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FORUM / RUGBY /  The Bok side that should be playing Samoa

The Bok side that should be playing Samoa

Started by Saffolk 33 REPLIES704 VIEWS· 20 Jun 2013, 15:56
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SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
20 Jun 2013, 15:56
#1
20 Jun 2013, 15:56#1
Lets face it we have been crap and this has much to do with the wrong players being selected. My side would have been: 15. Willie 14. Mvovo 13. JJ 12. Serfontein 11. Habana 10. Lambie 9. v/Zyl 1. Beast 2. Strauss (c) 3. Coenie 4. Lood de Jager 5. Etzebeth 6. Kolisi 7. Labascagne 8. CJ Stander 16. Bismark 17. Nkanyane 18. Jannie 19. Flip 20. Coetzee 21. Groom 22. Jantjies 23. de Allende
CA
carpetmuncherPro1,667 posts
20 Jun 2013, 16:37
#2
20 Jun 2013, 16:37#2

like the looks of the team.....if du toit was fit i would have put him in. the side looks a tad on the green side in terms of exp but at least there is talent there

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
20 Jun 2013, 18:07
#3
20 Jun 2013, 18:07#3
Reinach will be back next week - I believe and would prefer him to both Van Zyl and Groom. As this is premusably a team for 2015 WC in mind - I would prefer Goosen at flyhalf and Arno Botha at 8.
CA
carpetmuncherPro1,667 posts
20 Jun 2013, 18:10
#4
20 Jun 2013, 18:10#4

if fit i would also go with goosen and reinach but i am not sure how there injuries are coming along though

BL
bluebokPro3,977 posts
20 Jun 2013, 18:36
#5
20 Jun 2013, 18:36#5
Saff, I'd have Morne starting and Lambie on the bench, but other than that....good team. And before people start having a go, Lambie has done even less than Morne this year, and is therefore the lesser of two evils. and Jantjes is just too much of a risk. First choice, as has been mentioned, would be Goosen.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
20 Jun 2013, 18:41
#6
20 Jun 2013, 18:41#6
Hahahaha.....who is Lood de Jager?
BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
20 Jun 2013, 18:45
#7
20 Jun 2013, 18:45#7

Some very poor selections snaster and glaring ommissions. Hereare the corrections:

15. Willie 14. Mvovo 13. JJ 12. Serfontein 11. Habana 10. Morne (Loftus) 9. v/Zyl 1. Trevor 2. Strauss (c) 3. Coenie 4. Flip 5. Etzebeth 6. Louw 7. Labascagne 8. Alberts

CJ Stander is I thought unavailable - he has set his sights on playing for Ireland?

16. Bismark 17. Beast 18. Jannie 19. De Jager 20. Coetzee 21. Groom 22. Cat 23. de Allende

Snapster a bad blunder re Louw. Against the physical Samaons I think Flip is a good bet. Beast is playing lethargic rugby - give Trevor a shot - all Cheetahs front row so combos no problem.

BD
Big DaveRookie74 posts
20 Jun 2013, 18:50
#8
20 Jun 2013, 18:50#8

 Lood de Jager is a hard nut to crack he weighs 125kg. 

GE
generaltitPro3,164 posts
20 Jun 2013, 18:50
#9
20 Jun 2013, 18:50#9

Yes... This a real test for weakneses. Inovation is the only way we will win. A very good result of this minor test series to know where we stand in the next WC.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
20 Jun 2013, 21:35
#10
20 Jun 2013, 21:35#10

 Um Mike, this is my team to play Samoa this weekend. Botha and Goosen are injured. 

 

Blue there is no way I would play Morne, am bored with him, have never been a fan - time to move on. Lambie is far more talented player.

 

Moz you cant be serious, Lood is the giant Cheetahs lock who has many many a S15 side this year. Better option than passive Kruger.

