A question to the majority of you

Healthy Criticism is not a bad thing.....it is also necessary to let people know when something is not right ( Not that our talks reaches the bok Camp in anycase, maybe or I wish, we don't know) so they can fix it and become stronger......what's the use of not learning from your mistakes??....so I find that most of the posters on here, do support the Boks whole heartedly, but our level of acceptance is different....I myself know for a fact, or atleast I believe it with my whole heart, the Boks can do better, and become the true number 1 ranked Rugby Team in the world.

That’s what I believe….the only thing that stops us is NZ has been more combative, while the Boks are more inclined to celebrate their wins and rest on their laurels. The ABs seem to love the contest itself, they keep playing beyond the 80 minutes…the Boks end it if they are ahead.

That love of the game burns strong in the ABs. It’s NZ’s rugby culture that keeps them on top…we match them in terms of resources.

That is true....there Rugby culture is formidable and deeply embedded...difficult to beat that + SA,s general state of affairs is not to Rosie.....but Positive changes can already be made, like putting a Specialist Attack / Backline coach on the books.

we need to convince government to do away with their racist policies ... all of them

doing that will bring all South Africans into the mix ... a united nation ... focussed on advancing our cause and not just that of a single race group.

we are a divided country ... race against race ... each trying to outdo the other ... 

you and I both know that we will never unite under a common cause and because of it will never achieve our full potential as a nation. 

positive changes is not possible ... we will keep regressing till there's nothing left but a distant memory of what once was 

Mozart,

The love for the game burns strong in South Africans too.

Kiwis have seen that for a very long time.

Lets get real, both countries are great rugby nations.

We may piss each other off, however, going by this forum there are plenty of South Africans on here who absolutely love South African Rugby.

There are some good South Africans on here who have a great knowledge of the game.

Respect is earned - And South African rugby have earned that over a 100 or so years.

Yes we love beating you, but that shows the respect we have for South Africa.       

I agree with you.

Alot of your time is exactly that, trying to convince South African supporters.

Just like us - South Africans need to think that their team is the very best and they need to support the Boks at all costs.

I support NZ for the same reason and we expect the AB's to be the best.

Both South African and NZ Supporters expect their team to be the best and they have very high standards for their respective teams. 

we need to convince government to do away with their racist policies ...

GL with that......they'd be lost without an election winning tool.

we have 10 times the population of New Zealand and if we got our act together and presented a united front, we would have 10 times more depth, more talent and more resources than them.

we should be the most dominant rugby force on the planet.

imagine a united south africa wih the same rugby policies, approach and attitude in place as new zealand.

we'd be unstoppable.

instead ... we prefer division ... and truck loads of excuses.

is it any wonder that eddie jones wanted to be bok coach?

imagine a united south africa wih the same rugby policies, approach and attitude in place as new zealand/Australia.

Yep, instead they encourage mediocrity.....cadres and that sort of gemoss. As long as the colour mix is right dats all dat metters.

Pisses me off real bad.

Everyone seems to forget that England has the most registered Rugby players of all countries, France is another big nation with a lot of players. The Welsh too love their rugby but don't have as many people. Then, look at Ireland, all of the rugby players come from private schools. Rugby is not a big sport in Ireland. Galic Football is massive and way bigger than rugby. Landsdown road is half the size of Croke park but in the same city. 

One thing we do have is player depth, but we don't have the economics to support local players. Where as France can have 14 clubs and even professional clubs in the 2nd division and still provide players with a decent wage. 

The same goes for England, the div 2 has semi pro player but the jump from div 2 to premiership is massive. 

Dobbo and White showed that we can compete against the best in Europe with reject players. 

Just look at that Stormers team, other than Kitshoff and Malherbe that are world class, they don't have anyone else. 

Fourie, 35, Brok Harris 37, Dyamani Reject from the lions, Orie sucks, Roos couldn't make it at the sharks, Libbok couldn't settle at the bulls or saarks, Nel and Senatla  are 7's players . They had no right to compete and win the URC but they did. So it shows the depth we have. 

We just don't have the economy to support 14 provinces and ensure they are competitive. 

