Meyer starting to see the light - 2nd Bok training squad announced

Players invited to the second Springbok training camp of 2013:

Forwards (19): Tendai Mtawarira, Trevor Nyakane, Jannie du Plessis, Coenie Oosthuizen,Wiehahn Herbst, Adriaan Strauss, Bismarck du Plessis, Chiliboy Ralepelle, Eben Etzebeth, Flip van der Merwe, Juandré Kruger, Pieter-Steph du Toit, Siya Kolisi, Marcell Coetzee,Willem Alberts, Arno Botha, Lappies Labuschagne, Pierre Spies, Ryan Kankowski.

Backs (19): Jano Vermaak, Francois Hougaard, Pat Lambie, Morné Steyn, Elton Jantjies, Demetri Catrakilis, Jean de Villiers, Juan de Jongh, Jan Serfontein, Robert Ebersohn, JJ Engelbrecht, Bryan Habana, Lwazi Mvovo, Raymond Rhule, Lionel Mapoe, Bjorn Basson, Gio Aplon, Zane Kirchner, Willie le Roux.

While its an improvement on his last squad, one has to ask why the hell he keeps overlooking Brussouw. Other noteable omissions are v/Zyl, Elstadt, v/d Walt, de Jager, Kitshoff and Cooper.

Malherbe has lost out to injury, sadly

Good to see the exclusion of the likes of Franco v/d Merwe and Pat Cilliers. 

Saffex

There are still some notable absentees - eg Reinach, Vermeulen  and Malherbe - but I suppose those are the result of injruies.   I think Van Zyl should alsohave made that list - but he is not invited.

The list is a vast improvement on his previous invitees - but there are still some duds in that group - whose invites are rather inexplicable.   The form of some of the players this year was atrocious - yet they are still on the list.

I suppose that the team will be selected from this training group - but one will have to wait and see.  Meyer has so often made dud selections - that we cannot be sure there will not be a repeat.  

Yeah Brussouw is a glaring omission, Meyer just does not like him regardless of form. Meyer will be the cause of Brussouw moving up North shortly.

Players not worthy of selection are Basson, Kirchner, Aplon, de Jongh, Juandre Kruger and Kankowski. Better bets would have been Visser, v/d Heever, de Allende, Lood de Jager, v/d Walt and Brussouw

Bok B, bullshit, Kruger has been average for most of the season and has been exposed at test level. The best locks in SA by some distance are Etzebeth and Bekker, but Bekker is injured and off to Japan.

Well the issue with de Allende and v/d Heever not playing is down to their fool of a coach who fails to select them and wonders why they are languishing down the S15 table. Both have been good for the Stormers when given limited opportunities.

Aplon is too small for test rugby and getting on now - there is no point

Mike, Reinach, Malherbe and Vermeulen were not considered due to injury. Kankowski ahead of v/d Walt is a joke as is the omission of Brussouw.

Faulty forward selections are Siya Kolisi and Ryan Kankowski. Deon Fourie for Kolisi and van der Walt for Ryan. Van der walt the best number 8 in SA right now with Vermuelen out. Bad call.

Has Herbst done enough. I suppose with Malherbe out and Marcell van der Merwe still coming back he gets a spot.

 Will Louw be back?  we can't have wee kolisi at 6!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Faulty back selections - Francois Hougaard, Elton Jantjies, Juan de Jongh, Raymond Rhule, Lionel Mapoe, Zane Kirchhner,  

How hougard maks it one doesnt really know!!!! Elton is a bad call as well.. Rhule is not ready Mapoe is slow and and de Jongh does not deserve a call up. Visser looks a better bet than Zane.

 I fear there are quite  few quota selections here. Squad is weakened by injuries and departures but unfortunately also by some clangers. Nevertheless a good Bok 22 can be picked from this squad.

Still we will see who finally makes it.

Beenkop, Fourie cant even make the Stormers 6 spot, despite Liebenberg returning. Fourie at 6 ahead of Kolisi is a joke. 

Kolisi, Brussouw, Wimpie v/d Walt and Daniel are all better 6's than Fourie. Meyer has it spot on with Kolisi at 6, he has got it wrong leaving Brussouw and v/d Walt out.

