Pick the player then the captain?

Keo getting very passionate here and you may not agree with all this 

MARK KEOHANE writes the next Springbok captain must be a certainty in the starting XV. No player should be picked because of his captaincy credentials.(I agree this should seldom if ever happen))

John Smit and Victor Matfield rode the rugby gravy train in 2011 because of the incompetence of then Bok coach Peter de Villiers, who lacked leadership and the tactical acumen to manage and coach a team at the highest level. He relied too heavily on senior players past their prime and justified their continued selection based on experience, but their form in 2010 and 2011 was never good enough. (Well again I agree if he is refereeing only to Smit and matfield))

Heyneke Meyer, to be named Bok coach on Friday, does not suffer in the areas that so handicapped De Villiers.

Meyer’s focus will be to select the best available squad to play England.

And from that squad will come the captain.

No player should make the starting XV based on his ability to lead a side. South Africa is blessed with enough playing talent and enough leaders not to have to repeat the embarrassing situation of the 2011 World Cup when the captain was not good enough to make the run-on XV.

Whoever captains the Boks should not have his pedigree questioned. There are options and they include Stormers flank Schalk Burger, Sharks hooker Bismarck du Plessis and Cheetahs flank Juan Smith. Andries Bekker and Jean de Villiers are also very good leaders. Luke Watson, once the Kings play in the 2013 Super Rugby competition, is also a contender.(OH please surely NOT! - he is no tgood enough to make the team!!!!!)

Bulls No 8 Pierre Spies is an unknown as a captain and the Lions and Sharks captaincy duo of Josh Strauss and Keegan Daniel are not good enough to make the Boks’ starting XV. (Josh maybe good enoug - we shall see)

There can be no excuse that there is a lack of leadership among players in South African rugby. The notion that someone like Victor Matfield has to come out of retirement for Meyer’s first season in charge to remedy the lack of playing leadership has to be rejected. It is a load of bull. (hoor hoor!!!)

Matfield would no longer be good enough to command a starting place. His best days were between 2007 and 2009 when he had no comparison as a lineout specialist and an international lock, but his form in 2010 and 2011 was sub-standard and those thinking he performed well at the 2011 World Cup need to revisit his performances in the 2007 World Cup.

Matfield’s legacy is that he dominated the international game for five years. He is no longer that force. That he should even contemplate a return based on Meyer’s appointment is ridiculous. It smacks of arrogance. Matfield’s role, if any, should be as a lineout consultant and he can double up as a SuperSport analyst. His rugby knowledge is without dispute. His retirement should also not be disputed. There is a time to go in international sport – and Matfield’s was 24 months ago.

Burger has to be the favourite to captain the side, but it should also not be a given that the Bok captain has to be the captain of his provincial or regional team. Zinzan Brooke, as one example, captained the Blues and Sean Fitzaptrick, also in the Blues team, the All Blacks.

Leadership is a shared responsibility in Test rugby and any team whose coach relies so heavily on one player to be the captain is already vulnerable.

Smit’s leadership was always presented as the reason for his selection at the 2011 World Cup but in the final 20 minutes against Wales, when the Boks trailed, he was substituted. Ditto the quarter-final against Australia.

The best players have to make the starting XV. From that comes the captain.

South Africans need to learn from the history of the 2011 World Cup and demand the best start. The captain has to be secondary to the team. There can’t be any guarantees to any player, including whoever captains the side. Too much is made of who captains the side.

Meyer, whose skill has always been to build a team, has so much talent at his disposal that his eyes have to be on the now and not the past. Matfield, as a player, is very much the past. Matfield, in another guise, can be the future.

The same applies to Fourie du Preez and any other Bulls legend who feels he may be doing Meyer a favour by coming out of retirement. Who next, Frik du Preez? (Cant agree that a player at 29 is too old  -he could well added value being part of the mix.)

