It’s a disappointing squad in my opinion especially considering our opponents - there was an opportunity to blood more new players and discard some of the older players or rest some of them
So given the squad my test side would be:
15 Fassi
14 Kolbe
13 Moodie
12 Willemse
11 Arendse
10 Sacha
9 Williams
1 Ox
2 Marx
3 Wilco
4 Eben
5 RG
6 Kolisi
7 Cobus Wiese
8 Roos
16 Marnus vd Merwe 17 Wessels 18 Thomas 19 Vincent Tsituka 20 Kwagga 21 vd Bergh 22 Pollard 23 Hooker
We're looking a little thin in the loosies at the moment. Kolisi might show up or might not and Roos is still an unknown.
I don’t share your concern - we have more depth at loosies than anywhere else - sure it’s not test experience but then again it’s time to build on that
Against Georgia I’d go with
15 Willemse 14 Moodie 13 Moodie 12 Hooker 11 Edwil vd Merwe 10 Sacha 9 vd Bergh 1 Wessels 2 Marnus vd Merwe 3 Thomas 4 Moerat 5 Cobus Wiese 6 Kwagga 7 JL du Preez 8 Roos
16 Marx 17 Boan Venter 18 Nthlabakanye 19 Nortje 20 Vincent Tsituka 21 Williams 22 Libbok 23 Esterhuizen
Agreed on Georgia but I’d have Moody at 12 as well.
By the way nobody seems to be talking about it but Wessels got killed in the scrums on Saturday….
I like the idea of Cobus Wiese at 7, hopefully Hanekom is back soon and Kolisi gets an offer from the Chicago Bears,
Yes Wessels was trumped on the engage - he conceded the advantage a good few times - it was a technical issue not a power or technique one
Like I said earlier I guess his development is not aided by playing hooker one week then loosehead the next
You could spot it was a technical issue…man you’re good.
Well it was pretty obvious - if you are slightly late on the engage you concede the scrum advantage, which is what was happening with Wessels
Watch and learn
Sounds like your usual bulldust Dave…nice try though. Most scrums wheeled up and to the left, which suggests Wessels was cracked. Hard for just one side of the scrum to be late…or hadn’t that occurred to you?
Oh boy you really don’t get the details do you?
I do, you think the loosehead wasn’t attached to the hooker.
I have to agree opportunity missed here. I would have use these week games to get the next gen team off the ground and get them to play together and then make a decision during the Aus visit to SA and decide which players should continue and will be on the plane to NZ and which players will be dropper for good. I think that beating NZ in NZ is a big carrot, especially Eden Park. That will give SA a massive psychological edge.
It is a funny season when it comes to the lions tours as you don't get the strong teams touring your shores.
Barbarian, Italy x 2 and then Georgia are the perfect primer to bring some of the boks up to fitness and conditioning while giving the fringe boks a crack.
I would have gone with the youngest possible team. I don't know why Rassie persist with Kolisi.
In his recent interview he exposed his thinking when questioned about Roos. He was making excuses that Roos doesn't quit fit into his game plan and that he has players like Kolisi and Kwagga that can play 8 and that is better at 8 then Roos. That just shows short sightedness and we see Kwagga trying to play 8 and getting destroyed. It also explains the Dup Twins never gets a crack and it also explains why we see the reluctance in getting an out and out 8 at the back.
Roos has upped his game and doesn't matter getting stuck in.
I do believe it is a colour thing and Rassie team is a looking a few shades light these days. Bongi, Tevvvaaa, Kolisi are his front line brothers that are fading and he doesn't any replacements. So in come Trokkie. I think Trokkie is another overhyped player that is good but not great. He had a crack at the Stormers and never really showed his promise. He is very physical and have been effective for Northampton. But what is his work rate like? He doesn't seem to have the speed of Roos.
SA has always been successful with a really great 8 in Spies, Vermeulen, Teichman and Skinstad. I think it is a pity Hanekom couldn't make it due to his injury thanks to Kolisi falling on him Illegally.
It will be a long day for Rassie to try and find some brothers to appease the politicians
Oh wow so in your world all four props in a scrum engage at the same time and that there is no such thing as gaining an advantage by a split second quicker engagement by one of the props?
Nice All Black backline!
I really like your midfield combo. Explosive and wonderful defenders too.
Both have the ability to burst a game wide open.
I wouldnt want Doos in my starting 15.
He blows too much hot and cold and fades away sometimes.
I'd go with Kwagga or the new African representative.
What rugby you been watching Roos has been good all season. I really don’t get what some viewers are missing
Kwagga is literally a useless 8 - far too small
Kwagga is never good as a starter, his strength is off the bench.
