FIXTURESNo upcoming fixtures — check back soon.
FORUM / RUGBY /  The Great Morne Steyn debate

The Great Morne Steyn debate

Started by clevermike5 REPLIES1,100 VIEWS· 05 Dec 2013, 10:07
SHAREXFACEBOOKWHATSAPPTELEGRAMREDDITLINKEDIN
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
05 Dec 2013, 10:07
#1
05 Dec 2013, 10:07#1

This issue has been the top discussion point over the past week and there were at least three threads started on the issue.   Let me be quite frank - Morne Steyn is no doubt a very decent gentleman with high work and moral ethics so the  debate should never be around him as a person - but about his abilities and performances as a flyhalf.


On the site there are three distinct groups of people, namely -


*   the fire-brand Morne supporters (Mozart, Ceradyne, Sun-Tzu The_Truth, Arizona wildcat and  cjvandermerwe - who claim he is the best SA flyhalf around - emphasize how good he is as a goal kicker, praise him in every test he played in, blame any perceived deficiencies on other players, claims he has ball sense, but maintain absolute silence about his defensive lapses, lapses  in decision making and attacking flyhalf deficiencies.   They have the  propensity to attack Lambie as a player - personal and otherwise - as a smokescreen in an effort to defend Morne's selection.


*   the lukewarm Morne supporters (Clean Cut, Sharkbok, etc) who support his selection - but added with caution that he has deficiencies - but he is a reliable kicker at goal and has experience and reliability on his side, whilst they have reservations about  other alternatives based on their inadequacies on a variety of issues such as Lambie's inability to maintain a high level of performance and his shortcomings as a gal kicker and Goosen's frailty as injury- prone.    This group apparently include most of the NZ supporters on the site as well - who wish that Morne  remains at flyhalf - because of their own reasons - making life easier for the AB's in view of his predictability and the way the All Blacks can deal with him.


*   the anti-Morne faction (Saffex, myself, etc) who maintains his only real asset is his kicking at goal, but is severely critical of his predicatability, his lack of ability to be part of attacking backline play, his defensive lapses and his occasional lapses in sound decision making.


All three factions are probably somewhat amiss in their assessments with the luke-warn Morne supporters relatively nearest the mark.   They are basically on the same wave-length as the Stade Francais Club situation - who contracted him and is now playing him as their bench player, since they regard him as being less effective than their present starting bench flyhalf.  Basically this group would like to see him replaced if a better candidate emerges.  The fire-brand Morne Supporters are basically wrong in that they ascribe abilities to him clearly absent from his performances, whilst the anti-Morne faction over-emphasize his deficiencies and say every-one is better than Morne - in extreme cases even Earl Silky Hands Jantjies.


I think on reflection that Morne is a very average flyhalf on international level and is expendable but only of a better candidate emerges.   While the pro-Morne faction refuses even to consider such an option, I think we should be open-minded and consider the performances of alternative players in next years Super 15 on an objective basis - before arriving on a reasonable observation on what should happen.


The emphasis should be based on objectivity - not on personal prejudices and false pretences.   On the whole whilst Morne is not playing on Super 15 level, it would be advisable to see how his Stade Francais Club handle the issue  of his usage.   If he remains their bench flyhalf we should accept that he is not really up to standard, since he is not regarded by them as their first choice flyhalf, it is consequently  doubtful whether he should be our first choice flyhalf.


I hope this is a reasonable assessment of the situation and would consequently hear about the feelings of other members about the issue.   


         

BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
05 Dec 2013, 10:49
#2
05 Dec 2013, 10:49#2
 ou maaikie Morne Steyn has had a long and distinguised Bok career as his record clearly shows.His defence taken over his career has been good. His speed just fine with the ability to cut a line evident. Witness ou maaaikie how he has also played inside center for the bulle.
Obviously he has over his long career had the odd test where he has not performed. One recalls the Dunedin test where he must have misssed something like 7 kicks at goal (Frans missed a couple as well) and turned what should have been a very comfortable victory by the dominant Boks into a loss (Leading to absurd claims by the kiwis etc. I did notice in that game some of Morne's kicks heading straight between the polls and suddenly veering of sharply and have always suspected ball tampering by the kbbs!)However Morne was also (BECAUSE OF HIS VALUE TO THE BOKS AND BULLE) played into the ground.
I hope this brings some light into those dark caverns your mind is dwelling in re the acclaimed flyhalf Morne Steyn. Clearly young players like the very competent and growing performance of Lambie will challenge him as also we hope will Goosen who next year will be out of the under 20 ranks.We can also watch Sweil with interest and the Cat is as solid as a rock. SA are well served at flyhalf.The abs have to rely on the fading Dan. They then take a big drop to the crude and the frail beau. So they have zip to shout about but chest beat they will of course!
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
05 Dec 2013, 12:05
#3
05 Dec 2013, 12:05#3

Beeno


There is no dark caverns  in my mind - I tried to be objective about the issue.   I think you are pushing it a bit as to Morne's acclaimed status as a flyhalf.  "His defence taken over his career has been good. His speed just fine with the ability to cut a line evident." 


Morne never really was an attacking flyhalf and I have never once seen him cutting a line in his whole career.   This implies that he personally attack the gain line - which he effectively never does.  His defence this year in the CR was questionable with a 19% missed tackle ratio - about 10% higher than it should have been.  I do not have the stats for earlier years - so that remains a question mark insofar as I am concerned.


What worries me also is that his French Club apparently does not regard him as their first choice flyhalf - he plays off the bench for them.   That certainly is not a good sign about their assessment of his abilities as a flyhalf.   If he is not good enough as the first choice fllyhalf for his club, is he good enough as the first choice flyhalf for SA?


Howeve r, that does not stop Meyer in his selections - Gurthro Steenkamp rarely start for Toulouse in their matches and even Bakkies Botha is not a regular starter for Toulon. 

BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
05 Dec 2013, 12:12
#4
05 Dec 2013, 12:12#4
 Mike, Morne possibly is not as good today as he was so hence my saying Lambie, Goosen etc will challenge and strongly at that. I don't buy into the idea Lambie cant make it.However the Bulle certainly rated Morne as their top Super 15 player. See my post re the bulle on the rise. That has to show you he was not as bad as you think in 2013. 
HA
hakwaPro4,146 posts
05 Dec 2013, 13:44
#5
05 Dec 2013, 13:44#5
 Beeno, still harping on about Duneiden 50years later I see . It was a new Stadium Beeno and the air swirls were not something both sides were used to. I think we missed similar number of kicks. I also recall Cruden having concerns about the ball before the Test. This information is provided free of charge 
Here is the translation Beeno as you always seem to have problems understanding concepts 
"Beeno, nog steeds wat speel op oor Duneiden 50years later sien ek. Dit was 'n nuwe stadion Beeno en die lug herplaatst was nie iets wat beide kante is gebruik om. Ek dink ons ??gemis soortgelyke aantal skop. Ek het ook onthou Cruden met kommer oor die bal voor die toets. Hierdie inligting word gratis verskaf"
Morne is a good player. I blame the swirls.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
05 Dec 2013, 13:54
#6
05 Dec 2013, 13:54#6

Hakwa


What a translation - how did you manage that one ?   Not perfect - but reasonable. 

— END OF THREAD —

More from Rugby

More news