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FORUM / RUGBY /  Nigel Owens joins Craig Joubert

Nigel Owens joins Craig Joubert

Started by Mozart30 REPLIES744 VIEWS· 25 Nov 2013, 00:33
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MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
25 Nov 2013, 00:33
#1
25 Nov 2013, 00:33#1

.....two legends of NZ rugby. Every time Ireland made it into the NZ half, in the last 40 minutes, he found a reason to penalize them. But I saw AB bodies falling like nine pins in the rucks and nothing was called. Until that 80th minute penalty against Ireland. Really?


As for the conversion, wouldn't the right play have been to have sent the Irish back without the right to charge...rather than give Cruden in  essence a free shot?


I'm not sure why this whining Welshmen wielded a bent whistle, but for me he was oddly anti Irish. The ABs deserve great credit for their year and the way they kept fighting even after 80 minutes. A lesser side would have folded....but I think Ireland wuz robbed.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
25 Nov 2013, 00:35
#2
25 Nov 2013, 00:35#2
 I know why Moz........it's because he is bent
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
25 Nov 2013, 01:08
#3
25 Nov 2013, 01:08#3

Mozart


Maybe both have aspirations to go sheep farming in New Zealand.  

JW
Just_winCaptain18,570 posts
25 Nov 2013, 01:09
#4
25 Nov 2013, 01:09#4
In the first half Ireland was penalized once. What does that mean, is he Nigel bent one way in the first half and another way in the second half?
It was an exciting game to watch & all credit to the Irish, they played their hearts out. Not sure the ABs deserved to win if you look the full 80 minutes but like champions do they never lost hope and persevered. Cong rats to both teams for a game well played.
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
25 Nov 2013, 01:16
#5
25 Nov 2013, 01:16#5
 Moz, that is the law. If they start charging before he starts his run-up and he misses, he gets another shot.

(a) All players of the opposing team must retire to their goal line and must not overstep that line until the kicker begins the approach to kick or starts to kick. When the kicker does this, they may charge or jump to prevent a goal but must not be physically supported by oth er players in these actions.
(b) When the ball falls over after the kicker began the approach to kick, the opponents may continue to charge.
(c) A defending team must not shout during a kick at goal.
Sanction: (a)-(c) If the opposing team infringes but the kick is successful, the goal stands.
If the kick is unsuccessful, the kicker may take another kick and the opposing team is not allowed to charge.
When another kick is allowed, the kicker may repeat all the preparations. The kicker may change the type of kick.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
25 Nov 2013, 01:17
#6
25 Nov 2013, 01:17#6
 Probably Nigel was nobbled at the half....to quote Bertie Wooster.
JW
Just_winCaptain18,570 posts
25 Nov 2013, 01:19
#7
25 Nov 2013, 01:19#7
 Well Moz, Bertie has my full respect on most matters but on rugby? Fig Newton probably knows more, lol
MO
moolaaPro2,380 posts
25 Nov 2013, 01:22
#8
25 Nov 2013, 01:22#8

 Mozart, are you that desperate to see the ABs lose? Open the other eye bud!

Owens let the Paddies harass Smith at the ruck all game without penalising them for off-side. The first Irish try was a rort as clearly the ball was dropped. That didn't come from Owens but from the gutless TMO.

The ABs clearly didn't bring that maul down near the end as Owens looked to give the Irish a helping hand to win!

So have another look.....all that help and they still couldn't hold on against the best team in the world; they didn't deserve to win after all that assistance!!

WA
WardadPro6,663 posts
25 Nov 2013, 01:40
#9
25 Nov 2013, 01:40#9
 More ref whining ,amazing considering how the ref was apparently against the boks last time this time its against their new found team of the week Ireland pfftt i though Mozart had more character .Nope just more of the "enemy of my enemy is my friend " rubbish ,get over it cos as usual you guys never see the other team infringe do ya ?ABS Congrats ! too much character and class ,commiserations to Ireland sadly for them they arent as ruthless .Once again Wardad has no problems with refs .
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
25 Nov 2013, 01:42
#10
25 Nov 2013, 01:42#10
To be honest Vlag I'm not sure of this law. But in this case Owen stopped the players by signing and sent them back. They obeyed his instruction and retreated. At that stage were they still illegal? 
Moola I could give a toss whether Ireland beats the ABs....I call it as I see it. If you recall I congratulated NZ for their undefeated season last week, little thinking Ireland could mount a challenge. But being candid, my impression was NZ got a lot of calls in the second half. The penalty at minute 80 was a case in point.  
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
25 Nov 2013, 02:13
#11
25 Nov 2013, 02:13#11
Wardad if you want to see some ref whining, read the match thread, and the comments by your fellow countrymen. It seems there is a different standard for NZ whining.  
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
25 Nov 2013, 02:16
#12
25 Nov 2013, 02:16#12
 That is the law as it stands in the 2013 lawbook, Moz. If they charged early or even just crossed their own goal line, he had to send them back and have him retake the kick and they were not allowed top charge again. Remember that under normal/legal circumstances they are allowed to charge the moment that the kicker starts his run-up, so it is actually a double sanction. I have not seen the incident because I was switching between the GP and the rugby. I have downloaded the lawbook, but will get the link to the lawbook. 
JW
Just_winCaptain18,570 posts
25 Nov 2013, 02:18
#13
25 Nov 2013, 02:18#13
Moz: I haven't watched the Jeeves series in years but have it on DVD so you have sparked my interest. My wife is American & never could get into it but I read the books & enjoyed the TV series. You seem to remember ol' Bertie so you must have liked it?
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
25 Nov 2013, 02:20
#14
25 Nov 2013, 02:20#14
The link, Moz. You will not that on this page, there is also a video clip.