 

Beenkop, you must be mad - why retain the useless Morne just because he is at home, stuff that. Beast stays, Trevor on the bench. Lood is the future, he is better than Flip. Louw is no opensider and its time to move on. CJ Stander is twice the player Alberts is.....if I was coach, I'd give him a call in Ireland

BL
BlikkiesPro1,526 posts
21 Jun 2013, 00:42
#11
21 Jun 2013, 00:42#11

Hahahaha.....who is Lood de Jager?

Ligtoring Landmans' pal :)

 

(Both are Cheetah locks).


 

OI
oimateyPro1,870 posts
21 Jun 2013, 01:52
#12
21 Jun 2013, 01:52#12

An excerpt from an interview with CJ Stander earlier this year:

"Before you left for South Africa, you said you'd be open to representing Ireland. Is that still the case?

I've watched the Six Nations recently, and it looks like a very competitive and exciting competition. If the chance to play for Ireland came my way, I'd definitely take it. I first have to go through the three-year residency policy before I can qualify. I'm currently on contract with Munster until 2015, so we see how things go.

What if Heyneke Meyer gave you a Springbok call-up?
That's obviously something I'd look into. I know I was in a Springbok training squad last year and captained the Baby Boks. But South Africa is blessed with plenty of quality loose forwards, so I doubt I'll be considered."

 

 

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
21 Jun 2013, 01:58
#13
21 Jun 2013, 01:58#13

Which proves stupid Meyer should have secured CJ's services - what a twit

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
21 Jun 2013, 03:23
#14
21 Jun 2013, 03:23#14
Saffex Must admit - I do agree with you about Stander - he is top class. I like him and with Botha, Labuschagne and some other youngsters around - we certainly don't need the likes of the under-performing Spies and Alberts around. Mozart wrote off Labuschagne before he actually saw any of his performances and he discovered a new rugby term "system tackler" to do just that. De Jager was in the fantasy teams of a lot of members and was generally regarded as a more than solid selection by participants. That in itself shows that his performance throughout 2013 was top class, Mozart apparently similarly wrote him off - because he cannot call line outs or something silly like that. Like the youngster very much as a future prospect, Meyer is a dolt - and he has proven it over and over again.
SP
SpooonyClub Pro718 posts
21 Jun 2013, 03:32
#15
21 Jun 2013, 03:32#15

Mvovo? What the fck have he done this year? Absolutely f all. Why people keep selecting Willie at 15 truly baffles me. Trying to make place for names is not a good idea.  I would rather play Aplon before Mvovo at least Aplon go look for work but I guess he is too small will be the reply. 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
21 Jun 2013, 05:40
#16
21 Jun 2013, 05:40#16
Spooony My problem with Aplon is defence - he is vey weak in respect of that aspect of the game. I am also favouring Mvovo ahead of Basson - he made some impression this year in the games he played in and he was good under high balls - which in his case was weakIsh in the past.
CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
21 Jun 2013, 11:46
#17
21 Jun 2013, 11:46#17

 

I have a horrible feeling we're gonna be beaten by the chubby Samoans tomorrow.

 

If we are, somehow I still doubt we'll see any changes from Meyer coming through for the RC. 

 

 

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
21 Jun 2013, 11:58
#18
21 Jun 2013, 11:58#18
Spoon you have clearly missed the S15 this year, Mvovo has been our best wing - catch a wake up. Aplon is too small and now too old to worry about in the test arena
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
21 Jun 2013, 12:25
#19
21 Jun 2013, 12:25#19
Cleancut I have a bad feeling about the test against Samoa as well - I really am uneasy about the number of passengers selected by Meyer. That said - I am expecting a marginal win or even a draw or loss at worst. And yes - Meyer would never admit he is wrong about selections and change things for the Rugby Championships.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
21 Jun 2013, 12:25
#20
21 Jun 2013, 12:25#20
Cleancut I have a bad feeling about the test against Samoa as well - I really am uneasy about the number of passengers selected by Meyer. That said - I am expecting a marginal win or even a draw or loss at worst. And yes - Meyer would never admit he is wrong about selections and change things for the Rugby Championships.
CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
21 Jun 2013, 12:36
#21
21 Jun 2013, 12:36#21

Do you think Meyer's aware of our "expert" opinions?

