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FORUM / RUGBY /  The Core of the Bok team

The Core of the Bok team

Started by Mozart13 REPLIES246 VIEWS· 08 Oct 2013, 17:01
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MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
08 Oct 2013, 17:01
#1
08 Oct 2013, 17:01#1

These players aren't necessarily perfect, but they are the players who made a difference. Players that accounted for more than 90% of our scoring. All other positions could have been occupied by different players without much impact.

 

 


 

Willie, Habana, Jean, Morne, F du Preez, Beast, Strauss, Bismarck, Etzebeth, Louw and Vermeulen.

 


 

The remaining players can and many cases will be replaced next year. But with eleven core players (ten really because of the hooker duplication) two thirds of the team is core. We need a fullback or Willie to move back there if JP becomes available. The return of JP is key, we have learned these old war horses play great rugby as they approach 30.

 


 

We either need JJ to become more of a combatant or find a new 13. He was aggressive for the first half on Saturday...but a negative factor in the second.

 


 

Tighthead prop is an issue. Plenty of players have been annointed....we need to see proof. At lock  I expect Stephanie to finally be ready next year....he wasn't as developed as Etzebeth at a young age, but by 25 he will be a great lock. But don't forget about Bekker, when fit he may be the more dominant option. I haven't been impressed by Lood, but then again, I haven't seen much of him.

 


 

Louw and Vermeulen are now established Boks....they both had outstanding games against the ABs. Alberts is a punishing player. I expect him to have a great YE tour. But ultimately Arno Botha would provide more pace. And it will be fascinating to see if Schalk can find his old form...all the joints should be thoroughly rested.

 


 

Expect a lot of RWC nonsense next year as talk of 2015 begins to dominate. This middle year between RWCs in a way is the best rugby  rugby year of the cycle. Fittingly it ended with the best test since 1999.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
08 Oct 2013, 17:44
#2
08 Oct 2013, 17:44#2

Mozart

 

Your problem remains that you are addicted to some really mediocre players - with undisputed hatred of younger players - whom you decried at any turn - basically without reason.

 

Basically you virtually always ignore deficiencies in some players and are bargaining on other players who are not available and will not be available for the Springboks next year.   Your take on Morne is a case in point.  Morne is at best an average flyhalf with very little if any attacking abilities and deficiencies in defence.   In th latter respect his missed tackle ratio in tests this year was 19% - which is between 6 and 9% too high - making him a defensive liability.   With Morne as pivot our game can never improve to a level where he we are really competitive.

 

Our loosie combination and line out performances are also seriously problematic.   Outside of the immediate fringe attacks our loosies were nowhere to be found on defence.    On occasion Vermeulen and Louw looked good in the tries scored by Habana - but otherwise rarely showed anything in attacking play and also limitations in defence away from the fringes.   Follow-up of attacking moves was non-existent - even the attack by Etzebeth was thwarted because there were no follow-up by any of the loosies.

 

We also need efficient line out performers - and I think that Arno Botha could play a role in that.   Arno however, is to my mind a very good option at 8.   I would say taking into account his enormous tackling ability - coupled to his good ball-carrying, breakdown ball recovery and turnover capacity as well as his top line out stats for any loosie in Super 15 - the player you probably hate moe than anyone else - Labuschagne is a better option.  You call him a weakling - but he weighs in at 3 kgs more than Botha and there is every sign that he is a very strong tackler and ball carrier as well.  he was he top-rated loosie in Super 15 this year and is likely to be the same next year.

 

Burger might come into the picture - but at 32 he is unlikely to reach the level he performed at previously - and we must take into account the needs for the 2015 WC as well 

 

Pietersen and Bekker at this stage are skyscrapers without foundation.   Will they come back and perform on the same basis in 2015 as they did before - since there are virtually no chance of them being back before then.   Overseas players tend to get soft when playing in Japan - and that makes their selections chancy at best.   Fourie Du Preez showed massive skill in the one-sided Pumas test at Soweto - but was not really a house on fire in the two latest tests - matter of fact he did make some mistakes and his performance was not as good as it should have been.   What will happen to the other Japan players coming back?  Nobody really knows.      