http://www.irblaws.com/index.php?law=9 
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
25 Nov 2013, 02:33
#15
25 Nov 2013, 02:33#15
Vlag I notice Cruden made a comment about his stutter step prior to starting his run up, apparently thats what threw the Irish. But if you think about it, if the kicking team gets an automatic second shot, the better play is for the chargers to continue and disrupt the kick and so deny him two opportunities. 
JW I actually didn't much like the TV series with Fry as Bertie. I loved the books though...hilariously funny and an easy read.

CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
25 Nov 2013, 02:50
#16
25 Nov 2013, 02:50#16
 It will not help them to keep on charging. Check the law. If they cross the goal-line and the kick goes over, the kick stands. If he misses, he gets a second chance and then they are not allowed ti charge at all. Same with a penalty kick. 
There are some other laws around kicks as well. If he has not started his run-up and the ball falls over, he can place it again, but the clock keeps on ticking. His time limit does not stop while he resets the ball.
If, however, the ball falls over after he has started his run-up, he has to carry on. His only option then is to pick it up and drop-kick it. If the opposing team have started charging after the kicker has started his run-up and the ball falls over before he can kick it, they can carry on charging, provided that they have not started charging before the kicker has started his run-up.
RE
redsmanPro1,710 posts
25 Nov 2013, 05:22
#17
25 Nov 2013, 05:22#17

 Clearly the AIG conspiracy LIVES ON!!!!!!!! now even the more balanced posters are starting to see the clear, evident and blatant manipulation  of the AIGs and world rugby....

 

Shameful for the game and WHY ??? I guess AIG must be paying the right people....

 

PE
poi-ePro1,044 posts
25 Nov 2013, 06:01
#18
25 Nov 2013, 06:01#18
 You should be grateful the AB's bother to keep OZ rugby afloat, can't even turn a profit on a Lions tour year, clinging to the well managed NZRU as a crutch, beset with talentless players with shitty attitudes, I give Folau 12 months and he'll be signed for the Sydney City Roosters. 
The reality is Oz rugby would die if the NZRU allowed it, sometimes I think we should put a bullet in the ARU but then again I enjoy watching them get their arses handed to them year in year out
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
25 Nov 2013, 09:19
#19
25 Nov 2013, 09:19#19
Cloudy, what happened with the conversion was technically interesting....but by then the Irish win was already gone. Frankly, the rest was less compelling.
I have never claimed to be silent on ref issues, although rarely do I use them as an excuse for the Boks. Sometimes though you get a sense something is afoot. In the Boks vs France game too many decisions went the French way, I commented on those in another string. And in the Irish vs AB game, Owens blew the second half differently to the first....why one wonders? 
To me there were several players off their feet at the 80 minute penalty and at some of the prior rucks. That penalty was entirely at the refs discretion, nobody would have said a thing about it, had he not called it. But he did....and again that's interesting.

I'm not a believer in any conspiracies, but I do believe individual refs develop agendas on given days....preset notions of what they ought to do. To me Owens had that look about him in the second half. Take for example the penalty for taking Sexton, I believe, in the air. It was so obvious in real time,but there'd never called it....until the howling crowd forced a review.
As I said last week the ABs did what the Boks failed to do in 98.....play to the last second of the last game. That's rugby glory. At times it just seemed like Nigel wanted tone part of the plot.
But I could be wrong. That's the beauty of opinion.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
25 Nov 2013, 09:45
#20
25 Nov 2013, 09:45#20
Vlag my point is, if a second kick is going to be awarded any way, why not carry on the charge and do your best to disrupt the first kick. What's the point of meekly trotting back, as Ireland did, if two kicks are already in the cards.
Usually in rugby, eg at rucks, if the ref gives you an instruction and you obey, you avoid the sanction. It appears not to be the case with conversions.

