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FORUM / RUGBY /  The solution to the ref cock ups

The solution to the ref cock ups

Started by Saffolk 23 REPLIES395 VIEWS· 22 Sept 2013, 22:44
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SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
22 Sept 2013, 22:44
#1
22 Sept 2013, 22:44#1

We saw it in the Bok test against the AB's and yesterday I saw it in the Saints game against Gloucester, where the Saints were robbed of victory by a ref clanger.

 

The solution is simple.......adopt the cricket review system available to each side. Each side should be allowed 2 reviews each. A captain should have the right to request that the ref review a decision by refering the call to the 3rd official equipped with television replays.

 

If your review is succesful you retain it, if not you lose it. 

 

That way we would cut out bad ref decisions costing matches

BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
22 Sept 2013, 22:48
#2
22 Sept 2013, 22:48#2

 I would support that. Anything that stops sides bering robbed blind as does happen.  Start with two and see how it goes.

WG
What's going on?Club Pro237 posts
22 Sept 2013, 22:51
#3
22 Sept 2013, 22:51#3

Not full proof either Saffex as the TMO is also capable of making the same mistakes as we saw in SuperXV with the Aussie TMOs. It just passes the blame to a different official.

Only this weekend Waikato were ripped off in a Ranfurly Shield challenge where a try was erroneously  awarded by the TMO with the try scorers leg clearly out. The TMO should have gone to Spec Savers.

BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
22 Sept 2013, 23:12
#4
22 Sept 2013, 23:12#4

 stain larger what makes you think that was a mistake? If the TMO evidence is clear and the verdict is not in line why is it not cheating. In some cases wrong decisons cannot simply be wrong decisions. The evidence is too clear.

The problem is we are dealing with professional sport with lots of boodle at stake.

It's time to get real?

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
22 Sept 2013, 23:14
#5
22 Sept 2013, 23:14#5

Nothing is full proof but the TMO has a better chance of getting it right on review.......beats the hell out of a heat of the moment rash call being made by a ref.

 

There are just too many of these poor calls being made by the refs, many of which are influening the outcome of matches.

JW
Just_winCaptain18,570 posts
22 Sept 2013, 23:35
#6
22 Sept 2013, 23:35#6

 2 reviews each makes sense to me Saffex but whatever solution they try they need to test if of course. If they don't do something they will lose fans or even worse have some serious nut case behavior.

Even if they made sure they used existing tools better we could avoid some bad calls. Having TMO and not using it in curcial situations is crazy. Having it so the TMO can't say a word even if he sees something is crazy. They have options on how to make it better but in the end there will still be some room for human error just less hopefully.

WG
What's going on?Club Pro237 posts
22 Sept 2013, 23:36
#7
22 Sept 2013, 23:36#7

Brother Bueno i don't think the game on the weekend had anything to do with professional sport as it was grass roots rugby and shame on you for accusing a ref of cheating . Thou shouldst repent at once.

May i direct you to the relevent bible passage...

Romans 13;1-7 Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment....

 

RE
redsmanPro1,710 posts
23 Sept 2013, 09:09
#8
23 Sept 2013, 09:09#8
NFL has this sort of thing - throwing the flag or something I've called for it for years but it seems the IRB and kiwis(AIG) aren't into fair rugby just commercial decisions.
RE
redsmanPro1,710 posts
23 Sept 2013, 09:13
#9
23 Sept 2013, 09:13#9
The thing that really is the X factor to all this is getting precedent whereby betting agencys need to refund bets on games ruined by incorrect refereeing decisions... THEN see how many 'so sorry I screwed you over' apology/s are forthcoming by refs conceding they made a mistake.... then we'd see outcomes... Until the commercial side of the game is hit we shall never see changes - I would tend to think the NFL model may have had this as a basis considering the americans' fondness of legal recourse.
NT
ntangaClub Pro336 posts
23 Sept 2013, 09:38
#10
23 Sept 2013, 09:38#10
@ Redsman, Its good to see you back mate after the Boks VS ABs scandal, and that's a valid point you have there. @ Saffex, that's a good proposal about bringing in the cricket style reviews. That'll minimise the amount of errors in in a given game considering that the captain would be entitled to certain reviews per game. But I think the IRB is still under the impression that the current 'TMO' system works wanders. It could be years before they take action, like the goal line technology in soccer.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
23 Sept 2013, 10:14
#11
23 Sept 2013, 10:14#11
Saffex I support your suggestion in full - but would like to add that before any card is pulled out by the referee - he should be forced into calling for a review without the captains asking for one. The same should apply when dubious tries are scored and the referee should ask whether there is clear evidence that a try has in fact been scored - not saying he intends to award a try - unless there is evidence to the contrary. That leaves the TV ref with no option - but to agree with the referee. It depends at present on the referee to ask for the review - but if he ask the wrong question - it could lead to the wrong answer. In any TV review it would be clear what really happened - and if the situation is unclear a try should not be awarded. The present system is still dubious and whatever the IRB says - it is still open for abuse through incompetence. Why not use the system comprehensively and not partially? But the IRB would do nothing to effectively implement a sound system.
JW
Just_winCaptain18,570 posts
23 Sept 2013, 10:30
#12
23 Sept 2013, 10:30#12

 Look guys, you don't see us kiwis complaint about the South Africans hoarding all the yellow & red cards do you. No we are good sports & just accept it. You should do the same , lol

BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
23 Sept 2013, 11:18
#13
23 Sept 2013, 11:18#13

 Mike you are spot on. The IRB is fast asleep and could do a lot of simple things to improve matters if they would just apply their minds and actually had the will to do so.

