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FORUM / RUGBY /  Nine turnovers by our backs

Nine turnovers by our backs

Started by Mozart24 REPLIES252 VIEWS· 26 Nov 2016, 21:57
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MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
26 Nov 2016, 21:57
#1
26 Nov 2016, 21:57#1
2 each by Combrink, Venter, Jantjies and Goosen.....often in fine attacking positions. Our backs beat 3 defenders...Combrink alone missed 2 tackles.
BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
26 Nov 2016, 22:01
#2
26 Nov 2016, 22:01#2
 So they are a poorly coached outfit. These same players have done well against OZ and NZ backlines.Lets have some understanding Dr Mozzzzzz
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
26 Nov 2016, 22:18
#3
26 Nov 2016, 22:18#3
 Mozart
You blame the recipient and not the passer for sh!t passes going astray.   I think the whole team is a shambles and the coaching is non-existent.   I would say that this is the worst coach we ever had and even Meyer was better, 

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
26 Nov 2016, 22:27
#4
26 Nov 2016, 22:27#4
 You dont need coaching to catch the frigging ball. You dont need coaching to throw a decent pass.
XA
XaviPro1,924 posts
27 Nov 2016, 01:12
#5
27 Nov 2016, 01:12#5
 Players at this level shouldn't have to be coached how to catch, pass and run. Tackling technique should be perfected at school level. No matter how kak AC is as a coach, he didn't drop those balls or throw dying passes. 
BO
bobbok...Captain10,129 posts
27 Nov 2016, 02:19
#6
27 Nov 2016, 02:19#6
Matfield could assemble a team of oubalies & fatbellies & they'll give this klomp a klap .
CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
27 Nov 2016, 08:21
#7
27 Nov 2016, 08:21#7
 The usual nonsense from Mozart as expected.
When a team's confidence is at an all time low these things will happen.
These are class acts lead by a moron.  
Under Jones we'd have seen a different picture.
This quota delivered exactly as we thought he would. He was shown up as a donkeys ass way back in 07. Nothing's changed. He is still a donkeys ass.  
I am however pleased that Janse van Rensburg, Ulengo, Venter and Combrinck are no longer on Mozart's list of potential Boks. They join Pieter Steff Du Toit and Jaco Kriel ... both of which are destined to dominate the world if lead by the right level of competency.
Firing the coach is the first step to our recovery.

 

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
27 Nov 2016, 08:29
#8
27 Nov 2016, 08:29#8
 Quotas had very little to do with it.....the Beast and Casseim were among our best players yesterday. Jambo was about as unprepared as I thought, but no worse than Goosen, Faf, and our clueless centre pairing. jantjies of course was a disaster....but almost every dumb Bok fan was delighted when he became our flyhalf this year. Nope this is the result of mediocre talent as Naas finally admitted yesterday. We have repeated the Destroyli 2003 mistake of choosing every flavour of the day player. Jake got us out of that ....we need him again.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
27 Nov 2016, 09:08
#9
27 Nov 2016, 09:08#9
 We had the Mey er's disasters from 2014 EOYT and then we have the worst coach in history in Coetzee.   The selections were a shambles and Mozart is part of those shambles in support of certain players.
A typical example is his statement that De Jongh was organizing the defense of the backline when De Jongh failed to make his own tackles.   There are numerous other examples and the worst is his constant harping about some players when they were played out of positions they normally played in on lower level.
Instead of going to the core of the problem - Mozart blames individual players - especially those he constantly attacked in the past.   He supported  the appointment of Coetzee - claiming he was good as Stormers coach and then started to recant his original statement. 
His attack on players who score tries and assist in scoring of tries is relentless - according to him it is a deadly sin to score tries and assist in those.   He never ever mention that as a positive.   He claims that the players were trying unsuccessfully to play comprehensive rugby - but they were in fact playing Jake-ball rugby. 
Mozart must realize that he is not even remotely correct about players and player performances and that remains a problem in the players he supportsm, but mostly in the case of players he is prejudiced against.
          
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
27 Nov 2016, 09:08
#10
27 Nov 2016, 09:08#10
 We had the Mey er's disasters from 2014 EOYT and then we have the worst coach in history in Coetzee.   The selections were a shambles and Mozart is part of those shambles in support of certain players.
A typical example is his statement that De Jongh was organizing the defense of the backline when De Jongh failed to make his own tackles.   There are numerous other examples and the worst is his constant harping about some players when they were played out of positions they normally played in on lower level.
Instead of going to the core of the problem - Mozart blames individual players - especially those he constantly attacked in the past.   He supported  the appointment of Coetzee - claiming he was good as Stormers coach and then started to recant his original statement. 
His attack on players who score tries and assist in scoring of tries is relentless - according to him it is a deadly sin to score tries and assist in those.   He never ever mention that as a positive.   He claims that the players were trying unsuccessfully to play comprehensive rugby - but they were in fact playing Jake-ball rugby. 
Mozart must realize that he is not even remotely correct about players and player performances and that remains a problem in the players he supportsm, but mostly in the case of players he is prejudiced against.
          
