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The Springbok team performance evaluation

Started by clevermike26 REPLIES1,763 VIEWS· 24 Sept 2022, 23:06
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CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
24 Sept 2022, 23:06
#1
24 Sept 2022, 23:06#1

15    Le Roux              4/10

14    Moodie                7/10

13    Kriel                     5/10

12    De Allende            7,5/10

11    Mapimpi                6/10

10    Steyn                   3/10

  9    Hendrikse             7/10

  8    Woese                  7,5/10

  7    Du Toit                  7/10

  6    Kolisi                     7/10

  5    De Jager                7,5/10

  4   Etzebth                   5,5/10

  3   Malherbe                 7/10

  2    Marx                     7,5/10

  1   Kitshof                   7/10

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
24 Sept 2022, 23:29
#2
24 Sept 2022, 23:29#2

Dud Toit 3

Lomp 5

Dud Allende 5


Make those adjustments. 

sharkbok
sharkbokCaptain23,226 posts
24 Sept 2022, 23:31
#3
24 Sept 2022, 23:31#3

Delande 7.5... even worse. 

Delande threw wild passes on some of the better attacking movements that ended up rolling on the ground

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
24 Sept 2022, 23:36
#4
24 Sept 2022, 23:36#4

Dud Toit missed the lineout for the first Bargie try..missed tackles….got stripped trying to pick and go on the Bargie line.

P ToitFL2520
That’s 5 tackles made, two missed, two turnovers conceded
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
24 Sept 2022, 23:37
#5
24 Sept 2022, 23:37#5

That’s not an evaluation Tokkie, it’s an ejaculation.

MS
Mrs SearlePro1,533 posts
25 Sept 2022, 00:13
#6
25 Sept 2022, 00:13#6

I call bullshit on these stats... I counted 6 times de Lindy rushed out and got stepped beaten cleanly. The Blocks were chasing fucking shadows! Blocks can't taxkle when the target isn't coming right at them and they can't tackle in groups of two or three. Arg backs minced these chumps. Thank Player 16 that you didn't concede another 4 tries. 9th vest team on form. Fucked up on the line again. Maul with dodgy advantage calls like every other game. Only Frans gets higher than a 4 of the backs with a 5.7 and only Wiese gets a higher than a 5 of the forwards with 8. The man is a monster like the Blocks of old. When the likes of Bakkies were actually intimidating. These soft little fairies don't intimidate anyone. Ebenezer was a fucking nub out there. 

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
25 Sept 2022, 03:12
#7
25 Sept 2022, 03:12#7

Actually I have more confidence in the stats. Dud Allende’s performance was awful, but not that bad:


D AllendeC0430


That’s 3 out of 7 tackle attempts… missed.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
25 Sept 2022, 04:11
#8
25 Sept 2022, 04:11#8

And yellow cards do not count - neither did mistakes of other players did zero.  Talk about players that bugger up totally is clear and prciese.  When it comes to the pet hates Du Toit and De Allende Mozatrt can hardly be called objective - the shot took over his brain functioning when it came to those two,

If De Allende was 5 then Steyn was 2/10.     If  De Jager was 5 then Etzebeth was 3 out of 10 too.     Mozart pick and choose the stats he believed can be used to attack players on and would never ever quote full stats since that will be an indication of how weird his thinking is.     

Because of his prejudice he often lies about incidents in matches too.             

BO
bobbok...Captain10,129 posts
25 Sept 2022, 04:44
#9
25 Sept 2022, 04:44#9

https://rugby365.com/opinion/player-ratings-bittersweet-for-boks/

DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
25 Sept 2022, 07:00
#10
25 Sept 2022, 07:00#10

Thanks Bob.

LEEZIL HENDRICKS

OPINION: The Springboks ended their Rugby Championship with a hard-fought 38-21 win over the Los Pumas at Kings Park on Saturday.

But the win was not enough to secure the Rugby Championship title.

The Boks needed a bonus point and a 39-point plus win to clinch the trophy away from the All Blacks.

However, it was a big ask for Boks, who failed to execute their chances against a relentless Los Pumas side.

