Toetsie to to ring the changes for the Boks

Toetsie to to ring the changes by Gavin Rich 21 November 2016, 17:54

To many it would be a case of too little far too late, but it appears Springbok coach Allister Coetzee has finally run out of patience with some of the players and combinations he has stuck with through a poor run in 2016.

The Boks face Wales in their last match of the international season here at the Millennium Stadium in Cardiff on Saturday and Coetzee has hinted that he will make several changes to the team that lost 20-18 to Italy in Florence last weekend.

“The philosophy behind my selection for the Italy game was that I wanted to get some continuity going from the England match and then hopefully that would help us really be ready for the Wales game,” said Coetzee.

“But we did not get the result we wanted so I have to rethink that. I have to give opportunities now to other players. There are other young players who have worked really hard in training on this tour but haven’t played as yet. They deserve a chance and I am going to try and get them that opportunity against Wales.

“I want to use that match to look at the future so we know where we are next year. We want to finish on a high. It has been a disappointing year for us and the defeat against Italy was a real low, but all we can do now is try and resurrect some pride by playing really well against Wales so at least we can end the year on a positive note.”

Of course a win over Wales will still leave the Boks well short of finishing with a 50% pass mark from the first year with Coetzee as the coach. As it stands now, the Boks have won four out of 11 games, and a win on Saturday would make it five out of 12 – well below breaking even, and also a long way off the average annual win percentage for Bok coaches.

Coetzee’s predecessor Heyneke Meyer had to wait until the final match of his first year, the clash with England at Twickenham, to come out with a positive win percentage in 2012. However the difference between Meyer and Coetzee was that Meyer included two drawn games in his record before that end of year tour.

The decision to give youngsters a chance against Wales may be a sign that Coetzee has accepted that sticking to the core team he has stuck with for most of the year has kept him hand-braked in the same place throughout 2016. There has been a lot of talk about growing the Bok game and growing the depth available to the coach without it happening, and Monday’s press conference in Cardiff was the umpteenth time he spoke about the need to improve.

“We’ve just got to come up with better performances and we simply have to make sure we improve this weekend,” he said.

Wales have struggled so far in the autumn season, losing heavily to Australia in their first match and struggling to beat Japan by three points a few days ago. However, after the embarrassment of the defeat to Italy, Coetzee isn’t reading too much into the Welsh performances. Italy had been woeful in the games before they beat the Boks last weekend.

“We note that Wales are being bashed in the Welsh press at the moment, but they are an experienced team if you look at the players who are playing for them at the moment,” said Coetzee.

“Most of them were part of the World Cup last year, when they made it out of a very tough group and into the play-offs, beating England at Twickenham along the way. They have quality players and the fact that they have not been happy with their form of late will be more reason why they will really come out and play on Saturday.”

Hopefully, Rohan will get a run with Delande.I think Rohan should start at inside centre to get his first cap at Bok level. 

 We will know by Thursday afternoon but I guess the following should be the team to be fielded:-
15  Willie le Roux, 14 Jamba Ulengo, 13 Damian de Allende, 12 Rohan Janse van Rensburg, 11 Ruan Combrinck, 10 Johan Goosen, 9 Faf de Klerk, 8 Warren Whiteley, 7 Jean-Luc Du Preez, 6 Robin Smith, 5 Lood de Jager, 4 Pieter-Steph du Toit, 3 Vincent Koch, 2 Adriaan Strauss. 1 Tendai Mtawarira
16 Malcolm Marx, 17 Steven Kitshoff, 18 Trevor Nyakane, 19 Franco Mostert, 20 Nizaam Carr, 21 LD van Zyl, 22 Patrick Lambie, 23 Bryan Habana 
The loosies were our main weakness all along and I would rather see two rookies playing than Willem AWOL Sloth Alberts and Nizaam Carr - who has been very quiet after a top performance in 2014.  
I think it is time to move away from Habana.   He was given a soft try in the last test and his pass to Combrinck subsequently was a shocker destroying a potential try in the process.  In recent tests he was poor in defense as well.   Use him as an impact player - but not as a starter.
I think Goosen should start and use his obvious ball sense to replace Lambie - who was rather quiet after his injury.   