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
27 Nov 2016, 09:20
#11
27 Nov 2016, 09:20#11
I think we all know who won the debate....game, set and match.
CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
27 Nov 2016, 09:20
#12
27 Nov 2016, 09:20#12
 Nah ... Jake would be better suited to a caretaker role till a real coach is found.
Long term plans with Jake as Bok coach would be another bad decision.
And yes ... quotas played a big role in our down fall this year. Paige, Bongi, De Jongh, Mohoje, Trevor, Beast, Carr and Jantjies all played a part in our rapid decline this year.
Try to wake up will ya??

 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
27 Nov 2016, 09:23
#13
27 Nov 2016, 09:23#13
 There was no debate - with Mozart debate is impossible in view of his defective rugby knowledge and prejudice.     
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
27 Nov 2016, 09:23
#14
27 Nov 2016, 09:23#14
 There was no debate - with Mozart debate is impossible in view of his defective rugby knowledge and prejudice.     
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
27 Nov 2016, 09:25
#15
27 Nov 2016, 09:25#15
So did Combrink, Venter, Lambie, Goosen, Faf, Koch, Lomp, Mostert and Whiteley....Bongi hardly played and the Beast was among our 3 best, who at least broken even and most often edged his opponent. It's easy to blame quotas, but they played no greater a role than they have played for the last 8 years.
CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
27 Nov 2016, 09:29
#16
27 Nov 2016, 09:29#16
 To explain things to you at every turn has really become tiresome.
I think I'll just let you wonder on in your own little deluded mind. 
I'm done!



MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
27 Nov 2016, 09:33
#17
27 Nov 2016, 09:33#17
Giving up....just like the players you wanted. Run away then coward with your tail between your legs and find another black person to blame. Loser.
3K
3ku1Pro2,580 posts
27 Nov 2016, 09:34
#18
27 Nov 2016, 09:34#18
 Well watching the game. When De Klerk through a ball to three men who all stood their and did not move. The third man then dropped it lol. It is like a comedy of errors. Showed me their is no communication their. Like not even the systems are their. Poor Poor Structures. Coetzee is the problem of course. But the players need to be held accountable. The reality is the talent in that starting xv should of beat Italy, and should of beat Wales. The attitude is just not their. The selections are an issue. But come on the talent you do have should be good enough to beat Italy lol. You can't tell me your playrs are that bad. 
CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
27 Nov 2016, 09:45
#19
27 Nov 2016, 09:45#19
 Throwing a ball is not passing it. 
These loop de loop throws from Faff after his initial run isn't acceptable.
We need a coach to step up and enforce his game plan ... not one who throws his hands up claiming innocence.
Who's the boss in the end? 
We saw the weak Meyer dominated.The result ... a loss to Japan. 
Now we have a weakling pointing fingers. Is it any wonder we've slumped to 4 wins from 12 this year?





   
GE
generaltitPro3,164 posts
27 Nov 2016, 10:05
#20
27 Nov 2016, 10:05#20
 Still some of you cannot see the real problem...this player that, that player this and so on...blah,blah,blah...it never ends...it is irritating, mindless, infantile and missing the real underlying problem.

Straining at gnats and mosquitos whilst gobbling and swallowing down camels and elephants

Blind guides who cannot see the wood for the trees.

We need revolution and complete over haul in rugby administration and coaching...not band aid fixes and cosmetic changes.

AC could have the cream of players world wide and lead them to destruction...that's very clear...suckers are Saffas...sheep in sheep's clothing...ha,do we ever think logically and deeply in this country...some of us are so insular in this country follow the herd,popular thought and lack daring to challenge... it comes out how we think,politics,sport and social inter action
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
27 Nov 2016, 16:16
#21
27 Nov 2016, 16:16#21
 Oh rubbish, we may need an overhaul....but a half way competent coach and some seasoned players to help the few youngsters who are viable is all that's needed to beat Wales and Italy.
TH
TheTraditionalistPro4,003 posts
27 Nov 2016, 19:59
#22
27 Nov 2016, 19:59#22
 Everything goes when it comes to denial.