Check out how the Boks’ players rated!

15 Willie le Roux
The fullback has been very influential through the season, however, the final Rugby Champs match was not the best performance from the experienced fullback. He struggled under the high ball and also had trouble in defence. Was left on the floor after try-scorer Juan Martin Gonzalez stepped his way around the Bok. He helped out with the kicking after Frans Steyn struggled to find the touchline.
4

14 Canan Moodie
A very quiet day for the wing. He was forced to put in some big hits, including a try-saving tackle on Argentina captain Julian Montoya in the 43rd minute – showing immense bravery and confidence.
6

13 Jesse Kriel
The No.13 was basically absent in the first half of the game. He also conceded a penalty. He made two big hits in the second half and helped set up Kurt-Lee Arendse’s try. However overall not the best performance, really needs some more game time.
4

12 Damian de Allende
Made some wayward passes which put his team under pressure. However, tried to get involved on the attack and made some strong abrasive carries beating six defenders. He also joined the pack at maul time.
6

11 Makazole Mapimpi
Rarely got the ball in hand and was a very frustrating figure. He got involved in the closing minutes, however, it was a little too late to make any impact.
4

10 Francois Steyn
Playing in first his first Springbok start as a playmaker since 2008, it was a cameo the 35-year-old would want to forget. He failed to find the touchline on a couple of occasions and was charged down in the opening minutes. Nonetheless, his kicking from the tee was absolutely sublime, even slotting over a 55m penalty.
5

9 Jaden Hendrikse
There was nothing spectacular about his performance – he did the basics well. His delayed passes were not the most effective especially when the Boks were in the strike zone. Simply just lack energy. Nonetheless, his name will certainly be in the year-end squad.
6

8 Jasper Wiese
An absolute powerhouse and growing in stature. He scored his first try for the Boks and thoroughly deserves it. The No.8 was really effective with his ball carrying, getting over the gain line with most of his carries. He made nine carries and 58 metres. Very unfortunate to be substituted after 48 minutes.
9

7 Pieter-Steph du Toit
The 2019 World Rugby player of the year is slowly hitting his strides. Not his personal best after missing last weekend, and made way for Kwagga Smith after 48 minutes.
6.5

6 Siyamthanda Kolisi (captain)
He was hungry to perform at Kings Park and delivered a very commanding performance.  He did really well in open play, scoring the Boks’ second try. He did concede two penalties, however, he put in a massive defensive display making 11 tackles missed one.
7

5 Lodewyk de Jager
It was an industrious performance by the lock. Making some solid runs with great carries, he also showed great hands with an offload to Pieter-Steph du Toit at the start of the match. His work at the line-outs never falters.
7

4 Eben Etzebeth
Produced a very physical performance and made a crucial line-out steal. Unfortunate not to get his name on the scoresheet after he went over the tryline. The try was disallowed for offside. He had more bad luck in the second half when he was handed a controversial yellow card for what the referee deemed reckless play.
6

3 Frans Malherbe
Very quiet when it came to open play, but made up for it with some solid scrums, winning an early penalty for the Boks.
6

2 Malcolm Marx
It was not the best from the hooker, however, he still managed to add that physicality that is so vital for the Boks.  He made some crucial steals, including the one inside the Boks’ 22. His line-out throws were not flawless.
7

1 Steven Kitshoff
The prop was a rock at the scrum and made a couple of crucial tackles. He also put his body on the line with some strong carries against the powerful Los Pumas pack
7

Replacements:

16 Mbongeni Mbonambi (on for Marx, 70th minute)
Not enough time to be rated

17 Retshegofaditswe Nche (on for Kitshoff,58th minute)
His work around the rucks was very good, while his effort at the scrums was valuable.
5

18 Vincent Koch (on for Malherbe, 58th minute)
Part of the Bomb squad, he continued to dominate the scrums with Mbonambi and Nche and was rewarded the scrum penalty.
5

19 Franco Mostert (on for De Jager, 71st minute)
Not enough time to be rate

20 Duane Vermeulen (on for Wiese, 48th minute)
With a lot to prove, the No.8 made an immediate impact with his big run, while his work at the maul handed South Africa the penalty try. Vermeulen made 45m and four carries in his stint
6.5

