CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
16 Sept 2013, 00:56#2
Saffex
There would be no comment from the Morne Steyn supporters - because they refuse to own up that he was crap yesterday. The final proof how really crap he was was when he missed finding touch with a penalty kick. That typified his performance throughout the game.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
16 Sept 2013, 02:03#9
The issue is about Morne Steyn and his rubbish performance - but Mozart must do his usual - try and avoid discussion of the topic. No mention of Morne - but onto his bête noir Engelberecht. If we discuss Pieter Steph - he calls him Stephanie and try to discredit him - even if he did not see the match yesterday.
But then topical discussion is not his strong point - fabrication and nonsense is. Poor Mozart - sometimes I am really sorry for him. .
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
16 Sept 2013, 02:27#10
Oh dear egg face is at it again. He switches from string to string as he gets blown out of the water. But let's forget the clown and take up your point Dave. Lambie was my pick at the beginning of the season as well. But he had an awful S15.....perhaps the main reason why the Sharks were nowhere. Every significant stat, including defenders beaten and metres per run were worse than Morne. his pass/kick ratio was also worse. In fact the lad has perked up since playing 15 again.
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I also think Morne was off yesterday, but look at the service from Pienaar. He missed one tackle in 10, including a fine tackle on Nonu in space. Sure he kicked once into touch and went for too much on one penalty....that happens about once a season. And if Goosen had made that last kick which was inch perfect to Kirchner for Lambie's try, they would be ringing the bells in Bloemfontein. So much of this is what a viewer wants to see.
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By the way your question about Smith....he made one clean break, and beat one defender for 33 metres. He was much more involved than JJ, not because the ball was passed to him....but because he looks for it. JJ is stuck on station out in his channel. Frankly in the last three games he was invisible. And sure he made all his tackles, but almost every one with help. Check his tackle on Messam in 22....he gets driven back 5 metres after which he gets help. Not the kind of tackle that's very helpful.
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In his last 12 runs JJ has beaten one defender....that's pathetic. Bring on Serfontein, these games require physicality....JJ is just not combatitive enough.
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
16 Sept 2013, 03:11#13
Dave if you look at Retalliks try you will see Smith picking up the ball off the deck, beating a tackle and laying on the try. He was on the spot, reacted and executed. He has rugby instincts. Even in a tight game we can expect our centres to beat some tackles. JJ is totally wooden, scared to do anything unconventional. I was afraid of this.....if he isn't put away, he is going to be a non event.Look at the break Willie made...he had no more space than JJ had in his 5 runs, but he was elusive enough to crack the AB defence.....JJ by contrast gets stopped with ease.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
16 Sept 2013, 04:53#14
The prima donna do at it again. Best to ignore the bloody fools.
Saffex
Let me say - Mozart is tryiong to make out that Steyn made two bad kicks as if it happens once a season - where he got that argument from only the prima donna can tell us. No word about his other aimless kicks that allowed the All Blacks to counter-attack.
He obviously blames Engelbrecht for the poor backline performance. Just for the record here is Engelbrecht's ESPN stats:-
Engelbrecht 0/0 0 0/1/5 19 0 0 0 0 9/0 0/0 0 0/0
The useless old fart is trying to hide the fact that Engelbrecht handled the ball six times during the whole gme. He passed the ball once and the other five times he carried the ball for a gain of 3,75 meters per carry. Not as if he did not make a positive distance over the gain line - but Mozart will never admit that.
I also looked at Steyn's stats which reads as follows:-
Steyn 0/1 5 7/20/1 4 0 0 0 2 9/1 0/0 0 0/0
Mozart is dead quiet about the two cases where he caused the Springboks to lose possession of the ball, but concentrate on his one missed tackle - but what about the opther cases where he was standing around and did not even attempt to make tackles.
You must realize that the two prima donnas you have to deal with here - will never see anything wrong in Steyn and keep on harping how Lambie was poor in Super 15 and how good Steyn was. They have no facts t0 prove their case in any event. But facts never count with them - fabrication does.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
16 Sept 2013, 06:43#16
Mozart
You said Lambie was poor in 2913 Super 15 and now you come and asked me for the stats. I had a look at the Test Rugby stats - because thy are summarized already.
There is no indication that he was poor - he was very much on par in all respects with Steyn - that is insofar as tackle stats, and his kicking game is concered. The Sharks very often did not kick at goal - but went for corner kicks instead - so Steyn ovisously kicked more at goal.
What is conveniently forgotten is that Steyn missed 24 kicks at goal - Lambie missed 21. Steyn cause loss of ball possession 12 times - Lambie did it 11 times. Carry the ball forward - Steyn did it 39 times - Lambie did it 36 times. Steyn made 86 tackles - Lambie 82.