   

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
08 Oct 2013, 18:32
#3
08 Oct 2013, 18:32#3
I am very willing to change Morne for a flyhalf who is also a reliable kicker, but a better general player....but you guys pin all your hopes on Goosen. Will he ever be a healthy player....who knows. In the meantime Morne is our best option and according to 365 the flyhalf of the RC.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
08 Oct 2013, 23:28
#4
08 Oct 2013, 23:28#4

Mozart

 

Lambie is the present best option at flyhalf  - Goosen and Catrakillis future potential options.

 

At last a bit of a realization that Morne is not perfect - very reluctantly - and even the twisted idea that Morne is our only option at this stage.   That is based on Rugby 365, but how realistic is that one?

 

Morne and Sanchez were the only flyhalfs that played in all the tests.  The rest was injured and off and playing in some tests only.   So the only realistic comparison is with Sanchez.  The latter was in some aspects of the game better than Morne - his defence was definitely far superior - but he was playing in a losing side and often under pressure.   So Rugby 365 says Morne is better than Sanchez - great balls of fire - what a revelation!!!!

 

Now what about the loosie situation - when will it becoming clear top you that we are onto a losing situation there?  Never it appears.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
09 Oct 2013, 00:03
#5
09 Oct 2013, 00:03#5
Nonsense, JJ after Saturdays performance will be one of Meyer first names on the sheet......he will be the Bok incumbent for years to come. His performance against the AB's cemented his place. His display with ball in hand is just what we need in a 13........no other 13 in the country could have made those breaks.......look no further than the Savea beat as a precedent......it was awesome. That passage of play was the best by any test 13 all year........by some distance.........and against the AB's nogal. JJ is here to stay, he and Willie are our best attacking weapons.

Morne's performance all year will have Meyer hoping Goosen stays fit, for some unknown reason he has no faith in Lambie. Morne was the Boks biggest liability.

Of the youngsters, Serfontein, Coenie, Kolisi, Arno Botha and Steph du Toit are there to stay and the likes of Taute, Frans and Hougaard will return. We need JP back as well.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Oct 2013, 01:50
#6
09 Oct 2013, 01:50#6

By the way - I am just wondering - I may be wrong.  Is Sanchez not on contract with Stade Francais as well as Morne?   I think I read something like that somewhere.   If he is fact is - it would be interesting to see whom of the two the Club will prefer as starting flyhalf in the long run.

CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
09 Oct 2013, 03:44
#7
09 Oct 2013, 03:44#7
 Ou Maaikie, Morne Steyn and Stade Francais again....................... Sanchez has been playing for Bordeaux since 2011.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Oct 2013, 06:52
#8
09 Oct 2013, 06:52#8

Ceradyne

 

Thanks for the info.   I did not know what was the cade and appreciate your res ponse. 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Oct 2013, 06:52
#9
09 Oct 2013, 06:52#9

Ceradyne

 

Thanks for the info.   I did not know what was the cade and appreciate your res ponse. 

CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
09 Oct 2013, 12:04
#10
09 Oct 2013, 12:04#10
 So you did post a load of crock, without checking the facts, jus t for the sake of posting bullshit again.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Oct 2013, 13:37
#11
09 Oct 2013, 13:37#11

Ceradyne

 

Slap pieletjie - I did not state anything as fact - I asked a question and was thankful; for the answer.   So what crock did I post.   You really are a poor reflection of  a human being.

 

 

CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
09 Oct 2013, 13:56
#12
09 Oct 2013, 13:56#12
Ahhh, the name calling by the same man that craps himself over "personal attacks". What exactly was the reason behind your post, if it was not meant to be yet another effort of jumping on your favourite boring subject again? Let's be honest, you weren't ever sure whether Sanchez even played in France or not, were you?
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
09 Oct 2013, 14:11
#13
09 Oct 2013, 14:11#13
It was a request for info - nothing more.  I heard somewhere that Sanchez was playing for Stade Francais - but it obviously was wrong.  I knew he was playing for a French side - but did not know and was not sure for which one.  People who make unsubstantiated attacks and remarks need a dressing down - so take that as a warning.  
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
09 Oct 2013, 14:23
#14
09 Oct 2013, 14:23#14
Hahahaha. A warning even.................?

I caught you out again, and now I am on a warning. By the forum sheriff, nogal. You are a joke.
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