Victoria Missfield

Guys years ago when I stated on this site that he was the heaviest three quarter ever to pull on a Springbok Jersey I was shot down by all of you.
Some even went as far as to suggest that he was the best lock ever to wear the green and gold......
Well what say you guys now?
The only thing that has changed is that he has got slower....he still plays the same pattern of rugby as yesteryear without Bakkies to cover for him.
I my opinion he does not rate with the great locks that have represented SA like Andrews, Du Preez, Pickard.
Thankfully he will be old to go to the next world cup as a player and hopefully not as the backs coach.

Thank goodness....free at last.

Oh goody, another "let's bash Matfield" thread. Zzzz. 
Next we'll have Clevermike chiming in about Matfield turning the tight 5 into a tight 4. Again.

Good luck to Victor & the Bokke ........ hope they stick it right up the  'doubters', & ffs., please save the postmortems til after the game .  

 A decade of disasterous wee matfiled. But soon we will be free. However matfileds hapless groupies will all be lamenting his early retirement. bwahahahahahahaha 
Blobbie we all support the Boks so hence our total dismay that the show pony is still messing up the team. 
I see Meyer still thinks Du Preez is the best scrumhalf in the world. Well lets see. Du Preez is Meyer's key man.

 Beeno
What Meyer said is immaterial - he has to justify his selections and that justification is not based on anything - his viewpoints are not supported by facts at all.  Du Preez has been injured on a regular basis since 2012 and his last three tests have been 15 months ago - the man is 33 years old - an age where performances at the best of time goes down at a speed of jet engines.   So what can produce Du Preez at present?   However, to call him the best scrummie in the world - without playing for more than a year is crazy and unreal, especially since his June 2014 performances were nothing special.
Meyer is living in the past and he is picking teams that reflect players that cannot make the grade anymore - the worst one being Matfield.          

 hope they stick it right up the  'doubters',

@blobbok we know unfortunately that, even if he's man of the match in the final(like 2007), he'll still be the shittest player in the world to certain people. So I shall not hold my breath.

 ho3n3r
Thi happens to be 2015 - not 2007.  Does it mean that a player who managed to play well in 2007 necessarily perform well in 2015?   
Do you know the difference between reputation and performance and that reputation selections without adequate performance is the worst possible selection any coach van make?  

Nope. Just saying Matfield is still good enough to be there - although he's not as good as he was in 2007.
But something tells me you didn't like him back then either.
And don't patronise me, if you have to ask me whether I know the difference between performance and reputation only makes you seem arrogant. I don't ask you whether you know what the result is of 1+1.
If your opinion is different to mine, it doesn't make either wrong. I just gave you my opinion. If you wanna play insulting games, I see about 0% of my time further spent here will be discussing serious things with you.

 "Do you know the difference between reputation and performance and that reputation selections without adequate performance is the worst possible selection any coach van make? "
@Ou Tokkie. We have a new poster on the forum and on the first day you choose to launch a personal attack. Bear that in mind the next time you go p!ssing about personal attacks. What a hypocrite!

 Was calling him Desert Fox representing an insult.  The above was not - it was just a question?   He came back with an insulting remark.

 ho3n3r
I went to France in 2007 for 6 weeks to watch the Springboks play in the RWC and thought Matfield was very good.  Since his comeback from retirement in 2014 he was not even 50% of what he used to be - at this stage his selection to the Springbok team is insulting - no other coach than Meyer would have picked him for anything.
The same applies to players like Pietersen as well.    

clevermike
 
Status: Hall Of Fame 
Posts: 19220RE: Victoria Missfield
September 17, 2015, 13:33:00

 Was calling him Desert Fox representing an insult.  The above was not - it was just a question?   He came back with an insulting remark.

 

Huhh? What? F@kkit maar jy is toe. 

 Vlag...let him go now...I've asked him to up the dosage...tx

 Bwahaha! Always have loved House.
Love your posts Ceradyne.

