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FORUM / RUGBY /  Steppie stats...is a turnaround possible?

Steppie stats...is a turnaround possible?

Started by Mozart14 REPLIES224 VIEWS· 29 Apr 2014, 02:57
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MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
29 Apr 2014, 02:57
#1
29 Apr 2014, 02:57#1

In his second year Serfontein is having a painfully ordinary S15. With his inside step manouvre he is gathering 3.45 metres per carry and has made all of three clean breaks in 73 runs! His tackling at 85% is on the lower bound of acceptable. More crucially we are seeing nothing unusual from the lad.

 

Serfontein, playing in SA against foreign youngsters looked good at age level. He was heralded as the next big thing. But over a year later there isn't one golden moment to hang one's hat on....just a series of workmanlike probes.

 

So what are the chances he could start to really influence games, even at the S15 level? Well the strongest point is his youth....unlike mid career JJ he has time. But does he have real talent that shines beyond effort and competence. Jean was loafing much of the game on Saturday. But then he decided to play and ripped two holes in the Cheetahs defence...does Steppie have that talent?

 

It would appear not. Firstly he appears to be of average pace, no more. And while he is a sturdy young chap, he is not strong in the Roberts mould. His pass seems fine, but not unusual and he doesn't seem to see the field very well.

 

If I were advising Jan, I'd suggest he look at every tape he could find of Tim Horan....a player with similar attributes who beat the Boks in the RWC semi in 99. Tim did that stepping off his outside foot, but he did it when there was space to be had....and then immediately cut outside, not inside.

 

There are so many of these steppers who bomb...Jan's predecessor Olivier being a classic case....it's obvious the Horan's are few and far between. Somehow I doubt Serfontein is one of them, but he has time on his side.

SH
ShezzaPro2,471 posts
29 Apr 2014, 03:25
#2
29 Apr 2014, 03:25#2
 I am not going to trust your stats as the ones you have used for you're argument for De Jong's amount of tackles an De Allende's are wrong. 
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
29 Apr 2014, 07:03
#3
29 Apr 2014, 07:03#3
Shezza, check again in the relevant string. I did the comparison as fairly as possible.....using the same matches. Anybody can make a mistake, but I'm a bit old school about honest numbers.
BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
29 Apr 2014, 12:10
#4
29 Apr 2014, 12:10#4
I am backing Jan to come through. I can't give details but he ran back to save a try by the opposition and his pace looked good. Moz do you re call that incident - he was up against speedsters.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
29 Apr 2014, 13:00
#5
29 Apr 2014, 13:00#5
 Beeno
Mozart is completely mixed up insofar as the pace issue is concerned.  He thinks that Serfontein has a speed deficiency - but that his favourite players (the Steyns) have adequate speed,   He constantly carry on about Lambie and Serfontein lacking pace - bit refuses to recognize that the Steyns are slower than those two.  In the case of the Steyns lack of pace is no problem whatsoever.  
I would not take note of some of the statements of Mozart  - they are figments of his imagination.  
BO
BoklogicPro1,978 posts
29 Apr 2014, 15:48
#6
29 Apr 2014, 15:48#6
 Mike, what role does Frans Steyn and Willem Alberts have to play in global warming and the crime in SA??
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
29 Apr 2014, 18:11
#7
29 Apr 2014, 18:11#7

HasBEEN I know you are backing Jan, he is a nice South African boy and everybody said he was going to be great. The trouble is great centres are explosive when they are young ....O Driscoll, Mortlock, Jean, Joubert, Fofana.....these guys all scored great tries in tests at a young age. But Jan hasn't had any chances at centre in tests you say. And I say, what about his 10 odd S15 games this year....has he made one great run....just one? Jordaan, Jean, de Jongh and Sadie have all had super moments. Poor Jan has acumulated about 100 inside steps.

 

There is no evidence that this kid will ever shine in top company. It's not that he is too slow, but he doesn't have outstanding pace, strength or elusiveness.....you need two out of the three....or otherwise one dominating strength like the power of Roberts or Frans.