It's an interesting technicality...nothing more.
JW
Just_winCaptain18,570 posts
25 Nov 2013, 09:52
#21
25 Nov 2013, 09:52#21
 Strange how our experiences differ. As a schoolboy I knew the law about charging the kicker & that was so long ago I think the ball was a block of wood, lol
JW
Just_winCaptain18,570 posts
25 Nov 2013, 09:55
#22
25 Nov 2013, 09:55#22
 My take on the game is that we won by the skin of out teeth & the Irish played their best possible game.
It was a thrilling match, one all players will remember.
That very few on this site seemed to have enjoyed the game (except the kiwis) because most posters either don't want to talk about it or focus on the ref (some with legitimate questions but most with conspiracy theories.
Did you enjoy the game?
WA
WardadPro6,663 posts
25 Nov 2013, 11:47
#23
25 Nov 2013, 11:47#23
 Moz ,the Irish were tiring in the second half and starting to give away penalties as most do when out on there feet ,its just human nature when your utterly spent to make mistakes .And usually the team hot on attack gets the 50/50 decisions ,usually .The Irish made the stupid error opf trying to hang on to their lead against the best attacking side going .
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
25 Nov 2013, 12:15
#24
25 Nov 2013, 12:15#24
I totally agree with all three of you. JW it was a stupendous game and high drama...100 years from now they will still be talking about the last try after the 80 minutes were up...and we were there to see it in real time.
Cloudy I accept calls aren't perfect 

And Wardad I thought the same thing as the half went along, Ireland had stopped playing. It's actually an old Bok fault when we have a lead, so it was a familiar malady.
But still the Sexton kick  could have ended proceedings. He seemed frozen out there....like a golfer who can't pull the string on a big putt. Halfpenny or Morne would have slotted that kick..which is why coaches are so reluctant to leave then out the team.
JW
Just_winCaptain18,570 posts
25 Nov 2013, 12:36
#25
25 Nov 2013, 12:36#25

The question of the refs is really becoming an issue in the NFL now and they have even more chances to review calls. Not sure where all this is going.

 

Losses can be bitterly disapointing & when we have doubts about the ref it takes away from the game. The fact is that there will always be a few calls that we as fans dispute you just hope it is not a bad call that determines who won the game. But at the end if the day it should never get down to one call from the ref as teams have multiple opporutnites to win.

MO
MO(NH)Club Pro426 posts
25 Nov 2013, 13:17
#26
25 Nov 2013, 13:17#26
 I thought it was a great game of rugby and one that will be talked about for a long
time. Johnny Sexton was carrying an injury so his game was not as good as we expect from him, surprised he stayed on for so long but still is a class player.
At the end of the day we lost but played our hearts out.
I as you know have always been a great fan of the All Blacks, the best team in the world and as I said while the match was on if any team can come back and win it will be NZ. Many congratulations.
JW
Just_winCaptain18,570 posts
25 Nov 2013, 13:20
#27
25 Nov 2013, 13:20#27

MO, it was good to have at least one Irish supporter on the live thread. You could tell how nervous we all were, lol

 

Congrats on a game well played!

WA
WardadPro6,663 posts
25 Nov 2013, 15:08
#28
25 Nov 2013, 15:08#28
 Yes cloudy and they are getting better at it too they reckon ! They like having more games and players to mess aboot with !And my missus is annoyed at me still for waking her up with me shouting and wot-not !
WA
WardadPro6,663 posts
25 Nov 2013, 15:32
#29
25 Nov 2013, 15:32#29
 Nah Cloudy you finished with a flourish last time just load up with as many kiwis as possible !And Moz i read every post on the live blog and saw very little ref bashing ,given the closeness of the game .I cant imagine saffas in the same circumstances holding their tongue about the ref ,they would probably start a farce book campaign or some such nonsense now thats what you call whining ,last time I heard whining that loud was from the turbo-props and auxlliary engines inside a Hercules !
MD
Monkey D LuffyPro6,277 posts
25 Nov 2013, 20:29
#30
25 Nov 2013, 20:29#30
@mozter,

heres my two cents on some of ur comments,,,

"Cloudy, what happened with the conversion was technically interesting....but by then the Irish win was already gone. Frankly, the rest was less compelling."
less compelling???
totally disagree, a draw against the All blacks is still better then a loss to the All Blacks.
there was also the matter of a certain 100% record at stake, cos lets face it, the All Black fans love this record and are so proud of the boys, as much as the majority of Bok fans here hate that record and are completely envious of the worlds greatest rugby nation.
Boks colour green has never been more appropriate, aye???