 Ceradunce
You are a f#cking rugby-ignorant misfit - the only really stupid idiot together with Mozart on this site.    

Ceradunce
You are a f#cking rugby-ignorant misfit - the only really stupid idiot together with Mozart on this site.

Can you actually reply to anyone without swearing at them and/or calling them names? Maybe people will reply to you with more respect if you show them some in return.
/2c

Ho3, don't get caught up in the factionalism here. It is not good for your health.

Thanks mate. I'm not really fazed. I've been on the internet too long to get angry. But I will nonetheless have an opinion.

If Victoria Missfield is a fat lady, she hasn't sung yet. Has a crucial role to play in the WC.

 Hmmm. I wonder. Should I give Ho3n3r the link to the PSG thread? Nahhh. Just leave it. On second thoughts............ No leave.

Ahh what the hell. Let's do it.
Enjoy Ho3n3r.   http://www.ruckersforum.com/forum.cfm?threadid=9303#inscore_ifheight_xdc_500

 If Victoria Missfield is a fat lady, she hasn't sung yet. Has a crucial role to play in the WC.
Well said! We'll find that out during the world cup - those of us who don't know it already.

 I don't have any issues with VM being in the squad or even being first choice 5. I do however have an issue with the fact that we did not blood proper backup at lock during the last 4 years. If Victor and/or Eben gets injured, we are in serious trouble. PSDT and Lood? Really? Both good players, but both way too inexperienced for my liking to be the only backups at lock. IMO Victor should have played less tests during the last 2 seasons, either giving Lood more time on the field. We also wasted some time with other locks. Not criticizing Meyer, it's just that it didn't pan out and due to his conservatism(a good thing for slowly building a team), we are out of options if our starters get injured. Same can be said for Jean. Making him captain was a good thing for stability and all that, but will he really be up to top form by the time we reach the playoffs? I seriously doubt that.  

You have a point, Draad, but who else should he have tried? It iso easy to ramble  down the names of the S15 locks but seriously, who was there? The only one who did not get a shot was Paul Willemse but for some  reason I get the feeling that there was a story behind the story with him. It is as if he has just appeared into thin air. There is also not much coming out of France about him. 

 I don't know, I think he was banking on Flip and then Flip started to toi-toi about not getting a Bok contract. Then he also had to keep the pigmentation right, so less opportunities to blood players. One can see how desperate he is by his inclusion of PSDT, good player, but what other coach would have included him with the game time he had?Having said all that, I can't, for the Hell of it, understand how Coenie made the squad. Must be for an impact player only kinda thing, but I'm baffled.

 Draad
Meyer had no idea to give experience to players to build up a squad.  With the rare exception of Etzebeth Meyer made up his mind in 2012 whom he wants in his squad for the WC.   In the process he would let some younger players into the team and then discarded them when some of his players were injured.  They got no chance to fain much experience - when the injured players were back the younger players were out.
instead of giving them enough game time - the poor buggers never really came to a stage where they can establish themselves as Springbok players - they were never given opportunities to play - when Meyer's favourites were available and to become more experienced  - even against weaker international teams.
Then disaster struck - three of Meyer's initial "squad" opted out of international rugby and they had to be replaced with very little or no experience players.   The further problem is that Meyer's squad became a nightmare when a list of players had serious injuries - Alberts, Du Preez and De Villiers were seriously injured in 2014.  They had very little rugby this year and when they did they were way below par.  Meyer made no preparations to replace them - so he had to take a gamble and include them in his squad.
The problem is that nothing would change the mind of Meyer about his squad he stuck on from 2012.   Performance was not part of his perception - they were good enough in the past so that was all he required.  If their were others who performed better than his favourites did - it count for nothing at all.  If replacements were better than the original selections stood and they were discarded.  
I agree with you - Meyer did never tried to build up a more experienced squad with performance as a base.   We ended up with  a squad with too many has-beens and some never has-beens - where Ollie le Roux is 100% correct - we have not fone anywhere and will go nowhere in this WC.     
      