Must say Keo, right or wrong, doesn't mince his words!!!  Can't agree with everything but there is truth here.

Mark is exceptionally biased, people need to remember that

He also wants to follow the history of 2011, and forget the histroy of 2007 (when we won a RWC) where the captain was, by his own admission, not the best hooker at the time that he was apointed as the Bok Captain.

Keo is no more biased than anyone else - he gets it right and wrong like most of us. I do like the way he ehas  a view and states it and takes the flack  - sometimes warranted.

Too many writers really are too bland.

Who was the best SA hooker in 2007 then - I thought Smit was?

2007 Gary Botha was being called the best. Beeno how much rugby do you follow ? If Keo states his views then what makes him better than any other Journalist in the World. Or is he just your favourite ?

There are alot of great Writers around, but all they amount to is a writer.

Nothing more than Keo making his big push for Schalk to be appointed captain. Watch all his other lackies jump on the bandwagon. Keo is is a non entity.

The only senior player past his prime was Jean. Smit was solid, even outgunning Jannie at tighthead in 2009 when out of position. Matfield has never been bettered throughout his career. His last test totally slaughtering Australia. No excuses there. Without the quality of these players ther would have been no success at any point. Their ability and character is the only thing that got the Boks through Peter's tenure! End of story.

Leaders have to have followers. Schalk, Juan and Jean will have no problem in that regard. But if Spies is chosen, there will be discontent.

As for Look Watson.....he has to have groupies. The more mature blokes that people the Bok team , aren't going to follow that twit. 

Keo is what a good scribe should be....controversial. Take him or leave him but a dull or bland scribe does not sell newspapers. At times he'll get it right but it really doesn't matter, it's when he doesn't attract attention or provoke debate that he becomes a passing shower.

I find it interesting to note that Keo bleats that you have to start your best XV and the captain must be secondary. He even retorts that we must "learn from the past". Well Keo, what of 1999? What of 2003? both sides lacked the necessary leadership. 2011 was the result of biased reffing, but poor planning and player management didn't help either! Peter playung his first XV into the ground. Fact is that Smit and Matfield were standout players throughout the 2011 World Cup. Schalk is no Bok captain. There is no reason to justify his selection in the starting XV. He was one of the media darlings during the World Cup but offered lesser production than the very players Keo derides here! It's all laughable. Smit was a great captain because he could handle the many unique challenges our national side poses. You have got to select your captain first and foremost. Straeuli got it wrong and payed the price, Mallett got it wrong and payed the price too. The 2003 starting side was severely lacking in synergy, experience, leadership and ultimately maturity. We have got to drop this nonsense and sober up. Messing Smit around in the first place only hindered Smit's playing ability. Granted, he came through for us, but it was always a rash and stupid idea. It needs to be taken into consideration here. Juan for captain. The only logical and sensible option.

Denny I have to agree. He stimulates debate  and in my view has courage to make a politically incorrect point. He gets it wrong no doubt about it. Suggesting Luke as a possible Bok captain! Hahahhahahahaha  - no ways is Luke remotely good enough as a player to make it unless he has improved enormously since he was last in SA. We have fantastic loose forward talent at the moment.

Gary Botha in 2007 better than Smit. Methinks not!!!! Jinxed the first hooker to overtake Smit was Bissie and that came later.

In 2007 Smit deserved the hooker position and Jake made the right call. I can't recall any major campaign to get Gary installed as hooker but quite possibly there were the maak al die bulle bokke types callling for this. Hahahahhahahahaha every one of the bulle players are of course legends! All the ne wplayers starting this year fo rthe bule are of cours elegends in the making. Hilarious stuff!

How many posters here are bulle fans? 

Card Juan will first have to recove from his Achilles tendon. Ask becs just howserious these injuries can be>

Secondly he has to win back his place.