People in SA can't afford their TV subscriptions or go to the games. Safety is another concern. But the fans are their, just not the money. 

Mbombela is an awesome stadium and by all means the Pumas should be selling out. 

Our currie cup has become a club competition. It all comes down to money and how much money the fans have

player depth counts for nothing if all we have is garbage. 

Replacing a garbage player with another gets us nowhere.

it's not the quantity of our depth that matters to me but rather the quality of it.

Another golden thread. Alas, not the kind of gold that may be exported.

Years ago, when lining up some of the many reasons to terminate SA rugby , one was: it has no political benefits.

Usually, these teams are used as a means to rally a population around a common centre of interest, to bring people together.

A place of concord.

SA rugby plays an opposite part, it is a place of discord, a toilet bowl where people can vomit their resentment, their delusions of grandeur. A cess pool of wanton hatred.

A massive distraction that consumes energies that could be better allocated elsewhere in the empoverished SA, a scheme that tears SA society apart for no local benefit and no benefit for the rugby game.

Everyone would do better without SA rugby. The termination of SA rugby would advance humanity towards an appeased state.

This thread is golden as the OP admits the situation. Yet shies away from the conclusion, the behaviour that follows up.

SA rugby supporters can not let it go. It is beyond their strength, they are too weak to admit the situation's consequences and will keep maintaining it in fear of taking the decision that must be.

A mixture of resentment in the meaning of Nietzsche and sadism as SA rugby keep spoiling the rugby game, a suffering inflicted to all people who love the rugby game. And Christianity was supposed to be about limiting suffering.

Golden thread, it admits the woes and worships the cause.

Terminate SA rugby.

Another golden thread. Alas, not the kind of gold that may be exported.

Years ago, when lining up some of the many reasons to terminate SA rugby , one was: it has no political benefits.

Usually, these teams are used as a means to rally a population around a common centre of interest, to bring people together.

A place of concord.

SA rugby plays an opposite part, it is a place of discord, a toilet bowl where people can vomit their resentment, their delusions of grandeur. A cess pool of wanton hatred.

A massive distraction that consumes energies that could be better allocated elsewhere in the empoverished SA, a scheme that tears SA society apart for no local benefit and no benefit for the rugby game.

Everyone would do better without SA rugby. The termination of SA rugby would advance humanity towards an appeased state.

This thread is golden as the OP admits the situation. Yet shies away from the conclusion, the behaviour that follows up.

SA rugby supporters can not let it go. It is beyond their strength, they are too weak to admit the situation's consequences and will keep maintaining it in fear of taking the decision that must be.

A mixture of resentment in the meaning of Nietzsche and sadism as SA rugby keep spoiling the rugby game, a suffering inflicted to all people who love the rugby game. And Christianity was supposed to be about limiting suffering.

Golden thread, it admits the woes and worships the cause.

Most of the new rugby and cricket players that are showing signs of becoming legends of their respective sports, are snapped up far too easily by other countries....

Just look at how many awesome players we have lost in the last 10 - 15 years alone, due to the fear of possibly never playing for your country... just because of quota selections.....

It fucks up the morale of all these fantastic players, but they are human.... they want a sports career... they want a regular steady income.... they want to start families and be financially sound....they want to improve themselves by playing against the best in the world.... 

That cannot always happen in SA because of this fucked up quota policy....no matter how good of a player you are

I don't blame these players for one second.... so as CC said earlier.... it is not the quantity that we have here in SA.... it is absolutely the quality..... but that quality, especially what is still available.... is massively reduced by the amount of true talent that we lose every day... to competing countries....

"But the fact that players leave to play abroad does not preclude them from being selected for the Boks

Those players lost to other countries has been because our coaches don’t have their fingers on the pulse and chose not to select the likes of Paul Willemse, Duhan vd Merwe, Pierre Schoeman and Ollie Kebble"

Yes, agreed.... but I am referring to those players that end up becoming citizens of that country.... and end up playing their career for those other countries.....