21 Albertus Smith (on for Du Toit, 48th Minute)
He immediately injected some valuable energy, making a crucial steal inside his own 22. However, his overeagerness at the breakdown proved costly as he also conceded a penalty.
6

22 Francois de Klerk (on for Hendrikse, 61st minute)
Copped a yellow card, which saw the Boks go down to 13 men.
3

23 Kurt-Lee Arendse (on for Le Roux, 50th minute)
First game since serving his four-week ban. Took up the role as scrumhalf with De Klerk in the sin bin, and he scored a try during his cameo
5

PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
25 Sept 2022, 08:27
#11
25 Sept 2022, 08:27#11
All those Wiese doubters eating some humble pie. Guy is a monster and needs to be on the park with Roos, Snyman, Eben and Marx. DDA has to go. He’s doing nothing for us at this point, apart from stagnating or nullifying anything that the backs try. I’m no Kriel fan and i think Mapimpi is average, but for them to get so little ball is simply crazy. Willemse should play a 12 and the Boks would probably never, but would be better served by an attacking line that is able to capitalise on the embarrassment of riches in forward dominance that the pack delivers. Seeing how the Boks handled a game where the only option was to score big, it’s clear that the coaching staff have ZERO interest in the back line. And if that is the case, then play Roos at 12 and Louw at 13. Can somebody tell me why, considering how it’s very clear the Boks the Boks want to play, this is a bad idea?
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
25 Sept 2022, 08:31
#12
25 Sept 2022, 08:31#12

Draad

My problem is that the only worthwhile  comtribution made by Steyn was his kicking at goal - for the rest his contribution was of zero benefit to the game.    His passing game was near to zero in value - his out-of=had kicking was not strategic and gave ample opportunity for cunter-attacking and his ine kicking was with one exception a disaster.   He was so inaccurate that he missed two line kicks from penalties one from a defensive perspective and the other to put the Springboks on the front foot.   One went dead.   He was so bad that the corner kicks was given to  Le Roux at one stage during the game.   

The  case of passing also caused problems - far too many times the Springboks tried to start attacks - the scrumminy passed the ball directly to De Allende.    As a result the whole backline was jeopardized totally in any attacking play.    I do think that no backline can ever functions properly if the flyhalf malfunctions and there was enough evidence of flyhalf malfunctioning during the test on Saturday.

People\obviously can differ on the issue of performances - but at least one has to try and show a bit of  balance based on actual occurrences during the game when looking at games.    Take for instance the case of Mozart and his carrying on about Mostert in winning games when eh started on tests,    He started in all the games when the Springboks played weaker sides in the WC because of his disatous performances afginst the AB's in the Round Robin games in all  the tests 2018 games lost be the Springboks.    That kind  approach is total BS.   Mzart laso lose all common sense when he use selective stats to criticize players,   He will never give the full stats of players and his above approach is typically guided by prejudice.

I saw an article inw hich it was stated that the best performer on Satirday amongst the forwards werre Malherbe and that Steyn at fyhalf was a disaster - in many ways that article was true.   The writer pointed out that it was Malherbe who made the real contrubtion to the try scored ny Wiese by keeping the scrum straight in moving forward.

With Steyn at flyhalf the Springboks will losee more games than they will win and many problems in the game referred to above stemmed from having Steyn at fyhalf,    I think the sooner people relaize that the better.    .

        

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
25 Sept 2022, 08:31
#13
25 Sept 2022, 08:31#13

Draad

My problem is that the only worthwhile  comtribution made by Steyn was his kicking at goal - for the rest his contribution was of zero benefit to the game.    His passing game was near to zero in value - his out-of=had kicking was not strategic and gave ample opportunity for cunter-attacking and his ine kicking was with one exception a disaster.   He was so inaccurate that he missed two line kicks from penalties one from a defensive perspective and the other to put the Springboks on the front foot.   One went dead.   He was so bad that the corner kicks was given to  Le Roux at one stage during the game.   

