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Rugby politics/geriatrics

Started by ForeverArizona3 REPLIES108 VIEWS· 26 Apr 2014, 03:24
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FO
ForeverArizonaClub Pro580 posts
26 Apr 2014, 03:24
#1
26 Apr 2014, 03:24#1

Read the article on Rugby365 about Jaques Fourie making plans to play in the 2015 RWC.A few comments on this topic were interesting.Some were very upset about this and others were upset about the fact that most players play rugby abroad and then get selected for the Boks.

The fundamental issues here remain the same.The economy is of such a state that Saru cant pay what the overseas clubs are paying for top quality talent.But what then about bringing in young guns that can really fit the game plan.Guys like Lappies and Boom.Held out of the team by F Louw playing for Bath.The thing is,with pretty much all of them it is the case that there is a lack of consistency.To be a top player means top performance all the time,not just some of the time.Then there is also the fact that if they were better then none of the overseas players would be considered.In the example of Fourie du Preez who by some distance on a bad day is still way better then the next in line...who ever that might be.It was proved last year.That ball came out a lot quicker from the rucks.Snail Piennaar can only watch and learn.But the key here is the financial reward.Until Saru are willing to pay what players are really worth we will see the exodus continue.

Then there is the obvious color problem.In SA it seems yo be that if you are a young white male sports man,you are better of playing abroad.The so called quota system will ruin our rugby and fuel the exodus further.

But one interesting thought...at a world cup,should not the best 22/27 players be selected regardless of age,taking in to consideration that no one over 50 FFS should be selected...meaning if he has s 18;19 or 36...The best in form player should go.

What are your thoughts on that?

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
26 Apr 2014, 04:06
#2
26 Apr 2014, 04:06#2
. Our YE team was filled with older players....but the results were good. Was that an accident, or does the shrewdness of a Victor or Bakkies trump the fact that they are off their physical best? The answer lies in the middle.
Bryan Habana 
Victor Matfield
Bakkies Botha
Gurthro Steenkamp
Schalk Burger
Jean de Villiers
F du Preez
Jaque Fourie
JP Peterson
Jannie du Plessis
Andries Bekker

Almost every one of these players would add to the Springbok team if none of the others were included. But how many can you include before you start losing freshness and physicality? That is the question.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
26 Apr 2014, 06:00
#3
26 Apr 2014, 06:00#3
Mozart 
The list of older players mentioned by you is not complete.   the question is where do you start when adding to that list - start at 30 year old and older.  If so - you must add Morne Steyn and Willem Alberts to that list as well.   
Freshness and physicality - what a load of crap.  Lets look at the list of players provided and the two additions:-
*   Bryan Habana always was and still is a very top class player 0 he certainly adds value.  
*   Victor Matfield thus far in Super 15 took some line outs but for the rest is nit physically on par.  He just vanishes from sight in most games as he is nto competitive in tight phases of play.  
*   Bakkies Botha was mediocre in the tests he played in he showed no freshness and vitality     *  Gurthro Steenkamp does not make the starting line up for his club Toulouse and he is so far removed from being a Springboks as the west is from the east.  Grossly over-weight as well.
*   Schalk Burger - is he injury-prone - looks very much like he is.   Always was a clever player and at least he knows how to pass balls.
*   Jean de Viliers - even though he has thus far in Super 15 showed signs of slowing down and being less effective than he was last year - he is still the best inside center we have.
*   Fourie du Preez - excellent in the Argentina test last year and less noticeable in succeeding tests,  Still a potential candidate.  
*  Jacque Fourie is slow as a carthorse - acceptable in defense and useless in attack.
*  What is JP doing on that list 0 he is 27 years old -  slow as a carthorse and his work rate is as slow.
*   Jannie du Plessis' standard game can be described as useless and totally ineffective.
*   Andries Bekker - has last played for the SStormerslast year and no recent info available.
*   Morne Steyn cannot make the Stade Francais starting line up and plays in most games from the bench for ten minutes.   Proven flop - the French found out his limitations within a month  - we took years to that 
*   Willem Alberts did well in the limited scope he operates in in Super 15 this year - his most recent games were pathetic.
So insofar as performances are concerned = only three players should be in the Springbok squad.  The rest has no vitality and freshness in their games anymore.  Looking at Super  15 this year - it is evident that time for major change is necessary 0 our team performances has gone back in a massive way.          
FO
ForeverArizonaClub Pro580 posts
26 Apr 2014, 09:04
#4
26 Apr 2014, 09:04#4

 Mike

You have a very negative opinion about some quality players that we have.Dont know if it is related to your day job...I know those that work with money have the same hum-drum attitude.Although I have to agree with you about Bakkies Botha and Victor Matfield.Both should be back home coaching younger locks...not playing anymore.The younger guys we have also have enough experience under the belt.I rate Flip,Lood,Bekker and van der Merwe highly to pair up with a fit Ethzebeth.

 

But here is the thing,RWC are not won with pure talent.Experience mixed with youth wins world cups.In 2007,Os du Randt was in the 95 squad...Percy was well in to his 80th game and then mos of the forwards had done 60 games at least or near enough.That is a well balanced side.And that is the trick.Maybe Matfield is a key for the next RWC.Maybe the young guys need a player like that around for confidence.I don't know.Who knows.

 

As for the guys we have now,Alberts may be not your cup of tea,and he might be slow and all the other stuff,but they don't call this guy the bone collector for nothing.A must have,either as a super sub or a definite start.

 

At flyhalf again...you knock Steyn.Its the lesser of two evils here.You will never have a perfect flyhalf...jusy because no one is perfect,but you can have a hard working flyhalf and Morne has done just that.Let the guy have a career holiday in France.Hell since 2008 he played flat out for the Bulls,Boks and made a great success of it.Just remember,it was a Steyn penalty in the last minutes of the second Lions test that sealed the deal.When you knock him agian,think of that moment.Funny thing,after a disaster of injuries at flyhalf for the All-Blacks it was a sub...Stephen Donnald that kicked the All-blacks in to thehistory books.A bog ordinary player,much like Steyn,but cometh the hour...cometh the man.I have no doubt that Steyn will most likely sit this year out...It maybe Meyers plan to rest him up.Knowing that from time to time he will get some game time.We might be in for a thing at ten this year,my gut says Steyn F...but keep a.close eye on JLP.

 

But still politics might ruin it all for us with hopes of laying in to the All-blacks.They master the basics to let the flash take care of itself.We should learn from that.One player does not make a team.It is how ever a fifteen man game.We need to utilize all our strengths as best we can.

— END OF THREAD —

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