Wee Manie to Japan?

Appears he is going to Japan

They are wecome to have him - for SA and the Stormers he becam a handicap

Be nice, isn't today FamilyDay, of so iets?

Yep, I'd rather have Sacha, Pollard, Hendrikse, Wolhunter, or even Willemse at 10 for the Boks instead of Manie.

Let him make some nice bucks in Japan and set himself up for a good life after rugby.

I don't think he's Bok material anymore, but that doesn't mean that he's not a very hard worker and a good guy that deserves the best of what life has to offer.

Agree with Plum in this case as well.

Big loss to Stormers

Nice man…not a competitive bone in his body.

Bullshit he is a class act

A class act without a competitive bone in his body.

That’s your poor opinion on him, it’s certainly not the facts

If it was not for his poor goal kicking at times he would have attracted no negative press

Goal kicking does not define a player

But it does define nerve…and Manie’s tackling is pathetic. He is a total worm hole for the opposition.

Get real man stop talking crap.

Bullshit his defence is no different to all the other little players out there - Marcus Smith, Russell, Ramos, McKenzie, Jalibert, Carreras etc

Every one of those players is a better defender than Libbok.

Well, let’s not forget that before Sacha was really on the map, Libbok was the 10 when Stormers won the URC title.

Also his first performance ever in a WC as a Rookie Flyhalf was not that bad.

So yes he does have his weak points, but not completely useless I would say.

Elton > Manie

...sorry.

Libbok

Getting popcorn ready while I wait for Dave to warm up and release his tirade of why Manie is the best 10 ever.

I've been watching Rassies podcast if anyone watched it and he did mention if you are a kicker then you should get easy kicks over. So I think in the media he'll say one thing but behind closed doors he will be brutal with players. That misses kicked my Mania against the Pumas last year will cost him and it is not the first time he has done it.

I also think that is why Rassie have Hendeikse a crack. He is only 21, where as Manie is 27, Hendeikse can still improve a lot, where as Manie might have reached his ceiling or it is just character traits that he can't cope with pressure.

Elton Jantjies was the same. Could only function in the lions environment but when he went to the Stormers and played for the boks, he could never replicate that form.

Where as with Sasha he has already showed last year he has the mindset to take anyone and anything on. But that confidence is probably worth another chat.

"Where as with Sasha he has already showed last year he has the mindset to take anyone and anything on. But that confidence is probably worth another chat."

I can't recall being as impressed by a new Bok as I was with Sacha winning that crucial kicking battle against Dmac and Bauden toward the end of the AB test. A complete noob to that kind of pressure and that level, and he completely outplayed them. He mentioned it in the Paige podcast as well, so I'm glad he knows how special that moment was. To me, that little sequence felt like the birth of a star.

...and there hasn't been a single shred of evidence to prove otherwise.

No King you dumbfuck you seem either confused or stupid

Manie sits at number 3 in the pecking order behind Pollard and Sacha

Im just not pathetic enough like some clowns on here to suddenly declare that Manie is a shit rugby player or has no competitive bone in his body

Rugby ignorance of the highest order - derived at by defining a player based on an up and down kicking record - it’s as stupid enough to define Morne Steyn as a great rugby player when in fact all he could do was kick

Mostert a great lock that is defined by the number of process tackles he makes - ignoring the fact that he is unable to impose himself physically both on attack or defensively - the essentials of a Bok lock

Clowns on here and in general are followers who only understand the basics of the game - reality and depth escapes them

I very much doubt Manie is ahead of Hendrikse in the pecking order.

Is he even ahead of Wolhunter at this point?

Glad to see King has joined the "dumfuck" side of the bus.

Welcome, King.

Us dumfucks are legion!

He is definitely ahead of Hendrikse who is better suited to 15

Rassie has Manie at 3 in the pecking order

Wolhunter is bog ordinary

I’d rather have Hendrikse which means you have 15 men on the field defensively. Your choice of Libbok is hilarious Dave. You tell us there is no space in modern rugby so we have to choose Dud Allende. But Libbok’s only card apart from the now anticipated open side cross kick…is running in space.

You can’t even keep your own story straight.

No his card is not running in space it’s creating for those around him - get your facts straight

His defence is no different to that of Ramos, Marcus Smith, McKenzie, Jalibert, Russell, Biggar etc so your take is a little flimsy

How does he do that when there is no space for him to get the backline moving….he certainly can’t create that space by driving into tackles and offloading. Once again complete bullshit..Libbok gets into space and his speed opens things up. But that works only occasionaly in tests while you still have the defensive and goal kicking frailties.

Well exactly - that is what great players can do in tests where space is at a premiium - he finds it and exploits it - a very creative player with a suspect goal kicking history and a defence that mirrors more than 50% of the test flyhalves out there

Does that make him a poor player - anything but

So there is space and we don’t need 7 tractors behind the pack….got it. But Manie was yanked by the genius for a good reason.