The  case of passing also caused problems - far too many times the Springboks tried to start attacks - the scrumminy passed the ball directly to De Allende.    As a result the whole backline was jeopardized totally in any attacking play.    I do think that no backline can ever functions properly if the flyhalf malfunctions and there was enough evidence of flyhalf malfunctioning during the test on Saturday.

People\obviously can differ on the issue of performances - but at least one has to try and show a bit of  balance based on actual occurrences during the game when looking at games.    Take for instance the case of Mozart and his carrying on about Mostert in winning games when eh started on tests,    He started in all the games when the Springboks played weaker sides in the WC because of his disatous performances afginst the AB's in the Round Robin games in all  the tests 2018 games lost be the Springboks.    That kind  approach is total BS.   Mzart laso lose all common sense when he use selective stats to criticize players,   He will never give the full stats of players and his above approach is typically guided by prejudice.

I saw an article inw hich it was stated that the best performer on Satirday amongst the forwards werre Malherbe and that Steyn at fyhalf was a disaster - in many ways that article was true.   The writer pointed out that it was Malherbe who made the real contrubtion to the try scored ny Wiese by keeping the scrum straight in moving forward.

With Steyn at flyhalf the Springboks will losee more games than they will win and many problems in the game referred to above stemmed from having Steyn at fyhalf,    I think the sooner people relaize that the better.    .

        

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
25 Sept 2022, 08:50
#14
25 Sept 2022, 08:50#14
Draad’s ratings are more accurate than some of the prejudicial bullshit from others de Allende apart from those two back passes was huge physically and one lovely break. The guy is a physical freak PSDT was good and Lood very good I’ve changed my opinion of Wiese he might be dumb muscle but it’s effective dumb muscle - which begs the question why has their not been more investment in the du Preez twins Also seeing that opening try by Roos for the Stormers yesterday WOW we just have to find a place in the Bok side for him Kolisi and Marx were good again Frans at best a 3 - he was embarrassing
MS
Mrs SearlePro1,533 posts
25 Sept 2022, 09:04
#15
25 Sept 2022, 09:04#15

Mozart you can't be fucking serious! It was EXACTLY that bad. Stats are fucking useless because so much is down to interpretation. One hand on a back, successful tackle. Why aren't those misses included in the stats when he was beaten cleanly? Did the clean beats get logged by those Arg runs? De Lindy carried where he was held up for the strip... did the stats tell you that? Of course they fucking don't. So dumb fucks like you and Mike will blow a load over this shit and learn nothing. De Lindy was mostly invisible for at least 60 minutes. Pop up for a shit carry or two and the guy is apparently a beast. Fucking hilarious. It was a super shit performance but so many players get a fucking 7. Insular yarpie thinking... bitch and whine.... learn nothing. 

MS
Mrs SearlePro1,533 posts
25 Sept 2022, 09:07
#16
25 Sept 2022, 09:07#16

Steph was a fucking liability and Lood shit. Blocks pile on like fucking apes and hands in rucks slowing ball down was the only answer... several neck grabs helped a  it too. All uncalled by Player 16 though. Ex Saff... you are fucking clueless. DE Lindy hugely physically your gaping anus. Man's a fucking soft moron.

KI
kingcornPro3,695 posts
25 Sept 2022, 13:28
#17
25 Sept 2022, 13:28#17

I’m really pissed off in how we spoil our forward dominance. We should have put 50 passed the bargies. We had all the momentum but it just died in the back line. I don’t rate De Allende at all. Yes, he can tractor it up and put in the odd big hit, but fuck me, the whole back line dies when he touches the ball. Looks like he can’t pass beyond 1 meter. 

It is a basic skill to check a defender and pass. 

You need to watch the 2 fat props from the lions , think the Smith twins ran beautiful angles, straighten, short pass on the angle and a lob pass to the winger who ran into score. 