         

Bekker was the "rightful" successor - both in age, and ability. Unfortunately for the Boks I think with his injury history he made the business decision to stay in Japan exclusively. If he was still in the picture I somehow Matfield would have made his comeback.
Otherwise, plenty of young locks have been given the opportunity, few have excelled or made the position theirs. I do think Lood is much better and far more consistent this year than he was last year though and deserves his spot. He strikes me as someone who will stick to domestic rugby as well. Others (Willemse) took off overseas. Every extended Bok training squad Meyer has ever named has had many uncapped players. Its a fallacy to say that the youngsters haven't been given a chance.

 Oimatey 
Kindly think about who Meyer first hunted as Springbok captain - it was Matfield.  His second choice was Fourie du Preez - who was injured at the time and turned down the request.   His third choice was Jean de Villiers.
Bekker was never in the picture at the time and that was probably the result of his contract that excluded him playing international rugby.  However, even though his name was mentioned recently he was never really in the picture insofar as Meyer is concerned.
So what happened with the lock situation.  Without initially Bakkies Botha and Matfield not available - Meyer started off with Flip van der Merwe and Juandre Kruger and also turned to Etzebeth at lock.   Van der Merwe was surprisingly good in 2012, but hs rugby his nosedived since and he was also injured fairly regularly.    kruger was a flop.   Etzebeth was the player that lasted till at present.   The next choice was Bakkies Botha and ultimately Matfield.   Du Toit was used from the bench for 10 minutes in the 2013.  The main usage of locks was Etzebeth, Matfield and Botha with van der Merwe being involved irregularly in tests.
Last year De Jager came on the scene and up to date De Jager and Du Toit had the following match experience:
De Jager    -   12 caps - 8 from the benchDu Toit      -    4 caps -  All from the bench
Insofar as the locks are concerned the latter two locks had no real opportunities to prove themselves or get real experience.
Meyer always contained inexperienced players - but he used very few of them - other than in the main from the bench.  Meyer has 15 members from the 2011 WC squad in his present squad.  All 15 are being used on Saturday - with only two of the other players in the squad being starting (Mvovo and Kriel).   The bench also includes two of the 2011 WC squad and the rest includes a smattering of players first selected by Meyer.       
 
                

"Bekker was never in the picture at the time and that was probably the result of his contract that excluded him playing international rugby. "
Now spend some time and read this, the first from ESPN and the rest from Media24:

An audience with Heyneke MeyerFirdose MoondaJune 7, 2012One of the talking points around the final training camp is the inclusion of only four locks. Is it an indication that there isn't much depth in that department?
We've lost a number of very experienced locks to injury [Andries Bekker], retirement [Victor Matfield] and others have moved overseas [Bakkies Botha], so it's not a case of a lack of depth. Having said that, I have the utmost faith in the four guys we have here and I know they can do the job.
There have been a few worrying injuries, such as Jaco Taute's shoulder and Bekker's back - do you have any particular concerns about the strength of the squad?
No, I think we've put together a great squad for the England series. Injuries will always be a concern, but that's part of the game.
Boks likely to drop Bekker2012-09-04 22:38Beeld reports that Bekker will in all likelihood be dropped from the 22-man squad altogether with Juandré Kruger expected to be named as the starting lock alongside Eben Etzebeth. 
The 2.08m Bekker had a poor game, especially on defence, in the 16-all draw against Argentina in Mendoza, with many believing he's slacking off due to ongoing back problems.
Bekker backs young Bok pack2012-10-04 13:48Johannesburg - Springbok lock Andries Bekker is confident that South Africa’s youthful forwards can mature into one of the best packs in world rugby.With only 162 caps between the forwards, they have already shown signs of maturity after their stellar performance against a settled New Zealand pack in Dunedin three weeks ago.“We made a big step up after Dunedin and we had a good week in training last week and this week as well,” Bekker said ahead of their clash against the tourists in Nasrec this weekend.“It is nice to go into a game on Saturday against the All Blacks with confidence."With 28 Test caps behind his name, Bekker is one of the senior players among the forwards, but he has had a hard time moving out of retired lockVictor Matfield’s imposing shadow.While Bekker had been groomed as Matfield’s understudy, he made a shaky start in his first two appearances under new Springbok coach Heyneke Meyer.He soon realised that he did not have a free pass into the Bok starting XV after a lacklustre performance in South Africa’s 16-16 draw against Argentina in Mendoza in August.Bekker admitted that performance was not good enough, which saw him being dropped for the next Test against Australia in Perth.“I know I wasn't up to standard and mentally I needed to make that switch and hopefully it came up,” he said.“Personally I know I was shocking and I think it is good if you know when you were bad and you need to make the step up.”Bekker made it count when Meyer showed faith in him in the Springboks’ 31-8 victory over Australia in Pretoria last weekend, making 19 tackles, while he was also faultless with his lineout throw-ins.