Broer larger stain answer the question posed please rather than mis-applying scripture to find fault with the esteemed  Beeno!

JW you kiwis do "compaint". Recall that single ref mistake re the forward pass in the game against France that sent you crashing out the wc. Man the shrinks were working overtime to keep Kiwis in the land of the living. In South Africa we had to hear ear muffs to deafen the wails you guys were making! 

WG
What's going on?Club Pro237 posts
23 Sept 2013, 11:53
#14
23 Sept 2013, 11:53#14

Brother Bueno I get it so you're saying the Good Book only applies on Sunday and the rest of the week you're free to rape and pillage?

Funny az these Christians .

They've been misapplying scriptures since Adam was a boy to justify wars , slavery, homosexuality, abuse of woman, the killing of Jews or even the justification of denominational doctrines.

So forgive me Brother Bueno if i appear slightly cynical and amused by the irony of your comments..

BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
23 Sept 2013, 12:11
#15
23 Sept 2013, 12:11#15

 broer larger stain the scriptures remain the scriptures whatever man may do with them. Even the devil can mis quote the scriprtures.  Seek the truth and you will find it.

 

 

WG
What's going on?Club Pro237 posts
23 Sept 2013, 12:27
#16
23 Sept 2013, 12:27#16

Brother Bueno you are reminding me of that biblical quote "and the truth will set you free" from Liar Liar ..

 You and Jim Carey have alot in common.

BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
23 Sept 2013, 12:42
#17
23 Sept 2013, 12:42#17

 broer larger yet stain unless you believe nothing crerated the universe via the laws of gravity you best apply yourself to seeking Him as you will surely meet one day.

 

 

 

WG
What's going on?Club Pro237 posts
23 Sept 2013, 12:44
#18
23 Sept 2013, 12:44#18

Brother Bueno i intend to live forever. So far so good.

BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
23 Sept 2013, 12:48
#19
23 Sept 2013, 12:48#19

Broer larger stain I thought you kiwis were nigh indestructible but along came abnob! Make sure you survive the abs getting whipped in a couple of weesk time and we can talk about the few days that remain to you thereafter. 

WG
What's going on?Club Pro237 posts
23 Sept 2013, 12:54
#20
23 Sept 2013, 12:54#20

Brother Bueno you want to stay off those hallucinatory drugs,

Galatians 5:21 Envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

KI
kingcornPro3,695 posts
23 Sept 2013, 13:31
#21
23 Sept 2013, 13:31#21

 This is a blatent rip off from my previous post, Reff the Reffs. Although now that it has picked up momentum I'll give my 2 cents. Reffs get it wrong, they are human. The game is watched by thousands and designed to be entertaining. If a bad call ruins the entertainment then the reff has failed in my eyes. For me the law needs to be adjusted, the fact that the team loses a player kills the game. Their are two options to this, either send the player off and have him replaced or leave the player off  the field within a time duration until the team with the benefit scores where by the player comes back on. Teams can either decide to play for 3 points or they can push to get a the maximum seven. 

 

On red card, this is tricky as we saw that when you award it early the other team pretty much won the game, so in this case I believe that teams should be allowed to appeal the call, but fundamentally, losing players is not great from an entertainment point of.

 

Finally, rugby is probably one of the most complicated games after NFL, it has so many laws and different interpertations. I love the fact it has so many facets and that any event is a contest. So laws can't be simplified, perhaps we should go down the route of Gailic football, they actually have more than one ref on the field. Perhaps the game needs more than one ref going forward.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
23 Sept 2013, 15:30
#22
23 Sept 2013, 15:30#22
I never read you ref the refs so fuck all rip off involved!
RE
redsmanPro1,710 posts
24 Sept 2013, 08:00
#23
24 Sept 2013, 08:00#23
@kingcorn - Rugby has the problem of too many penalties now.... don't add more refs to add more penalties... NRL did this and if anything just created more problems adding second ref. I think answer is Video replays and potentially TMO (panel of 3x) having executive authority to override OBVIOUSLY BLATANT incorrect calls that ruin spectacles.... like we have seen for the AIGs recently.
JW
Just_winCaptain18,570 posts
24 Sept 2013, 08:32
#24
24 Sept 2013, 08:32#24

 AIG again! There are so many penalties because you guys don't know the rules . Lol fix that & you fix the problem ;)

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