Have to agree on Kwagga, wasn't it the Lions series or one of the test series, they picked him at 8. He took all the kick-offs and got obliterated. It works when he comes on in the last 20 min because he has had a chance to watch the game and figure out how to make an impact, but when he is straight onto the park there is no space for him hide.
It will be interesting to see who will make the bok 8 his number.
BUT, we know Rassie likes Swiss Armier knives and he doesn't always pick out and out players that master their position as we have seen with Willemse, Fourie, Kwagga etc. He always look at players that can plug hole, not only when they get injuries during the game but in the squad. He would far rather use a squady then bringing in a specialist.
I think Rassie values players higher that is in the system rather than those that is not. That is why we kept seeing Jantjies, Moerat, Libbok geting picked even when they are out of form and costing the boks the game.
My only fear is that we are losing specialist that can make a big difference
It will be Wiese at 8 for sure. With PSDT out it will be interesting to see who he picks at 7
Squad options are Cobus Wiese, Nortje, Vincent Tsituka and JL du Preez
Oh wow so in your world all four props in a scrum engage at the same time and that there is no such thing as gaining an advantage by a split second quicker engagement by one of the props?
Right the front row engages as a unit, not as individuals….they are attached. You find that confusing?
Fuck me Im laughing my head off
Rofl….who engages first the tighthead or the loosehead…..brilliant these guys. It probably takes 1/10 th of a second to close the gap and within that space of time Leinster sent their tighthead first.
Without doubt, the Leinster tighthead engaged seconds before Wessels - go check out the first scrum
The earlier engage puts your opposite number at a disadvantage - you are on the back foot before the shove takes place
Wessels was exposed technically
Seconds before Wessels…..,,,waaaaaaaaahahahaha….dumbest comment since Vaccine claimed the 17th century explorers were vaccinated
You really don’t know your rugby do you?
I mean that sincerely
Sincerely one whole front row can go early, usually penalized. But no, an individual prop can’t go seconds before his opponent . Trust me, you don’t want to go saying stuff like that in your local pub.
Brilliant so all three in a frontrow engage at exactly the same time, it’s not possible for one of the props to eat up a second or two (it’s all it takes) before the other on the engage
Bwhaaahaaaa - brilliant
I guess all frontrow players are programmed robots in your world
Chat - is it possible for a loosehead prop to engage before his tighthead does
In theory, no — but in practice, yes, it can happen, though it’s not ideal and often penalized.
In Law:
Under World Rugby’s scrum engagement sequence (“crouch, bind, set”), the entire front row is supposed to engage together. That means the loosehead, hooker, and tighthead on one side should move forward in unison, meeting the opposing front row as a coordinated unit.
So by the laws of the game:
In Practice:
Yes, a loosehead can end up engaging slightly before the tighthead — usually due to:
This can lead to:
Game set and match as always - one would think that after all these years you wouid know the obvious things that take place in a rugby match.
You still think a 2m tall blindside should compete on the deck or that modern test 12’s spend their time attacking space
‘Slightly’ is the operative words, not seconds. But given they are attached it’s so slight as to make absolutely no difference. If you don’t take the hit as a coordinated unit you are going to be splintered.
in all the scrums after the hit there was a neutral pause after which Wessels went backwards. I like Wessels, but at this level he looks vulnerable. He probably should play hooker.
And yes Lawes fetches, Dud Toit should fetch and not bottle out as he did in the last breakdown before Ireland made their drop.
And yes there is absolutely no point to a center like Dud Allende who never breaks the line or offloads.
If there is a one in 20 chance of a turnover ….20 Dud runs of a meter have a statistical outcome of minus 10 metre.
You have been owned yet again
You know your rugby on a surface level - it’s the details that escape you - frontrows are robotic, 2m tall blindsides compete on the ground and inside centres attack space all test long
Bwhaaahaaaahaaaaaaaaaa
No you have just repeated your fallacious beliefs
4/10
1 Jan-Hendrik Wessels
It was a tough outing in the scrums for the Bok. He was under pressure in the first scrum, which gave Leinster a penalty and it set the tone for the rest of the first
..
Okay I went through the scrums….zero and I mean zero evidence of Wessels being beaten to the engage. All the scrums started as a neutral….Wilco turned Porter in a few times, but Wessels after a few seconds got lifted and pushed back. Which wheeled the scrum anti clockwise, a sure sign your loosehead is being dominated, as reflected in the comments above.
The only thing that is a virtual certainty is that Willie will play in two of the 4 matches involving the Springboks and then be retiring and joining Erasmus' coaching program. Erasmus said in 2025 is that he would like Willie to et to 100 test caps and he is now on 98.