 Mike, Bakkies was rarely used and PSDT got fast tracked into the Bok setup. His injury problems are the only thing that prevented him from playing more. If I was Bok coach, I would not have picked him as a starter now and only one of him and Lood would have made my squad. I would have gone with Eben, Matfield, Lood and Flip, but it would have been different if PSDT played the whole year. I also would have played Willemse or another promising lock instead of Matfield in at least half the matches Victor started. Same goes for 8 as well. How many 8's were played during the last 4 years? Wings, centers? The problem does not lie with Meyer, the problem is with the performance clause in his contract and the fact that he is not allowed room for error. You can't properly build the younger players when you basically have to win every game at all cost, just to not get fired. That kind of mentality leads to just the opposite though. The older players ran out of steam and some of the youngsters did not step up. I really won't mind seeing Meyer appointed for the next 8 years, but with a slight alteration to his contract: No say in the selection of his squad whatsoever, only recommendations and requests to a selection panel who gives him the squad to train. He gets to pick the match day squad and starters, from his squad. I cannot see any other coach better qualified for the job. They better identify his successor now and make him assistant coach, or do something else to get the next coach ready, but there are no contenders that look like they can take over soon.

 oimatey
Sorry I disagree about the coaching issue - Meyer was more or less the worst coach we have had during the past 20 years because of ;lack of squad building for the 2015 WC.  His addiction to players he was acquainted with resulted in the present squad.  Gact is - the majority of the team on Saturday is the same lot who failed in the 2011 WC tournament and the fact that he consistently kept them in the squad and side with zero regard to actual performance is the reason for my statement. 
Instead of building up a squad over the past two years - he kept on fiddling with the old-timers.  If Bakkies Botha, Steenkamp and Jacque Fourie did not retire - they would still have been in the latest squad.   The performance record of those three was below par and so has the record been of at least 10 of the 15 survivors of the 2011 WC squad.
In his statements Meyer consistently referred to what his favourites are capable of - but in fact it should be what they were capable of years ago - nopt what they are capable of at present.            

Duplicate.  

Could it be that Mozart is using "Duplicate" to indicate when the thinks a poster is repeating himself?

Repeating himself ad nauseam.

2 days and I already feel like I'm losing energy due to him. He must be a real hoot in reality as well.
If he speaks at funerals, everyone would probably want to kill themselves too afterwards.

 Mozart
What the hell are you doing all the time with the rubbish you write about players you do not like.  The same list of players - the same names you designate to them - as nauseam.   What I write about Naledi Matfield are facts - but you cannot defend him as you know they are indisputable - so suddenly the "duplicate" stunt .    

 
Yup ... that confirms it?

Hoenie is a Bulls fan.

I bet the wanker even favours Kirchner at 15 ... he's probably disappointed that Matfield isn't Bok captain!!

Sounds a lot like Fox if you ask me. Ceradunce is also prone to multiple aliases

What do you think of Pat Lambie, Hoenie??