What’s the point of debating rugby?

Dave the main point about debating is to show that the other oak doesnt know his ruby. Rugby i s just a useful vehicle for a great argument. But lets not be too cynical some oaks hold their amazingly incorrect views with sincerity alas!

Some rugby noobs like ou Redrooi are so bad that they become a barometer, not foolproof though, for judging what is right, just take the opposite view and you will be right most of the time. Hahahahahahahhaha

But yes it true folks don't often change their minds. amazingly wee matfiled the weakest lock ever to play for the Boks is still lauded, perhaps for his time spent in the backline who knows how these fans "think" Once a thing reaches rugby PC any fallacy is hard to correct.

But the discussions do reveal facts, insights and agendas. Arguments about ruby will not end, thankfully.

Thanks Dave you make my point perfectly. Your fallacy that wee matfiled was 115 kg has been debunked countless times and you still trot out the same old BS.

Bwahahahaahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahaahahaha

Nope rather believe what matfiled himself said - his best playing weight was 108 kg

When he stopped playing he dropped to 102 kg and was thought to light to return to rugby.

Stick with Beeno. Airlight wee victor was indeed a lightweight hiding behind Bakkies! His severe lack of physicality was a big failing. Mostert is much more physical that wee matfiled the stringbean backline wannabee.

JJ Engelbrecht,??

When did you change your mind about him?

You may have omitted Jaco Taute too.

Though he started off brilliantly... he kinda let me down.

Like Jack Black... promised much as a youngster but never really ignited the world with his talent.

Well Dumb Fuck ... it comes down to the "proof of the pudding" in the end. The player shows his mettle ... for all to see.

Take Jantjies as an example. You told us that he was a rugby genius ... most of us disagreed with you ... you insisted we were stupid noobs ... and in the end you came clean and admitted that the only rugby noob on here was you.

See ... it took years to penetrate that thick noob skull of yours ... but persistence paid off in the end. You are a smidge wiser now than you were before ... not much ... but a little better off, thanks to much arguing, swearing, insulting, debating... etc.

That my dear Dumb Fuck is the point of it all.

Got it now?

My biggest problem with Saffex is that when someone disagrees with him, he speaks to us in the same tone that he speaks to his mother.

I enjoy a good debate.. but when he becomes British on me, i hate it.

The point is you might as well accept I’m right Dave.

Of course it does, Stupid.

You were guided to a better understanding through debate. 

If it hadn't been for debate you would still be wondering around in the dark.

Now ... you never thanked me for my guidance. When can I expect a heart felt thank you from you?

I'm here for you Dumb Fuck.

Yep there are only two opinions mine and the wrong one. How true!!

Actually Bloo I pretty much agree with your view on Allende, we don’t have many good options:

Senior player

3950 posts

The fact that there is even a discussion around rushing him back into the team just makes clear the dilemma we have at center. De Allende is a decent attacking player, but he is definitely not the best defender. That said, there really aren't a queue of people lining up to take his spot. We have a massive issue in SA at center, and the truth is that since Jaque Fourie and JDV, our cupboard has been empty. 

So on the one hand, I don't have a problem with De Allende being our starting center, but that has nothing to do with him, and everything to do with the fact that there is really nobody else. 

And I pretty much agree with your view on Dud Toit. He is energetic and a trier, just not very skilled. The WC suited the Duds, we were able to physically dominate all our knockout opponents, which disguised their limitations.

Senior player

3950 posts

PSDT is not a flanker. He is lock, end of story. There is a reason we never saw players like Bakkies and Matfield playing on the side of the scrum, because that was not their position. Them playing this poor kid out of position is ruining him as a player. Both his reputation and confidence take a knock with each failed attempt. In South Africa we keep on doing this. We play players out of position, and they pay the price. The list of talented players that have been down the jack of all trades path, and ultimately failed, is endless. Will the coaches ever learn??? 

I know for a fact that Damian is exactly as bad as I say he is. Who picked up his 2015 RC flubs, when the media were crowing about the dawn of the world's new best centre combination? Did you? I caught that. I caught it early. Heck, I covered every single activity of an entire test season, and over a dozen of the most important super rugby games. 

As for Steph? I have repeatedly pointed out his poor defence and his ineffective carries. I was challenged to post info on the Wellington win, because I was "such a damn liar". I posted a video. Everyone went quiet. Old Lugnerin avoided the thread entirely. 

All the issues that were raised exist. They exist in every single game. Damian was nowhere near to being a quality 12 in the World Cup, was outplayed comprehensively by Esterhuizen, and was therefore an undeserving Bok. Damian should have been discarded in 2014 and never seen again at test level. 