 

If not ... do you think it a good idea to advise him of his foolishness? Give him clarity of thought so to speak!!??

 

Nothing personal ... of course. All for the betterment of the Mighty Springbok.

 

The shit hit the fan in Lawrence's life when he favoured Oz over us at the last WC..

 

Maybe we should start something similar on Meyer's FaceBook page.

 

Expose him to the talent we have in the land and to certain players like Stander and Kockett who may be lost to us if no action is taken.

 

Just a thought!!

 

 

HA
hakwaPro4,146 posts
21 Jun 2013, 12:48
#22
21 Jun 2013, 12:48#22

good to see Samoa being given the respect they deserve!

BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
21 Jun 2013, 12:48
#23
21 Jun 2013, 12:48#23

"That's obviously something I'd look into. I know I was in a Springbok training squad last year and captained the Baby Boks. But South Africa is blessed with plenty of quality loose forwards, so I doubt I'll be considered."

What a cop out. Here he is as a youngster in the Bok training squad. He then says if called up he would look into it! Man how good of him to look into it. His enthusiasm knows no bounds.

The total cop out is "But South Africa is blessed with plenty of quality loose forwards, so I doubt I'll be considered." So I doubt I'll be considered - so I am off to Ireland to earn the biggger bucks to be made there. I hope I wont be considered it sounds like to me.

Sorry snaspter but this wont wash. I think Stander was good enough to play for the Boks but it is blatantly clear what his intentions are. Blaming Meyer is ludicrous and another kneejerk - its a bit like these Meyer bashers are epiliptic and have these jerks when ever something goes wrong.

BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
21 Jun 2013, 12:57
#24
21 Jun 2013, 12:57#24

Mike I totally agree with you. The Boks will certainly either win the game, draw or lose it. Anyone thinking otherwise hasnt a clue. 

I agree that injuries and some poor selections will hamper us but the fat samoans will be dealt with.

Time to turn up the heat Bookke and blown these Samoans away. No cheap shots please samoans.

 

 

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
21 Jun 2013, 15:59
#25
21 Jun 2013, 15:59#25
Beenkop, what part of CJ saying he would play for the Boks if selected do you not get. More to the point, that fool of a Meyer should have selected him last year. The man is too stupid to realise that there are jewels out there that he is missing and some he is chasing away. Look no further than CJ Stander and Brussouw - add Quinn Roux
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
21 Jun 2013, 16:24
#26
21 Jun 2013, 16:24#26
Why in heavens name is a guy with lead in his pencil a Bok candidate.....Lood de Jager.....you have to be taking the piss. Look for years Dave I have been telling you Flip Flop is all but useless. You have told me I'm full of it. Now you want to select Lood ahead of Flip Flop in his prime. Does that say I was right all along?
BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
21 Jun 2013, 16:41
#27
21 Jun 2013, 16:41#27

Snapster please. CJ Stander was in the Bok training squad as a very young player - he was being earmarked. There can be no doubt he would have been selected if he had stayed!!!!  So why did he go. Boodle in the bank.

why did Jaque Fourie, JP and Bekker go etc etc etc Try and see the economic realities at play here. Not even a Bok contract can hold some of these guys.