And in all fairness to our coaches.... it also does not necessarily mean that our coaches do not always have their finger on the pulse regarding our players, which to an extent is very true at times..... but we also cannot always compete with what the pound sterling, or Aussie or American dollar can offers these players.

"All these blacks that claim they think BEE policies in sport are wrong…funny how they will never bring it up to their peers or actually attempt to do something about it"

Yep... just like how all these recent racist stories have come out from these black players... AFTER they have retired from the game....

If their principles were so grounded and solid regarding any racist behaviour or decisions whilst they were playing, why the hell did they not speak up then?..... through a 10 - 15 years career, they ate all this alleged "racist" abuse up.... why.... well....because they were earning seriously good money....that's why..

Well said, Plum ... I feel the same way .

It really is such a fking blight.

There are obviously tons of excellent and deserving black players. 

And all BEE does is throw shade on their achievement.

If you get selected, you want to know that you deserve, else it's hollow. 

"There are obviously tons of excellent and deserving black players"

Yeah, I have voiced my opinion on this many times....

I have always said that I could not care at all if the entire Springbok squad was black... and they were all chosen on merit and performing... and it is so interesting how so many of my mates say the exact same thing....we just want consistency in selection based on the player's ability to perform... simple.

Credit though, must be given to those black players that have spoken out about quota selections in sport , because they have voiced that they don't like the fact that the public could or would think that they were selected purely because of their colour, and nothing at all to do with how well they play the game. 

Golden as golden. What a thread.

Just look at how many awesome players we have lost in the last 10 - 15 years alone, due to the fear of possibly never playing for your country... just because of quota selections.....

The human braind is something stunningly fascinating as there are obvious differences in brains.

People may be prevented from doing that kind of statements, their brain simply does not allow it.

For people, though, those kinds of statements are easy as easy. They flow.

As reported many times already, the most striking feature of SA rugby is not the sporadic presence of quota players in the international squad but well that it is quite hard to name a full rugby squad made of professional rugby quota players.

Very hard to name a full squad as they are lacking in many positions.

One is for example second row forwards. Which happens to be one of the main exports of SA rugby.

Many second row forwards from SA rugby elsewhere than SA.

It begets the question to know which quota players caused the exodus of all those second row forwards. Since the quota policy is responsible for the loss etc

That is really how this is amazing. Human brains are made differently. Brains do allow this settlement with a glaring and self obvious contradictions. They are stuck.

Whereas, brains, superior brains are able to jump over this contradiction to make it a definitive statement: second row forwards are flooding out of SA rugby because of the quota policy even though SA rugby keep failing producing second row quota players at a professional scale.

I have always said that I could not care at all if the entire Springbok squad was black...

Sure as sure in a country whose rugby is ill at ease to provide a full squad of quota players.

In fact, while certain countries in the north could maybe manage the trick, SA rugby can not.

There is by no means not tons of excellent and deserving professional rugby players in SA.

If their principles were so grounded and solid regarding any racist behaviour or decisions whilst they were playing, why the hell did they not speak up then?..... through a 10 - 15 years career, they ate all this alleged "racist" abuse up.... why.... well....because they were earning seriously good money....that's why..

What a disgrace. SA rugby supporters know no low, no shame, no honour, nothing. Just mere greed. Shipping gold outside,funnelling globalistic schemes.

Victims quite often report long after the fact. Dozens of years after the fact. So much that laws are quite often extended to accomodate the situation.

A situation happened or did not happen. The date of the report does not matter.

Raped victims often report long after the fact. They feel shameful. They fear the consequences. They are anxious about the denial. Kids, women, men..

Obviously, by all means, in a country like SA that makes easier for victimizers to confess their crime through guarantee of immunity, this must not be the case for their victim..

Trad why don’t you find a cliff to jump off

You would be doing us all a service

A service. How so.

What an ironical comment by the way.

People may admit. Their brain allows it.

People may not admit, their brain does not allow it. They have a specific capacity at denying.

Not starting this thread would have been a service made to all.

People whose natural inclination is to deny should avoid at all costs to report acceptance of things. This leads to this thread.

They show signs of accepting then are caught with their denial leaning, they must deny, deny and deny again.