Step, with his abysmal 1.7m per carry at Super level, leaving him ranked 17th overall at flank, does not qualify as a quality test player. His test figures mirror his shocking super rugby figures. He is a very incomplete player. One of the chief ball-hogs that kill movement, with his equally skillless backline equivalent, Damian. The man simply cannot defend. He looks like a disabled giraffe hobbling on ice, and he bites on the same ploys every single time! Neither Steph nor Damian learn from past experience. 

We have numerous players that upgrade on both. We don't need either one. They offer us nothing we cannot get much better elsewhere. 

The Dud Toit lock/flank thing had an  interesting resolution. Erasmus played him as neither..rather as a rover, to use a football term. He basically had no set duties, except for his charges onto George Ford in the final.

Beyond that he could pop up on the wing, move to 1 in the line out, be the first receiver and first tackler (process activities that bumped his stats). In the contests we encountered the opposition wasn’t skilled enough to exploit a battleship playing where the frigates are to be found.

But he was exposed when he really had to deliver as the defending flank near our line.....the Wallies feigned a big push andDud got stuck behind Faf, creating a yawning overlap.

Dud succeeds at flank when we physically dominate and the opposition is on the back foot.

Actually Shark I don’t see any new skill Rassie developed in Dud...perhaps he has got to the point in his career where he reads the game a bit better. But his running, his tackling are about the same and not great. If anything his passing and line out work are worse. And he is still a giraffe when fetching, easily toppled over.

What has improved is the team around him, which disguises his weaknesses and allows him to play the rover role which makes him look good.

That is baloney. Steph role is to rush and catch the opposition behind the gainline. It's high risk, high reward. You need a very good defender to execute this, that's not Steph. Look at the countless examples that have been raised where he has allowed opponentsto breach our defence, each and every one of those is a fail. Andre is the standard we are looking at here, of a rusher who effectively carries out this role. Steph is a defensive liability. If this were any other non-media backed player they'd be scourged. His poor mobility and ponderous reading of play make him unsuited to the role. In that respect, he is like Lood, he is okay if the opposition choose to run directly at him. That isn't always the case. Worse yet are the defensive engagements that don't show up in the stats, like being totally bypassed. Factor that into the equation, as I did for the 2018 RC, and it makes for far worse reading. Mostert has often been a scapegoat for Steph. A Springbok tradition it would seem. 

Really funny to read the BS postings of AO and Mozart.  They are both totally wrong in what they write on site as it is based entirely on prejudice without regard to any facts,   For them facts means nothing and what is amazing is how they can repeat BS constantly and dream up rubbish to support their nonsensical statements.   Hell they really are amazing!!!!   LMAO

Players run straight through Mostert and Du Toit gets blamed for it.   What a farce!!!  LMAO      

Just over a year ago I had a discussion with a Springbok player - some of the gold medal winners in the 2019 WC and particularly referred to the stories AO and Mozart comes up with on this site as to Du Toit and De Allende,  He was dumbfounded by the statements these two members make on this site and could not believe that anybody who wrote that type of thing in a public forum knows anything about real rugby.

Then after the WC I spoke to a real top class player of the past and about the WC - AO was absent at the time - but I refer to all the criticism of Erasmus on this site and his comments were straight and to the point : "They must be complete idiots" to come up with the rubbish they do.  

I prefer to laugh at their idiocy - one cannot call it anything else.  Meyer was their idol and could do no wrong,   When he selected the 31 man squad  for the 2015 WC - he included 8 players who were basically unplayable in games,   It makes me wonder if AO and Mozart were to select the Springboks team for the last WC by how many points the Japanese would have  beaten them in the quarters ,

That is why I am always amazed at their contributions - but at the same time finds it extremely funny - to make the statements they come up with they must be twisted.           

A year ago I had a conversation with a gold medal winner in the 2019 WC.....interesting, given a year ago the WC had not been played.

 LMAOFY&Y!

Mozart 

Do you really understand English or are you braindamaged in reading as well as in rugby? 

Mozart 

Do you really understand English or are you braindamaged in reading as well as in rugby? 

The man is awarded the best player in the world. This also means he is the best 7 in the world. Huge approval all; round by everyone but Dr Moz and Org!!!

Both are intelligent people so one can only conclude they are a bunch of trolls. Hahahahaahahhahahaha Org overdoes it though. Gives the game away.

We could be making some progress on Allende. So don't despair.

1.7m per run, and the highest missed tackles of the Boks under Rassie. 17th ranked flank in super rugby. Nuff said.

Player of the year 2019 - nu ff said.  

He is on the ruck fringe of course he is going to soak up defenders. The high volume of misses isn't good though, neither the poor reads on rushes. Teams like to have a pod of three engage, and the carrier will draw him out and pass inside and then we have a problem. This often ends up with Mostert being called a poor defender. Steph ranked 29th out of the top 30 carriers in South Africa. I covered this already. He is not a good carrier and has poor skills. No aspect of his game is elite. Nothing.