Thirdly remember that Schalk was SA player of the Year. H ei ssur eof his Bok place

Finally Bissie is probably the best hooker in the world (and recognised by many as such) and in his prime. He should have started in the WC quarters. Matfield was a faded flower. I can only hope he does not come back to foul up the Bok tight five.

Meyer make the right choice and install Schalk Burger a scaptain. Do not allow matfiled back as a player.  Fourie Du Preez at 29 can still be considered if his form allows it. He is not too old

@ Beeno

i didnt say Gary was better, but if you were up to scratch on your rugby you would know who our 2 hookers were in 2007. And you would also know that the debate around him was because he had captained the Bulls to a shared Currie Cup title months before the World Cup.

I am astounded that you do not know this. is all your rugby knowledge based on the last 3 to 4 years ?

@Beeno1. In 2003, Gary Botha was the better hooker between the two of them, without any doubt. John Smit said so himself. That was John's major issue when Jake aproached him. It is a wellknown fact (that John was concerned about it). Do you not believe it, or is it just a matter of you not knowing about it? Zaibatsu is 100% correct there. The whole issue about John Smit and the captaincy is well documented. You can say what you like about the situation. Jake White took a lot of flack in the media when, almost the first thing that he did when he got the job as the national coach, was to anounce John Smit as the captian for RWC2007. He took a lot of flack from many people for a long time, until as late as the '06 TN. The general feeling among the public, and many prominent rugby people, was that John was not the best hooker. Rudolph Lake, another journo who likes to spill it like Keo, lodged a drive early in 2007 to have Jake White fired and John Smit with him. In fact, there was even a huge front page article in Rapport at the time, by the very same Lake, that predicted that White was about to be fired. Like we know, it later came out that there were indeed major moves to have him removed.

@ceradyne

looks like we have a paint by numbers rugby enthusiast, Beeno if you need pointers i am sure we can help you out. Gary Botha was the Stand out Hooker in 2007 where were you

Oh please Cera and co no ways was Botha better thn John in those days. What are you gus smoking. Smit was a fine hooker and added the necessary grunt to the tight five. Gary was not in his class!!

Jus becasue the bulle won in 2007 did not make Botha better than Smit!! If tha twere the case all the bulle should hav ebeen bokke - Bwahahahahahaha

No please lets not make rash statements like Gary  should have got in before Smit!

So your source Rudolph Lake wanted Jake fired. Hahahhahahaha he wanted to fire the coach who guided us to a WC win. This is the standard bearer you quote of the campaign to replace smot with Botha. Hhahahahahahahahahaha sidesplitting stuff!

I just cant understand why you want to join this egg magnet Lake who will never live down thsi blunder in judgement. Major moves by minor minds - they sure ended up looking very foolish.

Take it from Beeno -  Smit was the right man at that time. Well done jake for having the nous to see what ou lakey was unable to see.

Is lake still writing or has he been fired or maybe  he is just a comic writer now?

@ Beeno

Rudolph Lake writes for sport24 and Rapport.

try reading something beyond Keo...there are lots of other heavily bias journos in the world , why commit to one only.

Hi - jinxed, may I suggest commiting to a journo is NOT the approach you should take. Commit to the truth.

Look, the Springboks need a real captain, Schalk is not a good decision either.... time to look at someone completely different and new, i'll even pick Captain Morgan above Schalk anyday !

@Beeno, you obviously do not believe what John Smit has said himself, do you. So, no use debating that issue any further. Then you also do not believe that Rudolph Lake was behind a drive to have Jake fired. Eish. Ignorance is bliss, apparently. Lake is not my source. He actually wrote the article, and they had a discussion with him on the TV-program SuperRugby the next Monday night about the issue.

@Beeno

I dont know what you mean about commiting to the truth, but i have just offered up information for you and you seem to begrudge that. what is wrong with you , do you not enjoy healthy debate ? If somebody provides you with morte accurate information on a topic, you should extend both hands and take it.

I will try and base my rugby opinions on what i have seen. not on what i dream up.