The above indicates very ;little to chose between the two players - but Lambie has better ball sense than Steyn and he has BMT - which Steyn misses out completely. . In crucial games - like the Super 15 semi and the game on Saturday - Steyn lost the plot completely.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
16 Sept 2013, 11:57#18
Mozart
Crap as per normal. Flyhalfs often enough falls back to collect high kicks and gain many meters that way. They carry the ball 10 meters or more and then kick - that gives them extra distances in carries - so the answer is - it is of very little significance in game evaluation. I am not even going to answer any further - only you would be stupid enough not to realize the above.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
16 Sept 2013, 14:33#20
Ceradyne
This is not about the issue that I by accident left out the no 10 when I posted the team and afterwards clearly indicate that Lambie is my choice at no 10. Has it entered your thick skull yet that it is a discussion on Morne Steyn and why he should be replaced? It is not my mistake that is being discussed - it is your bird brain support of Morne Steyn - is it not?
SASaffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SASaffolk Captain30,741 posts
16 Sept 2013, 15:12#21
Disagree Moz, Conrad Smith has done nothing of note this Championship, he has been as solid as JJ has. Its tough for outside centres to make an impression and to start pointing fingers at him over nothing is clutching at straws.
JJ is anything but scared and has been good for the Boks at 13. Smith and Ashley-Cooper have been no better than JJ and that's a fact.
More to the point, the issue is Morne Steyn, the guy is a passenger in that side, much like Pienaar is.
We need Lambie at 10 and du Preez at 9 for the next two tests
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
16 Sept 2013, 15:41#23
OOm I ask you again....did Morne have more metres, more metres per carry, more defenders beaten per carry and more clean breaks per carrry than Lambie in the S15? Ah hell, you don't have the integrity to admit that, so I will for you......yes, yes he does.....by a clear margin.
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Lambie may fight his way back into a flyhalf role, but to parachute him in there ahead of Morne in these crucial tests is sheer madness.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
16 Sept 2013, 15:55#24
Mozart
You still don't get it - that kind of stats are really meaningless because a huge amount of distance is covered when a flyhalf falls back and receive a high ball ran 10 or 15 meters and then kick it. It is similar to the kind of stats of Taute - when he caught the ball at full back - did not kick it - but ran iinto traffic and got tackled. Many meters gained with ball in hand - but nothing in fact achieved. However, to explain that one is really meaningless - because dunderhead is too stupid to assimilate it.
To keep Morne Steyn after his dismal game on Saturday - and his caving in under pressure - is sheer madness.
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
16 Sept 2013, 16:07#26
Oh so now Morne played fullback. You really are confused.....but tell me how defenders beaten per run and clean breaks per run are affected by this new theory of yours?
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
16 Sept 2013, 16:31#28
I agree completely CC. In the last 3 games JJ has been a statue out there....typical of these fast guys who don't really enjoy contact. He either gets put away or disappears. Give me a trier like Serfontein any day.
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As forthe flyhalf situation, Lambie was virtually a basket case by the time the Sharks moved him to 12 and brought in Butch to salvage a little pride. Morne had an ordinary day at the office, except for that last brilliant kick which gets no mention at all and his fine tackle on Nonu. But he is still the only choice.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
16 Sept 2013, 16:38#29
Mozart
Are you a complete idiot - or just pretending to be one. I said many meters are gained by a flyhalf falling back to collect high kicks - got it through your thick skull yet?
OK to satisfy you - I went into ESPN and checked the first four matches played by Steyn and Lambie. in respect of Super 15 of each of the Bulls and the Sharks respectively. The results were -
Morne Steyn - made no clean breaks - beat no defenders and off-loaded 6 balls.
Lambie - made two clean breaks - beat 5 defenders and off-loaded 7 balls.
I really do not think it worth while to check all the games the two players played in sine there is a clear trend in the first four games played by each of the two players.
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
16 Sept 2013, 17:49#33
What new dimension? What you clowns just don't get is Lambie cant run in the flyhalf position...he is small, not particularly accelerative, has no step and can't bounce off tacklers. He is dead meat as a runner at 10, he never made one decent break the whole S15.. The runs he makes from 15 rely on his excellent reading of the game and hitting the ball at pace.
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
16 Sept 2013, 17:58#35
Your kind of book Wardad....the ones with the pictures and the nice big print. Hahahaha....all is revealed.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
16 Sept 2013, 18:03#36
Carpetmuncher
100% correct. Steyn do not have ball sense and is defficient in BMT (big match temperament) Crunch matches like on Saturday and in the Super 15 semi-final - Steyn goes AWOL or turn to rank stupidity - making school boy errors like missing a line kick from a penalty.
Mozart
Just one question - does Morne have a step and can' he bounces off tacklers? None that I have seen for years now. After Steyn's dismal display on Saturday Lambie could have made a difference if brought on. He certainly would not have been worse than Steyn was -- that was impossible.
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
16 Sept 2013, 18:12#38
Nothing to lose except confusing the flyhalf issue and knocking Steyn's confidence. Teams don't work like that. Subbing Steyn that early wasn't justified....Pienaar I can agree with, he had a shocker.