"To me there were several players off their feet at the 80 minute penalty and at some of the prior rucks. That penalty was entirely at the refs discretion, nobody would have said a thing about it, had he not called it. But he did....and again that's interesting."
several players off their feet at the 80 minute penalty anbd some of the prior rucks???
there were players of their feet the whole entire game.
ireland were serial offenders in the first half here and got away with it, and the All blacks adapted in the second half to give them a taste of it as well.

the off ur feet penalty in the 79th minute against irelands mcgrath though wasnt for being of their feet, it was because mcgrath the No17 used his hands in the ruck.
ownes made the comment to ireland mcgrath was off his feet, but that was a misspoken mishap on owens part, cos the ruck was formed and it wouldnt have mattered if mcgrath was on his feet or not.
also worth noting that seconds before the penalty, nigel owens told mcgrath to leave the ball alone, he had a clear line of sight at it the whole time.

"I'm not a believer in any conspiracies, but I do believe individual refs develop agendas on given days....preset notions of what they ought to do. To me Owens had that look about him in the second half."
i believe that refs d develop agendas too, all those clever tactics by ur boohoo countrymen and their facebook pages and bombardment on social media where they rip into the refs, the recent embarrassing highlighting of the so called preferential treatment of the All Blacks by fatboy mackenzie and may others, despite irrefutable evidence to the contrary.

all this has an effect on the refs today, its why the All Blacks have been getting pinged a lot more then usual, as refs are determined to check nearly every single thing the All Blacks do. i mean, look at the 5 min autopsy on the final try, first it was the last pass, then it was the second to last pass, can u name any other team who gets that much scrutiny???

i believe like u that refs come out with their own set agendas, unlike some people though, i dont believe that theres anything dodgy, just differnt levels of incompetence.

thats why McCaw is the king, as he has always said, u need to adapt to the situation, and its clear the All Blacks adapted given the smart way they executed their get out opf jail free card.

"As I said last week the ABs did what the Boks failed to do in 98.....play to the last second of the last game."
no real surprises there though, aye???

"That's rugby glory. At times it just seemed like Nigel wanted tone part of the plot."
i felt the exact same way, cos nigel did everything he could in the firsthalf and in the 80th minute to give the irish their first win,
but the All Blacks arent the kings of every rugby playing nation for nothing, adapt to the situation, or else reduce ur fans to a sniveling pathetic mob who play key board warrior on facebook and what have u,
MD
Monkey D LuffyPro6,277 posts
25 Nov 2013, 21:25
#31
25 Nov 2013, 21:25#31
CONGRATULATIONS TO THE MIGHTY MIGHTY ALL BLACKS FOR AN UNPRECEDENTED 100% TEST WINNING SEASON!!!



08/06/13    All Blacks v France 23-13 (2:1) Eden Park, Auckland
15/06/13    All Blacks v France 30-0 (3:0) Rugby League Pk, Christchurch
22/06/13    All Blacks v France 24-9 (2:0)     New Plymouth    
17/08/13    All Blacks v Australia 47-29 (6:2) Stadium Australia, Sydney
24/08/13    All Blacks v Australia 27-16 (2:1) Westpac Trust, Wellington
07/09/13 All Blacks v Argentina 28-13 (3:1) Waikato Stadium, Hamilton
14/09/13    All Blacks v South Africa 29-15 (4:2) Eden Park, Auckland
28/09/13 All Blacks v Argentina 33-15 (4:0) La Plata
05/10/13    All Blacks v South Africa 38-27 (5:4) Ellis Park, Johannesburg
19/10/13    All Blacks v Australia 41-33 (4:3) Otago Stadium, Dunedin
02/11/13 All Blacks v Japan 54-6 (8:0) Prince Chichibu Stadium, Tokyo
09/11/13 All Blacks v France 26-19 (2:1) Stade de France, Paris    
16/11/13 All Blacks v England 30-22 (3:1) Twickenham, London
24/11/13 All Blacks v Ireland     24-22 (3:3) Lansdowne Rd, Dublin

very proud of u boys, and just look at that list of tough opponents, and u conquered them all.

friday the 13th is commonly known as black friday, so no surprises that the All Blacks should rewrite history in 2013, cos it has been a black year and then some.

on behalf of the uchiha clan and most folks here on sarugby.com, we thank u All Blacks for doing what no other nation could ever or will ever do.

GO THE MIGHTY MIGHTY UNSTOPPABLE ALL BLACKS!!!
— END OF THREAD —

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