Make the Bools centres the Bok pair?

Ah yeah Moz, this will be the JJ that made a huge impact with ball in hand against the mighty AB's the lad that cemented his spot as the Bok 13 for the next hell knows how many years.

If you are suggesting that Strauss could possibly be faster than JJ then the less said the better.

Moz what I don't get with you is that for an intelligent man you do miss the obvious and basics of rugby.

For a start as with JJ missing Bosch and Barrett, you will find that Serfontein missed Watts as he was not the inside defender, it was the inside defender that missed Watts not Serfontein......just like JJ was not in a good position to tackle Barrett and Bosch, Serfontein was not in a good position to tackle Watts.......its the basics of rugby which you dont seem too good at grasping. The idea that the inside defender has the responsibility to tackle the man with ball in hand seems to completely escape you.

Now onto the JJ and Strauss incident, I would have thought a bright man see the obvious in the one, but hey its JJ involved so guess what, its JJ either being slow or stupid......wow......well what really happened is that Strauss did a good job of keeping JJ from getting around him by simply obstructing him with infringing the laws.......JJ managed to get up next to Strauss and Strauss got the good bounce.......its that simple, has stuff all to do with speed or rugby intelligence.

Serfontein has had very little rugby thanks to being in the Bok squad and playing off the bench for 15 min at a time. He has lost a little form, but to question his credentials is laughable, but typical you......no doubt we will now witness an anti Serfontein barrage for the rest of time.

JJ has already proved himself as the best 13 in SA by some distance, Serfontein is our back-up centre, Jean is an old man........JJ and Serfontein will be our Bok centre pair for many years to come and by call is that they will go down as better than Jean and Fourie......our best combo since readmission. 

Lets drop Etzebeth as well as he did nothing of note for WP.........one would swear Sadie did more than JJ on the day or Ebersohn more than Serfontein. It seems the fact that JJ has just come off a bruising test series counts for nothing.......last I checked, Beast, Bismark and Jannie did little of note for the Sharks......you get the picture here. The only Bok that stood out was Vermeulen, who suffered the consequences as he looked dead on his feet at then end. Your anti JJ is getting a little tiresome

Saffex stop being stupid. This is delusional nonsense that you are feeding yourself whenever one of your young favourites make a mistake
The player in the best position should make the tackle, not only the inside player. 
If the inside player is not in a good position, surely the next player should make the tackle. 

This theory about the inside player is allways responsible for the tackle is crap.In nearly any situation a player will have another player on his inside, so is no one responsible for making the tackle? 
If a player is on the wing, and the opposition player runs on the outside trying to take the gap- you are saying that the wing should not make the tackle. 

Bosch was running on the outside of JJ and at the last second cut back in slightly. JJ was able to get his arms around Bosch but fell off him. It was a poor tackle. It was his fault, not the cover tackler (jannie a prop) who was on the inside but not in position to make a tackle.
Serfontein was completely outplayed by Jean in the 4 nations this year. When he came on for the Boks in the 4 nations he made no impact. 
Serfontein is a quality player and will get better, but he is no where near Jean yet. JJ has been good on attack but he admitted himself in a recent article that he has had defensive lapses like shooting out of the line.
If Serfontein does a chip kick and the opposition player catches the ball and runs millimetres from him, he should make the tackle. He was in the best position to make the tackle, actually in most likelihood the only person that could have made the tackle. 

Moz its not a JJ excuse, its a fact........you played the game did you not? If you did you will know that its the inside defenders responsibility to tackle the man with ball in hand while the outside defender covers wide......its the basics of rugby. This happened with JJ and Bosch, when Jannie was the inside defender, it happend with the Barrett try when Morne was the inside defender and it happened to Serfontein against Watts when he was the outside defender.

I am not saying that outside defenders will always miss tackles in those situations, but what it does do is leaves the outside defender little or no chance to readjusting his alignment to make the tackle on the player thanks to his inside defender not doing his job. Moz if you had played the game, you will have faced this situation a few times in your day, its part of the game.......you trust your inside man to make the tackle, you are focused on the outside channel anticipating the pass from the man with ball in hand, so you can take your man. Bosch and Barrett were not JJ's to tackle in the first instance, much like Watts was not Serfonteins, which is exactly what the commentators said.

I'd have an issue with JJ if he was missing his man, he is not.

