op die speler in sy eie kanaal gehad het. Jy bly dom. Daar is nie pille of medisyne vir jou toestand nie!
ST
Sun-TzuClub Pro713 posts
04 Nov 2013, 17:02
#12
04 Nov 2013, 17:02#12
Not as selective as you are you cleft. What has Goosen or Lambie brought to the Boks? Keep in mind that Morne already has the record against New Zealand - 31 points made up of a try, drop goal, penalties and conversion. What have the other two done to top that against our rivals?
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