 

I'm afraid this is another media miss.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
29 Apr 2014, 18:55
#8
29 Apr 2014, 18:55#8
What utter rubbish.......there is no context to this at all........how much good ball has Serfontein received this S15.........about as much as Frans has and Jean for that matter.

Frans has done nothing of note all S15 and but for a moment or two, Jean has been poor.

So to say Serfontein should have created more from nothing when the established Boks around him have been average at best is laughable.

If Jan was messing up good ball and not making an impression, then I'd be concerned. Fact is the lad is 20 and has more attacking clout than Jean or Frans ever had.....he is a far superior player aged 20 than Jean was.

Serfontein is a class act who needs to be employed in an attacking game plan, not the 10 man rugby the Bulls play.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
29 Apr 2014, 19:06
#9
29 Apr 2014, 19:06#9
He has had 73 runs. In any case metres per run, is not impacted by how many runs he had....your kid has an English education, ask him to explain.  As for blaming the Bools....Pollard showed again last week how to crack the defence, Steppie tried to butt out of his way. All bullshit.
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
29 Apr 2014, 19:19
#10
29 Apr 2014, 19:19#10
73 runs means absolutely nothing as it provides no context and no doubt Jean and Frans have had just as many runs and created just as little.

Pollard is hardly on the park and a 10 making a break has stuff all to do with creating space for his 12...........of course you have to blame the Bulls game plan on the lack of activity from their centres.......the Bulls dont advocate an attacking style of play, so how the hell are their centres meant to shine? Geez its bloody obvious.

Have Jean and Frans shone on attack? NO, so why on earth are the rules different for Serfontein........I am not stupid enough to conclude that Frans is shit because he is not creating something from nothing. A centre can only operate with good ball.......centres generally get very little good ball to work with in the modern game and the reasons are bloody obvious
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
29 Apr 2014, 20:07
#11
29 Apr 2014, 20:07#11
Your good ball is a myth.....the guys are getting mostly the same ball....a bit of space, a man blocking their path....the great players find the space. It's always the same story when your guys fail....played out of position, not enou gh games to settle, poor ball, poor game plan. I guarantee you all that could be true, but a Fofana, a Roberts, an SBW a Jean make the breaks. And that's the calibre Steppie will play against in the RWC.....it's a losing proposition.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
29 Apr 2014, 20:36
#12
29 Apr 2014, 20:36#12
Mozart
I will take serious note of you usage of stats the day you do a statistical evaluation of Francois Steyn's performances thus far in Super 15.   Also the day when you do a comprehensive overview of a specific players full set of stats - not only part of it that fits your arguments.
While you have dome the stats on Serfoontein be good enough to do a similar exercise on Steyn and De Villiers and make a logical comparison of the achievements of the three players.  Don't do one and say that one is insufficient - the others may be insufficient as well - so do a full job and enlighten us with your findings.



SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
29 Apr 2014, 20:46
#13
29 Apr 2014, 20:46#13
Well therein lies your problem.....Jean has made no more breaks than Jan has this S15, Roberts has had a year to forget, Fofana has made no impression at the business end of the Heineken Cup (hell he made 12m after getting the ball 15 times!!!) and had a very average 6N's by his standards.......so throwing their names into the equation changes nothing when it comes to Jan.

Fact is modern defences are so organised and tight that centres are offered very little ball in space to work with......the great centres utilise those fleeting moments of space to make an impression, or if you are SBW you make space by forcing it, something Frans should be doing.

Jan has long proved he has the skills to make that impression in space......it does not help that his opportunities are far less than the majority of centres out there based on the Bulls game plan........you simply cannot ignore this fact.

JJ, Jan, Jean, de Jongh, Sadie and Frans have done as well as can be asked of them given the limited opportunities they are presented with......the same applied to the centres playing for Sarries in the semi on Sat......Barritt and Bosch had little action in a 46-6 win
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
06 May 2014, 02:39
#14
06 May 2014, 02:39#14
ok Cheezer....you are outed.  
SH
ShezzaPro2,471 posts
06 May 2014, 05:40
#15
06 May 2014, 05:40#15
 You really are stupid, how about you read other peoples comments. The reason I didn't carry on that argument was because other people had already debunked you.
— END OF THREAD —

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