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The one player without whom the World Cup is lost...

Started by Mozart26 REPLIES849 VIEWS· 21 Aug 2019, 01:38
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MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
21 Aug 2019, 01:38
#1
21 Aug 2019, 01:38#1
It occurred to me when Dan Biggar was nursing his shoulder, that the Welsh WC was at risk.....which raises the question, who is that one player for the major countries. This would be my list: New Zealand.....Beauden Barrett. Australia.....Samu Kerevi Springboks.....Handre Pollard Argentina.....Pablo Matera England ...Vinnie Vunipola Wales.....Dan Biggar Scotland.....Stuart Hogg Ireland......Peter O' Mahony France....Louis Picamoles That's my group, every one crucial to their country's success. There are 3 flyhalves, 4 loosies, a centre and a fullback. Some of this is chance, when Anscombe was injured, Biggar became indispensible. Kerevi is crucial because Oz can only win by backline success and the guy who kick starts their attack is Kerevi. Barrett likewise is replaceable by Mo'unga in most regards, except for the history of magically doing something to win huge, close games. Hogg is a similar figure in Scotland. Others are just head and shoulders above their possible replacements eg Pollard. O'Mahony and Picamoles are key leaders, who lead by example. Matera and Vunipola are some of the best hard yards runners in the game....their presence changes tactics. In any case, that's my take....what do you think?
AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
21 Aug 2019, 02:09
#2
21 Aug 2019, 02:09#2

I think Pollard is irreplaceable at 10, but so much of our game hinges on 9. In that regard, Faf becomes indispensable. I think we become a much less effective side without him. 

I pretty much agree with everything else. Kerevi allows the Aussie backs to assert themselves and play through the opposition, making for a very tough side to stop. For many years they have been a team of crabs, dancing behind the gainline. 

RE
redsmanPro1,710 posts
21 Aug 2019, 03:23
#3
21 Aug 2019, 03:23#3

I think Nic White @ 9 also comes into the mix with Aussies too... Kerevi would be big loss though as definitely straightens the line... Aussies need to get premium 5/8 sorted and quickly...

Also think Saffas need Faf  - the bok team has gone from predictably average to consistent winners since his inclusion. Pollard is irreplaceable.

Poms like Kiwis have depth - but I would add George Ford to the mix.

sharkbok
sharkbokCaptain23,249 posts
21 Aug 2019, 03:43
#4
21 Aug 2019, 03:43#4

England - Owen Farrell

Wales - Dan Biggar. Especially now that Gareth Asscomb is out
South Africa - Pollard. (Marx, Vermuelen)
New Zealand - Barrat (if he is injured, New Zealand are out.
Scotland- Hogg. If t he pig is skewed, Scotland are stuffed
Ireland - Sexton. An important decision-maker that has the experience for a world cup
France -no one. They are probably screwed whatever happens
Australia - Folau. 

RE
redsmanPro1,710 posts
21 Aug 2019, 06:28
#5
21 Aug 2019, 06:28#5

lolol sharkbok - too true... I thought that as well till perth offered me a glimmer of hope.

RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
21 Aug 2019, 07:14
#6
21 Aug 2019, 07:14#6
Yes, the loss of Vinnie Vunipola would scupper England's hopes. Losing Mako Vunipola or Billy Vunipola would be bad enough, but Vinnie is the key.
LMAO!
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
21 Aug 2019, 07:42
#7
21 Aug 2019, 07:42#7

Is that Vinnie the 42year old from the Pacific Islands?  LMAO

Mozart left out Japan - their key player being Labuschagne.  Ignorance is bliss in his case.  

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
21 Aug 2019, 11:32
#8
21 Aug 2019, 11:32#8
Don’t rate O’Mahony at all it has to be Murray at 9 For England it’s has to be Farrell and if it’s a Vunipola it would be Billy at 8
RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
21 Aug 2019, 12:06
#9
21 Aug 2019, 12:06#9

I'd say Billy at #8 and Mako at loosehead would both be a big loss for the Poms. I don't think we've ever established what position Vinnie plays . . . Moffie seems to be the only person who's ever hear d of him.

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
21 Aug 2019, 15:38
#10
21 Aug 2019, 15:38#10
Well at least it's not Pierre Spies ou Peeper.... so funny you took the bait........SHHHHHHTUUUUUUUUNG! 'The Boks only had two chances....slim and none......and slim left town when Pierre Spies got injured'. Pierre Spies was your one player without whom the 2007 WC was lost.....except it wasn't The funniest early mouth in the history of these Boards, but stinging you with it 12 years later? Priceless!
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
21 Aug 2019, 15:42
#11
21 Aug 2019, 15:42#11
Dave I would have agreed on Murray during the Lions tour.....he was fabulous. But his form in the 6Nations was disturbingly poor.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
21 Aug 2019, 15:43
#12
21 Aug 2019, 15:43#12
I did say 'major countries' Muck.....do try to keep up!
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
21 Aug 2019, 16:37
#13
21 Aug 2019, 16:37#13

So Japan rated at no 9 i s not a major country,   You have a team in there not in the top 9,  Caught in the normal way Mozart,  Time for updating your homework for a change.  