Hougaard is our best 9 and will start at 9 under Meyer and rightly so.

not bad at all.  JP and Duane will be missed big time,

totaly agree Saff

What?!....no Piet van Zyl??....perhaps he'd make the squad if he had a Bulls contract like Vermaak, who is an average scrummie at best.

there's nothing special about Meyer's selections, surprising by his standards though in that he's picked those that everyone else on this forum would have picked.

Selections aside and let's say he picks a team which satifies most......what's his gameplan going to be?

Dave, it's been quite a while since we could say that Francois Hougaard is our best scrumhalf and, if last weekend's performance is anything to go by, he's not in the top 5 at the moment.

Before you dump all over me, I also rate him as one of the world's top scrumhalves when he's at his best but right now, he's just plain crap. Meyer would be taking a huge risk putting him on the bench, let alone starting him.

Well said Rooinek, I totally agree with your comments re Hougaard. He promised so much but there's nothing about his game that's got Bok written on it. Clearly his lost that something that made us sit on the edge of our seats.

I disagree Rooi, his game on Sat while not setting the world on light, was solid. Prior to that, he was coming off the bench and looked good to me. His service has been very good this year and he was starting to show glimpses of his spark in his games coming off the bench. 

At this stage no scrumhalf is consistently sticking their hands up. v/Zyl was great in his last match, Vermaak has been good in his last few, but pretty poor prior to that. Reinach and Groom blew hot and cold. Pienaar has been great with the boot up here, but offered very little else.

Hougaard needs to keep building

I thought Hougaard's performance against the Highlanders was poor and his slow service put the entire Bulls backline under pressure. They were rejuvenated when Vermaak came on and I don't think Jano Vermaak is any kind of world-beater.

Cobus Reinach has been consistently good when he hasn't been injured and so has Dan van Zyl. Neither one has been great admittedly and it's a bit of a worry. A few years ago we had quite a few world-class scrumhalves to choose from while the Kiwis had nothing and now we're struggling while they've got the likes of Kerr-Barlow, Smith and Perenara. The Wallabies also look very thin at scrumhalf. If something happens to Genia they don't have a test quality scrumhalf to call up.

"If something happens to Genia they don't have a test quality scrumhalf to call up."

Disagree, Nick White would be an excellent replacement.

Dense, I'm not sure what you see in Nick White but I think he's very average. The only thing he seems to do well is irritate the crap out of opposition players with his constant shit-stirring.

Roinek

I agree with you.   Hougaard on Saturfay was by far the worst performer f the scrummies eho played their Super 15 matches over the past weekend in SA.  He was similarly poor last year - causing Meyer to replace him.   If his Saturday performance is anything to go by - he should not have been near the trining group at all.   Meyer lovrs to pick Bulls players - so if there is a choice between an above average player and an average player the Bulls contract decides the choice.

I would say that he at least decided not to exclude the Cheethas - like he did with the first training camp  - w invited 7 Chetahs players to be at the camo this time around.  The Stormers still have 7 invitees -despite their atrocious performances ths year - and three of those invitees payed  amajor role in ensuring the continued poor performances.   I would never have invited Jantjies, De Jongh and Aplon to the camp.

I wonder what Meyer see in Kankowski - inviting him ahead of Philip van der Walt - who has been by some disatnce he best SA no  8 this year.   However, Meyer is a coach who use a lot of eyewash to mislead the public - he would still come up with his stanadar team - and most of the 38 new invitees will juts be sent back as not fitting in with his game pplan - whatever that may be.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

Have to disagree Rooi, there were two poor passes for the rest they were spot on. I dont recall the Bulls backs ever being under pressure, they were dominating the game.

I'm not saying Hougaard was on fire, he was solid, he certainly was not crap. Vermaak was as solid when he came on, adding nothing new to the way the game evolved, except for his well taken try.

Reinach has been mostly good and Piet v/Zyl was wrongly stuck behind Pretorious for much of the Cheetahs season, that has now changed thankfully. He has always looked the part. I do not get why Groom does not start for the Stormers, he is by far their best 9.

I am all for keeping faith with Hougaard and having v/Zyl, Reinach and Groom as back-ups. Vermaak is a good player but hardly an investment for the future. By all accounts Sharks Baby Bok scrumhalf Venter is a very good player - time will tell

Ou Maaik, that last post of yours has screwed up the margins. 

Not sure where you copied and pasted that from but please edit it.

Select and copy your text, delete it and then do a "paste special" into Word or Outlook using the "unformatted text" option.

Then select and copy the unformatted text and try pasting into your post again.

That should fix it.