'He was given a soft try and his pass to Combrink was a shocker'.....dishonesty doesnt really bother you does it Tokkie. Or perhaps you never played any rugby at all. The pass Habana received was behind him and high....he controlled it with one hand and brought it in......superb hands for the hardest pass to take. The pass he made to Combrink was in the tackle and came out low, at knee height, but certainly no harder to take than a pass behind you Habana pulled off.Hell I have seen Schalk take that kind of pass at full tilt. So let's start Ulengo, whose defence was poor against the Barbarians. Just another hit and hope selection in the Destroyli mode. We talk about emulating the All Blacks but then want players who would be nowhere in their system to be catpulted right over the bench straight into the Bok starting team. We have very stupid fans. Where I agree with you is that Goosen should start at 10. We might as well get this myth behind us as well.....having already disposed of the Jantjies and Lambie notions. We know those two aren't the answer.....but some fans still think a stringbean exposed nerve end is going to make it in test rugby......sure, lets try that idea.

 Give us your side then, Arsehole!
Let's have you match 23 for the coming test against Wales.
This is where you usually do your deep dive ... or where you ignore the post. A coward by nature. 
Can 't see that changing any day soon.

Yes,I too am very interested in seeing Moz's 23 to take on Wales.Thank you in advance.  

 What a load of baloney from Mozart.   First of all he mentioned Combrinck missing the pass and when I pointed out that it was below knee height he kept quiet.   Now he admits it was a poor pass - but find an excuse as per normal.   Incidentally Habana was still on his feet and in the process of being tackled when he made the pass - so no excuse since his arms were not impaired.   
He also has a very short memory - Schalk spilled four perfectly good passes in the Japan test last year - so why that example.
There is one major requirement expected from a flyhalf and that is ball sense influencing decision making.   None of the top flyhalfs of the modern era were/are particularly big and in that category one includes Carter, Wilkinson and Barret - so why should a heavy and big player being the answer? 
Wilkinson   -   1,78   -   89 kgsBarret        -   1,87  -    92 kgsCarter        -   1,78  -    94 kgsS exton      -   1,89  -    92 kgs 
Goosen is   -   1,85   -   89 kgs
Your idea of a flyhalf being Fat Fransie - being 1,91 and 115 kgs is not a rule     
There is one advantage of Goosen - he has ball sense.   The useless Fat Fransie and Morne Steyn never had any and their decision-making is poor and slow to boot. 
They are definitely also speed - deficient and poor in defense a nd execution.  So why the constant harping about Goosen?    

 

 Oh dear ... the cowardly old fart has vanished from sight.
Funny how often that happens when pressed or exposed.
I guess we'll not be seeing his incredible side to take on Wales.
LOL!!

 Mike ... do you have any idea where Brussow is?
 

 He is still in Japan as far as I know - but has already said he is not playing international rugby in future.   I do not think he will change his mind about that one. 

Oh you have to be very brave to post a side. Such courage. On Saturday night I'd have made a few phone calls and produced this team: Willie Combrink Allende Rohan Habana Frans Pienaar Beast Bismarck Koch Willemse Stephanie Alberts Schalk Vermeulen And they would have a good shot at beating Wales. And you know they would try .....not perfect I grant, I would prefer not to pick Combrink or Allende who attempted 2 tackles against Italy and missed both, but I cant see any alternative at this late point.

Oh and I would have asked Alistair to take the waters at Bath and asked Smith to coach the team.

Moz,i'd like Danie Gerber in the team. Please select from those available PLEASE. 

CleanCut

Status: Rugby Legend
Posts: 4699 RE: Toetsie to to ring the changes for the Boks
November 22, 2016, 08:11:04

 

Mike ... do you have any idea where Brussow is?
 