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
21 Aug 2019, 16:37
#14
21 Aug 2019, 16:37#14

So Japan rated at no 9 i s not a major country,   You have a team in there not in the top 9,  Caught in the normal way Mozart,  Time for updating your homework for a change.  

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
21 Aug 2019, 16:59
#15
21 Aug 2019, 16:59#15
No Japan is not a major country.....9 is the highest ranking they have ever had. They have never made the knockouts in the RWC. Argentina has an artificially low ranking coming out of the RC , but their highest ranking ever is 3 and they have twice played in WC semis. My homework is fine.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
21 Aug 2019, 17:02
#16
21 Aug 2019, 17:02#16

One of the teams you list is below 9 and after all Japan is the host country,   Wake up to reality please. 

They beat Meyer's donkeys in  the 2015 WC - did they not?

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
21 Aug 2019, 17:08
#17
21 Aug 2019, 17:08#17
Muck...........the WC betting odds on the Bargies are 40 to 1, the betting odds on Japan are 200 to 1. Do try to keep up.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
21 Aug 2019, 17:14
#18
21 Aug 2019, 17:14#18

Not interested in what you come up was to batting - what count is thr rating of teams.    

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
21 Aug 2019, 17:22
#19
21 Aug 2019, 17:22#19
Oh I see, well good luck finding odds based on the IRB ratings Muck.
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
21 Aug 2019, 22:40
#20
21 Aug 2019, 22:40#20
Moz that might be the case but I’m sorry there is nothing special about O’ Mahony. Sexton is another huge player for Ireland
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
21 Aug 2019, 23:28
#21
21 Aug 2019, 23:28#21
Furlong would be my next pick. Hell Dave Sexton's an old man at 34, and Conor Murray is no Spring chicken at 30....are you becoming soft in your dotage?
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
21 Aug 2019, 23:36
#22
21 Aug 2019, 23:36#22
Agreed on Furlong Sexton yes as he is that important for Ireland regardless of age
SH
ShezzaPro2,471 posts
22 Aug 2019, 09:57
#23
22 Aug 2019, 09:57#23
Picamole's isn't nearly as important to France as their young 9, Dupont. Louis isn't dependable in long format's like tournaments and they've learnt to make do without him, Dupont was the center of everything good for France in this years Six Nations. 
Farrell is replaceable by Cipriani but Eddie has made his bed in that matter, Billy is England's actual shining hope. 
Wales rely heavily on Alun Wyn Jones, he's their leader and also best player which is a lucky combination. 



ST
Stavanger1Pro4,532 posts
22 Aug 2019, 13:07
#24
22 Aug 2019, 13:07#24

Sexton and Murray are the key men for Ireland. Sexton is the lynchpin of everything Ireland do. Problem is that Johnny Sexton getting injured is abit like death and taxes, its going to happen. Though Joey Carberry is a fine replacement for Sexton if he's fit.

Murray's form in the 6 nations wasn't good but there is no way he will be dropped unless injured.

Peter O'Mahony has been struggling for form for a few months now and has been able to impose himself on games as he use to. 

Next 3 warm up games will indicate if the 6 nations was just a blip for Ireland or an indication of along term trend.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
22 Aug 2019, 14:55
#25
22 Aug 2019, 14:55#25

Stav

Is Stander out of contention for the WC?

I am surprised that Mozart chose O'Mahony  as the key player - he norally has a policy - age before beauty.

My problem with Ireland is that some Irish are getting a bot long in the tooth,  Sexton at 34, Best at 37 and Healy at 32 are not spring chickens at all.   Is that not the reason why Ireland struggled a bit in the 6-Nations t his year? 

ST
Stavanger1Pro4,532 posts
22 Aug 2019, 18:33
#26
22 Aug 2019, 18:33#26

@clever

Stander will be in the team unless injured. Again I think his form has dipped a bit since last year but you could say that about a lot of players.

Don't get me wrong O'Mahony is a great and important player for Ireland, but Sexton is the absolute most vital cog in the Irish team.

I think you may be right about the Irish team. I fear this world cup was simply a year two late for us and age has caught up with some of the players. If this was last year I'd saw we would genuine contenders and maybe 2nd favorites only slightly behind NZ. But on current form the southern hemisphere teams along with England and Wales will be very difficult matches for us.

I do think Sexton's form is still good, just he's rather fragile and injury prone. Difficult to see him lasting a full world cup.

This is Bests last hurrah and he's retiring after the world cup. 


CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
22 Aug 2019, 19:21
#27
22 Aug 2019, 19:21#27

Stav

The problem with older players are they become more injury prone and takes longer to recover - at least that is what my impression of the situation is,  They also struggle when they have to play four test in four weeks and then has to play in the quarters and semi - should their team qualify.

That was the problem in the 2015 WC in the case of SA.   There were 8 players in the SA squad  that was unplayable in the series and some played as little as 30 minutes from the bench.   That had a bad effect on performances - especially after the "golden oldies" was humiliated  by the Japanese.

I do not think there will be s similar selection disaster again this year - but we will have tos ee what Erasmus came up with,         .   

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