The exodus is caused by the collapse of SA rugby. As a consequence of the denial, SA keeps allocating way too much of their population to lust for a professional rugby career.

The wish to retain players from the sole attractivity of the SA rugby team is a pipe dream.

Greedy people's loyalty goes to the highest of the bidders.

And even in case of pride, the SA rugby team only offers 33 spots.

Players see their position in the pecking order and correctly achieve they stand no chances of securing a spot.

This affects any player regardless of their skin colour. Any selected player as a regular blocks the  path for the others.

Simple as simple.

The very fact though that SA rugby supporters reduce the problem to quota players only (only quota players block the path, others do not) is another useless reveal that rugby in SA can not be something else than an association with the Apartheid.

SA churns out tons of mediocre rugby players way too many for the opportunities that SA rugby provide.

Blatant misallocation of resources as all these people would be better employed to grow locally the economy.

SA rugby are a failure. They smear the rugby game. It would be better to let them collapse instead of sustaining them at all costs.

Trad the quicker you find that bridge the better

Hard to remember what the christian position about advocating for suicide is.

Why would you talk about the Christian position while addressing an Atheist?

We have one of if not the best test side in the game and depth to burn yet the majority on here get off on negativity

Ex Saff... you only prove one thing... yarpies number one resource is fertiliser . What Blocky would make one of the top 6 teams in world rugby??? Kwagga is only certainty. Marx a big maybe. Not Ebenezer... really not a lot... bigger only in your own vacuous empty skulls. 

"What Blocky would make one of the top 6 teams in world rugby??? "

What a bloody joke you are...if you wanna troll,  then at least try to make it authentic or something, not nonsensical...

Well then Donkey.. put your carrots where your mouth is! WHO would it be then eh??? If you're gonna shit out your mouth at least have the decency to wipe it clean, some bleach wouldn't hurt either ... thankyou. 

The funniest post was about how honorable ou Rooitwit is be abuse he takes it on the chin and never complains about the ref. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHA.

So it's honorable to not complain about a Crooked ref. Man whatever next.

I agree that merit based selections are the only way to go.

I do note however that there is a consistent animus against the Boks and the coach and Rassie.

The worst I bias I have seen was when Du Toit was trashed and then won IRB player of the year. Rassie was trashed, Allende was trashed and the Bok team that won the world cup and won team of the year were simply no good.

It was shameless and they never apologised

They seize upon any event that  fits their hapless narrative and vent their spleen

The worst of course are Rosie rooinek and that unadulterated buffoon trad. They pollute the board with their sewerage. 

We had the Boks losing to Oz where the ref made all sorts of blunders. Boks were terrible they haters, shrieked. Boks beat the Ausies but AUSSIES are useless anyhow. 

Dave yours is a fair question. 

As for wee cc he loves putting in the knife. Raves on and on and on and on as to how terrible the Boks are even when they are ranked number 1 in the world. What a total bore. 

Unfortunately many of the oaks don't understand rugby beyond what is on the scoreboard. HAHAHAHAHAHA. 

Dispute all this everyone generally has a great time. The Rugby is just incidental to the spats. 

You almost have it right Ballsack... Rassie is the genius who made a very simple plan that even the stupid Blocks could understand it and did it in a way that they stood a chance in games that they'd guaranteed to lose if they played any other fucking way. The players are shit... but he did something with it anyway. 

Rosie Nose what the Boks do require skills and brawn. When the Skills and brwan are sufficient we win as the record has shown. 

The idea that the Boks don't play any creative attacking rugby is absurd so quite naturally you embrace it. 

Crash goes Rosie Rooitwit! 

You're a fucking fool you dumpy baboon! \What fucking creative rugby is there, huh? Running mindlessly at space??? Am and Willemse amazing at running into dead ends getting isolated. Am's passing has got worse the last few tests... not that it was AMAZING... Fucking hell the inaccurate passing in the last game was fucking hilarious! BUT... because they won a real shit game the whole fucking thing is reinterpreted as GREAT! EXACTLY as I motherfucking predicated you arse plunger!