 

Still playing for the Red Hurricanes in the Japanese Top League since 2013

All the players selected are in Europe.....on almost every tour we have brought in a player who is not in the squad, but playing club rugby in Europe....usually with a clause that releases them for internationals. That's my team Monster.

 Mozart
Why do you want to destroy the backline by putting in Fat Fransie with his aimless kicks and poor attacking and defensive play? 
You were delighted when Morne came on Board - yet he was a disaster.   Now you want Fat Fransie - who is a worse choice since his accuracy at goal kicking is not on par with Morne.   Both are sub-standard players with serious deficiencies in all aspects of the game.   .       
Morne was so poor - he played himself out of any future Springbok team - maybe they should get Fat Fransie to do the same - then you may quie ten down on that one.   .  

 Hey arsehole, where was Morne the disaster. The Boks were close to New Zealand, at 22-15, when Lambie's kick got charged down. This made the score 29-15 after the Lambie mistake. Morne was then taken off the field and Lambie was moved to flyhalf. The rest of the team, who remained on the pitch (without Morne) then fell apart...

In the time with Lambie at flyhalf, New Zealand scored another 28 points and zero from the Proteas

 Tsk. Some people always have to fark about a good argument with facts.

 Well, well, well ... he had the balls after all. 
That surely deserves a pat on the back.  
A little puzzled though. He despises De Allende, thinks Janse van Rensburg is a defensive nightmare, doesn't rate Koch at all and looks for any excuse to run Pieter Steff Du Toit down ... and yet ... there they are.
He's playing Alberts at 6 so the egg laying counter ruck is still a favourite of his.
His loosies are old and slow and I doubt they'd compete well against most provincial sides. 
Honestly thought you would have had JP Pietersen slotted in as your first choice 14. His age alone should be more than enough to qualify. 
More than half of your starting 15 is deep into their thirties. 
A team of slow pensioners that would run out of puff within the first 15 minutes. I certainly hope you have a few more heroes of old on the bench, cause your going to need fresh legs after 20 minutes, that's for sure.
Not that it'll help cause by that time your side's behind by a good 50 pts.
We both know you really wanted Jake as coach of your side. Why didn't you just say so?

 Incidentally Trooth Fairy - this is a site where rugby issues are discussed and it aims at providing useful information.
However, the BS brigade try and whitewash some players with useless stats - as if Morne Steyn was the only player that contributed anything to the team.   His defense was horrible - his decision-making worse - his kicks out of hand aimless and only a means to hand possession to the AB's.
For the info of the BS idiots - take a lesson from the fact that Morne was dropped from the squad for very good reasons.   Let him continue as the Stade Francais bench disaster.    

"However, the BS brigade try and whitewash some players with useless stats - as if Morne Steyn was the only player that contributed anything to the team. "

Well well well. If it isn't the same p@epol who follows his own advice only when it suits him. When the team does well while MS is on the field, then we have to remember that he is not the only one who contributes. When the team does k@k when MS is on the field, he is the sole contributes to the k@k.

 Lets face facts the team was kak when Morne was on the field of play and he added to that by a kak display. 

 And the team was even kakker when he was off the field...

So, let's for the sake of argument accept that his kak play contributed to the Boks trailing by 22-15, just before the Lambie kick was charged down... Lambie's kick contributed to another 7 for NZ.... And an additional 28 points where Morne's kak display definitely did not "contribute" any further to the kak effort by the team...

I'd take his "contribution with kak play" for the 22-15 scoreline any day before the contribution of the others through their even kakker play to cause another 35 points conceded.

So, taking your so-called argument regarding his kak display into account and accepting it as "truth", you also need to accept the other truth, from logical deduction... The alternatives were even kakker than Morne.

There is nothing logical in what you preached here.  The bench players were poorly selected and  weakened the team considerably.  
That fool Alberts played or a time and never made a single tackle during the game.   The same can be said about the rest - bar Kriel.     