As for naming what JJ has created in the last few games......you must be kidding, that is bloody laughable, JJ was awesome with ball in hand against the Kiwi's in the last test......look no further than his beating of Savead and putting Willie away for what should have been a try. And you are not naive enough to expect every break or run to lead to points.......he has scored 4 tries in 9 games, he has set up Kirchner for a try.......and he was brilliant in the last test.......thats good enough for me and on the strength of the years performances he is here to stay for some considerable time, especially after that Kiwi test......when last did we see a Bok 13 beat 4 defenders in a test against the AB's and completely out playing Conrad Smith in the process.

Ebersohn did nothing of note but run in an easy try created by another. He did not outplay Serfontein at all. 

Beautiful.....but name one contribution, for or against, that has contributed one point to his team in the last six games. There aren't any....no try saving tackles, interceptions, passes for tries, runs for tries.....nothing. It's hard to be enthusiastic about a player who has no tangible contributions

Moz your measure is anything but reasonable and extremely naive. I am not naive enough to think that every break, beating of a defender or run will lead to a try or that every tackle is a try saving one.

JJ showed all the attacking attributes we are looking for in a 13 at test level last week........he carved the AB defence up at times and that's all we can ask for.........had Jean not slipped, who knows, had Willie's chip ahead gone to hand, who knows and JJ's beating of Savea and putting Willie away was sublime and had Morne gathered the ball he would have scored........that is 3 occasions in one test that JJ nearly set up tries..........and you can't bring yourself to credit that.

Moz, you can say what you like about JJ, I have always known he has what it takes to make the Bok 13 spot his own and last week he confirmed that in no uncertain terms. JJ has cemented his place in the Bok side so you are going to have to suffer the JJ torment for many years to come. Its been a while since I saw a Bok centre that had me on the edge of my seat eveytime he gets the ball. Serfontein has the same about him but is suffering from a lack of game time right now......he has just been solid, he is far better than solid.

I cant wait for the Serfontein and JJ combo at test level only because Jean is now an old man and old men lack that zip........dont get me wrong Jean has been powerful and good this year.

Much like I cant wait for Goosen to cement his spot at 10 and for the Etzebeth and PSDT combo to take root........same applies to Serfontein and JJ.

Look Dave if you can't point to one thing a Bok centre has done in 6 games to produce a point advantage.....that centre is failing. I don't care about the fact he beat 3 tackles last week after not beating one tackle for  three tests. You have to make things happen....JJ hasn't for 6 tests. Hell in the old days that was a wholeinternational season. My test is neither unreasonable, nor naive....it's practical . You get excited by youngsters running through wide open space, producing nothing. I prefer to win.

Moz your test is unreasonable and laughable in fact........I want my Bok 13 to beat defenders against the best the game has to offer, he did that emphatically last week against the AB's..........he past the test with flying colours.......the fact that none of those beats lead to points is nothing less than the nature of the game.

This crap about JJ only being good in space was put to bed with his inside, outside beating of Savea.......end of story.

Laughable Dave..... 6 games without any practical value added. Your inconsistency is amazing. The argument you always produced for Fury was the number of tries he scored. Now with JJ the fact he hasn't even taken a pass in a move producing a try...in six games.....is not a data point?

Nope he made great breaks against the Kiwi's more than that I cannot ask for........if they dont lead to tries or points, I know that, that is the reality of the game.

I dont care if his breaks or beating of defenders for the next 10 tests dont lead to points as long as he continues to beat those in front of him. If a centre is able to beat 4 defenders and make 1 clean break against a side like the AB's then I know we have found the right man........the rest will fall into place nicely, its the nature of the beast.

I am more than happy with his 4 tries in 9 tests and his setting up of Kirchner for another. I also find particular favour in the fact that in the test last weekend, he set up 3 try scoring opportunities that were not finished off by others......more than that in his first year as the Bok 13, given the nature of the modern game, I cannot expect.

I knew JJ would be good at test level, but he has been even better than I originally thought he would and that's thanks to his showing against the AB's last weekend. That performance set the benchmark......he was outstanding just as Sas said and he is a Kiwi.

Moz, prior to the Kiwi test, you had ammunition as JJ had started really well in his first 4 tests, then like all the Boks had at best a solid game against the Argies away, was good against Oz at home setting up the Kirchner try, was at best solid away against Oz and then did a damn fine job defensively against the AB's away with only 14 men......he made 9 tackles missing none and then we had his crowning game with ball in hand last weekend. Your ammunition was blown away last weekend.

No player is on fire every test, its his first year in test rugby, bloody hell what more do you expect from the lad and better still who would you play at 13 ahead of him?