 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
21 Jun 2013, 16:54
#28
21 Jun 2013, 16:54#28
Mozart You obviously try to make fun of the name and it does sound funny. However, there is a very real reason for the nickname. Incidentally my mother's maiden name was De Jager - so I know h background to the De Jager family ancestry quite well. One of the traditional names in the family is Lodewyk - through the centuries - the nickname always given to the sons thus named have been traditionally Lood. It is similar to the case of the surname Labuschagne - where the persistent nickname is Lappies - irrespective of what the first name of the person is. It is quite likely that Lood is descended from an Albertinia family where one of my fathers friends were also Lood de Jager - who was a well known farmer in the area - farming not far away from where Louis Oosthuizen father's farm is.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
21 Jun 2013, 17:11
#29
21 Jun 2013, 17:11#29
Beeno You are really make me mad today - with idiotic claims. Of course money talks and earning a huge pension overseas is a factor. However, you are dead wrong about a few factors here. Take for example your statement on New Zeland players. There is a lot of them out of new Zealand and the latest well-known player decamping is Rene Ranger. Add the names of SBW and Kahui to name just another two players to the list, However, Hansn use All Black selection to keep talented players in New Zealand. That is unlike our local dolt who comes up with players like Steenkamp and co. Then take Stander and Roux for instance - they had no hope to get higher honours in SA. Meyer's dunce colleagues Ludeke and Coetzee made damn sure of that. Ludeke rarely put Stander in the starting line up for the Bulls and at times he was not even on the bench - he (Ludeke) believed in the donkey-style Potgieters. Similarly Roux was ignored by Coetzee. They both left since they saw no future for themselves in SA Rugby. End of story.
DD
dan danRookie46 posts
21 Jun 2013, 19:19
#30
21 Jun 2013, 19:19#30

 1. Trevor Nyakane

2. Adriaan Strauss

3.Coeinie Oosthuizen

4. Eben Etzabeth

5. Lood De Jager

6.Francious Louw

7. Lappies Labuscagne

8.Phillip va der walt

9.Piet van Zyl

10. Morne Steyn

11. Bryan Habana

12.Jan Serfontein

13.JJ Engelbrecht

14. Willie Le Roux

15. Pat Lambie

 

16.Bismarck du Plessis

17. Beast

18. Lourens Adrianse

19. Heinrich Brussow

20. Cobus Reinach

21.Jean de Villiers

22. Gio Aplon

23. Siya Kolisi

SP
SpooonyClub Pro718 posts
21 Jun 2013, 19:52
#31
21 Jun 2013, 19:52#31

Mike please show me where his defense fraighlties cost the Stormers? He is a winger and em you drift and its on inside shoulder so taking on Aplon you are taking on the touchline. Mvovo defense ain't better as well. And when you go on about defense you really are saying you wanna play kick and chase still? So what is the use of selecting a ataacking backline? Lomu wasn't the strongest defender did you think the AB gave a crap about it? No if he is worth a try or two worrying about his defense is not really a problem

  And for goodness sake those who think we can lose this. Are you out of your bloody minds. We are playing at Loftus. Altitude gives us at least a 16 to 20 point start over visisting teams.  

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
21 Jun 2013, 22:17
#32
21 Jun 2013, 22:17#32
Mvovo would be a great guy to play against Japan. But if you are playing NZ his chicken hearted play is going to get you in trouble.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
21 Jun 2013, 23:36
#33
21 Jun 2013, 23:36#33
Spooony With respect - if you check the stats on ESPN you would find that Aplon has a serious problem insofar as defence is concerned. In all the games he played in in Super 15 this year he attempted 40 tackles - 29 successfully and he missed 11 tackles. A missed tackle ratio on Super 15 level in excess of 25% is certainly not acceptable. I initial comments were based on my own impression of his defensive game and adter your comments I checjed the Stats
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
21 Jun 2013, 23:44
#34
21 Jun 2013, 23:44#34
Spooony I watched all the Stormers games this year was the defensive gaps and with respect the poor defence of De Jongh, Aplon and Pietersen. However, in view of the repect I have for your comments on the site - I then went to check the ESPN stats on Aplon and it - with respect confirms my impression. Insofar as Apkon is concerned in all the matches he played in Super 15 this year - Aplon attempted a total of 40 tackles. He made 29 tackles successfully and missed 11 tackles. A missed tackle ratio over 25% is totally unacceptable. However, what made it worse is the missed tackle ratio of De Jongh at 28%. Between the two of them with the addition of Pietersen they formed the backline defensive sieve I always talk about, This sieve certainly account for most of the Stormer losses this year - even though I have to add Jantjies own miscontribution as another reason..
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