The system, the confidence are poor pretexts.

SA rugby players have been blunder prone for a long time now. So much that it could be  (and was) interpretated as an attempt to get rid of the coach. It might be the case. That is the only way the coach is implied.

Other than that, blunders happened on too classical patterns to be blamed on coaching.

Against Wales, one ball was dropped on the first pass after the ball is released from a scrum. No pressure from the defending line.

On the contrary, this is on this kind of easy, familiar, frequent patterns that confidence is built on. Players start by succeeding in these patterns and gain confidence.

SA players do not manage to capitalize on these phases. That shows a deficient training because professional players are learned to make the most of these opportunities to build their confidence and instead of doing that, SA players keep ruining the opportunities.

As to downplaying Wales or even Italy, it is a big mistake. SA is a strong candidate for being the nation that got the least from professional means. Welsh rugby has big troubles, because of a lack of means. Wales did better though than SA.

The solution for SA is to do as the french are doing: accept that their rugby is not good enough to challenge for the crown and must be dressed to entertain their fans.

SA players are mediocre players who are asked too much. By reducing the ambition pressed on them, they will be able to produce a better looking rugby,even if remaining a loser rugby.

At the moment, they are trying too hard, beyond their skill levels. They are out of their depth.
sharkbok
sharkbokCaptain23,262 posts
27 Nov 2016, 20:58
#23
27 Nov 2016, 20:58#23
Some expert tips by the traditionalist. We could find this guy as the backline coach next year. 
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
28 Nov 2016, 05:29
#24
28 Nov 2016, 05:29#24
 The lsit of sub-standard players produced by Mozart is to be expected from him.  There are and has been sub-standard players in the team selete by Coetzee - but you would nevr find him mentioning any of the older players.   He would never mention players like Morne and Alberts being sub-standard and his dislike of vertain players for no reason at all relating to performance is the norm. 
So who were the sub-standard players on Saturday and throughout the test season?   Some had poor games outright -
*   Jantjies, Morne Steyn, De Klerk, Carr, Strauss, Mohoje, Alberts, De Jongh, Hougaard, Paige
The following were below par in all tests -
*   Lambie, Mapoe, Louw, Habana, Pietersen, Whiteley. Koch, Adriaanse
The following had limited opportunities in a miserable environment -
*   Van Rensburg, Combrinck, Van Zyl, Marx
The following on average was acceptable -
*   Mtawarira, De Jager, Etzebeth, Goosen (even playing out of his normal position),  De Allende 
The following were on average above average -
*   Du Toit'
Mozart's assessment of performance is seriously defective and normally prejudiced and based on one incident in matches. 

  
TH
TheTraditionalistPro4,003 posts
28 Nov 2016, 14:25
#25
28 Nov 2016, 14:25#25
 Expert tips? If only...

An assessment of SA rugby does not require expertise. That is the pity. If expertise was  needed, the situation could be hidden, the lack of proficiency disguised. Mouth pieces would be at work.

SA misery is that it takes very little knowledge to expose the ailments of SA rugby. All common, obvious points. You dont even need to be drilled in rugby to make the points.
Actually, it takes to ignore willifully the points.

That quota story is the best thing found so far to try to cover for the abyssal condition of SA rugby. It does not hold much once put to scrutinty.

SA rugby was unable to think the future. They clung to a glorious past,thinking it would be enough. 20 years of professionalism later, the gaps are showing. When others used the increased means to extend their training pool, SA failed to achieve that.
So much that to hide the failure, SA must introduce by force boosted non white players. 80 per cent of people playing rugby are non white people in SA. Not a single one is good enough to play in a team that has a level similar to Wales or Italy. In the meantime, teams like England or France have included homegrown non white players. Starting with a much meager pool.

No one needs to be an expert to observe that. It jumps to the eyes.

Many other things like the failure to advance the demands on the player. NZ has increasingly pushed the limits on what a player must be able to accomplish.
SA stuck to an old canvas, the strong man.
The worse of it, SA strong men are no longer that strong. Welsh or Italian are as strong or stronger.

That is one part in the lack of confidence of SA players: the image of themselves does not fit the experience on the pitch. They think of themselves as stronger men and found the contrary proven on the field.

What else do they have otherwise? Power? No. Flair? No. Cleverness? no. Fighting spirit? no. Nimbleness? no. Footsies? No.

They have nothing else.

SA rugby players lack confidence because they are unproficient at too many skills required to play modern rugby.

They are third league players wishing themselves top league players.
— END OF THREAD —

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