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FORUM / RUGBY /  Who for scrummie - base on present performances this year?

Who for scrummie - base on present performances this year?

Started by clevermike21 REPLIES580 VIEWS· 18 Nov 2014, 07:05
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CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
18 Nov 2014, 07:05
#1
18 Nov 2014, 07:05#1

Put your scrummies in order of merit for performances over the past year in tests - bearing in mind that Du Preez had no test games since November last year and was out of rugby since June this year.   Please provide motivation for your rating based on performances  over the last 15 months - not on reputation.   


My rating without regard to reputation would be as follows:-


1  Reinach

2  Du Preez

3  Pienaar

4  Hougaard


The motivation would eb as follows:-


Reinach came form the bench in two tests and started in one test.   He did very well in both tests coming from the bench - especially against the Aussies.    In that test he only had six minutes playing time - yet he made a decisive break and he timed his pass to Lambie extremely well - creating a small space which enabled Lambie to score his try in that test.   He did well again on Saturday especially insofar as scoring of the try is concerned and his kicking game - especially relieving kicks were excellent insofar as both distance and accuracy was concerned.  There were some negatiives - but overall a very good performance.


Du Preez had comparatively litte game time in tests.   He was largely invisible in the home tests of the RC last year and since then only played in four test matches during the 2013 EOYT and in June this year.  Against Wales last year he was good - against Scotland invisible.   His performance in the June home tests against Wales was average in the first Wales test - especially bearing in mind ball possession losses stemming from his performance.   He was injured  in the second Wales test after a very questionable performance in that test.    Based on the latest performances - I cannot rate him better than Reinach.


Pienaar in recent tests showed that he is a journeyman - very much a stand-in type of player doing a satisfactory job.  he is more of a kicking scrummie - but can pass the ball accurately.   His negatives have been that at times he arrived late at breakdown points and is not always there to receive balls when coming back to the Springbok side.  He also have some problems in defending around the fringes.


Hougaard has largely been a sub until the injury of Pienaar in the All Black test in Wellington when he came on at minute 35.  There were some problems with his kicking game - too many kicks were the starting point for AB counter-attacks - and a few passes were also inaccurate.   He was more effective in the Ellis Park test, but put in a questionable performance in the irish test, whic h cost him his starting selection last week and may have a dampening effect in future tests.   Not much to choose from between him and Pienaar though.


       

 



    

BI
biltongbekClub Pro749 posts
18 Nov 2014, 08:08
#2
18 Nov 2014, 08:08#2

I want a halfback that can surprise, and then I want a halfback that cleans the ruck, kicking to me is secondary as I don't want a kicking halfback.


Over the years I never became a fan of Fourie du Preez,  even when he was touted as the best scrumhalf in the world. Ruan PIenaar was one of my favourite SA players, but he has become pedantic and is the out and out kicking scrumhalf.


Hougaard doesn't kick well, and Reinach is a bit better than Hougaard at kicking. Both of them are very good cover defenders, and I like that, they both have oodles of pace.


Yes based on what we have seen this year is that Hougaard is not a wet weather player. But Reinach looked good in wet conditions.


Many still believe du Preez is the best scrumhalf in South Africa, I struggle to see how they can make that assertion when we hardly see him run out for the Boks and with him playing in Japan we see none of his club form.


My choices are Reinach and H ougaard. But I think the search is not over, I would like to see Kevin Luiters et a shot, it is probably too late for the RWC.


But then, I do not believe we will win the RWC, there are simply too many question marks.

CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
18 Nov 2014, 08:56
#3
18 Nov 2014, 08:56#3
 
Luiters has it all. Great pass, kicking out of hand is solid, not afraid to defend, reads the game well and a good solid attacking game.

One for the future if you ask me.

Look forward to seeing him next year in the Super Rugby.

Actually I'm a little surprised he hasn't been snapped up by a bigger union yet.

I'm sure we at the Lions can make use of him.


CL
CleanCutPro9,905 posts
18 Nov 2014, 10:07
#4
18 Nov 2014, 10:07#4
 
Reinach knows there's an opening at 9 and has shown he can make the step up to test level.

Du Preez is a hasbeen. Time he settles down with a coffee shop in Church street.

Faff is a favourite of mine but may be a little small defensively. Has the heart of a "Lion" but that may not be enough.
 
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
18 Nov 2014, 12:32
#5
18 Nov 2014, 12:32#5

1. Hougaard 2. Reinach 3. Faf de Klerk 4. v/Zyl 5. Groom

 

I cant be asked with the hasbeens  

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
18 Nov 2014, 13:17
#6
18 Nov 2014, 13:17#6
 I mere;ly looked at the 4 players that played as scrummie for the Springboks from last year and their performances.   To be quite frank I was not impressed with either Du Preez or Pienaar - both were playing to my mind on reputationwith precious litte to show that they belong.
To answer Saffex grouing - I m jittery about Hougaard.   He was desperately poor in 2012 - was better this year - but still showed some deficiencies - which he semee to hae overcome in the Ellis Park test - but in the Dublin test he was back tohis 2012 performances.  He seems to be poor in wet conditions, which is not doing himself any favours.   
The problem is that Meyer is a fool - he still regards Du Preez and Pienaar as his main scrummie options and they have dome near to zero to repay his loyalty to them.  But that is nothing unique - the same applies to some of his other favourites like Fourie, Morne Steyn, Bakkies Botha and Matfield - while Jannie and Alberts seems to be other close associates.   
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
18 Nov 2014, 14:42
#7
18 Nov 2014, 14:42#7

Bullshit, Hougaard made a good come back this year, was excellent against Oz and NZ - showed us exactly what we are missing at 9......he along with the rest of the Boks had a poor to average outing against Ireland......so what, that does not define him.

