Not arguing about the past. The present indicates no fighters other than De Kock and Nortje. The present team remains a disaster, They lost totally any fighting spirit they might have had oi the past. A follow on has been enforced and lets see whether the disaster following the first innings is inevitable.
We need another batting all-rounder in the side to replace Pretorius or Maharaj.
Neither of them do enough with the ball to justify nothing contributions with the bat.
A Parnel/Klusner/Hall type character is what we need at 8.
Right now it's a very long tail behind a poor performing top 4.
Die Ock is a fighter?
A Parnel/Klusner/Hall type character is what we need at 8.
Ja Plum that would help...or maybe a Boucher and Symcox, but that's only a part of the problem, I think it's far deeper than that.
De Kock is not the problem - Mozart. He scored nearly a hundred more runs against the English than any of the other batsmen. He is a natural batsman with a tendency to attack and not fiddle around keeping balls out m while scoring minimal runs. What makes you think Du Plessis os a fighter for instance for that matter Elgar as well.
@clevermike...
de Kock? A fighter? LOLOL
He is many things... woderful things... but he isnt a fighter.
I dont think he knows how to spell "fighter".
@seb
Parnell? a Fighter? LOLOLOL.\
Hall yes and klusener yes... but Parnell? Maybe a street fighter on the flats.
This article relates to fighters, ie Nortje.
Plum relates to Klusener and Parnel
I said Boucher and Symcox...record 9th wicket stand...ok, it was ODI not 4 day stuff but nevertheless fighters that fight fire with fire and the game on without folding up.
We are talking character and spine.
Please read comments fully in the right context.
BOUCHER
It was not a career marked by an abundance of natural talent and individual brilliance but rather punctuated by dogged determination and a razor-sharp will to succeed.
Wicketkeeping drills
The epitome of the adage "practice makes perfect", he would often be
seen running through countless sets of wicketkeeping drills, long after his
teammates had hit the showers.
But, the Proteas lost more than just a wicketkeeper when doctors ruled out any prospect of recovery in time for the first Test against England at the Oval next week.
His teammates, past and present, will attest to Boucher being the heartbeat of the team and when they needed a boost, or were faced with an impossible challenge, he would be the one to rally the troops to order.
"He was a man who brought out the best in people. Boucher led his teammates in a special way that was never overpowering or demeaning, but he was always in control," said former Proteas seamer, Makhaya Ntini, who starred alongside Boucher in the Proteas for 11 years.
In his short, stocky frame, Boucher packed a special type of competitiveness and aggression that lasted throughout his 15-year career behind the stumps for South Africa.
Right from the start of his Test career in 1997 against Pakistan in Sheikhupura, Boucher could always be counted on to provide the resolve to see the Proteas through any tight spot – either behind the stumps or with bat in hand.
Outstanding innings
There was a reason Boucher became the first – and possibly the only player for
the foreseeable future – to bag 500 catches in Test cricket.
As a batsman, he lived for the big occasion – whether it was a quick 30 or 40 that was needed to secure a victory, or the vital session spent at the crease to hold out for a draw.
Perhaps his most outstanding innings came when he smashed an unbeaten 50 to see South Africa to the massive total of 438 for 9, for a penultimate one-day international victory against Australia at the Wanderers in March 2006.
Almost hardly worth mentioning is Boucher's South African record for the fastest ODI century and the world ninth-wicket Test match partnership record with Pat Symcox.
PAT SYMCOX and KLUSENER
https://youtu.be/_V7R0OFDpmk
Andile is our only true all rounder prospect, at 23 he has time on his side
Much is said about Mulder but he is yet to step up
Except nowhere did I say Parnell is a fighter.
He's just a better bat and more skillful with the ball than our present bowling all-rounders.
His first class average is almost 30 yet he is easily capable of bowling first change.
As I said, the current crop don't contribute enough with the ball to justify their tiny batting contributions.
Morris is another guy that could be added to the list of all-rounders I'd prefer over Maharaj and Pretorius.
At 200/6, good teams will crawl to 300+ with 20s and 30s from 7,8 &9. That's what we need now. At least until the younger guys in the top order find their feet.
Point being, stack the team's lower order with semi-competent batters or keep scoring 250.
Agreed Saffex.
But in the modern game Andile has been pegged as a limited overs player.
...which I think is utter nonsense.
Difference is Andile has a far better international record than Pretorious in ODI’s
Their bowling stats are similar but Andile has twice the batting average and more importantly has shown fight and won us a ODI or two with the bat
This kid has BMT and looks to have a good batting technique
As a fifth bowler he can offer a bit, has a bit of a golden arm and looks like he has the makings of a handy bat
He is 23, Pretorious is 30 it’s a no brainer. Unfortunately bloody Graeme Smith has dissuaded him to sign a Kolpak deal means we have to select this useless player
We have way bigger problems than our "all-rounder" spot.
We've got a wicket keeper, 2 fast bowlers and an OK'ish spinner. One opener is on his last legs. None of the rest of the team are even close to settled. Absolutely disastrous planning by the "Idiots That Be". Ideology is more important than results...like the rest of the country. Crises management is at the order of the day.
PLUM..the problem on this forum is not with the players, cricket, rugby, politics, bushfires etc is that we all spout our opinions (with no authenticated experience or actual physical or material experience and make opinions based on no substance but superficial knowledge and hearsay.
We just crawl back into senseless and futile rubbish and augument for the sake of egos...nobody really listens, nobody really cares and nobody here is anywhere an expert and we are in a sense pure plain pretending small men who sit and oogle about other individuals accolades, instead of creating a nice relationship and trust amongst each other. There should be rules...guns or knives as Paul Newman asked in Sundance and Butch Cassidy movie,,,knives...reply...rules...rules in a knife fight...answer ,,,just kick your challenger in the cajones as hard as you can.
Lol, Seb
People don't like being disagreed with. It's maar human nature.
Must say, I don't mind. In fact, it's actually great when someone can make a counter argument. That's the only way a discussion is of value.