 "There is nothing logical in what you preached here.  The bench players were poorly selected and  weakened the team considerably.  
That fool Alberts played or a time and never made a single tackle during the game.   The same can be said about the rest - bar Kriel."
Huhh? What happened to the fact that it was all down to Morne?

 Ou Tokkie, you should change your name to Boy George and have this as your theme song:
https://youtu.be/JmcA9LIIXWw

This would be a good avatar as well:

 @Clever
Who the F is Robin Smith?
Are you referring to Kwagga?

Stephanie is only in my team because Etzebeth is out concussed. Failing that my locks would be Willemse 4, Etzebeth 5....Etzebeth is the best athlete we have among the tight forwards. You are right though Carbuncle I am critical of du Toit.....those 2 Pom tries he let through and final lineout against Italy he lost just don't do it for me. As for Allende and Rohan they are poor defensively....but who are the alternatives Mapoe or Venter.....they are also poor defensively and non factors on attack. I chose the lesser of four evils. See here's the thing, it's a constrained choice. But I would pick Alberts, Schalk and Vermeulen to handily outplay the clueless loosies we have been fielding....old or not. The fact is my team is comprised of real Springboks, not the imposters who have been besmirching the jersey this season.

Was Schalk (fr knock-ons) not after Bismarck (4 Penalties) the biggest bugger-upper in the Japan test last year and was stand-in flyhalf in that game?
No comment on Fat Fransie and the fact that he is the worst flyhalf imaginable.   Worse than Morne - since he is not as good a goal kicker as Morne.  No ball sense, poor decision-maker - poor defender - poor attacker - poor passer due to ball-hogging and cutting out overlaps with skip passes - poor aimless kicker out of hand.   What the hell do you expect from that one?    

Was Schalk (fr knock-ons) not after Bismarck (4 Penalties) the biggest bugger-upper in the Japan test last year and was stand-in flyhalf in that game?
No comment on Fat Fransie and the fact that he is the worst flyhalf imaginable.   Worse than Morne - since he is not as good a goal kicker as Morne.  No ball sense, poor decision-maker - poor defender - poor attacker - poor passer due to ball-hogging and cutting out overlaps with skip passes - poor aimless kicker out of hand.   What the hell do you expect from that one?    

Patrick Lambie vs Oz and NZ at home......o points to 35 for Oz and NZ Morne Steyn vs Oz and NZ at home .....,,33 points to 32. Frans would do even better. It's really simple choose Springboks rather than callow provincial players.

 And Fat Fransie was he worst rated center in 2014 as no 32 in the center ranking and number 14 as flyhalf.   So is he a Springbok because you said so - what a joke. 
Still saying that stats does not reflect his value in teams?   What value?  

 Morne 33 ....Oz/NZ 32. Say no more.

 Mozart
Carry on living in dreamland - must be powerful stuff you smoke to come up with Morne and Fat F ransie being Springbok material. 

Morne 33....Oz/NZ 32, no need for RooiUrinal's hallucinatory drugs..

Greetings from down under guys.
I have two questions for the old F.A.R.T in the USA.
1. What about Victor....have u forgotten him already.2. Now all those unhappy Clinton folks in the USA want to move to Canada. Well if they are so concerned about the plight of illegals from Mexico why not move to Mexico and help them in their own country.
Oh I forgot the Mexicans don't want u democrats (cry babies) either.
Note: Plus we don't want u in CANADA.
Stay in the USA, Trump will sort u out shortly and give u guys some direction in life.
Finally pleased to add that my bet on the Goats not winning a game in this EOTY series is still good. Celebrating with real Saffers here in Queensland on the series thus far and adding an additional bit of spice to the curry for the TRUMP landslide victory.
All great news to my ears and pocket.
Vasbyt.

 Arthur John..You're the only person I know who gets pi.ssed on maple syrup...sjampies.
And oh by the way, QLD is redneck turf....I can understand you being in your element!

Shame.
Have another shot while u are still standing..........

 Actually right now I am in CT, a hell of a lot better than muggy old Queensland.

 Mozart
I hope you enjoy your visit to the Mother City and have a great time.