Stop acting stupid - where did I say that there was zero space in test matches huh?

Not enough space to justify a player who performs in space, unless it’s a player you like eg Libbok. Your reasoning starts with a player you like and then you define a world in which he can flourish. Except occasionally you screw up and support both Libbok and Dud Allende for completely contradictory reasons.

Keep up the comedy routine.

"Is he even ahead of Wolhunter at this point?"

Everyone is ahead of Wolhuter...he won't smell a test, ever...unless he somehow qualifies for Namibia or Botswana...or something...not even close to Bok material.

Fuck you really are rugby stupid

Listen an learn

80% of the time we see no space in a test match - hence the use of de Allende, Esterhuizen, Aki, Tuilagi, Ollie Lawrence, Danty, Tuipolotu and Kerevi type of 12’s - a fact you consistently miss

And for that 20% of the time you have the Libbok, Sacha, Jantjies, McKenzie, Russell, Marcus Smith, Jalibert, Barrett, Richie M, Quade Cooper type of played that look to exploit that bit of space

That’s the beauty of the game - a mix of talents to effect a result

So presumably in your model Williams, Sacha/Libbok, Am/Julius, Kolbe/Arendse, Fassi function in space. And Allende operates in traffic.. .but that’s 80% of the time …..the remaining 20% of the time is allocated to the other 6 backs.

That’s the beauty of complete bullshit, everybody allows you to get away with it 80% of the time.

Wrong again - your bruiser 12 takes it up in traffic as de Allende does so well - the rest find themselves taking contact most of the game with the ammunition to exploit space when it presents itself - every player needs to cope with contact 80% of the time, the best sides have the players to exploit the space 20% of the time

So just to help you - teams equip themselves with a physical 12 to take the brunt of the contact from phase play and the likes of Am, Fassi, Moodie, Arendse and Kolbe to operate effectively in contact for much of the game but equally well equipped to exploit space when it presents itself

The beauty of DA is that he is equipped to exploit space as well

Hope this is all sinking in - I suspect not?

More Nonsense…..if Dud actually put players in space you could try and make a case he is functional. But he doesn’t he tractors until he gets put down…..which means the next player always gets the ball in traffic according to your logic. Utter nonsense from a rugby moron.

Hell a pick and go right next to the breakdown. exploits space. Space is available in any channel….less in 10 than 12 which blows up your whole logic.

But there is no logic, no understanding of how players like Sexton and Marcus Smith find space….just a model of pick them by the pound.

It’s not DA’s job to put players into space it’s to create the next phase drawing defenders in - nothing nonsense about that it’s the facts - it’s the gameplan

Damn right the next player getting the ball will operate in traffic - that will be a forward running off a pod

You don’t get the basics

A pick and go near the breakdown exploits space??? What utter rubbish, that player will find himself back in traffic

Sexton created space by being the fall guy - with that loop around the world seemed to take forever to work out. He operated in traffic, putting his body on the line to manoeuvre space

Marcus Smith is another Libbok who have moments of magic which is outweighed by the pressures of contact for the majority of the time

Both find themselves in the wilderness right now

Many times the pick and go executor breaks the first line of defence….he sees the space…..that’s why he does it moron, Space is where you find it….Sacha finds it with a chip over the defense, Jordan finds it by cutting onto the ball at pace, Sexton finds it by wrapping round, Marcus Smith finds it by deception and acceleration,

‘The only likely consequence of a series of toothless runs like Allende is that eventually he or more likely the next guy who is under more pressure….coughs up the ball.

Oh for fuck sake you really are stuoid - so Sacha effects pick and go’s does he - fuck me which games have you been watching - fantasy rugby moron?

If pick and go’s were that effective at exploring space we would see them employed all game you idiot

You seriously don’t understand the game - no wonder you don’t see the merit in the likes of PSDT and DA but think powder puff is great

Your inability to grasps the basics explains these takes - fuck me you expect a big lock type 7 to beat defenders and effect turnovers - how fucking rugby niave is that moron?

I said Sacha finds space with a chip Arse…a pick and go is not a chip, Arse. There is no merit to running the ball and making no meters, it’s just the precursor to a box kick which was better done straight away, which at least reduces the risk of a turnover while giving up no yards and no time for the defence to get set..

Of course there is merit in running the ball up in traffic and making a metre it’s the Boks bread and butter it’s why they are number 1

Well yes the chip and chase is a method of breaking defences but is always 50/50 and can only really be executed once or twice in a game - hardly the fucking tactic to die by

One chip and chase recovery is worth 20 runs from Dud Toit, Arse….you know 1x20.