Well of course you saw zero evidence of being beaten on the engage as it’s totally behond you
Fuck me you were convinced that it was not possible for a tighthead to engage earlier than his loosehead - enough said
Your take on passages of play are about as accurate as props engaging at the same time
Case closed - you have been owned yet again
Based on the piss poor squad we have I will start with the following team to play against the BaaBaas and while we wait for players to be eased in. I would give some of the URC / Prem and French players a bit more time and only bring them in around the 2nd Italy test, (3rd game) or even the Georgia game. I would then pick my best team agains Aus and make a selection based on performance who gets on the plane to NZ. I don't think I would send a green team NZ, I want the guys to win, but then again, I might pick inexperience players to feel the pressure with seasoned players on the bench to soften the blow.
Here are my picks
This team is just to try the youngest possible team, but only 4 uncap players.
Then for the 3rd match I'll try pick my strongest team
But then again, a lot of talent on display here. If I can pick my team for World Cup based on who is here then there will be some additional names. I'm really interested to see how Jizzo does. Can he crack 13. Moodie did really well there against the All Blacks but struggles to play there under White.
With no injuries, I think my best team would probably be as follows.
I still think we need some wings, 9's and another fullback option. We can't have Wilie at 39
Zero evidence….but your rebuttal should be easy. Give us the timestamp of the scrum where Clarkson engaged early.
The first scrum
I’m torn between the old and the new - we really do need to move on from the old players but equally it’s hard to ditch players that have served us so well. As Rooi said, the thought of ditching Mapimpi on current form is crazy but
My players in order with an emphasis on youth
15 Fassi / Jordan Hendrikse / Gelant
14 Kolbe / Edwil vd Merwe / Tambwe / Zas / Jacobs
13 Am / Julius / Moodie / Henco v Wyk / Jessie
12 de Allende / Willemse / Hooker / David Kriel / Esterhuizen / Rickus Pretorious
11 Arendse / Green / Horn / Sebastian de Klerk / Hartzenberg/ Davids
10 Sacha / Pollard / Libbok / Masuku
9 Williams / vd Bergh / Papier / Nohamba / Jayden Hendrikse / Jantjies
1 Ox / Steenkamp / Wessels / Mchunu / Boan Venter / Matanzima
2 Marx / AH Venter / Dweba / Grobelaar / Bongi / Marnus vd Merwe/ Mbatha / JJ Kotze
3 Wilco / Thomas / Malherbe / Hanro Jacobs / Frans Klopper / Nthlabakanye/ Sadie
4 Etzebeth / Ruan Vermaak / Cobus Wiese / Jenkins / Moerat / Andre Smith
5 RG / Ruben v Heerden / JF v Heerden / Lood / Rahl / JD Schickerling
6 Kolisi / Kwagga / Buthelezi / Theunissen / JC Pretorious / de Villiers
7 PSDT / Elrigh Louw/ JL du Preez / Vincent Tsituka / Ruan Venter / BJ Dixon / Ludwig / Nortje / Gumede / Liebenberg
8 Roos / Hanekom / Dan du Preez / Manu Tsituka / Wiese / Augustus / Dayamani / Horn / Morabe
I’d love to see this side take the field:
15 Fassi 14 Kolbe 13 Julius 12 Willemse 11 Arendse 10 Sacha 9 Williams 1 Ox 2 Marx 3 Wilco 4 Eben 5 RG 6 Hanekom 7 PSDT 8 Roos
16 Wessels 17 Steenkamp 18 Thomas 19 Cobus Wiese 20 Kwagga 21 vd Bergh 22 Pollard 23 Moodie
Back up side:
15 Jordan Hendrikse 14 Edwil vd Merwe 13 Hooker 12 David Kriel 11 Green 10
Libbok 9 Papier 1 Mchunu 2 Dweba 3 Hanro Jacobs 4 Ruan Vermaak 5 Ruben v Heerden 6 Buthelezi 7 Vincent Tsituka 8 Elrigh Louw
16 Grobelaar 17 Boan Venter 18 Frans Klopper 19 JF v Heerden 20 Manu Tsituka 21 Nohamba 22 Masuku 23 Henco v Wyk
The first scrum? Right I’ll report on it shortly
Okay the first scrum at minute 2.40, Leinster feed. They go down and actually the Bools push first, Leinster responds and the scrum goes down. No sign of Clarkson engaging early and the scrum is reset.
They engage at exactly the same moment on the reset…Clarkson drills Wessels backwards and the whole Bools front row is driven back for a penalty.
I repeat, no early engagement by Leinster, the two front rows engaged as two units. Wessels makes a slight forward move, but is down on his knees……one can see the ref looking at his legs. The lift from Clarkson allows him to regain his feet, but he is going backwards…..the Bools are penalized.
There was no early push from Leinster, the Bools engaged properly, but Wessels was dominated.
Perhaps you should stick to your theory that centers can’t line break, at least that’s a little more vague even if complete nonsense.
ROFL!