 

du Preez looked good in terms of service in his first outing for the Boks and then faded to nothing.

 

Having Pienaar on your list is a laugh......the guy is just far too passive as a 9 at test level these days and kicks far too much.

 

Our best 9's are Hougaard, Reinach, de Klerk and v/Zyl.......Groom is handy enough as well and I like the look of Luithers  

BI
biltongbekClub Pro749 posts
18 Nov 2014, 14:45
#8
18 Nov 2014, 14:45#8

I wish de Klerk was a bit bigger, from memory I saw somewhere he weighs less than 70kg.


He is one exciting young halfback, but I cannot think of one coach that will put him in a springbok jersey.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
18 Nov 2014, 14:48
#9
18 Nov 2014, 14:48#9

Size is of little consequence at 9.....look at Smith of the AB's, he is he best in the business and tiny. Same can be said of Care and Youngs of England.

 

de Klerk was the find of the S15......outstanding player. A fit de Klerk would be in my Bok squad 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
18 Nov 2014, 15:06
#11
18 Nov 2014, 15:06#11
 The thing about Little Faf is the way he pushed off Matfield in the one game and ran past Francois Steyn n the other game. in Supoer 15 this year.  Really got me in h is corner - that one.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
18 Nov 2014, 15:06
#12
18 Nov 2014, 15:06#12
 The thing about Little Faf is the way he pushed off Matfield in the one game and ran past Francois Steyn n the other game. in Supoer 15 this year.  Really got me in h is corner - that one.
BI
biltongbekClub Pro749 posts
18 Nov 2014, 15:08
#13
18 Nov 2014, 15:08#13

 Saffex, there is no way those measurements are correct, Faf de Klerk 1.87 meters tall?


Not a hope in hell.


Doesn't give much confidence in the tale of the tape there.


Wiki, gives him as 66kg and 1.72 m tall.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
18 Nov 2014, 15:10
#14
18 Nov 2014, 15:10#14
Yeah that is true my guess is that it should have been 1.78m  
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
18 Nov 2014, 15:11
#15
18 Nov 2014, 15:11#15
He is 1.69m which is about right.......but size is of no issue at 9  
BI
biltongbekClub Pro749 posts
18 Nov 2014, 15:11
#16
18 Nov 2014, 15:11#16
 WHat I like about Faf and Reinach is that both of them are very exciting players, they can come up with a game changing play and bring you back into a game. It is th eir unpredictability that I like.
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
18 Nov 2014, 15:16
#18
18 Nov 2014, 15:16#18
Yep Biltong and that was Hougaards strength before he got messed around. Hougaard at his best is unrivalled with ball in hand at 9   
DE
DezertFoxPro2,288 posts
18 Nov 2014, 16:13
#19
18 Nov 2014, 16:13#19
Michael back to his lies about Du Preez. Anything to fell a Bull. Remember that embarrassing episode about seeing Du Preez in 2005? 

You have a history of being exposed. You lied about the 2012 Dunedin test where I, yet again, posted video footage exposing your lies. So you shifted to the Ellis Park test last year lamenting Morné's poor defensive efforts, as you stated he was "run at all day" and buckled. 
DE
DezertFoxPro2,288 posts
18 Nov 2014, 16:15
#20
18 Nov 2014, 16:15#20
Biltong, you cannot rely on individuality as a sole means for winning tests. Reinach is not a tactically PR technically sound 9 . He can be negated, as we saw on Saturday, and as we saw in the S15. I think he needs a lot of work and experience before he can play test rugby. At the moment I would opt for Pienaar first, he at least understands how to control a test.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
18 Nov 2014, 16:26
#21
18 Nov 2014, 16:26#21
 Letsallbemorons
The indcident with Du Preez happened in 2004 and I admitted that my initial dating was incorrect.   The incident was factual.
Whayt have you proved about the Dunedin test - that Morne missed 8)% of his kicks at goal and was so sh!t that meyer had to drop him from the team. 
Morne's defense was poor in the Ellis Park test and worse in the recent Perth test - in fact piss-poor.   He has had a record of BS decisionmkaing or lack of decisionmaking for years - and he single-handedly caused to the loss of the Springboks in Perth.   
Let me put it straight - I am not against Bulls players - I am against Bulls players who do not perform - whether for the Bulls or for the Springboks.  Morne was one of the worst ever.
"I think he needs a lot of work and experience before he can play test rugby".  Moron  - he is already playing test rugby - wake up to reality please - although it is hard for yoiu to undestand reality.  
BI
biltongbekClub Pro749 posts
18 Nov 2014, 17:37
#22
18 Nov 2014, 17:37#22

" Biltong, you cannot rely on individuality as a sole means for winning tests"


Tell that to Habana in the Super 14 final in 2007

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