If a prop forwards could do it, but fucking Fran and Dud can’t even connect with one another what the fuck are they doing on the field

KI
kingcornPro3,695 posts
25 Sept 2022, 13:30
#18
25 Sept 2022, 13:30#18



KI
kingcornPro3,695 posts
25 Sept 2022, 13:31
#19
25 Sept 2022, 13:31#19

Watch it from min 5:59, brilliant, wobbly loop, slow but straight, simple passing 

MS
Mrs SearlePro1,533 posts
25 Sept 2022, 13:38
#20
25 Sept 2022, 13:38#20

Your forwards are not that dominant at all. Wiese was the only muscle man. Beatn on the line in every game and then the ref awards a stream of one sided penalties to blow the opposition off the field. Facts... Arg were much better attacking and were kept at bay by Mr Player 16. If any team should have put the other away... ARg should have scored another four tries. Your forwards are part of the reason why you cannot play modern rugby... the forwards and backs are linked together . You dopey fucks think of backs as one line with set positions on the field. stupid old baloney. You will NEVER play modern rugby because your piss poor forwards are too shit and are as shit as forwards as backs are. It's pretty obvious that none of you will or can understand this shit. Not one good back on attack and not one stopper on defence at all. Arg made your fat forwards look like their feet were encased in concrete and your backs look like blind OAPs swatting at flies. Embarrassing. But hey, it's all down to one player and Rassie. Pick a scapegoat for the day and excuse teh real issues... never learn a damn thing. 

PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
25 Sept 2022, 13:47
#21
25 Sept 2022, 13:47#21
And there is of course the Stormers try which incorporated both backs and forwards in a fantastic and skillfull try. What is with the Bok’s? You cannot ignore the fact that there are talented backs in SA and as long as you deem them all to be merely kick chasers then you’re wasting talent. I really don’t get this.
PA
PakieCaptain17,321 posts
25 Sept 2022, 13:52
#22
25 Sept 2022, 13:52#22

PSDT was a non-entity at best, a liability if anything. Made ground once in contact pushed by a few teammates, otherwise zilch.

DA fits perfectly into the Bok plan. Can't distribute, doesn't need to. He can keep his feet and burrow ahead carrying a tackler or two, which looks impressive but rarely leads to anything as the defense reorganizes while he burrows , and that's the way we play. A more competent all round player will be wasted on the Bok "gameplan".

PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
25 Sept 2022, 14:01
#23
25 Sept 2022, 14:01#23
Saffex mentioned the Dup twins. I say having them at 12 & 13 would be a better option than our current combo. I mean, if you’re gonna basically ignore any form of back play, then don’t be a coward, go Full Monty and put two loosies in the heart of the back line. If that’s how they wanna play then cool, but then go all in and completely change the game. I can’t see you losing anything by doing that other than, as far as Am and Jessie are concerned, maybe a yard or two of pace. Here are the benefits; Defence Smash ball Ruck support Holding up opposition runners At least i could get behind something like that because it’ll be new and challenge the status quo. Right now we’re ignoring the backs without replacing their traditional role with anything of any substance.
MP
MpowerPro5,061 posts
25 Sept 2022, 14:08
#24
25 Sept 2022, 14:08#24
It will only be fully understood, once dismantled.....will Rassie be joining the team for EOYT?? My guess is as good as yours....but this Tour will be different as it will be a defining one for all involved before WC23....playing the top ranked teams is going be tough with this R&N brand we playing now and not to forget there Supid Stubborn neglect to get more younger inform players in the Squad.
KI
kingcornPro3,695 posts
25 Sept 2022, 23:27
#25
25 Sept 2022, 23:27#25

I’m not holding my breath. The physio was at it again with his ludicrous statements that we built depth at flyhalf?! and wing. 

I’m expecting Ireland, France and England to beat the boks. 

Pollard crocked, Jantjies playing with is dingeling, Willemse can’t kick goals and then we have the legend and the man of the last to decades, Frans Steyn who got charged down, missed touch four times. Passes not going to hand, but yes, all good

BO
bobbok...Captain10,129 posts
26 Sept 2022, 03:11
#26
26 Sept 2022, 03:11#26

,.,. This fella's impartial


BO
bobbok...Captain10,129 posts
26 Sept 2022, 03:52
#27
26 Sept 2022, 03:52#27

,.,.

— END OF THREAD —

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